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[MadchesterManc]

Performance mode seems alright on console. Tough to see the cutbacks for 60fps when the post processing is so thick. Might give it another try on the Pro

- PS5 Pro does not have the occasional odd drops that PS5/SX have with only one drop seen in DF's testing

Get em told

 

[Bojji]

Nof to change the subject, but it's more annoying DF when they talked to prefer whatever upscaler over PSR without provide a video comparison to show what exactly they have seen of better. They did the same with Days Gone remaster. I would appreciate to see with my own eyes what is better in a video capture than hear what they "prefer".

What Tom prefers is irrelevant, game has setting for it so every player can choose. Video shows standard PSSR noise in action, at the same time TSR ghosting is AWFUL so I bet PSSR is much better in this aspect.

 

[Karim]

What Tom prefers is irrelevant, game has setting for it so every player can choose. Video shows standard PSSR noise in action, at the same time TSR ghosting is AWFUL so I bet PSSR is much better in this aspect.

You know from a tech analysis I expect to see a comparison. Where exactly PSSR is more noisy compared TSR? The only thing I noticed is the typical haze effect in the grass through the fog. But transparencies with TSR are more pixelated and aliased. Don't know if it's better such effects than the PSSR noise but it's really curious to hear he preferred it.

 

[Zacfoldor]

Nice performance on the pro! After playing the first one this is not my game, but glad for those who will enjoy it.

 

[Lagspike_exe]

The constant trashing of PSSR by DF is laughable. PSSR looks much better in motion than the non-ML upscalers. Judging them by still images when the spatial upscalers can accumulate a lot of signal is misleading.

 

[Killjoy-NL]

A very generous use of the word game.... Is hellblade 2 a game? Many would argue otherwise.

Many opinions don't matter, as there is no set criteria to what constitutes a game.

 

[Karim]

The constant trashing of PSSR by DF is laughable. PSSR looks much better in motion than the non-ML upscalers. Judging them by still images when the spatial upscalers can accumulate a lot of signal is misleading.

They are literally the major experts to find out any PSSR limitations but about TSR and FSR or whatever are far more accomodating. It's really a weird attitude.

 

[Lagspike_exe]

They are literally the major experts to find out any PSSR limitations but about TSR and FSR or whatever are far more accomodating. It's really a weird attitude.

A lot of their reporting is flat out bizarre. I remember when they did not particularly like BG3 PS5 Pro. I played a ton of BG3 on OG PS5. The difference in performance mode vs. OG PS5 is absolute night and day. You have to be seriously biased to claim it's not a huge leap by cherry picking issues.

 

[Karim]

A lot of their reporting is flat out bizarre. I remember when they did not particularly like BG3 PS5 Pro. I played a ton of BG3 on OG PS5. The difference in performance mode vs. OG PS5 is absolute night and day. You have to be seriously biased to claim it's not a huge leap by cherry picking issues.

Because they always focused to the flaws when they look at the PSSR. PSSR it's limited with AA and denoising but in motion give more or less the same quality in still where the others upscales are better in still but when you start to move show all their limits compared the PSSR.
Mark my words when the PSSR will be expanded with the FSR4 algorithm, FSR4 won't be more so good because DF will find any sort of flaws who missed when FSR4 was only on pc. My safe bet.

 

[Diego Brasil]

- PS5 Pro does not have the occasional odd drops that PS5/SX have with only one drop seen in DF's testing

Sorry, I didn't notice that in the text...

but you forgot this one.

 

[adamsapple]

Sorry, I didn't notice that in the text...

but you forgot this one.

Added.

 

[Panajev2001a]

- New update adds 60fps mode to Series X as well as launching with this update on PS5/Pro.
- PS5 Pro allows switching between PSSR and UE5's built-in TSR up-scaling
- The game is now official Steam Deck supported as well

- The 60FPS performance mode works really well across the board with only minor drops observed, with PS5 Pro having the least of them.
- The appreciable visible difference between the 30 and 60fps modes is rather small.
- The biggest difference is change in DRS. Series X goes from 1600p to 1080 with DRS mostly staying close to higher bounds (1593p in Quality and 1069 in Perf.)
- Things like foliage do lose some clarity at range along with some extra visual noise on things like Senua's hair
- TSR upscale to 1440p in Performance mode and 2160p in Quality mode

