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[Mokujin]

For someone who would never play the switch undocked, what the hell would I want to buy another console which is on par with the wii u? Especially with enhanced ports of Mario kart etc coming. Went from 100% on a preorder to now waiting and seeing. Hype deflated. FFS Nintendo.

These clocks are only a notch below Tegra X1 which any sane person expected, and still 3xWii U. So clearly it was never going to be on Xbox 1/ Ps4 level, why where you 100% on preorder then? Are you one of those expecting a Ps4 Pro portable?

PS4 is $249 w/ Uncharted 4 right now on Amazon.com

good fucking luck to Nintendo if they launch this thing at $249. If you're releasing a home console (like the advertising says!) and yet claim you aren't competing with Sony or Microsoft, you can't price it like the competition!

Needs to be $199. 3DS at $99.

Last I checked I couldn't use my Ps4 as a portable.

 

[metalslimer]

We also have to remember the PS4 and XB1 will have variants at 199 next holiday. Nintendo having a weaker "home console" at a higher price than that is really not going to be acceptable.

 

[Lebon14]

So... let me get this right...

People were expecting the power of a low-end desktop (at least as powerful as XB1 or PS4) in a very small chassis, run all games 60 fps/1080p docked or in portable, have a great battery life while on the go and cheap. Unrealistic much?

However, we should be thankful that CPU stays at the same clock and memory bandwith can stay at a very good 1600MHz (if devloppers so choose). For the GPU, sure 768MHz while docked is disappointing. Even then, architectural benefits should fill some gaps with the PS4/XB1. We have to remember that, in portable mode, we only have to care about 720p resolution rendering which, imo, is very feasible with that cpu at these clocks. And, at these clocks, 3GB of RAM is well more than enough.

 

[Terrell]

Gosh, you'd swear I was in a GameCube spec thread circa 2001.
Remember that, when its CPU and GPU clocked significantly under PS2 and Xbox and everyone said it was too weak to compete? Remember how that turned out?

 

[bomblord1]

We also have to remember the PS4 and XB1 will have variants at 199 next holiday. Nintendo having a weaker "home console" at a higher price than that is really not going to be acceptable.

But they have the most powerful portable.

 

[nogoodnamesleft]

So... let me get this right...

People were expecting the power of a low-end desktop (at least as powerful as XB1 or PS4) in a very small chassis, run all games 60 fps/1080p docked or in portable, have a great battery life while on the go.

Again, who expected this? Link please

 

[th3sicknness]

This thing is WiiU 2. That doesn't bode well. Too weak for a home console, and too expensive for a portable.

Speaking of WiiU's effect on game support...

These numbers might be a moot point considering Nintendo can release their portable IP on a home console now and drastically increase the base to attract other parties to develop.

The Wii U never got Pokemon, Fire Emblem, Bravely Series, Yo-Kai watch,Professor Layton, Animal Crossing, Lugi's Mansion, Kid Icarus and so on.

 

[jroc74]

Wii got ton of support from publishers which were still interested in releasing SD games or family friendly games.
The main platform which shared multiplatform games with Wii was actually PS2 but eventually the console was so successful that publishers began making exclusive Wii version of multiplatform games available on PS3/Xbox 360/PC.

Interesting. Kinda makes you wonder if thats why the Wii wasnt 720p, 1080p.

Great stuff!

Nintendo Switch portable mode:

this thread

Nintendo Switch docked mode:

Need to remove the v from the end of the URL.

This is amazing.

 

[Relentless 757]

How is it expansive for a portable if you don't know the price yet?

Also, why you're so sure it's Wii U 2?? Because if you're making this analogy based only in the weak hardware do not ignore OG Wii.

While true, the OG Wii also had an enticing "gimmick". Motion controls were new and exciting, and it pulled in the casual crowd and many gamers alike.

Now, Nintendo is essentially making a console that you can play anywhere! But, is this something people actual want and care about, or is this gimmick gonna fall on its face like the Wii U. Because let's face it, people have phones now and only the hardcore Nintendo fans are gonna use it. I personally don't see it doing very well myself. Maybe GC numbers.

