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[DigitalHitmann]

I been talking to a personal friend of mine whose a TO of a major an he said the reason they banned the Ninja costumes is because they make all the fighters look too similar. He says its pretty standard an thats what they do for their Tekken scene too. Just thought id share that incite.

Do you ever wonder how women might feel watching a game like this?

Tell that to all the girls who show up to the events. DOA has more female participants than any other game ive seen.

 

[Banana Aeon]

Do you ever wonder how women might feel watching a game like this?

DoA has the highest female representation at tournaments though.

 

[Sushi Nao]

DoA has the highest female representation at tournaments though.

Great! Then a soft ban on distracting costumes is directly serving the tournament base. Very adaptive.

 

[Jarate]

Do you ever wonder how women might feel watching a game like this?

The same as me? I dont feel anything by them, and hell, we had a poster here saying that DOA had a big female scene in comp play. Not all females will react the same as you may think, and you have to understand that maybe there's a lot females out there that like playing as sexy females just like I like to play as a muscle huge dude.

It's just tits man, no one cares other then small pockets of people. It's redundant and happens in a lot of games which sucks, but DOA has always been about this stuff.

Great! Then a soft ban on distracting costumes is directly serving the tournament base. Very adaptive.

Fighting games is about using everything in your arsenal to win. If tits are too distracting for someone in a tournament, you know that im sure as hell gonna use tit costume #42

 

[GuessMyUserName]

Great! Then a soft ban on distracting costumes is directly serving the tournament base. Very adaptive.

It's all sorts of gross that you think women are incapable of being fine with this stuff, or enjoy it as well.

 

[Mr. X]

Great! Then a soft ban on distracting costumes is directly serving the tournament base. Very adaptive.

They arent doing this on behalf of women.

 

[AAK]

DoA has the highest female representation at tournaments though.

Do you have a statistic on this, where are you getting this from?

 

[DigitalHitmann]

What I dont understand is if people are so bent out of shape about a bikini, why is Alpha152 even allowed in tournament play? Shes just a render of Kasumi with no clothes and random colors. Shes essentially naked if we want to be realistic about it.

 

[DigitalHitmann]

Do you have a statistic on this, where are you getting this from?

I go to alot of tournaments, and I can vouch for it. When I ran pools at our event we had like 8-10 female participants.

 

[Demoskinos]

Do you ever wonder how women might feel watching a game like this?

DOA has a LOT of female fans believe it or not.

 

[Sushi Nao]

It's all sorts of gross that you think women are incapable of being fine with this stuff, or enjoy it as well.

Right, because if the last year has taught us anything, it's that women love how they're being presented in games

 

[FyreWulff]

Community decides how their community run tournaments for their community is going to be run.

If you don't like it, run your own tournament with your own money.

 

[ZeroX03]

Great! Then a soft ban on distracting costumes is directly serving the tournament base. Very adaptive.

And the male costumes?

 

[Banana Aeon]

Right, because if the last year has taught us anything, it's that women love how they're being presented in games

Women are not a hivemind. Don't present them as such.

 

[Mr. X]

Women are a hivemind?

 

[Camjo-Z]

Right, because if the last year has taught us anything, it's that women love how they're being presented in games

I think you've reached the point where you're so socially progressive, you're actually going backwards.

 

[Osu 16 Bit]

I been talking to a personal friend of mine whose a TO of a major an he said the reason they banned the Ninja costumes is because they make all the fighters look too similar. He says its pretty standard an thats what they do for their Tekken scene too. Just thought id share that incite.

Wait, what does this even mean? This is not standard in the FGC. I've never heard of this ever.

 

[GuessMyUserName]

Right, because if the last year has taught us anything, it's that women love how they're being presented in games

I suggest you try speaking to them some time.

 

[Pachinko]

For the record, to get more specific - I have no problem with DOA being the game series that has bouncing boobs , it's not even exclusive in that regard anymore. Soul Caliber and Tekken have both pushed that area of silliness just as far.

It's just, for all the praise DOA5 gets (specifically) about improving the gameplay to a new series high , it's also pushed the hypersexualized aspects of the series to levels normally reserved for for the spinoff DOAX games.

Prior to DOA5, you'd be lucky to get 1 "sexy" outfit per girl. This was partially because outside of the 1 time booster disc for doa3(which was just to add the handful of new outfits present in the jp release) they never bothered to push DLC costumes. Now, all I'm saying is from Team Ninjas point of view it doesn't really make sense to stop releasing all these crazy costumes because people keep buying them.

