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[hlm666]

questioning whether or not the 4090 is necessary? In fact, he/they've done the EXACT OPPOSITE of this as it relates to PC cards (as they should).

Not true, when the 4090ti rumors were floating around both richard and alex said it wasn't a good idea or really needed.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

I think one of the reasons why a Pro console might be getting some push back is we're seeing few games actually using the next-gen features they already have, and a lot games are requiring many optimisation patches to get them running acceptably. PC has been swamped in poorly performing console ports that are simply too heavy for what the games are actually doing. It seems developers aren't held back by the hardware in the same way the Xbone/PS4 held them back, they're held back by a lack of optimisation, time, and QA. The constraints appear to be elsewhere. My two cents.

Except a PS5 Pro would have the advantage of optimization that is already present on the consoles with the added benefit of the additional horsepower experienced on PC...

It's what all gamers should be asking for right now as PC is entering a stage of struggle, while the consoles are pushing more for 60 fps but at the expense of fidelity...

A PS5 Pro means more 120 fps games, more 60 fps fidelity games, better VR, more RTX... and as I mentioned above hopefully some QOL.

 

[ZehDon]

Except a PS5 Pro would have the advantage of optimization that is already present on the consoles with the added benefit of the additional horsepower experienced on PC...

Potentially, but as I highlighted, that additional horsepower on PC is being abused to make up for bad optimisation. There's no guarantee of additional work to meaningfully use the PS5 Pro's more horsepower. We might just get an unlocked framerate mode on PS5 Pro mislabeled as "performance", or DRS left to run at full frame target. If folks want a Pro model, and Sony's selling one, then it's all just moot conjecture on my part. Like I said, my two cents.

 

[Killjoy-NL]

Except a PS5 Pro would have the advantage of optimization that is already present on the consoles with the added benefit of the additional horsepower experienced on PC...

It's what all gamers should be asking for right now as PC is entering a stage of struggle, while the consoles are pushing more for 60 fps but at the expense of fidelity...

A PS5 Pro means more 120 fps games, more 60 fps fidelity games, better VR, more RTX... and as I mentioned above hopefully some QOL.

People forget inflation. Life is already expensive enough as is.

Poverty is growing rapidly, so at what pricepoint would Sony release a Pro?
699 or 799?

 

[Sleepwalker]

People forget inflation. Life is already expensive enough as is.

Poverty is growing rapidly, so at what pricepoint would Sony release a Pro?
699 or 799?

Yet the PS5 keeps breaking sale records left and right so much that it even had a price hike before. Should Sony lower the base PS5 to 400 and release a pro at 599-699 it will sell. People bought those $700-800 PS5 bundles like crazy.

 

[Killjoy-NL]

Yet the PS5 keeps breaking sale records left and right so much that it even had a price hike before. Should Sony lower the base PS5 to 400 and release a pro at 599-699 it will sell. People bought those $700-800 PS5 bundles like crazy.

Yes, but those are bundles. Consumers aren't stupid, there is much more value to a bundle than a console itself at the same pricepoint.
Plus the core gamers have moved on, it's mostly the (more) casual gamers that have to migrate to PS5, it's tougher to sell them quite an expensive console, so the question is if it's worth releasing a Pro console for a minority of more enthusiastic gamers this time.

Imo the only thing that makes sense for Sony to release a Pro, is if they really want to run Xbox into the ground, but I wonder if they think it's worth the effort as they're already crushing it.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

Potentially, but as I highlighted, that additional horsepower on PC is being abused to make up for bad optimisation. There's no guarantee of additional work to meaningfully use the PS5 Pro's more horsepower. We might just get an unlocked framerate mode on PS5 Pro mislabeled as "performance", or DRS left to run at full frame target. If folks want a Pro model, and Sony's selling one, then it's all just moot conjecture on my part. Like I said, my two cents.

I have zero problems with an unlocked framerate within fidelity mode... targeted around 60 fps.

Insomniac is already delivering 40 fps within fidelity modes utilizing VRR.

 

[Sleepwalker]

Yes, but those are bundles. Consumers aren't stupid, there is much more value to a bundle than a console itself at the same pricepoint.
Plus the core gamers have moved on, it's mostly the (more) casual gamers that have to migrate to PS5, it's tougher to sell them quite an expensive console, so the question is if it's worth releasing a Pro console for a minority of more enthusiastic gamers this time.