 

[Lom1lo]

While dropping to 40% sounds major, talking to my graphics programmer it may not be as bad as it sounds.

The handheld unit has 44% of the pixels of the docked version. While performance doesn't scale exactly with number of pixels, it's still going to be a big factor here.

There are also a lot of image quality bells and whistles you can live without on a smaller screen. For example, turning off shadows, AA, etc. would have significant performance savings and wouldn't be as noticeable on the smaller screen.

At least as far as I'm concerned, I'm fine with some graphical sacrifices in order to enjoy games on the go. I mean, we've only been doing that forever. So I fail to see why this is all that different or surprising.

The problem here is not the 40% drop this was expected (Im surprised it isnt 50%). Its the clock speed of the docked mode, I really Hope nintendo doubled the multiprocessors of the gpu, and use a 8 Core Cpu. But I have no idea if thats possible, there is a good post here explaining this better.

 

[CrustyBritches]

It has the same amount of first party games/year as the highest on the list....

edit: Or are we comparing third party?

3rd-party and total sales. I expect 1st-party output to increase, obviously.

 

[krizalidzero]

These numbers might be a moot point considering Nintendo can release their portable IP on a home console now and drastically increase the base to attract other parties to develop.

The Wii U never got Pokemon, Fire Emblem, Bravely Series, Yo-Kai watch,Professor Layton, Animal Crossing, Lugi's Mansion, Kid Icarus and so on.

Exactly. This console is genius - all of their efforts and money into one system.

The only problem being is that many users/costumers have/had both the Wii U and 3DS, so it might make them sell less HW in total, but the software numbers will probably outweigh that.

 

[DrROBschiz]

We also have to remember the PS4 and XB1 will have variants at 199 next holiday. Nintendo having a weaker "home console" at a higher price than that is really not going to be acceptable.

people dont buy Nintendo hardware to have another ps4

the difference in the value proposition you are making wont be a factor unless the marketing is somehow identical

 

[DeuceGamer]

We also have to remember the PS4 and XB1 will have variants at 199 next holiday. Nintendo having a weaker "home console" at a higher price than that is really not going to be acceptable.

We don't know what the price is at launch and definitely don't know what it will be at next holiday. With that said, even if it is more expensive it will do just fine as long as it's not tremendously more expensive and Nintendo has the games people want. They have to deliver the software but from what we know about the price I don't think that's going to be the issue if Switch fails.

 

[MacTag]

This isn't a rumor. It's a well established news source with legitimate direct connections to the industry stating hard numbers with phrasing and certainty that would indicate they're holding a goddamn spec sheet. When the New York Times runs an article on political corruption and cites "sources" it isn't a rumor. This is the video game analog to that.

Meanwhile your rebuttal is some random person who knows some other random person who maybe knows something or is maybe just full of shit. That is a rumor.

Laura Dale isn't exactly some random person who knows some other random person who maybe knows something or is maybe just full of shit. She's an established games journalist, was at Destructiod before starting LPVG, and every leak (not rumor) she's reported on she's had multiple verifiable sources for. And her track record for NX/Switch info has been 100% spot on so far (unlike Eurogamer btw).

That said she also backed EG's spec article although she only had one source for it. But Dark Souls III running on the hardware is every bit as credible and these clocks are (and I'd argue bith aren't mutually exclusive either), you can't simply dismiss one as a rumor and not the other given the sources and track records involved.

 

[Roo]

oh bummer

you would think it could clock up a bit on direct power

they should put more thought into this but I remain optimistic

I mean, if the games have performance issues while in handheld mode compared to docked then I'd agree with you but if that's not the case and they run just as good as docked mode but at lower resolution then it'd be only a waste of energy as you wouldn't even notice the difference on the 720p screen.

I actually think they did the right thing here. The system would run hot way more often if docked mode were enabled just by plugging the charge cable.

 

[blankempathy]

Exactly. This console is genius - all of their efforts and money into one system.

The only problem being is that many users/costumers have/had both the Wii U and 3DS, so it might make them sell less HW in total, but the software numbers will probably outweigh that.

True but if the switch does combine Nintendo's portable/console games on one console it may entice those who were interested in Nintendo games but didn't want to just get a 3ds for pokemon or a wii u for 3d world and so on. Having access to all their modern games I'm sure would tempt plenty of those who were on the fence.