- Base PS5's DRS range is often lower than Series X with Quality being 1432p (vs 1593p) and Performance being 989p (vs. 1069p)
- The final TSR resolve targets the same max resolutions (2160p in Quality and 1440p in Performance)

- Performance mode retains all of UE5's features (Lumen, Nanite, VSM) with making only granular changes to their coverage
- Some other post process elements like Depth of Field and some screen space fog are lowered in quality in Performance mode

- Engine level animation rigging and mesh changes that had to be made for Performance mode also rolled into Quality mode
- DF says that while the reduced milisecond budget would make things like pop-in more obvious, it was hard to catch it in their testing
- 'Too many tweaks to mention but the key point is that 60fps works and it works well'
- Sudden change in lighting which can cause DRS to stress can see a single digit frame drop or two during game play with SX seeing this a bit more
- Other than that some minor traversal hitching observed during traversal between areas

PS5 Pro:
- Quality and Performance mode with the choice of choosing PSSR or UE5's TSR mode
- DRS ranges are higher on Pro with Perf mode now targeting 1200p (vs 1080p on PS5/SX) with average of 1166p
- Quality mode runs at 1700p DRS with average of 1696p at 30fps
- Both modes reconstruct to 4K
- Rocks, foliage etc are better defined on PS5 Pro compared to base PS5
- Variable Rate Shading is introduced on PS5 Pro
- Shadow quality and DoF runs at higher pre-sets on Pro's performance mode vs base PS5
- PSSR was back-ported from future UE5 versions as it does not natively support the version this game was made on
- DF's preferred up-scaler is TSR as PSSR can show noise and artifacts in specular highlights
- PSSR can show better coverage when moving
- Though the heavy post process often makes them hard to differentiate
- PS5 Pro does not have the occasional odd drops that PS5/SX have with only one drop seen in DF's testing

Steam Deck:
- The update makes the game run better at 30fps, makes it kind of like a portable Series S version.
- Low settings at 768p with TSR up-scaling makes the game run at a practically solid 30fps with only minor drops
- Some optimizations were made at reducing settings that won't be obvious to players
- 20% improvement and reduction in stutter observed in some areas where other areas show slighter boosts to 7%
- Stuttering still remains in some places.
- DF recommends using 30fps lock with TSR up-scaling to maintain a steady 30 versus running the game unlocked

PC:
- PC's 'very high' setting preset essentially improves all the effects one rung above they were.
- DF did not go into it much.

This thing about preferring TSR to PSSR even though the latter looks better in motion feels odd…

 

[adamsapple]

This thing about preferring TSR to PSSR even though the latter looks better in motion feels odd…

Going by what they say, TSR is more stable, less noise and artifacts.

The game is so heavily post processed that it's barely possible to tell it apart in most cases anyway.

 

[Karim]

Going by what they say, TSR is more stable, less noise and artifacts.

The game is so heavily post processed that it's barely possible to tell it apart in most cases anyway.

TSR more stable, less noise and artifacts. A miracle happened there.

 

[playbignbox]

The constant trashing of PSSR by DF is laughable. PSSR looks much better in motion than the non-ML upscalers. Judging them by still images when the spatial upscalers can accumulate a lot of signal is misleading.

I watched the video and didn't see the "much better in motion" you mentioned.

The truth is that the PSSR is a disappointment; it was just another piece of misleading marketing by Sony to sell the PS5 Pro.

 

[Lagspike_exe]

Going by what they say, TSR is more stable, less noise and

The game is so heavily post processed that it's barely possible to tell it apart in most cases anyway.

TSR is obviously not better in motion. Watch the video.

 

[Karim]

I watched the video and didn't see the "much better in motion" you mentioned.

The truth is that the PSSR is a disappointment; it was just another piece of misleading marketing by Sony to sell the PS5 Pro.

Ok show us how much better is TSR over PSSR. Make a capture. TSR and FSR can be better only in still in AA and denoising though more blurred. The problem are when you start to move or something else moving.

 

[viveks86]

Going by what they say, TSR is more stable, less noise and artifacts.

Not in motion. In stills. Even for a barely interactive game like this, that's a useless conclusion. DF needs to rethink who they are making recommendations for. People who play the game or pause it. I don't think they are doing this out of bias. They are doing this out of staring too much at static screens.

 

[playbignbox]

Ok show us how much better is TSR over PSSR. Make a capture.

Just put it at 14:50 of the video and you will see the noises in the PSSR that are not in the TSR?