It would be awesome if they just did it with a new installment of DOAX and made DOA6 a game that perhaps still kept the jiggle that everyone likes so much but didn't go overboard with the DLC fetish wear. It's too late for DOA5, it's already gone too far down the road of perversion and the fact that the pro community has now suggested disallowing people to pick "distracting" outfits for the female characters tells me they really desperately want the game itself to be taken more seriously.

I used to be a pretty big dead or alive fan but I've realized that I've mostly grown out of it , DOA2 came out when I was nearly 17 years old and since then I've played it in the arcade, dreamcast, ps2, DOA3 on xbox, DOA2ultimate on xbox, DOA4 on 360, Dimensions on 3DS and finally I really tried to get into DOA5 on the 360 but it didn't grab me the same way (I'm going to blame being older mostly). I played through 1 attempt of arcade mode in the core fighters edition on PS4(and it then locked up) and yeah, the spark is gone.

 

[Mushroomer25]

Extremely interesting. This is the right move to make within the community, and the FGC as a whole. It's fine to have these sort of costumes within the game (clearly there's a market for it, and you can't fault Team Ninja for making what sells) - but it might be best to not have them showing up in videos meant to represent high-tier play.

 

[Jarate]

Right, because if the last year has taught us anything, it's that women love how they're being presented in games

And clearly female fans of fighting games enjoy DOA tit bounciness and revealing costumes more then other games with women wearing normal clothes! DOA does have really good female representation at tournys and such.

 

[Tripon]

I been talking to a personal friend of mine whose a TO of a major an he said the reason they banned the Ninja costumes is because they make all the fighters look too similar. He says its pretty standard an thats what they do for their Tekken scene too. Just thought id share that incite.

Might as well ban clones at that rate.

 

[Eolz]

So you're saying that the status quo of sexual presentation in games is just fine, that small steps to improve it is just based on oversensitivity and me, and others who feel the same way, have the problem and we should just go somewhere else and let the tough insensitive people do their thing?

That's not the problem, the problem is the poor communication and the refusal to discuss it.
Should we ban gore from Mortal Kombat because I'm sensitive over it? Should we ban Cammy's costumes in Street Fighter? Most outfits in Soul Calibur? Bikinis in Tekken? Why didn't we already?

Do you ever wonder how women might feel watching a game like this?

I don't know, have we heard many women opinions on the matter since this started? Why aren't the male costumes banned since they could be distracting for some other players? Why is there more female pro players in games with more fanservice?

I been talking to a personal friend of mine whose a TO of a major an he said the reason they banned the Ninja costumes is because they make all the fighters look too similar. He says its pretty standard an thats what they do for their Tekken scene too. Just thought id share that incite.

That's a bit dumb. If this happened for Tekken/SF/MvC/etc at a national scale, there'd be the same backlash.

What I dont understand is if people are so bent out of shape about a bikini, why is Alpha152 even allowed in tournament play? Shes just a render of Kasumi with no clothes and random colors. Shes essentially naked if we want to be realistic about it.

Freedom, things being decided without actually asking "the community", and the dangerous slippery slope it is (banning more things in the future if this is being allowed).


Edit:

Prior to DOA5, you'd be lucky to get 1 "sexy" outfit per girl.

Really? DOA4 costumes, DOA Ultimate Costumes, DOA1 Costumes. You can easily find 2-3 per girl. And no, DLC didn't exist back then, just as development costs weren't the same.

 

[DigitalHitmann]

Wait, what does this even mean? This is not standard in the FGC. I've never heard of this ever.

He said if a costume makes a character look too similar to another they dont allow it. So if Kasumi and Hitomi both had ninja costumes that looked exactly the same they wouldnt allow it because newer players wouldnt be able to tell the difference between the two. Atleast thats what his reasoning was..

Might as well ban clones at that rate.

Yeah, exactly..

 

[Banana Aeon]

He said if a costume makes a character look too similar to another they dont allow it. So if Kasumi and Hitomi both had ninja costumes that looked exactly the same they wouldnt allow it because newer players wouldnt be able to tell the difference between the two. Atleast thats what his reasoning was..

But what about the male costumes that look sameish?

 

[Kuroyume]

Right, because if the last year has taught us anything, it's that women love how they're being presented in games

You're under the presumption that these people speak for all women?

Women are a hivemind?

That's what some feminists would like you to believe.

 

[omlet]

Just thought id share that incite.

Incite indeed.

 

[Osu 16 Bit]

He said if a costume makes a character look too similar to another they dont allow it. So if Kasumi and Hitomi both had ninja costumes that looked exactly the same they wouldnt allow it because newer players wouldnt be able to tell the difference between the two. Atleast thats what his reasoning was..

