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Digital Devil Saga is amazing

Shouta said:
Just get to the last dungeon. If you kill mobs towards the end of the tower in one or two rounds, they'll be plopping 50k a piece if not a little more.
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What do you mean by 'last dungeon'? Cuz I got all the way to the last boss, and Titanias, with there 33k (3 of 'em killed within my first round, before they even get to attack), was by far the best money I was making, and by far not enough.

If you mean the extra dungeons that open up around then... the fights take too long because all I seem to be fighting are tons of Sammael dragons, which can not only put up a strong fight, but give shit rewards too. *sighs*

3x Titanias USED to give me almost 50k, but for whatever reason, they only give me 33k now.
 
The last major savepoint (Karma D I think) is where I earned most of my money. I don't remember the enemy configs but I was getting upwards of 50k a battle on most enemies that I killed in one or two turns. I'll have to load it up another day to see.
 
The high level mantras aren't too bad if you set up your team with an array of hunt skills. I used Atma Bonus, AP Divide, Iron Stomach, and Insatiable as the hunt skill. The problem I have is the cost of the high level mantras (1400000, whew!!)
 
I think I was making an average of 20k there. Ugh. :(

Edit - Yeah Mox. APs are NOT the problem. Macca is. At this point, where 350 - 500k are my cheapest remaining Mantras, I've got 3 or 4 of my guys learning NOTHING because I don't have enough cash to support their Mantras!
 
From what I read at Gamefaqs, once you pass a certain level, the Karma Temple starts penalizing your Macca gains... apparently if they feel you're scumming levels for money and exp. That's why Titania fights that used to gain me 45k now only gain me 33k... etc.

Titanias are also kinda handy because they can drop Cells. Either Logic or Theory, I forget.
 
I believe that level depends entirely on the enemy you're fighting. This final dungeon was not the first time my Macca gains decreased substantially. I'm in my 70s now, btw.
 
I can't remember the name of the enemy, but there's some enemy you fight very rarely in the sewers and the last level (maybe elsewhere?) that you can only damage with guns, don't they give you a lot of exp/money/drops? My memory's pretty rusty, but I remember those guys being a big deal for that reason.
 
Man, if you guys like DDS this much you're gonna be blown the fuck away when DDS:AT2 arrives. Sooooo much better ;)
 
Even though I couldn't get myself into SMT3 N (I had SMT3 NM-JPN and SMT N-US) after a couple of sessions, after reading so much praises about the 2 DDS, I bought DDS AT (deluxe box set at US$50) and DDS AT2 (at bargain price, around US$25) today, hopefully I can get into them.
 
maskrider said:
Even though I couldn't get myself into SMT3 N (I had SMT3 NM-JPN and SMT N-US) after a couple of sessions, after reading so much praises about the 2 DDS, I bought DDS AT (deluxe box set at US$50) and DDS AT2 (at bargain price, around US$25) today, hopefully I can get into them.
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I skipped nocturne (well, okay, it's on the shelf but I've never bothered to play it) and bought DDS this weekend...probably put in at least 12 hours of time, which is far more than usual for me lately. There's just something about the game that pulls me in.

Now, if only I could find that right statue key, because I'm starting to think I've spent a few too many hours in the dungeon (lv18 characters, Serph has iron stomach already).
 
Himuro said:
Statue key? The Solid's base?
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Probably. It's been a while since I actually heard the name. I need two statue keys to turn the eyes on the statues blue, and while the left one was rather trivial to find, the right one is likely hiding somewhere past another statue maze of which I can't reach the bottom right corner. (well, it better be around there because I have run out of other places to look).

I did just notice the yellow guys change eye color though...maybe it's something about that.
 
I finished God of War last night, so it's time to begin my next game.

I've had DDS since it released, but was afraid of starting it while I was still in graduate school. I picked up Nocturne (used LE copy with OST for $40) the other day, and I'm unsure which one to play first. If I start DDS, it means I'll probably tackle DDS2 before I get around to Nocturne, but that doesn't bother me too much.