Imo the only thing that makes sense for Sony to release a Pro, is if they really want to run Xbox into the ground, but I wonder if they think it's worth the effort as they're already crushing it.

Considering Jim Ryan's alleged comments about him wanting to block the ATVI acquisition and past marketing from sony (used game commercial) I have no doubt that they absolutely want to run xbox to the ground if given the chance. Specially now after those leaks happened.

 

[Clintizzle]

Just random shower thoughts. Have the 25-odd MS studios provided clear feedback that the console being the lead platform is not in their best interest? MS Studio's strategy is to now be PC-centric and have the Series S and X being companion-type devices.

That interview with Kinda Funny where Phil said they're not in the business to out-console PlayStation and Nintendo could be a clue.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

Yes, but those are bundles. Consumers aren't stupid, there is much more value to a bundle than a console itself at the same pricepoint.
Plus the core gamers have moved on, it's mostly the (more) casual gamers that have to migrate to PS5, it's tougher to sell them quite an expensive console, so the question is if it's worth releasing a Pro console for a minority of more enthusiastic gamers this time.

Imo the only thing that makes sense for Sony to release a Pro, is if they really want to run Xbox into the ground, but I wonder if they think it's worth the effort as they're already crushing it.

Running a competitor into the ground is way more important than just crushing it.

From Sony's point of view, if Microsoft didn't release another console next generation, they could probably charge an extra 100 dollars per unit, save tremendously on advertising and exclusivity deals and sell 160+ units outselling the PS2 at a time when digital sales generate way more operating income.

That's why I think a healthy Microsoft is good for consumers, but Phil Spencer is just too incompetent. They need different leadership and they need to abandon their GP plans and to that extent their PC plans.

Either that or Nintendo needs to re-enter the fray.

 

[Killjoy-NL]

Considering Jim Ryan's alleged comments about him wanting to block the ATVI acquisition and past marketing from sony (used game commercial) I have no doubt that they absolutely want to run xbox to the ground if given the chance. Specially now after those leaks happened.

Sure, but we've seen what happened to cocky Sony with PS3.

There are more calculated ways to get the same result.
Business-wise it would be way smarter to wait for the right time, in which case next-gen would be much better timing.

Xbox is already bleeding and struggling in even their stronger markets, there is no rush atm.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

Just random shower thoughts. Have the 25-odd MS studios provided clear feedback that the console being the lead platform is not in their best interest? MS Studio's strategy is to now be PC-centric and have the Series S and X being companion-type devices.

That interview with Kinda Funny where Phil said they're not in the business to out-console PlayStation and Nintendo could be a clue.

They're still a console-first business.

Unless they had a successful PC launcher in Microsoft Store, that's not going to change. They'll never generate as much money on PC as they could have on Xbox.

 

[Zuzu]

Man I really hate do venture into conspiracy theory territory but these guys give me no choice. There's no need to dive into Alex's nonsense perspective, his irrational opposition to anything console (especially Sony) is well known and documented. It's Richard that pisses me off and convinced me he is going out of his way to stay in Microsoft good graces by downplaying any positive rumors relating to PlayStation. How does the leader of a tech channel go on and on praising the Xbox Series S as a "great value" for entry into next gen while being mellow/skeptical on the potential of a PS5 Pro which at the very least has solid rumors of enhanced RT? Could you imagine Rich praising the 4060ti 8gb simply because it is the cheapest NVidia card that offers tensor cores for RT and DLSS while questioning whether or not the 4090 is necessary? In fact, he/they've done the EXACT OPPOSITE of this as it relates to PC cards (as they should). So why is there a different mentality applied to console arena?

Sorry, but this stinks of biased, selective favoritism of one corporation over another. It's sad and pathetic to see this from DF.

Yeah I can’t understand anyone thinking that the Series S 512Gb is great value if we define value as performance per dollar and features. The PS5 digital is clearly the best value wrt performance for the price plus it has a little more storage, it’s cheaper to upgrade it’s storage, has wifi 6, has a usb c port, and it comes with a more advanced controller (though comfort will depend on each person). It’s clearly the value king.

 

[Killjoy-NL]

Running a competitor into the ground is way more important than just crushing it.

