EA Cancels Black Panther Game, Closes Cliffhanger Studios
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Black_Stride
do not tempt fate do not contrain Wonder Woman's thighs do not do not
Thats rough.....I dont even know what the logo for Cliffhanger games looks like.....let alone actually seeing a game from them.
Thats the studio that picked up some of the Rocksteady guys yeah?
Double rough.
EA Originals is just the publisher for Hazelight.
Haze is independent, and if EA decides they dont want to honor contracts there are millions of publishers who will jump out and do it.
Theyve also still got:
DICE
Ripple Effect - Probably a support studio for above though
Motive
Bioware
Criterion
Maxis
Respawn
DICE, Ripple Effect and Criterion are working on Battlefield'24
Bioware are working on Mass Effect
Respawn is doing more Star Wars shit instead of giving us Titafall 3.
Maxis is doing Maxis things dont ask questions they print money
Motive is???? Working on Ironman
Thats the studio that picked up some of the Rocksteady guys yeah?
Double rough.
EA Originals is just the publisher for Hazelight.
Haze is independent, and if EA decides they dont want to honor contracts there are millions of publishers who will jump out and do it.
Theyve also still got:
DICE
Ripple Effect - Probably a support studio for above though
Motive
Bioware
Criterion
Maxis
Respawn
DICE, Ripple Effect and Criterion are working on Battlefield'24
Bioware are working on Mass Effect
Respawn is doing more Star Wars shit instead of giving us Titafall 3.
Maxis is doing Maxis things dont ask questions they print money
Motive is???? Working on Ironman
Unfortunatecookie
Member
Aggressive stupidity -- like the one in the clip -- is absolutely going on at PlayStation productions. For example, Concord.
An entire studio was being led by people who were tolerant of exclusion ideologies. In any creative art, in America, that's a recipe for disaster.
I don't think crunch is the best answer, because I don't think that will weed out the talentless artists. A lot of low effort/low-skilled people can survive if there are enough high effort/high-skilled people doing the brunt of the work. You see this all the time in gigantic corporations, retail businesses, basketball teams, manufacturing plants etc.
I think a new perspective on scope, budgets, scalability, market realities (e.g., nobody wants 90 GaaS a year), etc. will eliminate aggressively stupid people. If your studio only has the budget to hire 70 people, you're not going to recruit people who are more interested in race/politics/culture wars etc. than working at the studio.
The Mad Draklor
Member
Oh no... anyways, fries in the bag.
Gilgalaad
Member
owandeseis
Member
I think this is happening at most american Studios nowadays, which explains why almost every game created there lately is a mix of thrash, flops, or at least forgettable games.
It's sad because just 15-20 years ago they were dominating, hopefully this wont Last long and we'll see great games from there soon
winjer
Member
Because they have no talent.
Portugeezer
Member
EA must have been shocked and awed when they saw that their identity based hiring studio was producing a trash game.
KiteGr
Member
At this point it's more of a joke.
If you are not getting it, you might need a deeper look at the last decade.
Allow me to sum up the situation while venting out.
After the me2 movement, investors where very afraid of companies getting into scandals. So the biggest investment companies created a score of "virtuousness" for the investors called ESG in each potential company , that was heavily influenced from the percentage of "downtrodden social groups" in their ranks, such as women, racial minorities, or those of malfunctioning sexuality. Like any rule with gaming properties, so that system was "gamed" with companies focusing on those groups to attract investors.
That created the groundwork for the DEI movement and the creation of supposed Dei consultants that focused on pointing and including the supposed underrepresented groups in all aspects of the corporate world and products.
Sadly, this forced and bureaucratic version of "Diversity Equity & Inclusion" had a very opposite effect, and introduced hiring based on race, sex, sexuality, and beliefs in places where originally there wasn't necessary any, while introducing into the ranks a lot of activists to further force the movement.
The consequences became very obvious on the entertainment industry, such as movies, comics and videogames, where we started seeing feminist ideologies in boy brands, queer ideologies in masculine brands, multiracial presentation of otherwise homogeneous communities, and generally a lack of respect and understanding of established franchises.
