Fist with 5 primaries (one of those being +fire damage), chest with +fire damage and RCR on fire skills, fire runes are typically the highest weapon damage runes per skill.
No other element can compete.
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Diablo III: Reaper of Souls |OT3| Tyrael Looted: {[El'druin]}
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Fist with 5 primaries (one of those being +fire damage), chest with +fire damage and RCR on fire skills, fire runes are typically the highest weapon damage runes per skill.
No other element can compete.
It's because of Magefist and Cindercoat.
Plus the Fire runes tend to be the most DPS runes. Cold rune generally slows/freezes, Lightning one generally stuns or has reduced CDR and the other ones have other utiliities. But Fire runes for more skills consistently is the highest DPS rune.
But it's really Cindercoat that pulls the most weight. Without set bonuses it's hard for most classes to be able to spam their skills. Cindercoat enables the spamming.
Since the release of RoS they have not rectified this problem and now that have to deal with it again. When Cindercoat was first released Blizzard specifically said that they don't want to create more Cindercoat-like items for other elements. Damn shame though. Lightning has the Thundergods Vigor, Cold has Frost gauntlets, Poison has the pants and that's about it. They tried to add the Legendary gems too but really... it's the Cindercoat that makes the builds.
More importantly they haven't added a lot of good neutral Legendaries in the game. Like they added Aquila Cuirass in this patch and that's the best neutral chest Legendary they have added to the game since the game's release!
Pyros_Eien
Member
Only things you can't get is Ashbringer and like transmog stuff from pony land.
rukland
Member
So you are saying it was really rare to see lighting as an element in play in 2.3? I remember at the start of the patch before I dropped my DH that I was laughed at for using lighting as the focus of my Nat's build. It seems as if I might have been on the right track.
But looking at 2.4 and what little I have been able to play things are going to shift again and you are right fire is key. LoN has made things pretty bonkers, not to mention I think the BS buffs for crusader might be a bit crazy. That being said I love me some Captain America.
Ricerocket
Member
So far while this PTR has a lot of legs and shit, it's just the same shit with higher numbers. ;/ I already feel bored faster than ever compared to last patch. Won't be surprised if it turns out to be the most unbalanced patch due to LoN.
We are talking about items outside of sets. Sets tend to push you towards a specific rune so it avoids the fire problem sometimes. This fire issue was a problem back at the start of RoS when people had to use non-set builds since getting a complete set could take literally hundreds of hours. They just never fixed it because sets became more plentiful and easier to get.
There are some exceptions of course. Some runes have weird mechanics that allow they to out perform other runes despite what their numbers might indicate. Lightning Nat's is actually really powerful but more importantly Static Charge Monk is extremely powerful. Before Static Charge the best Generator Monk build was the Fire Mangle build as on paper that did the most damage. But when you combined a high proc move with Static Charge it out damaged the fire rune by a lot.
Then there's stuff like Exploding Palm Impending Doom which is like double the damage of every other rune so it's the only rune that is used in EP builds. It's a cold rune.
Arcane Orb Frozen Orb is the best rune because if you place the explosion just right you get more damage.
And LoN is definitely getting nerfed. The question is by how much relative to other sets. Right now the other good sets can do GR80 fairly easily so should the LoN set be tweaked so that full ancient gear can do GR80 for most specs? Right now LoN sets can easily do GR90.
Then there's stuff like Exploding Palm Impending Doom which is like double the damage of every other rune so it's the only rune that is used in EP builds. It's a cold rune.
Arcane Orb Frozen Orb is the best rune because if you place the explosion just right you get more damage.
And LoN is definitely getting nerfed. The question is by how much relative to other sets. Right now the other good sets can do GR80 fairly easily so should the LoN set be tweaked so that full ancient gear can do GR80 for most specs? Right now LoN sets can easily do GR90.
Some are class specific of course.
This is pretty amazing ok it is PTR but this goes above and beyond we have now in 2.3. I can finally go above 60 for myself.
