Ex-Ravens cheerleader charged with raping teen boy

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Well, damn. Not only she cheating, she also did it with a teenager below age of consent. That is definitely dead ball
 
They were already separated I believe. This will make the custody battle easy for the husband though.
 
Sai-kun said:
Okay...but that doesn't matter. Because it was illegal where it took place.
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I should note that I don't actually give a fuck about what the law says and am more interested in evaluating these sorts of things on a case-by-case basis.

If every discussion on this sort of thing just ended on "it was obviously illegal" well, then, why even bother having a thread on it?
Steve Youngblood said:
I'm of two minds about this. On the one hand, I agree that there is utility in delineating between things. Terms exist, and there's nothing wrong advocating for clarity in language. In that sense, I don't have a problem with distinguishing between ephebophile and pedophile, as these are both real words that have a real meaning.

However, I will also admit that I sometimes find the push for the distinction counterproductive. Both refer to predatory behavior of underage partners. And "pedophile" is often used as the more well-known catchall term that people are more familiar with to refer to that sort of behavior. Now, if it's a technical sticking point, I'm more than happy to acquiesce and use the proper terminology. But I would only do so to be more technically clear. I can't begin to tell you how little interest I have in using the term for mitigation purposes so as to allow for the fact that one isn't "as bad" because the partner in question had pubic hair and the other didn't.
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The severity of the crime is absolutely relevant when it comes to how the perpetrator is treated, however. I mean, that's just undeniable fact.

I get a very different picture in my head when someone calls someone a "kiddy diddler" versus a "teen predator". Lumping the former in with the latter does no one any favors.

Also, with regard to the bolded, that's just plain wrong. Obviously there's a HUGE difference between a 9-year-old child and a 15-year-old teenager even if you completely disregard the physical differences, hence my hangups with the misuse of the term "pedophile".
 
strobogo said:
It is the norm. I have no idea where dude was at where 16 is the age of seniors and 18 year olds are people who have been held back.
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Not that this has anything to do with the topic but just as a matter of curiosity, in let's say Michigan you're eligible to start Kindergarten if you turn 5 in Dec. http://enlightenme.com/age-to-start-kindergarten-by-state/ This means you can be 4 entering Kindergarten, 5 entering 1st grade, 11 entering 7th, and 16 entering 12th grade. That's the way it was for me.

I was wrong when I said the only people 18 in my HS were held back. If their birthday was before May, they did graduate at 18.
 
Teremap said:
Also, with regard to the bolded, that's just plain wrong. Obviously there's a HUGE difference between a 9-year-old child and a 15-year-old teenager even if you completely disregard the physical differences, hence my hangups with the misuse of the term "pedophile".
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There's obviously A difference, just as there'd be a difference in having sex with a 9-year-old vs. a 3-year-old. However, it's not one that I'm particularly interested in being meaningfully more forgiving of. Obviously, in each instance mentioend above (i.e 14 year old vs. 9 year old vs. 4 year old), I'm increasingly more disgusted the younger we're talking about. But I'm disgusted all the same.
 
Steve Youngblood said:
There's obviously A difference, just as there'd be a difference in having sex with a 9-year-old vs. a 3-year-old. However, it's not one that I'm particularly interested in being meaningfully more forgiving of. Obviously, in each instance mentioend above (i.e 14 year old vs. 9 year old vs. 4 year old), I'm increasingly more reviled the younger we're talking about. But I'm reviled all the same.
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Perhaps where we're diverging is in how we view these sorts of illnesses with respect to the management of society as a whole.

To wit: I have been presented with a preponderance of evidence that 'punishment' as a method of preventing ill-formed behaviors is extremely ineffective and, as such, I am not particularly interested in the constant talk of 'lock 'em up!' and such that tends to dominate any thread about crime.

I also view rather arbitrary age barriers as being counter-productive and that anything that would be considered "statutory rape" should instead be considered on a case-by-case basis, and that there is an intrinsic and very obvious difference in any case between a teenager with developed post-secondary sex characteristics and a prepubescent child, regardless of the existence of said arbitrary age barrier.

In this particular case there was obviously a power imbalance at play and the behavior should definitely be discouraged, but it is hardly behavior that I would "revile" as much as I would find it unfortunate. What's more concerning to me is what in the world actually happened to the woman to encourage her to seek out 15-year-old boys in the first place. Simply locking her up without asking the question of what lead to those circumstances is not beneficial to society as a whole.
 
Lothar said:
The only people 18 in my high school were people who failed a year.

I got kicked out of a rated R movie in my senior year because I was 16.

I remember being annoyed in my first semester of college that my friends and I all could not go into an 18+ club because we were all 17.
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Dude, where are you from? There wasn't a single 16 yo in my graduating class, and I sure as hell never failed a year.
 