 

[DrROBschiz]

I mean, if the games have performance issues while in handheld mode compared to docked then I'd agree with you but if that's not the case and they run just as good as docked mode but at lower resolution then it'd be only a waste of energy as you wouldn't even notice the difference on the 720p screen.

I actually think they did the right thing here. The system would run hot way more often if docked mode were enabled just by plugging the charge cable.

True

This thing is still gonna kick the crap out of anything 3DS was capable of and its a significant jump over the Vita

I am very excited

 

[asagami_]

These numbers might be a moot point considering Nintendo can release their portable IP on a home console now and drastically increase the base to attract other parties to develop.

The Wii U never got Pokemon, Fire Emblem, Bravely Series, Yo-Kai watch,Professor Layton, Animal Crossing, Lugi's Mansion, Kid Icarus and so on.

As a fan of japanese games, I can imagine all the low-mid tier games would reach to Switch and to be portable <3

 

[CrustyBritches]

These numbers might be a moot point considering Nintendo can release their portable IP on a home console now and drastically increase the base to attract other parties to develop.

Yes, never underestimate the potential of Wii Sports-esque/Wiimote killer app.

They need install base, and they need it fast. I haven't seen anything that would qualify as being a killer-app. The gimmick in this case is that it's a "Hybrid". Pretty cool, unless it completely lacks AAA 3rd-party support. Then it's just an expensive Nintendo portable.

I'm expecting worse combined sales than the 3ds+WiiU and worse 3rd-party support. Just tempering expectations. What is the upside for all the Nintendo Apologists here?

 

[Easy_D]

Because troll.

Though it would also be good if FF XV could achieve what XenobladeX did.

Oh yes definitely, XCX is ridiculous, doubly so considering the hardware. They have some fine tech people at Monolith Soft for sure

 

[Ploid 3.0]

Even if you don't like portable gaming, I think most people would agree that a library that consisted of the Wii U's library + the 3DS's library + the Vita's library would be a rather solid library of games. And there's a good chance that with the Switch, that's basically what we're getting (plus some PC games that scale well to lower power configurations).

Forgot to add mobile gaming. Sonic Jump coming!

 

[Kssio_Aug]

While true, the OG Wii also had an enticing "gimmick". Motion controls were new and exciting, and it pulled in the casual crowd and many gamers alike.

Now, Nintendo is essentially making a console that you can play anywhere! But, is this something people actual want and care about, or is this gimmick gonna fall on its face like the Wii U. Because let's face it, people have phones now and only the hardcore Nintendo fans are gonna use it. I personally don't see it doing very well myself. Maybe GC numbers.

I remember many being skeptical about Wii mote though. And Nintendo is taking a different approach now, besides portability is not something new, the way they're bringing it with Switch is still very intriguing. Also I'm pretty sure Mario Run and Pokemon Go is part of Nintendo's strategy to call some audience for Switch.

And, as I said before, the 3DS is a very successful hardware, that still sells pretty well, what demonstrates there is an audience for it. Switch may gather this audience as well, if they price it well enough.

I wouldn't compare Switch to Wii U just yet, it seems to me the appraoch they're taking with it is very different besides betting in a weak hardware (for the home console perspective) again.

And since the standard home console market has PS4, XB1 and PC in the front line it's quite risky for them to bet in a more powerful and expensive console to try fighting for the same market share, specially since we don't know where this home console market gonna lead... as we can see Sony and Microsoft are approaching their consoles to PC and may end up with the "generations of consoles" as we knew. I'm not really sure if Nintendo could handle it.

 

[blankempathy]

Yes, never underestimate the potential of Wii Sports-esque/Wiimote killer app.

They need install base, and they need it fast. I haven't seen anything that would qualify as being a killer-app. The gimmick in this case is that it's a "Hybrid". Pretty cool, unless it completely lacks AAA 3rd-party support. Then it's just an expensive Nintendo portable.

I'm expecting worse combined sales than the 3ds+WiiU and worse 3rd-party support. Just tempering expectations. What is the upside for all the Nintendo Apologists here?

