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[John Harker]

It's needed. Software sales outside of japan is basically nonexistent, unless you're a handful or less of 1st party titles. This might allow them to revitalize some of that without losing revenue on their current 3ds projects/userbase. It's a needed stopgap, because they need the money and can't afford to dedicate resources to launching a full successor right now when they have to focus time and money and manpower on wii u

 

[LegendofLex]

That example is bullshit. In what world is the DS a revision of the GBA?

DS had a much larger impact on GBA owners than New 3DS will have on 3DS owners precisely because it wasn't first and foremost a hardware revision. And yet Nintendo released it within three years of GBA. This isn't going to be like the DS in that you aren't going to see literally thousands of titles released on New 3DS that you can't play on old 3DS. So as someone who bought a 3DS, you aren't getting screwed nearly as bad by New 3DS as someone who bought a GBA was screwed by the DS.

I wasn't responding to the idea of a hardware revision - just the idea of splitting the userbase between two platforms where the first doesn't have parity with the second.

 

[jeffers]

It's needed. Software sales outside of japan is basically nonexistent, unless you're a handful or less of 1st party titles. This might allow them to revitalize some of that without losing revenue on their current 3ds projects/userbase. It's a needed stopgap, because they need the money and can't afford to dedicate resources to launching a full successor right now when they have to focus time and money and manpower on wii u

I also get the feeling with the emphasis on better net functionality, and generally better CPU, they are prob gearing both users (more connected device) and indies (easier to get games running well) to hit the ground running when they do push next-gen handhelds.
edit: also ofc allows for easier amiibo as well.

another thought: how does this affect the successor, and as a biproduct, affect the wiiu successor? could we now see both coming close together?

 

[ReyVGM]

There were/are a total of 5 DSi exclusive titles. I wouldn't worry.
New buttons are just replacing optional Frankenstick.

No there weren't.
The DSi introduced DSiware and every single downloadable game was a DSi exclusive.

 

[Y2Kev]

This isn't a big enough jump to me. Forget splitting the user base. They need a new handheld. Oh well. I guess 2016?

 

[FoneBone]

It's needed. Software sales outside of japan is basically nonexistent, unless you're a handful or less of 1st party titles. This might allow them to revitalize some of that without losing revenue on their current 3ds projects/userbase. It's a needed stopgap, because they need the money and can't afford to dedicate resources to launching a full successor right now when they have to focus time and money and manpower on wii u

Agree with this as to the reasoning behind it, but I also don't think it's going to be successful, for the reasons EatChildren pointed out earlier:

I see this as Nintendo trying to extend the shelf life of the 3DS hardware by using more or less the same cheap components with incremental improvements aimed primarily at allowing for easier porting of GameCube and Wii generation titles that will be used to flood the 2015 and beyond market. They're trying to hold off committing to a true successor by fluffing up the 3DS with a revision. As the system somewhat flounders in the West I do not think this revision will make a significant dent in the market: the changes are welcome but long overdue, and do little to nothing to alleviate majority of the concerns/observations as to why dedicated portable gaming hardware has stumbled in modern times due to the advent of mobile gaming. I feel the appeal of the 3DS LL is maybe too heavily reliant on what the 3DS XL and 2DS already had: a combination of those aware of yet hesitant to buy finally doing so, and early adopters looking to upgrade. Neither of these markets are particularly big and so, again, these seems like an effort to desperately extend the core 3DS shelf life instead of really hit the market hard with something new and appealing.

My concerns are as followed:
- Reliance on ports over new, exclusive software. I maintain the hardware upgrade will lead to a ton of GCN/Wii ports, and while that interests me somewhat I would like to see new stuff.
- Long term software support. Nintendo is historically fucking atrocious at committing long term to any device or peripheral that fragments their market. It's nice to talk shit about a better CPU and exclusive software, but proof is in the quantity. I would not be in the least bit surprised to see this release, get a bunch of ports, then die shortly after.
- Shitful marketing. 3DS LL sold alongside 2DS and 3DS XL and 3DS? Recipe for disaster.

I'm going to hock off my XL (which is one week old, fuck) soon and intend to get one of these whenever they hit Australia. But yeah. Not a move I'm confident in at all.

 

[Jarmel]

DS had a much larger impact on GBA owners than New 3DS will have on 3DS owners precisely because it wasn't first and foremost a hardware revision. And yet Nintendo released it within three years of GBA. This isn't going to be like the DS in that you aren't going to see literally thousands of titles released on New 3DS that you can't play on old 3DS. So as someone who bought a 3DS, you aren't getting screwed nearly as bad by New 3DS as someone who bought a GBA was screwed by the DS.