Ricerocket
Member
Yeah I've tried arcane channeling with star pact and nilfurs boots combo. It's sick. You can just kite and drop a full powered star pact meteor every sec. was just doing it with like 4 ancients on doing over 20b dmg constantly.
200% might run into the same problem of it making 6 pc obsolete. So I am hoping they might settle at 150%.
LoN exposed a crap ton of problems with the game like the fact that the new Shield Crusader set up is ridiculous. Also we still lack a lot of good Legendaries for Armor, Chest, Shoulder, Pants and Boots. Ever since they started focusing on Sets and weapons they have neglecTed those slots and now all the LoN builds have the same Legendaries for those slots despite having wildly different builds.
I am hoping that this initial test was to gather data on these wild imbalances in the game. Certainly when you raise numbers that high it more easily highlights issues in the game.
LoN exposed a crap ton of problems with the game like the fact that the new Shield Crusader set up is ridiculous. Also we still lack a lot of good Legendaries for Armor, Chest, Shoulder, Pants and Boots. Ever since they started focusing on Sets and weapons they have neglecTed those slots and now all the LoN builds have the same Legendaries for those slots despite having wildly different builds.
I am hoping that this initial test was to gather data on these wild imbalances in the game. Certainly when you raise numbers that high it more easily highlights issues in the game.
Well that was a huge nerf..
They should have gradually turn it down to test it.
Also, firebird set effects ? Wtf
https://youtu.be/aFaL3kUTuKM
They should have gradually turn it down to test it.
Also, firebird set effects ? Wtf
https://youtu.be/aFaL3kUTuKM
Ricerocket
Member
Reading that Wyatt Cheng post I don't think Blizzard is interested in making the LoN set be useful for higher GR... just for TX tomfoolery (aka fodder for their play your way Thursday episodes).
Which is disappointing because with some tweaks they could've at least added a 5th alternate to gearing a character for GR60+ (4 sets plus a non set build).
Which is disappointing because with some tweaks they could've at least added a 5th alternate to gearing a character for GR60+ (4 sets plus a non set build).
Pyros_Eien
Member
The guy is disconnected, it just spams Arcane Torrent visuals.
Shuggananas
Banned
Some invoker crusader feedback, mainly concerning which skills I picked and why, which I didn't and why, talk about items, and the new steed charge set which is made to work with invoker
Link to build/cube/spells
So first off, my active skills build :
Punish - Celerity (attack speed increase on block)
Laws of Valor - Answered prayer (longer duration with kills, most runes suck since we don't use critical hits)
Akarat's Champion - Prophet (tanking, rez)
Iron Skin - Reflective skin (+100% thorns). Spam it on CD.
Consecration - Bed of nails (AoE 100% thorns for 10 seconds). Spam it on CD and packs especially, helps cleaning and gives some healing too
Steed charge - Spike barding (500% thorns damage per second to enemies hit)
Punish is a better option than slash imo because :
- It gives 15% block (damage mitigation through justice lantern)
- It gives more attack speed and more reliably (15% on block rather than 10 1% stacks)
- It doesn't need a belt to be used (omnislash), we are already using a belt and can't afford a cube slot
The rest of the spells is pretty obvious I think, now for skills I considered taking :
Bombardment - Barrels of spike. It sounds like good damage but it doesn't proc a lot, damage isn't that high (200% thorns per barrel compared to the 600% per hit you deal with your primary attack), and bombardment is mostly used for the 4p damage reduction. I used it in the beginning but eh.
Provoke - Hit me (taunts, 50% block bonus). Sounds nice but 4 seconds is too short imo, also we don't care about generating resource since we're always full. Also I already cap at 75% block chance
Now for the passive skills build :
Fervor, finery iron maiden and fanaticism seem obvious, there's not many options actually.
