[Digital Foundry]PS5 uncovered

Cerny:

"There's enough power that both CPU and GPU can run at their limits of 3.5GHz and 2.23GHz, it isn't the case that the developer has to choose to run one of them slower."


Can we put the 9.2 tf bs to bed now .
 
Regardless, the fact is that there is a set power level for the SoC. Whether we're talking about mobile phones, tablets, or even PC CPUs and GPUs, boost clocks have historically led to variable performance from one example to the next - something that just can't happen on a console. Your PS5 can't run slower or faster than your neighbour's. The developmental challenges alone would be onerous to say the least.

"We don't use the actual temperature of the die, as that would cause two types of variance between PS5s," explains Mark Cerny. "One is variance caused by differences in ambient temperature; the console could be in a hotter or cooler location in the room. The other is variance caused by the individual custom chip in the console, some chips run hotter and some chips run cooler. So instead of using the temperature of the die, we use an algorithm in which the frequency depends on CPU and GPU activity information. That keeps behaviour between PS5s consistent."



Peeps, willfully or not, still don't seem to understand this, it's not temperature based boost. It's deterministic. The same code will always behave the same so you still get that console performance determinism even with variable clocks.
 
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Agnostic2020 said:
Cerny:

"There's enough power that both CPU and GPU can run at their limits of 3.5GHz and 2.23GHz, it isn't the case that the developer has to choose to run one of them slower."


Can we put the 9.2 tf bs to bed now .
Click to expand...
"the boost clock system should still see both components running near to or at peak frequency most of the time."

welp.
 
Cerny also delivered PlayStation 4 - which he defined as 'super-charged PC architecture'

What a funny guy. Tablet CPU installed in the console and awfully slow in 2013.
 
'devkits don't have smartshift. Retail have.'
'games on PS5 will get improved by variable frequency'.
 
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Agnostic2020 said:
The engineering behind that segment that I m reading is so interesting .damn
Click to expand...
I'm not saying otherwise. I'm just really annoyed, when anybody who is trying to sell me something is saying things like "most of the time"

Because "most of the time" can be 80% of time, 95% of time and also 99% of time.

And i'm not even talking about fact, that we still don't have minimum frequencies (and we will probably never have) just info that lowering a frequency have a big influence on power requirements (No shit, Sherlock...)
 
Sim points....

- Variable clock was choose due how difficult was to cool PS4 so that allowed a easy and effective cooling system in PS5.... he says you will be surprised here.
- The clock is not defined by temperature but workload so you won't have unexpected performance drops... the opposite the performance is pretty consistent.
- Inside the APU there is a power control unit.
- All PS5 runs and delivery the same performance.
- The power budget is enough to run both CPU and GPU at max speeds.
- Both CPU and GPU runs most of time near to or at peak frequency.
- He tive an example that dropping the frequency in 10% give a 27% power draw decrease so they only need a few percent drop in frequency to 10% drop I'm power draw.

A lot of crow eating here about the variable clocks.
 
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Ascend said:
But not both at maximum workload.
Click to expand...
Games doesn't use max workload... it always have one part waiting the other do it job.
He even gives an example that if you do a code to force max workload in modern CPU/GPUs the units will showdown themselves to avoid brink.
 
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Ascend said:
But not both at maximum workload.
Click to expand...
Lol did you even read the fucking segment.yes both can run at maximum at the same time. only when one becomes less busy system detects and runs it for that period slower since it is not needed to keep temperature low and system quiet
 
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ethomaz said:
Sim points....

- Variable clock was choose due how difficult was to cool PS4 so that allowed a easy and effective cooling system in PS5.... he says you will be surprised here.
- The clock is not defined by temperature but workload so you won't have unexpected performance drops... the opposite the performance is pretty consistent.
- Inside the APU there is a power control unit.
- All PS5 runs and delivery the same performance.
- The power budget is enough to run both CPU and GPU at max speeds.
- Both CPU and GPU runs most of time near to or at peak frequency.
- He tive an example that dropping the frequency in 10% give a 27% power draw decrease so they only need a few percent drop in frequency to 10% drop I'm power draw.

A lot of crow eating here about the variable clocks.
Click to expand...
A quote from the article:

"Several developers speaking to Digital Foundry have stated that their current PS5 work sees them throttling back the CPU in order to ensure a sustained 2.23GHz clock on the graphics core. It makes perfect sense as most game engines right now are architected with the low performance Jaguar in mind - even a doubling of throughput (ie 60fps vs 30fps) would hardly tax PS5's Zen 2 cores. However, this doesn't sound like a boost solution, but rather performance profiles similar to what we've seen on Nintendo Switch. "Regarding locked profiles, we support those on our dev kits, it can be helpful not to have variable clocks when optimising. Released PS5 games always get boosted frequencies so that they can take advantage of the additional power," explains Cerny."

throttling back the CPU to ENSURE GPU sustained clock.
 