From Sony's point of view, if Microsoft didn't release another console next generation, they could probably charge an extra 100 dollars per unit, save tremendously on advertising and exclusivity deals and sell 160+ units outselling the PS2 at a time when digital sales generate way more operating income.

True, but just like in a fight, if you carelessly rush your opponent, it's easy to run right into an unexpected punch.
It isn't always the best way to do it.

That's why I think a healthy Microsoft is good for consumers, but Phil Spencer is just too incompetent. They need different leadership and they need to abandon their GP plans and to that extent their PC plans.

Either that or Nintendo needs to re-enter the fray.

I'd rather see Nintendo stepping up to the plate, personally.

I also don't think Spencer is the big issue, but just MS in general.
Spencer is replaceable.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

Sure, but we've seen what happened to cocky Sony with PS3.

There are more calculated ways to get the same result.
Business-wise it would be way smarter to wait for the right time, in which case next-gen would be much better timing.

Xbox is already bleeding and struggling in even their stronger markets, there is no rush atm.

Not sure how that makes any sense.

When you have a competitor on the ropes, you don't wait for them to regain their composure, you go for the knock out.

Not sure how this is analogous to the PS3 at all.

The PS3 launched a year after the Xbox 360 so already had a year deficit in sales.

It then launched a 500-dollar console and a 600-dollar console when the 360 could be purchased for 300 and 400.

So there was a 200-300 dollar difference in price and a year head start...

 

[Mibu no ookami]

True, but just like in a fight, if you carelessly rush your opponent, it's easy to run right into an unexpected punch.
It isn't always the best way to do it.

Can you illustrate how putting out a pro console while maintaining the current sku at a competitive price to the XSX and XSS is carelessly rushing?

 

[nowhat]

Are you kidding me? Almost everyone thought DF was pro Sony during the PS4/Xbox One time period.

ESRAM. Ring a bell? It was supposed, at least according to Rich, to make all the difference for One.

<narrator>it didn't</narrator>

 

[Killjoy-NL]

Not sure how that makes any sense.

When you have a competitor on the ropes, you don't wait for them to regain their composure, you go for the knock out.

Not sure how this is analogous to the PS3 at all.

The PS3 launched a year after the Xbox 360 so already had a year deficit in sales.

It then launched a 500-dollar console and a 600-dollar console when the 360 could be purchased for 300 and 400.

So there was a 200-300 dollar difference in price and a year head start...

Being on the ropes doesn't mean much if your opponent is still ready and able to fight.

The point was cocky Sony, not PS3.

 

[Killjoy-NL]

Can you illustrate how putting out a pro console while maintaining the current sku at a competitive price to the XSX and XSS is carelessly rushing?

Honestly, it could make Series S seem like a much much cheaper console that plays the same games.

The PS5 is partly as successful as it is because it's in between Series S and X pricing.
If they go above Series X, consumer perception might change and PS5 might be considered the expensive platform.

It's still Xbox we're talking about.

Edit:

I could be completely wrong though. Lol
I just think Sony is smarter than that. Much more calculated.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

Being on the ropes doesn't mean much if your opponent is still ready and able to fight.

The point was cocky Sony, not PS3.

Can you illustrate why Sony releasing a PS5 Pro would be cocky?

 

[Killjoy-NL]

Can you illustrate why Sony releasing a PS5 Pro would be cocky?

I was referring to "running Xbox into the ground"

 

[Mibu no ookami]

Honestly, it could make Series S seem like a much much cheaper console that plays the same games.

The PS5 is partly as successful as it is because it's in between Series S and X pricing.
If they go above Series X, consumer perception might change and PS5 might be considered the expensive platform.

It's still Xbox we're talking about.

Edit:

I could be completely wrong though. Lol
I just think Sony is smarter than that. Much more calculated.

How so if the PS5/DE are still relatively the same price compared to the XSS.

I don't see how the introduction of a higher end system changes that in any substantial way.

I think you're working your way back from a conclusion, but your argument doesn't add up.

Your conclusion: Sony would be cocky to release a PS5 Pro and Sony is too smart for that.

Your argument: Because somehow people would think the PS5 base and digital are now more expensive than they are because the pro is more expensive, but their price hadn't changed and somehow that makes the XSS a better value?