I wasn't responding to the idea of a hardware revision - just the idea of splitting the userbase between two platforms where the first doesn't have parity with the second.

The difference is that with a successor, you're not splitting the userbase. You're replacing/updating the current one. Now you might be splitting the market temporarily but again the assumption is that the update is significant enough to validate the purchase for the old buyers.

What we have here is an apparent stopgap measure that isn't significant enough to really justify a 2nd purchase for a large portion of current 3DS users and instead of releasing a new system which will guarantee at least three years, the New 3DS could be phased out at any time for a proper successor.

 

[Maintenance]

I'll just quote myself from the other topic:

Fucking bullshit is what this is. I wasn't mad when the GBA SP was released with backlight, because I still could play all games in my OG GBA. I never said a word when the DSi was released, because it never had "big" exclusive software, only small digital games. It was a minor revision, even with a bump in the processor. Now this? This is fucking bullshit. I would be jumping with joy right now if they announced a 4DS or a HDS instead of this, but this fragmentation is just pathetic. I will wait for more information on the "exclusive developed games", but if something like Majora's Mask ends up being only a "new" 3DS only, I'll probably skip the console and stay with my Vita. I am so mad right now that I even regret buying my Wii U from Nintendo.

 

[Byron Bluth]

The worst part of this all will be the hundreds of thousands of 3DS and 2DS systems that will be purchased in North America this holiday/Christmas, and then the "New" 3DS systems will show up likely in February/March.

Awful. This should have been worldwide before the end of this year, along with Smash and Amiibos.

 

[LegendofLex]

The difference is that with a successor, you're not splitting the userbase. You're replacing/updating the current one.

DS was not originally positioned as a GBA replacement, but as a third pillar. It was only when it was successful that DS development totally replaced GBA development. Whether it's a revision or a successor, the same people ultimately have to make the same purchase decisions based on the same factors - is it worth buying this new device instead of/to replace the current one? So I don't see how it's dramatically different from a "how this affects current owners" perspective. For all we know, this thing could sell well enough to justify New 3DS being a worthy replacement that sticks around for 4 more years and gets a majority of the new software.

 

[jeffers]

Also for those hurt by exclusives: how likely is it going to be that these form the lineups of nextgen handheld? Don't think a title like xenoblade is worth putting on 3ds without some future plan.

 

[lt519]

This isn't a big enough jump to me. Forget splitting the user base. They need a new handheld. Oh well. I guess 2016?

With this releasing in 2015 I think this may actually be the final dedicated handheld by Nintendo. They'll push this and other minor revisions until they are ready to reveal their combined home/handheld solution.

 

[LegendofLex]

Also for those hurt by exclusives: how likely is it going to be that these form the lineups of nextgen handheld? Don't think a title like xenoblade is worth putting on 3ds without some future plan.

Incredibly unlikely. Nintendo already clarified that they need to redesign their platform from the ground up so they can make sure they can easily port stuff between handhelds and consoles.

 

[Pastry]

I bought a 3DS XL less than a year ago and honestly I'm kind of pissed. Honestly now I'm
concerned that Nintendo is going to do a hardware bump to the Wii U and segment that userbase. Makes me concerned about purchasing a Wii U and have some sort of revision out soon.

 

[4Tran]

I think that this revision will not do much to invigorate 3DS sales because it's too much of a halfway measure. This new handheld doesn't offer enough to attract anyone who doesn't already have a 3DS, so Nintendo is basically poaching off of their existing fanbase. Meanwhile, the tradeoff is that there's grumbling from 3DS owners who feel like their current handheld has been made obsolescent without enough of a payoff.

An actual new handheld would have gone over a lot better, but it looks like it's going to be a long ways off.

 

[LegendofLex]

Honestly now I'm
concerned that Nintendo is going to do a hardware bump to the Wii U and segment that userbase. Makes me concerned about purchasing a Wii U and have some sort of revision out soon.

What are they gonna do, bump the RAM and CPU and make it more expensive than it already is?

 

[Fine Ham Abounds]

Shoulda just gone all in and called it the WiiDS

No one would know what they were buying from Nintendo ever again

 

[jeffers]

Incredibly unlikely. Nintendo already clarified that they need to redesign their platform from the ground up so they can make sure they can easily port stuff between handhelds and consoles.

Isnt that issue more on the console side? with its architecture. I dont really know hardware, so dunno if the DMP gpu in the 3ds is a problem or not.