 

[Karim]

Just put it at 14:50 of the video and you will see the noises in the PSSR that are not in the TSR?

Where? What details I have to look? If you zoom to the grass there are even more raytracing pixellated artifacts with TSR.

 

[gerth666]

Steamdeck looks like watching one of those XVid DVD rips from the early 00s.
I'm not even saying that in a bad way - it's just - uncanny from the noise to blocking artifacts...

Also I don't get the upscaler recommendation.
In every shot the voice-over is comparing them - TSR is noticeably more artifact-ridden/noisy, and obviously less clear in motion. Is the 'screenshot' image quality of games really that valuable to DF?

Come on mate everyone knows you only buy games to take screenshots, and not play them.

 

[viveks86]

I would appreciate to see with my own eyes what is off indeed... Can you show us please?

There are two issues with it. One is specular highlights. He doesn't show this in the comparison, but you would see it flickering in the two marked areas in full screen at around 14:36-14:40.

EDIT: It's actually even more visible a few seconds before around 14:34

The other is slightly more distant detail with TSR in stills. This is simply how PSSR works in general. It's softer. This is simply due to slightly different levels of sharpening between TSR and PSSR.

Overall, neither issues are worse than the very obvious noisiness of TSR, which is in the same comparison footage but he somehow glosses over. There is so much visible flickering with TSR that's far more subtle with PSSR in that comparison.

And who cares about stills, right? So imo, PSSR is better as per the shown footage. Nothing dramatic. Not even by a good margin. I'm just glad it didn't shit the bed like Silent Hill 2.

 

[Lagspike_exe]

There are two issues with it. One is specular highlights. He doesn't show this in the comparison, but you would see it flickering in the two circled areas in full screen at around 14:36-14:40.

The other is slightly more distant detail with TSR in stills. This is simply how PSSR works in general. It's softer. This is simply due to slightly different levels of sharpening between TSR and PSSR.

Overall, neither issues are worse than the very obvious noisiness of TSR, which is in the same comparison footage but he somehow glosses over. There is so much visible flickering with TSR that's far more subtle with PSSR in that comparison.

And who cares about stills, right? So imo, PSSR is better as per the shown footage. Nothing dramatic. Not even by a good margin. I'm just glad it didn't shit the bed like Silent Hill 2.

These were pretty much my impressions as well. TSR flickering in motion in very obvious in the scenes you highlighted.

 

[Karim]

There are two issues with it. One is specular highlights. He doesn't show this in the comparison, but you would see it flickering in the two marked areas in full screen at around 14:36-14:40.

EDIT: It's actually even more visible a few seconds before around 14:34

The other is slightly more distant detail with TSR in stills. This is simply how PSSR works in general. It's softer. This is simply due to slightly different levels of sharpening between TSR and PSSR.

Overall, neither issues are worse than the very obvious noisiness of TSR, which is in the same comparison footage but he somehow glosses over. There is so much visible flickering with TSR that's far more subtle with PSSR in that comparison.

And who cares about stills, right? So imo, PSSR is better as per the shown footage. Nothing dramatic. Not even by a good margin. I'm just glad it didn't shit the bed like Silent Hill 2.

You kidding. Without offence to your dedication, TSR in motion is always a pixelated/ghosting show. PSSR is nothing of special because TSR in still has some sharper/more stable details? It's really a personal take. PSSR it's a league ahead. I mean I have played enough games to notice TSR never reach the same stability and clarity of PSSR in motion. Now if we want say it's not perfect, sure, but it's out of mind see preference for such limited upscaler.

 

[adamsapple]

And who cares about stills, right? So imo, PSSR is better as per the shown footage. Nothing dramatic. Not even by a good margin. I'm just glad it didn't shit the bed like Silent Hill 2.

PSSR (right) shows more noise/flickering type artifacts on the plank if you move this segment a bit forward.

Tried to gif it, not sure if it's a good representative but keep an eye on the plank on the right side.

 

[Karim]

PSSR (right) shows more noise/flickering type artifacts on the plank if you move this segment a bit forward.

Tried to gif it, not sure if it's a good representative but keep an eye on the plank on the right side.

And TSR show pixelation/ghosting around the characters plus pixelation where PSSR flicker/aliased.

 

[viveks86]

You kidding. TSR in motion is pixelated/ghosting show. PSSR is nothing of special because TSR in still has some sharper/more stable details? That's really a personal take. PSSR it's a league ahead without any offence. I mean I have played enough games, I hardly seen TSR reach the same stability and clarity of PSSR in motion.