Do they even actually have ninja costumes that look identical?

 

[RM8]

Clearly it would not be a sound business decision, but DOA would be a much better series IMO without the absurd fanservice. It's incredibly off-putting and it overshadows what is a fun, smooth, flashy fighting game.

 

[Sushi Nao]

Nvm

 

[GuessMyUserName]

Extremely interesting. This is the right move to make within the community, and the FGC as a whole. It's fine to have these sort of costumes within the game (clearly there's a market for it, and you can't fault Team Ninja for making what sells) - but it might be best to not have them showing up in videos meant to represent high-tier play.

There is absolutely no reason to forcibly separate sexuality and high-tier play. The two are completely unrelated, you can have both.

 

[duck_sauce]

There is a huge difference between sexy outfits for males and females in a fighting game and objectifying women. I find the idea more offensive, that women need to be saved or shielded from certain content, than seeing bikini outfits on a female fighter. The majority of the female fighter cast in doa 5 tlr is strong and capable and very empowered and i love that. Plus, having a lot of costumes to choose rom is always, always a huge bonus.

I cant speak for everyone, but i like doa 5. It is fun. There are other issues that should raise public awareness than skimpy outfits.

 

[Sayah]

After reading this interview, I can tell that at least a part of the DoA competitive fanbase is annoyed that people don't take their game seriously because of its image.

I don't think the problem is exactly swimsuit costumes and whatnot. TTT2 also had them. SCV also gives similar attributes to its female cast. It's just the marketing angle for the DoA games is waaaaaay too heavily focused on the female sexualization aspect and becomes a huge part of its identity. It's just trying too hard. The camera angles in intros and win poses specifically focus on breasts and with current technology, there's also sweat effects and what not. I can see why it would be creepy or uncomfortable for someone to play this game in front of others. DoA5 is the only fighting game I wouldn't play in front of my family. Any other fighter is fine.

That's just my personal perspective at least.

 

[Sophia]

DOA has a LOT of female fans believe it or not.

Speaking purely of my own opinion, it's the high representation of female characters within the game + the large amount of outfits. There's a lot of characters that are interesting to play as, and I absolutely enjoy switching up the costumes every so often. I pretty much bought Hitomi and Marie Rose because of the outfits they have.

The fact that Dead or Alive, as of DOA5, is actually a pretty good fighter and has some of the best single player options of any fighter helps too. I love the survival mode. <3

 

[DigitalHitmann]

Do they even actually have ninja costumes that look identical?

Both Kasumi and Honoka have ninja costumes that look similar. Another reasoning he used was color blind. Im both red/green and blue/purple color blind and I said I could tell the difference between Honoka and Kasumi but he said thats because ive been playing DOA since I was like 10 years old and know the difference between everyone. Someone else might not.

 

[Enter The 36 Chambers]

Most people who go to tournies don't fuck with the soft bans. It's a sign of disrespect if you do.

Fuck a soft ban. And fuck anyone who feels disrespected by a costume choice. I hope people pick the banned costumes.

 

[Mushroomer25]

There is a huge difference between sexy outfits for males and females in a fighting game and objectifying women. I find the idea more offensive, that women need to be saved or shielded from certain content, than seeing bikini outfits on a female fighter. The majority of the female fighter cast in doa 5 tlr is strong and capable and very empowered and i love that. Plus, having a lot of costumes to choose rom is always, always a huge bonus.

I cant speak for everyone, but i like doa 5. It is fun. There are other issues that should raise public awareness than skimpy outfits.

I think it's less about protecting women from sexual imagery, and more about protecting DOA. If the game wants to be taken seriously, do they want comically sexualized characters to be a part of it? If they've got the ability to make the game at least appear more serious (especially when you consider things like streaming, where new potential players could be introduced to the game) - I see why they'd do it.

 

[Accoun]

I pretty much bought Hitomi

Wait, Hitomi is now DLC? I thought she's one of the standard fighters.

 

[Malice215]

Clearly it would not be a sound business decision, but DOA would be a much better series IMO without the absurd fanservice. It's incredibly off-putting and it overshadows what is a fun, smooth, flashy fighting game.

That absurd fanservice is why the game is still being supported, so it's a double edged sword.

There's nothing wrong with making the game more presentable at offline tournaments, which there aren't many of for DOA. Most of the people who are upset don't play the game or go to tournaments, so this doesn't pertain to them. Plus you can still enjoy the T&A from the privacy of home.