This was pointed out by the clientele, but all those subjects where tabu to be talked against, especially on any official social media. Anyone who speaked against the whole situation was slapped with an -ist slur, was labelled a toxic minority and was silenced, if not outright banned. With the immigration situation on countries like England and Sweden becoming worse, people became less welcoming of the minority group, with masculinity being vilified and women being indifferent to replace the lost audience, beloved products began to fail, with horror stories surfacing of school forcing queer ideas to children and parents castrating their kids with puberty blockers, normies stopped trusting the modern systems with their kids, and with people being unable to comment their dissatisfaction and the one sided rhetoric of the official social media, other variables where blamed for the failures. With all major long lasting western franchises simultaneously dieing, Nerds made a mortal enemy of the DEI movement, so you see this passionate hate of today, and the orange testicle finding the opportunity to come to power in the US and destabilise the western civilization.
Now with all those nerds finally speaking their minds and with proof of not being "a minority of incels" we have posts like these where they vent out the frustration they've amassed all those years.
That was a long post...
RagnarokIV
Battlebus imprisoning me \m/ >.< \m/
Awesome news lol thanks EA.
ProtoByte
Weeb Underling
Monolith. So hilariously ironic that these guys were trifling with WB because they wanted to make a new IP, then decide to go to creativity bastion EA to make a Marvel game that then gets cancelled.
Everybody here, Marvel Games included, is just fucking beyond dumb.
"Over three years of experience"
Imagine going to GDC and get lectured by an absolute noob whose only concern is skin color and gayness.
Three years experience getting a speaking slot is fucking diabolical.
StueyDuck
Member
The only people doing the reaching here are the woke artists, towards people non-consensually.
Black_Stride
do not tempt fate do not contrain Wonder Woman's thighs do not do not
Ohh yeah Cliffhanger stole a bunch of people from WB Games both Monolith and Rocksteady, they were using Unreal Engine, they were using a character who is known for his combat prowess, they in theory had the budget to make this AAA.......how the fuck did EA fumble this badly?
Hector Hall
Member
Guess Dani LOLonders strategy on racial hiring didn't go as well as expected once she got rid of all those stinking whites uh?
squidilix
Member
elbourreau
Member
Pejo
Member
A Spooderman/Arkham series type BP game could have been good, but only if it was made by passionate people that respected the source material and was looking to make a great game instead of agenda material game #18932.
Something tells me this group wasn't it, but barring some leaks, I guess we'll never know.
Something tells me this group wasn't it, but barring some leaks, I guess we'll never know.
Rayven_king
Member
As a black panther fan I'm glad they nuked this, its diabolical trying to Gotham Knights the IP without even attempting a solo game first. Black panther fans only care about T'challa
And the same for white on white violence. You got white folks killing their whole family out here but yet black on black violence is very high. Mate, do some research.
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Jinzo Prime
Gold Member
I really want to see the concept art and script for this disaster.
Connificent
Al Pachinko, Konami President
We got Zau on Game Pass. Thank you EA
Dr. Samuel Hayden
Member
Don't worry we have Spider Man 3 to look forward to for that
The Mad Draklor
Member
It's because these developers hire by identity instead of talent. That inevitably leads to brain drain as they value ideological purity over merit.
drotahorror
Member
I don't know how it is in Australia or UK or wherever the fuck you're from, but in the States that loser white guy killing his whole family is a lot less body count than what the hoods are on a daily basis.
Even google agrees with my original statement about black on black and white on black violence.
nial
Member
Schizo response.
DeafTourette
Perpetually Offended
As a black man I KINDA understand what she was saying BUT I'd want a group of people from all walks of life chiming in on how to make a GREAT story. A truly collaborative effort pulling from TRUE fans of the character. Put in lore from the comics, real world history (which doesn't need editorializing), and a truly imaginative story that mixes great drama with great action!
I hope they make a Black Panther/Wakanda game one day as he's one of my favorite characters along with Steve Rogers, Luke Cage, Peter Parker, Sam Wilson and pretty much all X-Men (except for a few).
I hope they make a Black Panther/Wakanda game one day as he's one of my favorite characters along with Steve Rogers, Luke Cage, Peter Parker, Sam Wilson and pretty much all X-Men (except for a few).
StreetsofBeige
Member
Canada doesn't release crime incidents categorized by race. And if they do, it's hard to find doing internet checks. But the US releases shit tons of public info for everyone to see.
But all I know is being in the Toronto area which is a giant mix of everyone (I think white people are roughly 50% of the metro area give or take a bit) where it's most heavy in Asian and Indian minorities, but when it comes to crime reports and mug shots, it's almost all Black people. And the victim is usually Black too. So Black on Black crime is definitely not just a US thing. It's in Toronto too.