Yes because all that is ever needed is AAA third party games. Did you not pay attention of the amount of third party games on the 3ds? Where do you think those games are going to go? To the vita? Nintendo apologists lol. You aren't seeing the implication of having all of Nintendos ips in one place instead of splitting them between 2 platforms. Or did you just assume people bought the 3ds for its portability?

 

[th3sicknness]

Exactly. This console is genius - all of their efforts and money into one system.

The only problem being is that many users/costumers have/had both the Wii U and 3DS, so it might make them sell less HW in total, but the software numbers will probably outweigh that.

Nintendo will save a lot of time and money by not having to develop and consistently update 2 platforms. They could easily fill software droughts with first and second party support from their exclusive console and portable IP. In my mind consumers rarely double dipped with owning a Nintendo console and Nintendo portable. The Wii U suffered because the 3ds started to get a lot of the Wii U exclusives like Smash Brothers and Mario 3d world / land. Now they dont have to worry about cannibalizing their own hardware and software sales.

 

[KAL2006]

Some sales predictions

If the Switch is priced as the rumoured $250/£200 for basic SKU.

I predict Switch will underperform year 1 and 2. Launch it will do well as it's hot new hardware. A modest bump in sales when Zelda launches. But other than that this will underperform for the first 2 years.

However I reckon by the end of year 2 Nintendo will give Switch a price drop. With a next gen Pokemon and Monster Hunter to turn it around.

3DS was only successful when they dropped the price and had some hot hitters like Pokemon in the West and Monster Hunter in Japan

 

[DeuceGamer]

True but if the switch does combine Nintendo's portable/console games on one console it may entice those who were interested in Nintendo games but didn't want to just get a 3ds for pokemon or a wii u for 3d world and so on. Having access to all their modern games I'm sure would tempt plenty of those who were on the fence.

Even more so if they get the Virtual Console up to snuff and you have access to NES-GC/Wii home console and GB-??? on handheld. Of course they have to get the account system and VC in order, but with GC already rumored to be running on it that's a good start.

 

[FLAguy954]

We also have to remember the PS4 and XB1 will have variants at 199 next holiday. Nintendo having a weaker "home console" at a higher price than that is really not going to be acceptable.

Exactly. There is no defending this, Nintendo once again fucked up. I already had zero expectations for the Switch but this was even worse than I could even imagine.

 

[Miracle]

Doesn't need too much power if they're rendering only at 720p

720p in 2017...

 

[Leizt]

The point IS... its running on custom APIs and there is no Android to cut the power... that is what you guys r forgetting here...

 

[Nesther]

A beefier Wii U that can switch between TV and handheld on the fly? The hype is real.

 

[ascii42]

Gosh, you'd swear I was in a GameCube spec thread circa 2001.
Remember that, when its CPU and GPU clocked significantly under PS2 and Xbox and everyone said it was too weak to compete? Remember how that turned out?

Uh...
Gamecube: 485 MHz CPU, 162 Mhz GPU.
PS2: 294 MHz CPU, 147 Mhz GPU.

And the GameCube had about 50% more RAM as well.

720p in 2017...

That's for handheld mode, 720p is pretty good for a handheld. Thought I'm sure it'll see plenty of sub 1080p when docked games as well.

 

[Delio]

As a fan of japanese games, I can imagine all the low-mid tier games would reach to Switch and to be portable <3

Yeah this excites me a ton. If they can lock down a lot of mid tier japanese devs i'll be good.

 

[what-ok]

There is nothing to defend. These are rumors. (=. Don't be silly.

 

[jroc74]

True but if the switch does combine Nintendo's portable/console games on one console it may entice those who were interested in Nintendo games but didn't want to just get a 3ds for pokemon or a wii u for 3d world and so on. Having access to all their modern games I'm sure would tempt plenty of those who were on the fence.

Yup.

No more 3D Land vs 3D World.

No more Mario Kart 7 vs Mario Kart 8.

I think the beginning of them going one platform was hinted at with Smash Bros. No real distinction between the 2 with names except what platform it was on.

 

[Kaisos]

Yes because all that is ever needed is AAA third party games. Did you not pay attention of the amount of third party games on the 3ds?