 

[Killjoy-NL]

How so if the PS5/DE are still relatively the same price compared to the XSS.

I don't see how the introduction of a higher end system changes that in any substantial way.

I think you're working your way back from a conclusion, but your argument doesn't add up.

Your conclusion: Sony would be cocky to release a PS5 Pro and Sony is too smart for that.

Your argument: Because somehow people would think the PS5 base and digital are now more expensive than they are because the pro is more expensive, but their price hadn't changed and somehow that makes the XSS a better value?

I'm not working my way back, I don't think there will be Pro consoles this gen.

Last-gen, Sony already spoke about how PS4 Pro doesn't mean that approach was going to be standard practice.

PS4 Pro was meant to boost PSVR performance, because it was strugling with the bare minimum requirements.
MS followed Sony to stay competitive.
That isn't an issue this gen.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

I was referring to "running Xbox into the ground"

You realize that your argument sounds more like like, Xbox has made a mistake in not investing in a pro system, so Sony shouldn't release a pro system because that will run xbox into the ground, and that's a bad result that you personally don't want.

I don't personally want that either, but that doesn't change the fact that it's a smart move by sony to run them into the ground, unless your larger argument is that Microsoft will get more desperate somehow, but your XSS argument holds no weight.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

I'm not working my way back, I don't think there will be Pro consoles this gen.

Last-gen, Sony already spoke about how PS4 Pro doesn't mean that approach was going to be standard practice.

It's been confirmed by Kotick and heavily rumored/confirmed by numerous other sources. There is going to be a PS5 Pro and the lack of an XSX Pro doesn't change that any more than the lack of a PS5-Lite erases the XSS.

 

[Killjoy-NL]

You realize that your argument sounds more like like, Xbox has made a mistake in not investing in a pro system, so Sony shouldn't release a pro system because that will run xbox into the ground, and that's a bad result that you personally don't want.

I don't personally want that either, but that doesn't change the fact that it's a smart move by sony to run them into the ground, unless your larger argument is that Microsoft will get more desperate somehow, but your XSS argument holds no weight.

No, I was saying there won't be Pro consoles before the leaks happened this week.

I think the leaks show that MS thinks the same way.

 

[Killjoy-NL]

It's been confirmed by Kotick and heavily rumored/confirmed by numerous other sources. There is going to be a PS5 Pro and the lack of an XSX Pro doesn't change that any more than the lack of a PS5-Lite erases the XSS.

What has been confirmed? The rumors?

We'll see. I'll definitely be surprised if Sony would actually release a PS5 Pro.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

No, I was saying there won't be Pro consoles before the leaks happened this week.

I think the leaks show that MS thinks the same way.

Where does Microsoft state in the leaks that they don't think there will be a PS5 Pro?

They just confirm that Microsoft isn't looking at their own XSX Pro, which is consistent with years of reporting on this.

None of that has anything to do with a PS5 Pro.

Somehow people believe the decision for Microsoft not moving forward with this has any impact or correlation with Sony moving forward with a Pro and it just doesn't work like that.

It is a disappointing result though, because as I mentioned, I do believe this will ultimately be unilateral disarmament that leads to brand erasure.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

What has been confirmed? The rumors?

We'll see. I'll definitely be surprised if Sony would actually release a PS5 Pro.

Trusted sources have confirmed that rumors are in fact true. We've yet to hear anything from Sony, but that's not outside of normal practice.

Sony normally would announce something a month before release.

 

[Killjoy-NL]

Where does Microsoft state in the leaks that they don't think there will be a PS5 Pro?

About not releasing a Pro this gen.
I think Sony thinks the same as well, there just isn't a logical reason to do so.

I thought the lockdowns were illogical as well, but everyone went along with it anyway. So who knows?

They just confirm that Microsoft isn't looking at their own XSX Pro, which is consistent with years of reporting on this.

None of that has anything to do with a PS5 Pro.

yes, that's not what I was trying to say.

Somehow people believe the decision for Microsoft not moving forward with this has any impact or correlation with Sony moving forward with a Pro and it just doesn't work like that.

It is a disappointing result though, because as I mentioned, I do believe this will ultimately be unilateral disarmament that leads to brand erasure.

Again, I was already saying there won't be Pro consoles before the Xbox leaks, so that is completely irrelevant to how I came to my conclusions.