That's fair. I just wanted to try and point out what the differences even are, as the DF commentary doesn't line up with the footage.

 

[viveks86]

PSSR (right) shows more noise/flickering type artifacts on the plank if you move this segment a bit forward.

Tried to gif it, not sure if it's a good representative but keep an eye on the plank on the right side.

Yeah I see that. But don't you think the flickering with TSR in the comparison is more obvious? All upscaling comes with some drawbacks after all. What is more noticeable?

 

[playbignbox]

Where? What details I have to look? If you zoom to the grass there are even more raytracing pixellated artifacts with TSR.

Man, I think the mere fact that we're discussing all this and needing to capture distant scenes with zoom shows that the differences aren't "much better." And this becomes even more questionable when we see the TSR being better in some situations.

I just find this attempt to create some problem with DF funny, as if they were biased because they think TSR is better in this title.

There's only one real problem with all this: Sony overpromised with the PSSR, and it's nowhere near what they wanted to convey in that PS5 Pro presentation. It was a marketing ploy, and many people fell for it once again. In fact, the PS5 Pro as a whole is a disappointment.

 

[adamsapple]

Yeah I see that. But don't you think the flickering with TSR in the comparison is more obvious? All upscaling comes with some drawbacks after all. What is more noticeable?

I don't think either is noticeable in regular motion, lol. Like mentioned before, the game's thick layers of post processing cover over most 'blemishes' anyway.

 

[Markio128]

I tried the original on Pro this evening and it looks pretty darn good. I doubt I'll finish it again though because those puzzles are tedious as fook the 2nd time around.

For those who have played the sequel, are the puzzles the same kind of deal - aligning broken up symbols to open doors?

 

[viveks86]

I don't think either is noticeable in regular motion, lol. Like mentioned before, the game's thick layers of post processing cover over most 'blemishes' anyway.

We can agree on that. For the most part, the average gamer wouldn't notice. And for a game that looks this good on console, that's all credit to the devs.

If only the game itself was good...

 

[Karim]

Man, I think the mere fact that we're discussing all this and needing to capture distant scenes with zoom shows that the differences aren't "much better." And this becomes even more questionable when we see the TSR being better in some situations.

I just find this attempt to create some problem with DF funny, as if they were biased because they think TSR is better in this title.

There's only one real problem with all this: Sony overpromised with the PSSR, and it's nowhere near what they wanted to convey in that PS5 Pro presentation. It was a marketing ploy, and many people fell for it once again. In fact, the PS5 Pro as a whole is a disappointment.

What exactly Sony overpromised with the PSSR? Enlight us. It's definitely better than FSR or TSR if it's what you meant, such upscalers are quite limited at lower base resolution in motion. You can have appreciable result at 1080p, below it, they are both more problematic and ineffective than PSSR. A disappointment it's read again and again all the same generic arguments without provide effective basis but just complains.

 

[playbignbox]

What exactly Sony overpromise with the PSSR? Delight us. It's definitely better than FSR or TSR if it's what you meant, such upscalers are quite limited at low base resolution in motion. You can have appreciable result at 1080p, below it, they are both more problematic and ineffective than PSSR.

What did Sony overpromise? Did you watch the presentation and see how they emphasized PSSR? Do I need to name all the games like Silent Hill 2, Jedi Survivor or Alan Wake 2 that got worse with PSSR? Exactly in the games that most "need" a competent upscaling solution.

Hellblade 2 is another example of how this upscaling technique isn't anything special, and yet you guys still defend it, lol

Not only that, you guys even want to criticize DF for pointing this out lol

 

[Karim]

What did Sony overpromise? Did you watch the presentation and see how they emphasized PSSR? Do I need to name all the games like Silent Hill 2, Jedi Survivor or Alan Wake 2 that got worse with PSSR? Exactly in the games that most "need" a competent upscaling solution.

Hellblade 2 is another example of how this upscaling technique isn't anything special, and yet you guys still defend it, lol

Not only that, you guys even want to criticize DF for pointing this out lol

Excuse me? Lol they are not absolutely worse the hell you even talking about. Yeah I exactly blame DF because people disinformed like you always reach such stupid conclusions thanks to them without even really know of what they talking about.