Lone Wolf said:
A quote from the article:

"Several developers speaking to Digital Foundry have stated that their current PS5 work sees them throttling back the CPU in order to ensure a sustained 2.23GHz clock on the graphics core. It makes perfect sense as most game engines right now are architected with the low performance Jaguar in mind - even a doubling of throughput (ie 60fps vs 30fps) would hardly tax PS5's Zen 2 cores. However, this doesn't sound like a boost solution, but rather performance profiles similar to what we've seen on Nintendo Switch. "Regarding locked profiles, we support those on our dev kits, it can be helpful not to have variable clocks when optimising. Released PS5 games always get boosted frequencies so that they can take advantage of the additional power," explains Cerny."

throttling back the CPU to ENSURE GPU sustained clock.
Click to expand...
I don't think you understood what it wrote in that quote.

Basically the CPU is not being used so it keeps in lower frequency...
 
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ethomaz said:
I don't think you understood what it wrote in that quote.

Basically the CPU is not being used so it keeps in lower frequency.
Click to expand...
I do. Having sustained 2.23 and 3.5 is better than variable. The PS5 will not maintain those clocks, it will have to use smart shift to throttle one of the processors
 
Is there detailed charts and numbers of the variable clocks if not its more marketing speak period. It's not hard to post hard numbers they have done it over and over for the SSD. I'll take it no charts or hard numbers to hold them to reading the comments people trying to interpret marketing speak. Show me the numbers.
 
Lone Wolf said:
I do. Having sustained 2.23 and 3.5 is better than variable. The PS5 will not maintain those clocks, it will have to use smart shift to throttle one of the processors
Click to expand...
It doesn't have to keep fixed clocks (just like pc) when it's not needed by the game code. Not every scene uses all of the tf . So why not use this in your advatage and get your console running cooler when games doesn't demand it .

You are being obtuse for no reason lol
 
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Agnostic2020 said:
Lol how the fuck did u get to that conclusion? Its always 10.3 tf .it drops by few percentage when it is not needed by code to keep it cool
Click to expand...
Until we get an official chart or white paper your guessing off of marketing speak like xbox fans in 2013 with esram marketing speak. It is not hard to post charts and white paper on this to back it up not marketing speak and general terms.
 
Agnostic2020 said:
Cerny:

"There's enough power that both CPU and GPU can run at their limits of 3.5GHz and 2.23GHz, it isn't the case that the developer has to choose to run one of them slower."


Can we put the 9.2 tf bs to bed now .
Click to expand...

nope

"Developers don't need to optimise in any way; if necessary, the frequency will adjust to whatever actions the CPU and GPU are performing,...Right now, it's still difficult to get a grip on boost and the extent to which clocks may vary. "

"Several developers speaking to Digital Foundry have stated that their current PS5 work sees them throttling back the CPU in order to ensure a sustained 2.23GHz clock on the graphics core."
 
I don't feel like this changes much. The Series X still has better specs overall, at its best, the PS5 is two teraflops slower than the Series X. Unfortunately we still don't know what 'most of the time' means (51%?) and the power advantage of the Series X is even bigger at least 'some of the time'.

Will it matter in third party games? That's still to be determined, however the most likely scenario is that the Series X will be the best place to play third-party titles.

Given that third-party titles make up the vast majority of games, that's important.
 
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quest said:
Until we get an official chart or white paper your guessing off of marketing speak like xbox fans in 2013 with esram marketing speak. It is not hard to post charts and white paper on this to back it up not marketing speak and general terms.
Click to expand...
Cerny
"There's enough power that both CPU and GPU can run at their limits of 3.5GHz and 2.23GHz, it isn't the case that the developer has to choose to run one of them slower."

Then he goes and explains in detail how the gpu drops clock when the game doesn't demand it after a heavy scene.

you can read it here :

www.eurogamer.net

PlayStation 5 uncovered: the Mark Cerny tech deep dive

On March 18th, Sony finally broke cover with in-depth information on the technical make-up of PlayStation 5. Expanding …
www.eurogamer.net www.eurogamer.net


As for data we will get those around launch .dont worry
 
Space_nut said:
nope

"Developers don't need to optimise in any way; if necessary, the frequency will adjust to whatever actions the CPU and GPU are performing,...Right now, it's still difficult to get a grip on boost and the extent to which clocks may vary. "

"Several developers speaking to Digital Foundry have stated that their current PS5 work sees them throttling back the CPU in order to ensure a sustained 2.23GHz clock on the graphics core."
Click to expand...
He just said the dev kits don't have the variable frequency technique .like if u wanna cherry pick then no point in arguments bro
 
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