 

[Killjoy-NL]

Trusted sources have confirmed that rumors are in fact true. We've yet to hear anything from Sony, but that's not outside of normal practice.

Sony normally would announce something a month before release.

Trusted sources have been wrong before.

But so have I, so who knows?

 

[Mibu no ookami]

People forget inflation. Life is already expensive enough as is.

Poverty is growing rapidly, so at what pricepoint would Sony release a Pro?
699 or 799?

I think we're too early to speculate on the price.

We don't know if the PS5 redesign is going to maintain the same price or not.

If the PS5 slim without a disc drive replaces the standard unit and sells for 400, I think a Pro could easily sell for 600-700.

If the price remains 500, the pro could be as much as 800.

Life is expensive, but there are definitely gamers willing to pay a little extra for the best experience.

The original iPhone came out and was priced at 499 (739 adjusted for inflation).

The current consoles are historically cheap and could probably be priced higher.

Adjusted for inflation the PS1 was $615.28, yet you could buy a PS5 digital for 400 dollars...

 

[Crayon]

Like a year ago I though the pro consoles would be 599 but if it's just the ps5 pro, they should probably try to slide it in at 500 with the $100 disc separate. If an sx refresh is discless and 500 then that would be murder. Let's go, murder.

 

[GHG]

He should have been running Xbox but a total introvert and always said no to going on stage, hated being in front of people like that.

In situations like this it's better to just run with it anyway and then employ some hype-man to front the operation publicly.

It's a shame because it seems like he knows his stuff.

 

[Unknown Soldier]

Already watched this, basically they think xbox will NOT be releaseing a pro console.

In general, you can always assuming Sony and MS know each other's plans on this. If there isn't going to be an Xbox Series XX, we can infer that there also won't be a PS5 Pro. MS and Sony won't waste money and effort on making a Pro console unless they know the other competitor is doing it too.

 

[PeteBull]

What I find most curious is that they told DF way back in 2020 that there would no XSX Slim or XSX Pro. And that they CANT do it.

You have to wonder just why? Why CANT they do it?

Sony isnt just making a Pro, they are also making a slim because the slim will cost them less while increasing the userbase and the pro will allow them to sell it to all the double dippers at a higher profit margin.

MS needs to ask some hard questions to their engineering teams. Why cant you do something that has been a standard for Sony since the 1990s.

Very likely coz with x series pr0 they would have 3 different consoles for devs to optimise for, s,x,pr0, sony was smarter, first they made cheapest possible ps5(400$ for discless version was a steal for ppl who dont use discs, comparing that to terrible xss value proposition ...) now when they see opportunity for higher performance midgen upgrade we only get second platform.

 

[Daneel Elijah]

What I find most curious is that they told DF way back in 2020 that there would no XSX Slim or XSX Pro. And that they CANT do it.

You have to wonder just why? Why CANT they do it?

Sony isnt just making a Pro, they are also making a slim because the slim will cost them less while increasing the userbase and the pro will allow them to sell it to all the double dippers at a higher profit margin.

MS needs to ask some hard questions to their engineering teams. Why cant you do something that has been a standard for Sony since the 1990s.

The leaks proves that a XSX digital is on the way, or that they planned to at least. So that is a slim. For the XSX Pro, I am not sure that they can't do it, but more that it does not make sense for them strategically. From a marketing and practical point of view, there is a lot of problems.

From a marketing point :

The S will make the Xbox Pro useless, as if the S is enough to play games and get Gamepass, then either the X is a good enough upgrade or it is not. How do you market all 3 consoles when each have 2x to 5x the power of the weaker version?
The X will become the middle option. It will negate all previous marketing, and will need new ones to compensate. As the value proposition is already weak compared to the PS5 IMHO( who can have a cheaper digital version that compete directly with it) Xbox will need to compete on price. And that would either eat in the S( the official value proposition), or loose them a lot of money as we know that the X can't be made for cheap like Sony managed to do for the PS5.
The Xbox Pro will be the new king. But how to create a need for it without harming the S and X reception? Making it a monster (600 to 1000$) would not only make it a really niche product, it would harm them for the next gen, that they want to happen fast. So another console that will loose money? And force the other ones to be cheaper to maintain relevance?