Steve Youngblood said:
There's obviously A difference, just as there'd be a difference in having sex with a 9-year-old vs. a 3-year-old. However, it's not one that I'm particularly interested in being meaningfully more forgiving of. Obviously, in each instance mentioend above (i.e 14 year old vs. 9 year old vs. 4 year old), I'm increasingly more disgusted the younger we're talking about. But I'm disgusted all the same.
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Which also means that a 19 year old having sex with 17 year old is a disgusting pedophile. Interesting to see Teremap getting banned over this.
 
kamorra said:
Which also means that a 19 year old having sex with 17 year old is a disgusting pedophile. Interesting to see Teremap getting banned over this.
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Firstly, this is a very disingenuous distortion of my position. There's a giant chasm that separates "hard lines must be drawn and they must be immovable and inflexible" and "all lines are drawn arbitrarily and are thus largely meaningless." In terms of the legal discussion, there are often Romeo and Juliet laws on the books to aid in dealing with these borderline cases. You know what's NOT a borderline case? A 47-year-old women that preys on 15 year olds and buys them beer.

Secondly, I wouldn't presume to know the specific cause for bans.
 
Steve Youngblood said:
Firstly, this is a very disingenuous distortion of my position. There's a giant chasm that separates "hard lines must be drawn and they must be immovable and inflexible" and "all lines are drawn arbitrarily and are thus largely meaningless." In terms of the legal discussion, there are often Romeo and Juliet laws on the books to aid in dealing with these borderline cases. You know what's NOT a borderline case? A 47-year-old women that preys on 15 year olds and buys them beer.

Secondly, I wouldn't presume to know the specific cause for bans.
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Honestly wouldn't it be way easier to discuss if we just use the English words we have? You wouldn't have go tell me that this particular case isn't borderline as an example. Just because I think that the correct use of words is preferable doesn't mean I'm here to post "nice". I just think that using our own made up definitions won't help.
 
kamorra said:
Honestly wouldn't it be way easier to discuss if we just use the English words we have? You wouldn't have go tell me that this particular case isn't borderline as an example. Just because I think that the correct use of words is preferable doesn't mean I'm here to post "nice". I just think that using our own made up definitions won't help.
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Firstly, I haven't refused to distinguish between pedophile and ephebophile. I think it's fine if people want to distinguish a difference. However, I did contend that even with that distinction that I'm not at all interested in using ephebophile so as to mitigate the seriousness of the transgression. So, sure, let's call her an ephebophile. That doesn't change the fact that she's a sexual predator.

Of course, all of this has little to do with your insistence of trying to throw in the example of a 19-year-old sleeping with a 17-year-old so as to muddy the works and raise questions about the validity of lines in the sand to undermine viewpoints that probably aren't as rigid as you suspect they are. If I was in charge of having to make the rules for the purposes of having clear laws, I'm honestly not sure precisely where I'd draw the lines myself. However, the person the story is about? Yeah, I'm perfectly fine condemning this regardless of what term we use to define her sexual predilections.
 
Normally I look at these cases hating both parties, usually because the boy comes off as a shitlord who just wanted to have sex.

But this seems to be a case of the boy just following along with no initiative, and it paints the lady as someone who's actually taking advantage of someone who doesn't know what they're doing/want. Maybe it's just the article, but compared to most women who get caught she actually comes off as a predator/abuser, instead of someone who just made the stupid decision to run with a willing teen.
 
Steve Youngblood said:
Firstly, I haven't refused to distinguish between pedophile and ephebophile. I think it's fine if people want to distinguish a difference. However, I did contend that even with that distinction that I'm not at all interested in using ephebophile so as to mitigate the seriousness of the transgression. So, sure, let's call her an ephebophile. That doesn't change the fact that she's a sexual predator.

Of course, all of this has little to do with your insistence of trying to throw in the example of a 19-year-old sleeping with a 17-year-old so as to muddy the works and raise questions about the validity of lines in the sand to undermine viewpoints that probably aren't as rigid as you suspect they are. If I was in charge of having to make the rules for the purposes of having clear laws, I'm honestly not sure precisely where I'd draw the lines myself. However, the person the story is about? Yeah, I'm perfectly fine condemning this regardless of what term we use to define her sexual predilections.
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Well, I admit I shouldn't have quoted your post. I did it because you basically agreed with Stet who started this discussion with the very, very rigid viewpoint that every adult having sex with a minor is a pedophile. That muddied the topic quite a bit.
I will stop now, so everyone can get back to business.
 
So her son told the victim to call his mom. He was just hooking a bro up.

http://gawker.com/ex-nfl-cheerleaders-son-to-alleged-victim-mom-is-obse-1655483319

The details of the rape investigation involving the NFL's oldest cheerleader Molly Shattuck keep getting weirder. According to Delaware State Police, Shattuck's 15-year-old son helped Shattuck connect with the 15-year-old boy she allegedly raped.

Forty-seven-year-old Shattuck, who is estranged from her millionaire ex-CEO husband Mayo Shattuck, allegedly began a relationship with the 15-year-old victim after "spotting" him on Instagram. The relationship ended when she allegedly performed oral sex on him during a weekend Bethany Beach getaway with her kids. Now, court documents show that her son was instrumental in introducing his mom to the victim.
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Game has changed since I left high school.
 
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