HeisenbergFX4
Member
As an older white man of 58 years who played sports at the very highest levels I can say I played with people of most races and never once did I feel the need to remotely think I needed to play on an all white team because it made me feel safe
I never remotely cared what the color of your skin was, just get the job done and treat me with respect and you got the same from me
StueyDuck
Member
Yeah, it's a bit disconcerting when someone says, "As race X, I can see where the racist is coming from".
the litmus test is always to replace X with any other race and see if it holds up to the same scrutiny, and as you point out, it doesn't.
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Shmunter
Member
What do you mean as a lack man you understand? Is the suggestion all black people are racist?l
StreetsofBeige
Member
When it comes to any organization, how about just hire the person who seems like the best fit in terms of personality, qualifications, and can fit the budget. And the aim is to put together a great team to win.
HeisenbergFX4 being an experienced athlete says it best. It's probably the ultimate in juggling performance, attitude and budget without needing to shoehorn in DEI loser policies. You dont see a sports team purposely saying they got to sign Player X due to race, Player Y due to age, Player Z due to gender or whatever other demographic metric something can think of. But a lot of desk jobber roles push for it. Funny how you never see the same DEI push in blue collar roles getting dirty outside or working a factory floor.
Just imagine if the Leafs, Jays or Raptors had to follow DEI ratio rules . Instead of building the best team they can, they purposely construct a team that reflects the GTA demographics (Greater Toronto Area, not the game!). It would be something like:
10 whites, 4 Asians, 4 Indians, 1 Mid East, 1 Black.
And that doesn't even involve adjusting it to take into account age, gender, language etc...
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ReasonBeing
Member
Hundreds of people lose their job but it's awesome because one of them was a racist idiot. Am I doing it right? I am all about not giving these types of ideas she has a platform, but let's not throw the baby out with the bath water. When we use a singular date point to pass judgement on a particular group, we are giving in to confirmation bias. This is the same type of funny math this woman is doing to pass judgement on all white people.
I've seen others say it speaks to the character of the people the studio hires, but I would like to point out that I'm sure we can find a piece of shit on any team that numbers in the hundreds, hell in the dozens.
Granted I only made it through page 2, so maybe there is evidence of the entire studio holding similar shitty ideas.
I've seen others say it speaks to the character of the people the studio hires, but I would like to point out that I'm sure we can find a piece of shit on any team that numbers in the hundreds, hell in the dozens.
Granted I only made it through page 2, so maybe there is evidence of the entire studio holding similar shitty ideas.
HeisenbergFX4
Member
heh you edited that just as I was typing out imagine where sports teams would be if they were forced to hire their athletes just based on skin color first and foremost
FeralEcho
Member
Seriously,the day that shit muncher Schreier started poking around hard on AAA studios about crunch issues was the day this industry turned into the lazy,uninspired,bloated fest of useless hires it has become.
That's why we start seeing these AA studios with 30-50 people putting these awful mismanaged AAA studios to shame with their 300 to 1000 developers that do nothing all day except waste fucking time and money sitting at their desks with their dick in their hand(that's if they don't go on strike for having to actually go to the office and not pretend working from home)while having nervous breakdowns on twitter every 3 days about stuff most of the time not even related to the game they are supposedly "working" on.
The sooner this whole cesspool of AAA publishers implodes on itself with all these worthless hirings that have done nothing but bloat the budgets to absurd amounts,the better the industry as a whole will be.
Zacfoldor
Member
I feel sorry for the people who lost their jobs and also don't like to revel in the bad luck of others.
That said, I haven't been able to wipe the smile off my face since I read this.
My honest opinion is that I think they knew Black Panther would absolutely flop(based on the release of several recent games as well as internal review of what they already had) and nobody wanted that.
Let me ask you this. What sells more in a global video game market? Wolverine or Black Panther? Taking a black panther flop to the face would be humiliating and something EA would never live down.
That said, I haven't been able to wipe the smile off my face since I read this.
My honest opinion is that I think they knew Black Panther would absolutely flop(based on the release of several recent games as well as internal review of what they already had) and nobody wanted that.
Let me ask you this. What sells more in a global video game market? Wolverine or Black Panther? Taking a black panther flop to the face would be humiliating and something EA would never live down.
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StreetsofBeige
Member
I remember a survey years ago asking about crunch, and a lot of video game employees said they dont even get crunched. So the whole perception of crunch is probably overexagerrated.
I think a lot of us who dont work in the industry (myself included) read all these articles with employees complaining and get an image that working at EA, or T2 or whichever company big or small and every person there works 14 hour days and brings a sleeping bag to work. So all us gamers have to give them a pat on the back and feel pity. So give them all a break and buy their game.