Other interesting passives : holy cause (bonus damage), indestructible (rez), divine fortress (75% armor but we got prophet already), renewal (healing), none of these seem too strong compared to the 4 I picked. For hellfire amulet I'd chose either divine fortress or indestructible depending on how I fare
Now for my item build :
Starting with rings, we don't have space for RoRG whatsoever. Justice lantern and unity (solo play) are mandatory, 48.75% and 50% damage reduction are too strong. For the third slot I use convention of elements, I can't find much better and it's a really good boost (thorns damage is physical)
Because of this we also have to use the 6 pieces of invoker (bracers, shoulders, helm, gloves, pants, boots)
Which leaves us with a few slots to fill. Belt, chest, amulet, weapon, shield
Belt should be belt of the trove, no other option. The 4p invoker is meant to use it. Free 50% damage reduction
For the chest, I use heart of iron and cubed aquila (500% of your vitality as thorns, and perma 50% damage reduction because full wrath). The build should have around 7500-9000 vitality, so that means about 40 000 thorns which is a lot (the highest source of thorns on the gear is the new gem which gives approx 120 000 thorns, the rest comes from items, about 3000 per item)
For the amulet slot, you can either go hellfire, ess of johan (for solo play mostly) or any elemental amy. Hellfire doesn't seem mandatory because the other passives aren't great
Now for the weapon and shield, this is where it gets tricky. You obviously need a one handed weapon equipped because the build relies A LOT on attack speed. You build invoker stacks with attacks, and you deal a fixed amount of thorns damage per attack (600%) so you want to attack super fast anyway. Shields offer good choice but I chose Akarat's awakening for the cooldown reduction since I use akarat's champion
The weapon though, I think the choices are too poor. Hack sounds nice but it's only 100% thorns damage while invoker gives you 600% a hit already so I feel it's a waste. I like swiftmount for mobility but the damage on steed charge is meh, I'm considering using endurance already for more duration. Eung jang do seems nice for mass attack speed, I have yet to try it
For the cube I use blood broother. It's 20% block chance (helps reach 75%), and good damage mitigation. I tried using mortal drama when I used bombardment but the spell is a letdown imo.
Overall feeling with the set : it lacks a bit of mobility but damage is great, single target mainly, but packs melt too because you get a lot of thorns with the 2p bonus. It also tanks A LOT with everything multiplying. I love how the thorns gem scales, 30k + 1k5 per levels is really nice
Now about Norvald's favor :
Set seemed fun when I read about it in the patch note, although the weapon is a 2 handed flail... this is garbage. This means the set will ONLY be played for lower rifts or speed farming (bounties or ~30/35 GRs tops). Because of this you lose fervor and have to take heavenly strength, losing a LOT of damage because invoker's scales doubly with attack speed.
Other than that, the bonuses are weird. You need to one shot monsters with steed charge (thorns rune) in order to get it to last longer, this is weird, imo it should just last longer for every enemy hit instead. The bonus when steed charge is.. alright I suppose but only lasts 5 seconds anyway
Set could be good but needs some tuning, namely change the weapon to a 1H flail, and change the first bonus a bit. Most other weapon sets (bul kathos, shenlong, chanto) are used in higher GR, there's no reason this doesn't deserve a spot too
A few concerns :
- I don't know if area damage works with thorns
- Belt of the trove doesn't cast bombardment if there's no enemy in sight meaning you might get some downtime on the 50% reduction even with a 6 seconds interval roll on bombardments (the bonus lasts 8 second)
- Heal may be lacking without simplicity's strength
- "thorns are increased by a portion of your strength" couldn't they be more accurate ???
Link to build/cube/spells
So first off, my active skills build :
Punish - Celerity (attack speed increase on block)
Laws of Valor - Answered prayer (longer duration with kills, most runes suck since we don't use critical hits)
Akarat's Champion - Prophet (tanking, rez)
Iron Skin - Reflective skin (+100% thorns). Spam it on CD.