 

[LegendofLex]

Shoulda just gone all in and called it the WiiDS

No one would know what they were buying from Nintendo ever again

I was REALLY surprised they didn't call Wii U this.

Isnt that issue more on the console side? with its architecture. I dont really know hardware, so dunno if the DMP gpu in the 3ds is a problem or not.

The problem seems to be more on the handheld side, where compromises have historically had to be made to get the game to run well on a portable without killing the battery life. They've been recycling console architectures since GameCube.

 

[Jarmel]

DS was not originally positioned as a GBA replacement, but as a third pillar. It was only when it was successful that DS development totally replaced GBA development. Whether it's a revision or a successor, the same people ultimately have to make the same purchase decisions based on the same factors - is it worth buying this new device instead of/to replace the current one? So I don't see how it's dramatically different from a "how this affects current owners" perspective. For all we know, this thing could sell well enough to justify New 3DS being a worthy replacement that sticks around for 4 more years and gets a majority of the new software.

Third pillar talk amounted to nothing because the DS was a rather big difference from the GBA. Other than the hardware boost, developing for the DS is very much different in that developers had to find ways to optimize how to use the second screen. Here we have a CPU/possible ram boost and an additional joystick(which can be done on already existing 3DS with an accessory). I should also mention that I doubt we're talking about a gargantuan CPU boost.

With a successor, there is the assumption that there will be a sizable number of games exclusive to the new system. With a revision like this, nobody has a clue.

 

[cakefoo]

Gameboy -> Gameboy Color

1989 -> 1998

 

[Ogawa-san]

I sure wouldn't want to be that poor bastard in a game store trying to explain why this one game saying is for the "new 3DS" won't run on their new 3DS - the XL.

It's like they haven't learned anything with the Wii U and confusing people, it's downright impressive.

In any case, I'll sit tight and wait until 2016 for a super new 3DS or something, while counting how many 3DS games they'll "remake" in the meantime to help convincing people to spend another fresh $250 on a minuscule upgrade.

Coming up next: New SSMB4.

 

[jeffers]

I was REALLY surprised they didn't call Wii U this.



The problem seems to be more on the handheld side, where compromises have historically had to be made to get the game to run well on a portable without killing the battery life. They've been recycling console architectures since GameCube.

Dunno how thats relevant. What I'm thinking is they are trying to get to similar architectures to share assets and tools better. the WiiU successor is going to need to throw out more than the 3ds. Unless you think the next 3ds wont be ARM?

 

[ndawgdrake]

IMO having exclusive games makes it a "new console."

The Nintendo handheld apologists love to cite that this isn't the first time this has happened. While true, still a slap in the face to the current 60m+ 3DS owners.

They also like to point out that if Nintendo called this the 3DS-2 instead, people wouldn't be bitching. Well theres a reason it's NOT called the 3DS-2: because it's only a slight spec upgrade over the current 3DS with some new buttons and nothing more. Nintendo knows this. It's not the true successor to the 3DS.

So no, I'm not in favor of it. The current 3DS is barely more than 3 years old. Bullshit.

 

[WrenchNinja]

This isn't a big enough jump to me. Forget splitting the user base. They need a new handheld. Oh well. I guess 2016?

Yeah, I was hoping for something substantial. As it stands, the upgrades aren't interesting enough for me ditch my original 3DS. Even with Xenoblade being available for it...I already have it on the Wii.

 

[BomberMouse]

This is pretty bad, they are not even being open about it.

This could be the 3DS successor that could last for 5 years or just a mid step and we would get the "true" successor in 1 or 2 years. They are basically playing with their userbase and see what sticks.

 

[Zeyphersan]

I'm fine with it. It's like a Gameboy Color. 3DS software will still get made, and people will upgrade or not upgrade as they see fit.

I guess I don't get why this is a problem? It's like asking if releasing the 3DS would split the DS userbase. The 3DS will play all the old software, plus new ones. The N3DS will play all the old software, plus some new ones.

At some point, people are just gonna have to update, be it for a new generation or a half-step

 

[Staab]

We really need to get going on those "modular devices"

Between yearly updates to phones (which somehow people don't seem to mind that much) and now almost yearly revisions for some consoles, it is TIME !

 

[Sami+]

It's a terrible value proposition and I'll be skipping it as a result.

 

[Maintenance]

We really need to get going on those "modular devices"

Between yearly updates to phones (which somehow people don't seem to mind that much) and now almost yearly revisions for some consoles, it is TIME !