Gaming is an odd industry when you look at the manpower/budget between successful games and bad ones. As you said, a AAA resourced game can fail miserably. But then some indie studio with 5 people making the game in their basements with nothing but YT videos to promote the game can make a hit game. Very few industries are like this. Typically the big companies dominate where more resources leads to more success.
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tkscz
Member
Wait wait wait wait wait... so EA bought a studio whose only game was a terribly made dating sim, and had them try to make an AAA action game? What is the logic here? They had no experience on making a game that has actively moving and controlled characters and they were put in charge of an open world action game?
Angry_Megalodon
Member
Lets put aside the shitty ideas argument.
Hundreds of people lost their job because they were NOT able to produce a game. Even if those hundreds of people were legimetely hired (highly unlikely), they proved themselves unfit for the job. That Starbucks chick may be the nicest person in this world, but she can't work in the videogame industry at a managerial level.
As a player, I mostly want to enjoy good games. If they can't make good games, I want someone else in their place. It's that simple.
Finding out that they are assholes is the cherry on top.
FeralEcho
Member
It's hard to get an image of devs working so hard at these big studios when every time there's a fucking video inside a studio it shows everyone smiling ear to ear like they are on lucky night in a gay bar,sitting in hammocks writting like they are vegetables or riding their electric scooters between cubicles like they're shooting a live action south park episode.
The thing with crunch is it eliminates the people who are just there for the pay and nothing else because no lazy cunt in any job out there will stay working at a company that forces them to dedicate their valuable "me time" into the project's time.
We tried the non crunch way and what we got was 8 year development cycles,80 dollar games,500+ people workforce and hundreds of millions of dollars per project cost. That shit is and will be unsustainable and big companies are starting to realise it...only took countless of cancelations,studio closures and billions wasted but they're getting there...
ReasonBeing
Member
No I understand why they lost there jobs, I'm commenting on the people that are celebrating specifically because one of the team members was an awful person.
StreetsofBeige
Member
All new products at my company have an internal ship date I'd estimate about 1 year out from release. So everyone internal knows about it and so does the stores who buy form us.
Unless there is something completely out of the company's hands like government health approvals are delayed (FDA or Health Canada) or logistics issues like port strikes, or the company purposely delays the launch because there's not enough retailers who have accepted it yet (need to wait for some critical mass to make it worth doing), I dont think I've even seen a product delay due internal coworkers like R&D, marketing or supply chain departments fucking up simply not being ready on time.
And I've only seen the government health approval delays a handful of times even though there is zero guaranteed timeline of getting back to the company. But the internal staff plan that far enough in advance it's almost always good timing.
And when it comes to non-software/digital industries, you got a lot more to go wrong form making it, to shipping overseas on container ships going through ports, to government approvals etc.... And somehow we can still do things pretty consistently on time.
DeafTourette
Perpetually Offended
First, you're not understanding my perception because you're either not American black or haven't experienced certain things in this country.
Second, I said "kinda" because there have been many instances of black people not feeling safe or heard in majority white spaces. If you don't understand that, you don't understand and that's ok. And given the history of this country (and yes, there was plenty of racism in the 90s against black and brown people), I understand why so many (non-white) people want to have safe spaces.
And 3rd, i get wanting to have a group of mostly POC folks. Again, because of those instances.
In no way am I saying "black people are racist"... It's just not the direction I'd go (that she took). There are plenty of talented black and brown (as well as white) people in that industry and I'd want them to have a seat at the table, a table they're more often than not even invited to despite their talent. But I'd also have white people in my company. Talent above all and there ARE talented black and brown folks in the gaming industry.
If I want a black protagonist, I'd ask for black folk's perspective and experience to contribute... Same if I had a Native American protagonist, I'd have Native American input... Or if I had an Asian American protagonist... You get what I'm saying? I can't use my own singular perspective and apply it to any protagonist if it's a different "race" or culture from my own. Neither your or my experiences are universally applicable. Just like you can't apply yours to an Appalachian woman character's experience and I can't apply mine to a South African character's...
In the past, having an all black group like the Tuskegee Airmen was because of circumstance beyond their control... Having, as an example, an all black flight crew is also a matter of circumstances (so is an all white flight crew). In business, it's good to have a group with varied life experiences and viewpoints, even ones you may not agree with.
I hope I made that as clear as possible but I have a feeling some will not see my meaning. And my meaning is exactly what I said. I don't do hidden messages.