From a pratical point:
3 SKU will make third parties not happy. As the X is a 12 tf console, they may want to have a 24 tf Pro. They should not feel the need IMHO, but I read rumors that they wanted a 12 tf XSX because the One X was a 6 tf so who knows? Making a Pro console takes time. They already decided to loose a lot of money to sell the S and X for cheap. 1.5 billions dollars for 2021. So maybe in 2020 they could not push for a Pro on top of that. As we know that Pro consoles are a small part of the total consoles sold (10 to 20% I think) adn that the Xbox know that they will sell less than Playstation, they may have calculated that 20% of 60 millions consoles ( their objective that we saw in the leaks) can't be made cheap enough. Sony may be looking at 20% of 120 millions consoles, and that will give them economies of scale. And again if they want to go next gen early a Xbox Pro would just be another problem for them.

 

[Zuzu]

I’m worried that Xbox might rush out a new console generation in 2026 in response to the PS5 Pro and also to try to get ahead of Sony generally only to be decimated by the PS6 in 2028. I don’t want Xbox to disappear; I want them to change their strategy a bit and flourish even if they always remain the 3rd wheel in the console market.

Hopefully they won’t and they’ll just ride the Series consoles until 2028 and release a great console with a good lineup of launch titles for once (surely with all these studios they’ll be able to get something ready for 2028 )

 

[Physiognomonics]

Man I really hate do venture into conspiracy theory territory but these guys give me no choice. There's no need to dive into Alex's nonsense perspective, his irrational opposition to anything console (especially Sony) is well known and documented. It's Richard that pisses me off and convinced me he is going out of his way to stay in Microsoft good graces by downplaying any positive rumors relating to PlayStation. How does the leader of a tech channel go on and on praising the Xbox Series S as a "great value" for entry into next gen while being mellow/skeptical on the potential of a PS5 Pro which at the very least has solid rumors of enhanced RT? Could you imagine Rich praising the 4060ti 8gb simply because it is the cheapest NVidia card that offers tensor cores for RT and DLSS while questioning whether or not the 4090 is necessary? In fact, he/they've done the EXACT OPPOSITE of this as it relates to PC cards (as they should). So why is there a different mentality applied to console arena?

Sorry, but this stinks of biased, selective favoritism of one corporation over another. It's sad and pathetic to see this from DF.

They have done about the same thing with Pro vs X1X. hyping the X1X for free for more than one year while downplaying Pro by cherry picking analysis on some games/scenes etc.

I expect no less for them this time, they are going to follow the same strategy. Downplaying new RT hardware / PS5 Pro for as long as they can while hyping the "true RDNA4-5" rt hardware of next-gen Xbox (that midgen console will very likely not be released). Of course the reality is that both consoles will have the same RT hardware but they'll just follow the Spencer Script on this.

 

[Daneel Elijah]

I’m worried that Xbox might rush out a new console generation in 2026 in response to the PS5 Pro and also to try to get ahead of Sony generally only to be decimated by the PS6 in 2028. I don’t want Xbox to disappear; I want them to change their strategy a bit and flourish even if they always remain the 3rd wheel in the console market.

Hopefully they won’t and they’ll just ride the Series consoles until 2028 and release a great console with a good lineup of launch titles for once (surely with all these studios they’ll be able to get something ready for 2028 )

They are in a hard position no matter what. They are selling less consoles than the 360 and Xbox 1 generations, so we can see them having around 60 million at best if they continue with the S/X strategy until 2028, according to their own documents. If the PS5 Pro will be there on 2024, and that Sony want the have the PS6 in 2028, each option that Xbox does will harm them one way or another.
-Rush a next gen console ? As you have said, it will be hard to compete with a superior PS6, and the market is not ready for true next gen anyway. And it would need them to loose a shit ton of money to try to have a competitive console 2 years in advance.
-Continue as normal? Then a PS5 Slim at 300 will destroy them IMHO, and it will happen unless Sony does not see the need, and in this case they have already won.
Sony have a tendency to give us great games for a console when a new one is coming, and Xbox tends to make it more light in comparison. Cross gen change that a little of course, but the same problem remains. If Xbox decide (just as an example) to push Fable to their next gen console, it will reduce somewhat the Series S/X sales if you see what I mean. And the less they sell this gen, the harder it will be to be conpetitive next gen against Sony IMHO.
For me they need to be first in next gen, but not by too much. They need a competitive console, no S to slow them down and a Pro version a few years after the PS6 to garantee that a Xbox console will always be on top. And having great games of course.