Consecration - Bed of nails (AoE 100% thorns for 10 seconds). Spam it on CD and packs especially, helps cleaning and gives some healing too
Steed charge - Spike barding (500% thorns damage per second to enemies hit)
Punish is a better option than slash imo because :
- It gives 15% block (damage mitigation through justice lantern)
- It gives more attack speed and more reliably (15% on block rather than 10 1% stacks)
- It doesn't need a belt to be used (omnislash), we are already using a belt and can't afford a cube slot
The rest of the spells is pretty obvious I think, now for skills I considered taking :
Bombardment - Barrels of spike. It sounds like good damage but it doesn't proc a lot, damage isn't that high (200% thorns per barrel compared to the 600% per hit you deal with your primary attack), and bombardment is mostly used for the 4p damage reduction. I used it in the beginning but eh.
Provoke - Hit me (taunts, 50% block bonus). Sounds nice but 4 seconds is too short imo, also we don't care about generating resource since we're always full. Also I already cap at 75% block chance
Now for the passive skills build :
Fervor, finery iron maiden and fanaticism seem obvious, there's not many options actually.
Other interesting passives : holy cause (bonus damage), indestructible (rez), divine fortress (75% armor but we got prophet already), renewal (healing), none of these seem too strong compared to the 4 I picked. For hellfire amulet I'd chose either divine fortress or indestructible depending on how I fare
Now for my item build :
Starting with rings, we don't have space for RoRG whatsoever. Justice lantern and unity (solo play) are mandatory, 48.75% and 50% damage reduction are too strong. For the third slot I use convention of elements, I can't find much better and it's a really good boost (thorns damage is physical)
Because of this we also have to use the 6 pieces of invoker (bracers, shoulders, helm, gloves, pants, boots)
Which leaves us with a few slots to fill. Belt, chest, amulet, weapon, shield
Belt should be belt of the trove, no other option. The 4p invoker is meant to use it. Free 50% damage reduction
For the chest, I use heart of iron and cubed aquila (500% of your vitality as thorns, and perma 50% damage reduction because full wrath). The build should have around 7500-9000 vitality, so that means about 40 000 thorns which is a lot (the highest source of thorns on the gear is the new gem which gives approx 120 000 thorns, the rest comes from items, about 3000 per item)
For the amulet slot, you can either go hellfire, ess of johan (for solo play mostly) or any elemental amy. Hellfire doesn't seem mandatory because the other passives aren't great
Now for the weapon and shield, this is where it gets tricky. You obviously need a one handed weapon equipped because the build relies A LOT on attack speed. You build invoker stacks with attacks, and you deal a fixed amount of thorns damage per attack (600%) so you want to attack super fast anyway. Shields offer good choice but I chose Akarat's awakening for the cooldown reduction since I use akarat's champion
The weapon though, I think the choices are too poor. Hack sounds nice but it's only 100% thorns damage while invoker gives you 600% a hit already so I feel it's a waste. I like swiftmount for mobility but the damage on steed charge is meh, I'm considering using endurance already for more duration. Eung jang do seems nice for mass attack speed, I have yet to try it
For the cube I use blood broother. It's 20% block chance (helps reach 75%), and good damage mitigation. I tried using mortal drama when I used bombardment but the spell is a letdown imo.
Overall feeling with the set : it lacks a bit of mobility but damage is great, single target mainly, but packs melt too because you get a lot of thorns with the 2p bonus. It also tanks A LOT with everything multiplying. I love how the thorns gem scales, 30k + 1k5 per levels is really nice
Now about Norvald's favor :
Set seemed fun when I read about it in the patch note, although the weapon is a 2 handed flail... this is garbage. This means the set will ONLY be played for lower rifts or speed farming (bounties or ~30/35 GRs tops). Because of this you lose fervor and have to take heavenly strength, losing a LOT of damage because invoker's scales doubly with attack speed.