Already saw that. Thought by a designer, probably, not an engineer. There are reasons that the phones are a single piece of hardware. There are complications with this like heat generation, speed of transfer via connectors, etc. I'm not the most enlightened person to talk about this, but a real engineer might chime in and explain why this will not matter for high end devices. Mid range, maybe.

I'm fine with it. It's like a Gameboy Color. 3DS software will still get made, and people will upgrade or not upgrade as they see fit.

9 years between GB and GBC. Not even 4 years from the 3DS and the New 3DS (February 2011 to the japanese launch of the new 3DS this year).



On topic, this only makes me think twice about buying things from Nintendo again, like the QoL. Who knows what they might add in it after a while?

 

[John Harker]

Yea but it's not as simple as that. their "true" successor, they've said time and again, will share architecture with their next gen console hardware as well. That is simply not ready. They are dedicating resources toward keeping wii u afloat and that takes time and money and people.

It wouldn't really work with that strategy to launch a new system now when it would cripple what they want to do with the home system, it simply needs more time and development. They are building that now but what this 3ds does is what I mention above... Keeps revenue from bottoming out while they work to deliver their synergy strategy for their next cycle. They literally just merged buildings and teams and backend infrastructure for this end like in the past month. It'll take time, and also who would develop games for it? This approach allows them to keep their current pipeline a little longer too.

They had to do something... And this is what they buy time with. Should help the shortfall somewhat, I don't really see it being that harmful given current usage numbers declining, might help increase their digital attach and tie their ecosystem closer to wii u in prep for the next cycle.

 

[FoneBone]

I'm fine with it. It's like a Gameboy Color. 3DS software will still get made, and people will upgrade or not upgrade as they see fit.

GBC wasn't like that at all; there were almost no backwards-compatible titles after the first year or so.

 

[Zalman]

I think Harker is right on the money here. It's something they have to do to keep the 3DS and the revenue stream going. The successor to the 3DS won't be ready until 2016 at the very earliest.

 

[sonto340]

I feel like its confusing too the general consumer, but a good move for anyone who knows what they're talking about.

As long as those colored buttons make itnto the US I'm 100% in.

 

[FoneBone]

They had to do something, yes, but what they're offering doesn't strike me as likely to appeal to much of anyone who hadn't previously been interested in the 3DS (or had lost interest in it).

 

[puffyshirt]

Method works pretty alright for iPad. There are plenty of apps and games releasing on iOS these days that don't work on older versions of the iPad, and no one loses their minds.

This seems perfectly acceptable to me.

 

[gofreak]

They had to do something, yes, but what they're offering doesn't strike me as likely to appeal to much of anyone who hadn't previously been interested in the 3DS (or had lost interest in it).

I think the sales department will take upgrades from the existing user base at this point. I'm guessing the new hardware has a decent profit margin. Every little helps.

The splitting off of a new game runtime environment + the Xenoblade announcement are squarely aimed at inducing a higher conversion rate from the existing userbase than an ordinary revision would bring. It's probably not something Nintendo wanted to do, but here's where they are. This is probably as close to a machine demanded & designed by sales/accounting/marketing as you can get.

 

[ramparter]

Just bought my fucking 3DS last year for Pokemon...

And the new one won't be available for another 6 months. If you knew it was coming would you rather wait for a year and a half?

 

[Symbiotx]

 

[JoJoSono]

And the new one won't be available for another 6 months. If you knew it was coming would you rather wait for a year and a half?

Yes. Why wouldn't you wait? Who wants to blow $200 now on a system that's about to get superseded?

 

[TheRook]

Im conflicted.

I got the Limited Fire Emblem 3DS which is pretty awesome on it's own and it's my daily driver handled since I don't have a case for my Vita.

At first I was kinda mad that they are making a new 3DS...but now I feel like I can retire the Emblem 3DS and use this new one without the fear of something happening to that limited edition 3DS.

I'm just more worried about price at this point and release window at this point. From what I understand, these new ones don't come with chargers....is that true?

 

[BitStyle]

The way I see it, it'll be more like the DSi: stop-gap to next gen, will have a few exclusive titles (nothing substantial/groundbreaking), and continue to release software that shares compatibility with both the 'new' and 'old' 3DSes. Maybe the 'new' 3DS will get extra game modes or features a la pokemon black/white.

 

[QuixoticNeutral]

If the full successor to the 3DS has full backward compatibility with the half-step up to the New 3DS, just as the 3DS did with the DSi, I see nothing to complain about. Xenoblade 3DS will still be there on the eShop.