 

[playbignbox]

Excuse me? Lol they are not absolutely worse the hell you even talking about. Yeah exactly blame DF because people like you always reach such stupid conclusions.

The only stupid conclusion is to defend a technique that you can't even tell the difference from (like in the video) or that makes it worse. You know they removed it from SH2 Remake, right? Or that it became more unstable in Alan Wake 2?

Anyway, I'm tired of answering your questions by pretending not to understand. Keep defending the company that delivers a mediocre solution but charges a premium price tied to the hardware.

 

[Flabagast]

What did Sony overpromise? Did you watch the presentation and see how they emphasized PSSR? Do I need to name all the games like Silent Hill 2, Jedi Survivor or Alan Wake 2 that got worse with PSSR? Exactly in the games that most "need" a competent upscaling solution.

Hellblade 2 is another example of how this upscaling technique isn't anything special, and yet you guys still defend it, lol

Not only that, you guys even want to criticize DF for pointing this out lol

After updating to the Pro I was set aback by how bad the IQ in AW2 looks (in balance 40 FPS mode), it's all a shimmering blurry mess.

 

[Karim]

The only stupid conclusion is to defend a technique that you can't even tell the difference from (like in the video) or that makes it worse. You know they removed it from SH2 Remake, right? Or that it became more unstable in Alan Wake 2?

Anyway, I'm tired of answering your questions by pretending not to understand. Keep defending the company that delivers a mediocre solution but charges a premium price tied to the hardware.

I'm not defending anything. You simply don't know of what you talking spite out approximate discourses. Neither DF has ever talked of games getting worse with the PSSR. This is just trolling.

 

[playbignbox]

After updating to the Pro I was set aback by how bad the IQ in AW2 looks (in balance 40 FPS mode), it's all a shimmering blurry mess.

No man, your eyes are biased by DF lmao

 

[Karim]

After updating to the Pro I was set aback by how bad the IQ in AW2 looks (in balance 40 FPS mode), it's all a shimmering blurry mess.

Shimmering ok but blurry mess wut FSR2 it's more blurried than PSSR eh.

 

[Karim]

No man, your eyes are biased by DF lmao

 

[Radical_3d]

Everyone's doing Epic's work, trying to optimise that POS of an engine. Fantastic work by ninja theory and a beacon of hope to the future CDPR optimisations for The Witcher 4.

 

[DanielG165]

NT are genuine masters of UE. Really really impressive gains here, especially considering the improvements/enhancements. I hadn't thought Hellblade 2 would ever see a 60 fps mode on console, and not one that is as rock solid as this one is. I've already played through it once on PC, but I may just give it a try on Series X now too.

Awesome work all around! These consoles still have plenty left in the tank, especially with proper optimization.

 

[Shmunter]

Still weird seeing Microsoft Corporation on the Playstation Dashboard


P.S
What is the Playstation 5 Dashboard official name?

Playboard

 

[Shmunter]

Finished it in the 480Super in the day. Performance was lackluster with the hitching.

Good too see consoles give a superior experience overall. Will dip on pro when deep discount.

 

[gerth666]

The only stupid conclusion is to defend a technique that you can't even tell the difference from (like in the video) or that makes it worse. You know they removed it from SH2 Remake, right? Or that it became more unstable in Alan Wake 2?

Anyway, I'm tired of answering your questions by pretending not to understand. Keep defending the company that delivers a mediocre solution but charges a premium price tied to the hardware.

I've played Alan wake 2 loads, and the pssr mode is better then the fsr2 mode.
Especially when you actually play the game, i.e move the camera.
Silent hill 2 is definitely a crappy implementation, it looks awful especially in the performance mode

 

[Vaquilla]

Given it holds up okay on Steam Deck, it'd be cool to see a Switch 2 port just for curiosity's sake.

Hellblade 1 on Switch was a pretty fascinating case.

 

[TheKratos]

This might sound crazy I was not wowed by the graphics. Don't get me wrong, they are very impressive, but it might be the art style that just doesn't wow. Kingdome Come 2 and Indiana Jones for example looked absolutely stunning.

 

[mrMUR_96]

Any change for series s?

 

[metareferential]

Welcome to next-gen graphics, Playstation.

Before you idiots come around with the same old "no gameplay argument": if you don't like the game, I don't give a damn. It's the best looking game out there, period.

And by the way: give it a chance. It's a great ride (aside from some boring puzzles, which were even more boring in the first game), especially so on a nice screen with some good audio.