Other than that, the bonuses are weird. You need to one shot monsters with steed charge (thorns rune) in order to get it to last longer, this is weird, imo it should just last longer for every enemy hit instead. The bonus when steed charge is.. alright I suppose but only lasts 5 seconds anyway
Set could be good but needs some tuning, namely change the weapon to a 1H flail, and change the first bonus a bit. Most other weapon sets (bul kathos, shenlong, chanto) are used in higher GR, there's no reason this doesn't deserve a spot too
A few concerns :
- I don't know if area damage works with thorns
- Belt of the trove doesn't cast bombardment if there's no enemy in sight meaning you might get some downtime on the 50% reduction even with a 6 seconds interval roll on bombardments (the bonus lasts 8 second)
- Heal may be lacking without simplicity's strength
- "thorns are increased by a portion of your strength" couldn't they be more accurate ???
welp that's a lot of text
Shuggananas
Banned
Orange values are when you hit harder than average in a period of time
Etched Sigil seems really, really good. The way it actually works is that for every "pulse" of one of the three spells mentioned, it casts ONE of your other arcane spenders, not to include the three listed.
Which basically means just take the best one, which in this case is Meteor - Star Pact; this is especially broken because it casts star pact but consumes no mana to do so, but you still get the damage buff from arcane power as if it had. Slamming ridiculous numbers with it.
Which basically means just take the best one, which in this case is Meteor - Star Pact; this is especially broken because it casts star pact but consumes no mana to do so, but you still get the damage buff from arcane power as if it had. Slamming ridiculous numbers with it.
rukland
Member
When is the nerd to LoN to go into effect? Because right now it's still crazy,I mean the crusader leader board is proof of that. When I just logged off the top was 106. At least the top end is not shield spam ... nope now it's heavens fury. But with out a doubt it's because of LoN.
I'm slowly climbing up the greater rift levels 80 is my current and really the only issue is the same as last season mob density. They need to fix LoN soon or no real testing will be done.
I'm slowly climbing up the greater rift levels 80 is my current and really the only issue is the same as last season mob density. They need to fix LoN soon or no real testing will be done.
Head of Vengarl
Banned
Do you guys think RoS will go on sale for Black Friday? Getting a little tired of vanilla after killing Diablo for the 50th time, but I can wait if you think there's a good chance RoS will get a price cut.
It's been on sale for $20 or less many times already, so I don't see why not. And wow you're really missing out if you like the game that much but haven't gotten the expansion.
If you've enjoyed D3 enough to play through campaign 50 times you NEED to buy the expac right meow. It's well worth $20. Hell, I'd pay full retail price again. It's crazy how many hrs I've dumped into it.
FWIW it's only $18 at Wal*Mart
http://www.walmart.com/ip/Diablo-3-Reaper-of-Souls-PC/33872564
I can't see it dropping much lower than that.
FWIW it's only $18 at Wal*Mart
http://www.walmart.com/ip/Diablo-3-Reaper-of-Souls-PC/33872564
I can't see it dropping much lower than that.
Head of Vengarl
Banned
I was exaggerating a bit, I haven't actually cleared the campaign 50 times through.
It's $20 right now if I buy it straight from Battle.net, which is how I would buy it. I have a Best Buy gift card so I can buy a $20 Battle.net card from there (they don't sell D3) and basically get the game for free. I was just wondering if there would be a price cut. This is Blizzard though so I agree they probably won't drop it lower than $20...
I was exaggerating a bit, I haven't actually cleared the campaign 50 times through.
It's $20 right now if I buy it straight from Battle.net, which is how I would buy it. I have a Best Buy gift card so I can buy a $20 Battle.net card from there (they don't sell D3) and basically get the game for free. I was just wondering if there would be a price cut. This is Blizzard though so I agree they probably won't drop it lower than $20...
Buy the damn expansion what is holding you back? Adventure mode is the bread and butter of this game...add rifts,greater rifts to it and you will be lost for hours upon hours. And every new season starting fresh with a class. Clearly you didn't read the PTR notes for 2.4 that is a almost a new expansion for free and how massive it is?