There is, of course, a legitimate concern that in integrating the next portable platform with the home console architecture, a backward-compatible "3DS Mode" isn't as secure an expectation as we might like. But pending any announcement on the matter, if you just acquired a 3DS XL this year, the DS/DSi precedent suggests there isn't much reason to worry about long-term software support, which was already visibly in decline.

I reserve the right to repudiate all this and grab my pitchfork if a New 3DS-only Metroid is imminently announced.

Edit: Also, it seems clearer than ever that with the reorganization of the hardware division and the development of the next portable in tandem with the Wii U successor, we probably won't see a full successor portable announced in 2015 or released until late 2016 at the earliest. Something needs to keep the portable line going, and a stopgap semi-upgrade is as good a solution as any.

 

[Zeyphersan]

If the full successor to the 3DS has full backward compatibility with the half-step up to the New 3DS, just as the 3DS did with the DSi, I see nothing to complain about. Xenoblade 3DS will still be there on the eShop.

There is, of course, a legitimate concern that in integrating the next portable platform with the home console architecture, a backward-compatible "3DS Mode" isn't as secure an expectation as we might like. But pending any announcement on the matter, if you just acquired a 3DS XL this year, the DS/DSi precedent suggests there isn't much reason to worry about long-term software support, which was already visibly in decline.

I reserve the right to repudiate all this and grab my pitchfork if a New 3DS-only Metroid is imminently announced.

Xenoblade 3DS will be on the eShop, yes. But the 3DS hardware literally can't run it. You NEED a N3DS to play it

 

[Maintenance]

If the full successor to the 3DS has full backward compatibility with the half-step up to the New 3DS, just as the 3DS did with the DSi, I see nothing to complain about. Xenoblade 3DS will still be there on the eShop.

There is, of course, a legitimate concern that in integrating the next portable platform with the home console architecture, a backward-compatible "3DS Mode" isn't as secure an expectation as we might like. But pending any announcement on the matter, if you just acquired a 3DS XL this year, the DS/DSi precedent suggests there isn't much reason to worry about long-term software support, which was already visibly in decline.

I reserve the right to repudiate all this and grab my pitchfork if a New 3DS-only Metroid is imminently announced.

It probably won't be, the 3DS will be the last one. The really new hardware will not be BC, if what they said is true, since it will adopt a new architecture. The Wii U I think will be compatible, but not the 3DS.

 

[QuixoticNeutral]

Xenoblade 3DS will be on the eShop, yes. But the 3DS hardware literally can't run it. You NEED a N3DS to play it

Yes, I know. For clarity: if the next (post-3DS) portable has a 3DS mode, you should be able to grab Xenoblade 3DS off the eShop just as how DSiWare is entirely playable on the 3DS. We don't know yet if the revision of the software architecture cuts out a backward-compatible mode entirely. The Wii U retained Wii Mode (basically embedding a Wii into the hardware as a dual-boot option) despite also being an architectural overhaul.

 

[Sevyne]

It probably wouldn't be such a big deal if they were just making games that could take advantage of the new specs, but didn't really have to in order to play the game. I mean a lot of games are developed a bit beyond the limits of what a console can handle and then scaled back, right?

That said; It's not an incredibly huge deal to me, but I could see it causing some confusion. Splitting the userbase is probably going to be bothersome for some folks too.

If it's coming to NA I may still get it though. I'm still rocking an OG 3DS and planned to upgrade to an XL. Maybe I'll hold out and just get this instead. Current XL owners might be a bit annoyed though.

 

[Devilgunman]

If you don't like it, don't buy it. You vote with your wallet. Also do you think 3rd party devs will jump on board to make games for the New 3DS and abandon massive installed base of the "old" 3DS? They will make games compatible with both consoles. Nintendo can make exclusive games all they want but nobody has to follow.

 

[Trago]

I think Harker is right on the money here. It's something they have to do to keep the 3DS and the revenue stream going. The successor to the 3DS won't be ready until 2016 at the very earliest.

Exactly, Nintendo aren't hyping this up to be their next generation handheld, it's a new device in the 3DS line.

 

[Sevyne]

Exactly, Nintendo aren't hyping this up to be their next generation handheld, it's a new device in the 3DS line.

The problem I think most people have is that Nintendo seems to create hardware with that particular moment in mind instead of being more forward thinking. Because of that, they end up having to do revisions like this as stopgaps because the previous iteration doesn't have the technological legs to keep up. If they were just a little more forward thinking then this model for the 3DS (or something like it) may have been what we got to begin with.

Of course that's just my own guesswork and nothing of pure fact. Don't shoot me!