 

[Kyo]

Everyone seems to miss the point of a Pro console. It's not about improved RT, it's about finally getting to play From Software's PS5 games at a stable 60 fps.

 

[FalconPunch]

DF’s turnaround on Pro consoles is so weird to see between last gen and this gen

and the only real difference is this gen it seems like Xbox isn’t going to have one

It's very suspect. First Alex whining about it, then Audi/Richard being concerned that Sony would have the performance leadership. It's all very suspect. Then the guys were saying that they feel bad for Phil and co because of the leak and how it makes them look bad? All the leak exposed is the true colors of certain individuals which if you were paying attention, you'd already know. This excuse making leaves a very sour taste in my mouth.

 

[FingerBang]

Like a year ago I though the pro consoles would be 599 but if it's just the ps5 pro, they should probably try to slide it in at 500 with the $100 disc separate. If an sx refresh is discless and 500 then that would be murder. Let's go, murder.

With no competition from MS,Sony has absolutely no reason to release a Pro console for "cheaper".

With PC gaming prices gone off the deep end, all they have to do is to price it competitively with a GPU of around the same performance

 

[Helghan]

I understand why they aren't making a pro console, it's not where the money is... In case of PS4, once the Pro launched PS4 v. Ps4 Pro was 3:1.

 

[Killjoy-NL]

I understand why they aren't making a pro console, it's not where the money is... In case of PS4, once the Pro launched PS4 v. Ps4 Pro was 3:1.

This as well.

I do wonder if Sony did make plans for a possible Pro, in case Series S/X offered more competition with Spencer taking over and those plans somehow reached these insiders that started the rumors.

 

[PeteBull]

I understand why they aren't making a pro console, it's not where the money is... In case of PS4, once the Pro launched PS4 v. Ps4 Pro was 3:1.

Pretty sure it wasnt even that, its 20% of sales for pr0 version https://www.dualshockers.com/sony-1-5-ps4s-sold-ps4-pros-selling-better-expected/

The thing is, those ppl who buy midgen upgrades are most devoted customers, those are the guys who buy 20-30games/year, u really want them to keep buying it/stay in ur ecosystem, if they go to pc sony loses out tons of profit.

 

[Killjoy-NL]

Pretty sure it wasnt even that, its 20% of sales for pr0 version https://www.dualshockers.com/sony-1-5-ps4s-sold-ps4-pros-selling-better-expected/

The thing is, those ppl who buy midgen upgrades are most devoted customers, those are the guys who buy 20-30games/year, u really want them to keep buying it/stay in ur ecosystem, if they go to pc sony loses out tons of profit.

The people jumping ship to PC are negligible though.

Consoles have a completely different demographic.

 

[balls of snow]

Sounds like they did ask the engineering team, and the response was We Can't Do It.

Software company vs Hardcore electronics company. Proof is in the pudding.

 

[PeteBull]

The people jumping ship to PC are negligible though.

Consoles have a completely different demographic.

https://www.ign.com/articles/2016/0...st-ps4-edition-for-substantial-period-of-time time to educate urself, bro

House also explained that the Pro has been designed, in part, to provide competition with the PC, as opposed to its direct console rivals.

“I saw some data that really influenced me,” he explained. “It suggested that there’s a dip mid-console lifecycle where the players who want the very best graphical experience will start to migrate to PC, because that’s obviously where it’s to be had.

"We wanted to keep those people within our eco-system by giving them the very best and very highest [performance quality]. So the net result of those thoughts was PlayStation 4 Pro – and, by and large, a graphical approach to game improvement.”

 

[Killjoy-NL]

https://www.ign.com/articles/2016/0...st-ps4-edition-for-substantial-period-of-time time to educate urself, bro

Ofcourse that's part of it, but Pro was meant to boost PSVR performance. I believe it was Hirai (or maybe Yoshida) that talked about it pre-release.

Pro also released shortly after PSVR.
But you don't release it just for PSVR, you try to cover as many bases, those enthusiast you're referring to are another reason (4k gaming being another, for the masses).
But the vast majority of console-gamers don't care enough about PC gaming for it to be an issue.