You want to wait for 2.4 patch to run that zoo build again.
In any case you want to look at diablofans.com for builds and make sure you specify which patch (so right now it's patch 2.3).
Is 2.4 coming any time soon?
Probably a month from now although the 2.4 PTR is active now if you want to try it out.
Pyros_Eien
Member
They said PTR is broken for Mac, they're working on a fix.
OK rocking the new setup on the PTR, MAN melee DH is fast as fuck. I'll get some GIFS and stuff for you, but suffice to say, the 2pc is absolutely needed to run higher rifts and torment levels. Once I had it on, I was literally popping torment VI baddies with relative ease.
Now comes the 4 pc and Shadow Power always on is GODLIKE. So fast, so furious, much damage reduction, I said wow. The ring affix that gives you 50% or more damage reduction after you vault is fucking insane, I was at 49 mil toughness, barely anything could do damage to me.
Now comes the 4 pc and Shadow Power always on is GODLIKE. So fast, so furious, much damage reduction, I said wow. The ring affix that gives you 50% or more damage reduction after you vault is fucking insane, I was at 49 mil toughness, barely anything could do damage to me.
Go higher son. The shit you described is standard fare fore getting one of the cookie cutter sets.
Sounds a lot of fun though!
Shuggananas
Banned
Haha, I reach 500M toughness on my crusader, and it's even more if you take into account spells that aren't factored in (iron skin being *2 for instance but doesn't affect toughness)
JohnOfMars
Banned
Man, coming back after last playing in 2.2. This game, man. They keep improving it. The CUBE. Holy shit, the CUBE! So much fun both powering up and experimenting with stuff.
I'm a little at a loss for how to progress my barbarian, though. Before I quit, the meta for 2.2 was 6Immortal King/4Wastes Whirlwind with Ring of Royal Grandeur.
Now it's 6IK2Wastes Rend or 6Wastes2BK if I want to keep spinning to win, but when I equip those sets my DPS and survivability goes way down. :-/
Here's my character. I just recently assembled all the 6 piece sets and so it's far from optimized. Just trying to figure out which set I should focus on. If there are any Barbs out there I'd appreciate the help.
I'm a little at a loss for how to progress my barbarian, though. Before I quit, the meta for 2.2 was 6Immortal King/4Wastes Whirlwind with Ring of Royal Grandeur.
Now it's 6IK2Wastes Rend or 6Wastes2BK if I want to keep spinning to win, but when I equip those sets my DPS and survivability goes way down. :-/
Here's my character. I just recently assembled all the 6 piece sets and so it's far from optimized. Just trying to figure out which set I should focus on. If there are any Barbs out there I'd appreciate the help.
The 2 piece for Wastes is going to waste for your build. You're not using rend. Either go 6piece wastes or use other items such as 6pc Immortals without RRoG. The Fury of the Ancients shoulder and the IK gloves might be a better option.
Huh?
6IK/2wastes is one of the best Barb builds right now. Rend for damage and WW for survivability and reducing your wotb cooldown.
It and 6Wastes/2BK are about on par with each other.
Extra p.s. 6 IK/4 Wastes was always shit tier compared to 6Wastes/BK even in 2.2.
JohnOfMars
Banned
Thanks for the replies, guys. So it seems that Whirlwind is out for damage, but still in for mobility/survivability? That may explain why my eDPS went down when I tried 6Wastes or 6IK, since I wasn't doing much rending. I'll try those tonight.
Your setup looks kinda mixed right now, you have the skills of a pure WW build but the gear of a Rend build.
If you want to stick to Rend you need to replace your rings with Focus/Restraint and your belt with Lamentation (Each of those double your damage) and your cube ring with Unity. Then change out Ignore Pain/Battle Rage for Furious Charge/Rend.
If you want to go WW go full Wastes with BK weapons and replace your bracers with something else and your RoRG with Unity. Then change ancients with something like threat shout.