So, which one of these SMT games should I begin when I get home tonight?
 
Crazymoogle said:
I did just notice the yellow guys change eye color though...maybe it's something about that.
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The yellow eyes change to their true color when you get close to them. Knowing that, the maze is easy.

distantmantra said:
So, which one of these SMT games should I begin when I get home tonight?
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I'd go with DDS.
 
So, which one of these SMT games should I begin when I get home tonight?
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Well, it really depends on what you're looking for. Although the games share a lot of similarities, Digital Devil Saga is more focused on character development and dungeon crawling. SMT: Nocturne is more of a full-fledged, epic RPG, and is longer and much deeper than DDS.

I prefer SMT: Nocturne.
 
Himuro said:
NO. I refuse. i want to make everyone learn every mantra, and I want to do it the first playthrough. Might as well do all the sidequests and waterway dungeons.
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I feel the someway, but not that powering up has slowed to a never-ending crawl, I just can't manage to boot the game back up. Currently in one of the Waterways.
 
I'm not sure how many there are... 4 I guess? I think you have to beat the Frost King and human form Be'elzebub optional bosses first. At least, that's what I did, before hitting up the waterways. To actually unlock them, I think what triggered it was a conversation in the VERY beginning (first screen) outside of the Karma Temple.

Remember those two angels blocking the bridge, and the wounded tribe member that couldn't pass 'em? Well, I noticed, on my way out to explore the optional content, that he was standing on the other side of the bridge (right side of the screen, instead of the left), and he reveals how communication with some other tribe members were lost, and suggests rumors about new, powerful demons.
 
As I said, the very first screen.

When you enter the Karma Temple area from the main overworld map, you have to span a bridge (initially guarded by 2 of those dark angel things). That's where the NPC is that triggered the hidden stuff.

Frost King is a joke. Human Be'elzebub is not. He should be accessible, yes. Vanguard base, IIRC, beyond the Red Key Gate.
 
Nooo... I got the Red Key quite some time ago. The first sewers, I think? 3rd to last required dungeon, that is.
 
Himuro said:
Oh, the first waterways? Ok. I thought I completed it though..odd. Thanks.
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One of those water-chute puzzles in the Waterways. It's located BEHIND a large waterfall in the sewer. Very annoying puzzle, much bigger than the last one.
 
Himuro said:
How do I get that gold treasure thing on the top floor of the Brutes hide out? You see it outside but how do you get to it? =/ :(
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There are a variety of chests, such as this one, that cannot be attained until the Hidden Bosses are slain.

The 3 chests as the very bottom of Embryon's first base are a good example, too.
 
just finished the game, what a great experience, best ps2 rpg for me (so far).

and I just can't wait for the sequel, that ending was more confusing than revealing so I hope that when I finish the second one I can say "ah, so that's how it was"
 
Himuro said:
What beasts do you ever mean Meji?
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Aren't there four Legendary Beasts or something. I haven't gotten that far, so I'm not sure. But I thought they appear in some of the empty rooms that suspiciously lie within Green/Yellow/Red Gate protected areas.
 
Whats arguably the best path for Serph? So far i've focused on magic, strenght and luck while keeping vitality & agility not too low.

Did 2nd ice mantra then switched to lvl 2 devour path. Which mantra pays off the best late in the game?
 
I took the balanced path for the most part, paying more attention to strength and slightly neglecting luck. I reccomend keeping on the Hunt (Devour) path so you can acquire Iron Stomach and some other very useful skills. Also, it's not entirely important for you to pump up the Ice mantra for Serph, although I did. What's more important that you pump up his weakness, which is Fire. It will eventually allow you to get a skill that takes away his weakness. Do the same for everyone. Enemies will exploit your weaknesses later in the game if you don't protect yourself.
 
Ah, Shin Megami!

I'm really having a great time with Nocturne, after I discovered Estoma - brings the encounter rate back to something near reasonable. Saved it from flying through the window by a hair's breadth.