 

[Spaced Harrier]

I go to alot of tournaments, and I can vouch for it. When I ran pools at our event we had like 8-10 female participants.

DOA has a LOT of female fans believe it or not.

People who actually are in the fgc, know this to be true.

 

[Water]

So you're okay with a couple of TOs deciding this without little to no input from the community itself? Just deciding that something should be banned and issuing a blanket ruleset with no vote on what should be allowed or not?

Yes, especially when those rules are purely cosmetic and do not actually affect the players in any way, as is the case here. It's the norm for tournament organizers to choose what they want the tournament's public image to be, and to dictate aesthetic rules, courtesy rules etc. accordingly. Professional players and athletes expect it and deal with it.

Refraining from using character skins that show particularly large amounts of boob for the duration of a fighting game tournament is a pretty fucking small thing to ask. Just for instance, MMA tournaments around here do not allow a particular fighter to fight shirtless because he has tattoos linked to an extremist ideology, and the tournaments have no obligation to promote that particular ideology. That's his own actual skin being banned. But everybody involved is an adult, so there's no problem, no whining of "censorship" or "appeasement". He just wears a rashguard to cover the tattoos and competes like everybody else.

 

[ShinMaruku]

Funny thing about this is people never took doa seriously and these bans put attention to the perviness and this gesture did nothing to grow the scene. You want doa to grow? Don't try to bring in the same fgc people, you make your own scenen big enough to be subsumed with the rest. You will never get acceptance from the fgc crew.

 

[Mushroomer25]

Wait, Hitomi is now DLC? I thought she's one of the standard fighters.

LR is set up on a free-to-play model. You get the "core fighters" for free, but have to purchase everyone else. There's also a $40 disc version that contains all that content, if you'd rather not buy a-la-carte.

 

[Ragingnight]

wait. people can't tell by the fucking character name at both character select and in game match to know who they are fighting? Are you serious? That is why they banned ninja costumes?

LOL I hope to god that is not the reason

O GOD I CAN'T TELL IF IM FIGHTING RYU OR KEN OR AKUMA OR DAN AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

 

[Hex]

Got news for folks, it is a sub tier game that will ALWAYS be below Tekken, Virtua Fighter, Soul Calibur , Mortal Kombat and far far below Street Fighter.
The eye candy is what makes the series stand out, and they are doing this?
More power to them for taking it into their hands but ...

 

[Max Payne]

DOA is the only fighting game my GF will play *shrug*

 

[DigitalHitmann]

People who actually are in the fgc, know this to be true.

People dont understand an realize the break down of a typical FGC event. The typical east cost event will have 250-300 players for Street Fighter, ~150-200 for Marvel and of those players maybe 5-10 will be female. Dead or Alive will have around 30-50 participants and have 8-10 females every time.

 

[vg260]

For those upset by this, is it really that unreasonable for the tourney organizers to say, "Hey community, for the events where the game may be getting more exposure, can we try to avoid the more revealing costumes, because there's less chance of someone feeling uncomfortable that way?" Does it really bother people that much to maybe think about how others might feel and do something as simple as picking a more modest costume in a tournament to avoid a negative impression? I mean, is that really that unreasonable given the negative perception these costumes give the game (whether justified or not)? Is it really asking that much?

Granted in the US people are more desensitized to violence than sex, and perhaps that seems silly and people need to step back and think about that, but it's a whole other topic. But given that, in the context of a tournament where the gameplay is the focus, is it really that off-putting to concede a bit on the issue?

 

[HappehLemons]

Wait, some of the characters in this game have over 39 costumes?

 

[border]

If you're still going on with this myopic view of only individuals and their feelings about the game, with zero consideration of the bigger picture, I can only guess you didn't read my reply to your previous post.

Or maybe you think increased publicity for a game's tournaments, increased inclusion in larger events and media, increased sponsorship opportunities etc. do not increase the audience of a game. In that case I don't know what to say.

I saw your post but felt I'd mostly discussed its broader concerns. I'm skeptical that toning down the game's content is going to result in greater coverage or greater public interest. I don't think there's anyone that refuses to watch DOA tourneys because of the dumb outfits. Tournaments will feature whichever game puts asses in seats, and IMO DOA's audience is limited by virtue of how the game plays and not how it looks. Turning off the cheesecake is not going to make it more popular.....it's still going to be a second or third-run franchise, suddenly devoid of its only unique features.

I'd be happy to see the game have a content filter, just as I'd probably play Bayonetta in a "NO T&A" mode if it had one.