Nobody on this site paid attention to the 3DS. That's where all the DOOOOOOMED comments come from.

 

[nogoodnamesleft]

Uh...
Gamecube: 485 MHz CPU, 162 Mhz GPU.
PS2: 294 MHz, GPU 147 Mhz.

And the GameCube had about 50% more RAM as well.

This thread is about 70% people talking about something they have no idea about.

 

[th3sicknness]

If you price this at 200 it flies off the shelves.. If you offer custom design Switch handhelds based around Pokemon releases it will fly even higher imo... Everytime a damn pokemon game comes out people seem to find money to buy the exclusive handhelds that come with them lol.. I expect the switch to be the same.

 

[cyberheater]

The point IS... its running on custom APIs and there is no Android to cut the power... that is what you guys r forgetting here...

Ha ha ha...

I'm enjoying this thread.

 

[krizalidzero]

Nintendo will save a lot of time and money by not having to develop and consistently update 2 platforms. They could easily fill software droughts with first and second party support from their exclusive console and portable IP. In my mind consumers rarely double dipped with owning a Nintendo console and Nintendo portable. The Wii U suffered because the 3ds started to get a lot of the Wii U exclusives like Smash Brothers and Mario 3d world / land. Now they dont have to worry about cannibalizing their own hardware and software sales.

And I just realized they'll probably steal everything the VIta had going for.

Nintendo is moving forward with their marketing/advertising too. You can tell they're not focusing on Family Friendly anymore and going for the young adult demographic.

 

[DSN2K]

so its Not just old Nvidia tech but old Nvidia tech what is running slower then its original design....how disappointing.

 

[Kssio_Aug]

720p in 2017...

If we ignore the portable aspec of it, okay...

 

[Daeoc]

The Wii U never got Pokemon, Fire Emblem, Bravely Series, Yo-Kai watch,Professor Layton, Animal Crossing, Lugi's Mansion, Kid Icarus and so on.

This is why I'm interested in the Switch. The last Nintendo console I cared for was the GameCube(2001), while I've always wanted to be able to play their handheld games in a console environment(controller and TV). I've always just tolerated handhelds for the games, I never take them outside so they were never being used for the portable aspect.

 

[Pie and Beans]

Gosh, you'd swear I was in a GameCube spec thread circa 2001.
Remember that, when its CPU and GPU clocked significantly under PS2 and Xbox and everyone said it was too weak to compete? Remember how that turned out?

Are you even vaguely trying to suggest the Switch is going to be more powerful than either the Xbox One or PS4?

Do you perhaps think you may be part of the problem in why this cycle always goes the way it does for Nintendo fans since the Gamecube?

 

[TAJ]

The point IS... its running on custom APIs and there is no Android to cut the power... that is what you guys r forgetting here...

Yeah, just look at all that Android overhead holding back PS4 and Xbone.
Sure, PS4 Pro has a 4.2TF GPU, but in practice? 4.2 flops.

 

[aBarreras]

If we ignore the portable aspec of it, okay...

dont you see? his phone has a 1440p display!

 

[KAL2006]

If you price this at 200 it flies off the shelves.. If you offer custom design Switch handhelds based around Pokemon releases it will fly even higher imo... Everytime a damn pokemon game comes out people seem to find money to buy the exclusive handhelds that come with them lol.. I expect the switch to be the same.

Laura has been right when it comes to leaks so it's likely $250 at launch as UK leak price is £200.

However dropping it to $200 when Pokemon Stars releases in fall 2017 would be a great strategy. Perhaps at the least $250 Pokemon Stars Switch Bundle.

 

[CarbonFire]

The point IS... its running on custom APIs and there is no Android to cut the power... that is what you guys r forgetting here...

Ah yes coding to the metal! Something Something secret sauce.

 

[th3sicknness]

Ha ha ha...

I'm enjoying this thread.

Why is that funny? I think everyone knows that running android eats up unnecessary resources and kills battery life? Running literally anything else would be a net performance gain?

 

[Lebon14]

Again, who expected this? Link please

Seeing the reaction of people in this thread, especially at the beginning, they were pretty much expecting this.