My favorite thing about Nocturne is the ability to talk to demons to recurit them - the various conversations, the banterings, the styles dependent on the demon, the subtle discrepancies between male/female interactions... - it was such a relief to find an RPG that contained a bit more during battles than "kill kill kill."

How does the sequel handle this? I'm hoping they had the sense to expand upon the conversation threads available during battle, but I've heard an ugly, dirty rumor that they've eliminated "talking" with the demons. This seems like an almost unbelievably bad idea, considering the demon conversations/negotiations were some of the best parts of Nocturne, so I'll take this as a cruel, venom-barbed lie for now.
 
Sea-Dragon said:
Ah, Shin Megami!

I'm really having a great time with Nocturne, after I discovered Estoma - brings the encounter rate back to something near reasonable. Saved it from flying through the window by a hair's breadth.

My favorite thing about Nocturne is the ability to talk to demons to recurit them - the various conversations, the banterings, the styles dependent on the demon, the subtle discrepancies between male/female interactions... - it was such a relief to find an RPG that contained a bit more during battles than "kill kill kill."

How does the sequel handle this? I'm hoping they had the sense to expand upon the conversation threads available during battle, but I've heard an ugly, dirty rumor that they've eliminated "talking" with the demons. This seems like an almost unbelievably bad idea, considering the demon conversations/negotiations were some of the best parts of Nocturne, so I'll take this as a cruel, venom-barbed lie for now.
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Digital Devil Saga is about as much a sequel to Nocturne as Final Fantasy VII is to Final Fantasy VIII. Basically not at all.

The games do share some common plot themes and gameplay mechanics, but Digital Devil Saga is an entirely different beast from Nocturne. Conversing with demons is gone in DDS, as is the ability to choose the outcome of the game, but in its stead you get a great story, and have a deeper character customization system where you not only have control overyour own abilities, but those of your party as well.
 
Sea-Dragon said:
Ah, Shin Megami!

I'm really having a great time with Nocturne, after I discovered Estoma - brings the encounter rate back to something near reasonable. Saved it from flying through the window by a hair's breadth.

My favorite thing about Nocturne is the ability to talk to demons to recurit them - the various conversations, the banterings, the styles dependent on the demon, the subtle discrepancies between male/female interactions... - it was such a relief to find an RPG that contained a bit more during battles than "kill kill kill."

How does the sequel handle this? I'm hoping they had the sense to expand upon the conversation threads available during battle, but I've heard an ugly, dirty rumor that they've eliminated "talking" with the demons. This seems like an almost unbelievably bad idea, considering the demon conversations/negotiations were some of the best parts of Nocturne, so I'll take this as a cruel, venom-barbed lie for now.
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Yeah no more conversing in DDS, but mainly because your goal has changed a bit, instead of recruiting demons now you have to devour all of them:P

You could maybe try to round up a copy of Persona 2:Eternal Punishment for the PSOne. It combines the cool, indepth story and characters of DDS with the demon conversing, collecting and fusing of Nocturne, just a flat out amazing game.

But to be fair....they're all amazing, what a great series.
 
I just got done with the solid's base and went back to the miralba(sp?) base to go after Mick, encountered the bat again and wasnt ready for all those mudo crap so i lost, but i'll put gale in priority next time, should be easy. Only sucky thing is none of my other characters have hama line of spells, so no weakness attacks, and since gale will be too busy casting void death, its gonna be the long/hard way.

Really fun game so far, i played like 12~14 hours of SMT nocturne before giving up because.. well the story wasnt too thrilling, its freaking complex (never played persona series before) and it loves kicking your ass, DDS seems to be much more friendly in that department and it actually has some pretty damn good voice acting o_o Who knows, maybe after finishing DDS i'll think of returning back to SMT:N after learning a thing or two about the series's mechanics.

I have serph on Holy beast, argilla with fierce spirit and heat with ogre mantra, i wonder how that combo gonna end up. Probably will have to decide between serph's devourer path & heat's physical path because i dont think i'll ever have enough macca to push both of them at the sametime.
 
You'd be surprised how much money your party starts earning in the later stages of the game. Also, be sure to sell every Cell you find at maximum solar noise. I found I had plenty of money at the end of the game, and I didn't even spend much time grinding levels.
 
No way. The main reason I haven't yet beaten the game is because I'm making so little money, it's proven unreasonably slow to power up my guys. I'm in what's arguably considered the Macca-richest area of the game, and it's still ridiculous. I need to grind millions in order to completely power up my guys, but just ran out of patience for it. :(
 
Well yeah, if you're looking to power up your party to the max, then of course it's going to take awhile. But you can make a party that will overwhelm the final boss without putting too much time/money into it. Unless you're dying to tackle the optional bosses, it's insane to ruin your experience with the game by getting burnt out from level grinding. The sequel is just around the corner. Finish the game.
 
That's the thing, if you get all of the mantras with your crew, they each get like 5 points per stat as a bonus when starting up DDS2. I kinda want that. :/ I think I'm in the process of hunting down some of the optional bosses at the moment. Got tired of fighting non-stop Sammael duos, however.
 
Mejilan said:
No way. The main reason I haven't yet beaten the game is because I'm making so little money, it's proven unreasonably slow to power up my guys. I'm in what's arguably considered the Macca-richest area of the game, and it's still ridiculous. I need to grind millions in order to completely power up my guys, but just ran out of patience for it. :(
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Have you not beaten it yet because you're too weak or because you're trying to get 100% powered up guys with full trees? I've heard that it takes a very long time to get some of the expensive spells.
 
I'm going for 100%, full trees for all 5. I'm pretty close, but I've gotten to the point where the I need close to 1 million Macca just to learn the next tree... for ONE guy. It's annoying, the game gives you SO much Atma, but not nearly enough Macca. I actually stopped hunting, because I just don't need the Atma anymore, it's a total waste.

Also, now that I passed level 70 with my crew, the Titanias (who used to give me close to 50k for every group of 3 fight I did, only give me 33k now.) Apparently the Karma Temple penalizes your Macca gains if you level too much. I got so irked at that point, that I just stopped playing.
 
I get confused as to all the different things you accumulate in this game. Karma, Atma, Macca.

Macca is like gold right? Which You can buy spells and items with? And Atma the stuff you have to aquire to fill up that bar to learn the spells?

edit: it's pretty obvious, but i just started.
 
Mantras are what you purchase from the Karma Temple. You buy them for each character, and they "equip" them, one at a time. Killing enemies net you Karma (experience points for leveling up your character) and Atma (skill experience for mastering Mantras.) Once you master a Mantra (by filling up the blue bar with Atma), you learn all of that Mantra's skills, and you can purchase a new one from the Karma Temple. Macca is the game's currency.

By the end of the game, accruing Atma is NO problem, but buying new Mantras becomes insanely expensive (over a million Macca for the high level ones, FOR EACH CHARACTER), and getting Macca becomes more and more difficult as you pass certain level plateaus. Apparently, the game penalizes you for attaining higher levels by lowering Macca rewards and Cell drop percentages. Cells are sold in shops for Macca.
 
I finally got all the mantras mastered, but felt like I wasted half my life doing so. I also beat the ultimate boss as well. I was going to see if I could beat him a better way but I was so wasted after trying to level up and kill that boss, I didn't have any desire to go back.

I didn't care for DDS as a whole (story) but I still got addicted to maxing out the everything. Almost feel like I have a love/hate relationship with the series. Flawed but still has it's good parts.
 
Any advise for accruing Macca? I would have had no problems grinding the money required to master all of the skills, but I have a backlog of games to play that's beyond belief. Any help would be appreciated. At this point, I probably won't beat the game if I don't max out my skill trees.

Also, does fully learning an elemental skill path grant you immunity from it as a weakness? I thought it only increased your chance to resist it as a weakness...
 
It seems pretty clear to me that the game designers designed it so that it is only reasonable to achieve perfection in a few paths, which would thus increase replayability by having the player play again to see what the game is like with a totally different skill set.
 
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