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Fighting Game Headquarters |eSports| 4444 Life

D

direct_quote

Member
Kadey said:
I disagree. Faster or faster paced doesn't mean less skills involved. Same thing applies to many games. Like VF isn't less skilled than say DOA because the latter is faster. Like I don't think Overwatch is less skilled than COD, etc because it is much slower. It just takes different skills.

I had many situations in Destiny where I had to do something basically super frame perfect with jumping and shooting.

For example this gif. Person activated super, technically I should be dead. But I jumped in the air and sniped him. If I fell I would be dead. And if I were using another class I would probably be dead too. Warlocks float, and hunters have a fast normal jump like most standard jumps but titans get that high fast boost. If I didn't get a head shot I would be dead. If I used any other gun I would be dead. The sniper rifle was the only thing strong enough to kill that super in one hit. But I had only one chance to take that shot.
Click to expand...

I'm not saying faster pace automatically means more skills are involved, I'm saying advanced movement mechanics add more to the encounter (and more universal advanced mechanics in general). A lot of twitch shooters require skills that require last minute dodging and precise shots. Adding movement mechanics on top of that require precise timing give more to me than just getting a perfect shot or using the right tool. Because that shit has been done a thousand times, and I've done it a thousand times in fpses. I'd agree with your example that classes having different attributes add to encounters, but that's basically components of a class based system. I think having more universal mechanics on top of that (like in a fighting game) would even add more to such an encounter. But I don't play that game and there are probably other things to look forward in Destiny like factions, etc. So adding that may not be as relevant in that type of game?

But the game i harken to (NS1) had class based system mechanics, rts elements, skilled movement elements and ultimately more things to master and consider than most fpses. Does that make it better? Maybe, but the level of complexity the game had made the way the game played out much more interesting to me. I didn't get bored of it because there was always something different beyond some new conquest, or dlc character. The mechanics really stood the test of time, and I feel this is not as much an aim for modern shooters...

I don't feel all fpses need to do this (and if people like hero shooters or w/e), but if esports are becoming more of a thing I'd like to see games with more complicated base mechanics for people to build up on. Like real sports..
 
K

Kadey

Mrs. Harvey
Destiny has a ton to it. There really is no other comparison because it is a mesh of an rpg and fps. Single player has strikes, raids with complex requirements, etc.

You get three classes and each class has it's own subclass and each subclass has three movement options along with other class only stuff, up to like seven or eight out of twenty to thirty. That along with being able to level up. Having hundreds of weapons and gear and there is a lot to it. And each gear has up to seven or eight perks and there are countless perks. And some weapons have an element. Of course the community has figured out what's top tier and stuff by now but you see the point. Part of the reason why I like it too is the rpg aspect. Whether in PVE or PVP encounters have variety. It's a very unique game compared to anything out there.
 
K

Kadey

Mrs. Harvey
Oh even if you don't like the game it has some interesting stuff to it. There are many emotes related to pop culture. You can do the Carlton dance, Drake dance, Elaine dance, Michael Jackson's thriller dance, etc. At this point the game has like 40 - 50 emotes.

^ Prey reminds me a lot of Bioshock. Almost as if the same guys made it. And it looks nothing like the original Prey which was like a Doom III clone.
 
Spuck-uk

Spuck-uk

Banned
Karsticles said:
Have you seen the range on Scissor Kick?!

I'm not super satisfied with Bison, but SFIV also had no characters I liked in its massive roster. Sometimes you half to meet the game halfway. Sim has those huge normals, but I don't like playing keepaway.


I need arm room. :-/
Click to expand...

Tbh it sounds like you should be playing Johnny or Sin in Blazblue

CZhXkxpUkAET6ch.jpg
 
L

Line_HTX

Member
Last year's Tekken Global Finals is the best high level competition I have ever seen. Plenty to learn from that entire day's worth.
 
Tizoc

Tizoc

Member
This image has nothing to do with this week's offerings, it is just a pretty cool artwork
Click to expand...

1 Hour of Rival Schools 2
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ndYn80_1BYE

2 Hours of Dissida FF
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hmkf5_YgWSw

2+ Hours of Karnov's Revenge
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6VTo4eVKXsc
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qQbWy-o_6FI
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HF2EwgAxmXM

1 Hour of Suiko Enbu
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WdIVNeC8lVA
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ATYWPZYHPJ8

10+ Hours of various Samurai Spirits/Sho(w)down footage
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=01Und6A6TGU
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jvDMta8yRYM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gf27H6nje9w
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FoXkS8poWSs
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SvBIxgquGs4
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qt8CuPNX_8A
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mwe0IAlI5SE
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HM8DAwaiLww
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y2W3oWrxcPs
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CyRbW_EfqNk
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6p3CTr8BS6c
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N3AL07O0uO8
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vduMFkgWSNA
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FGdIZ3pol6w

3+ Hours of BlazBlue
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ca2db0VNbr0
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7NIs0U482vk
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yew28IJt41U
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YiKjNuJaLOo

90 mins. of Persona 4 AU
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W1OMH4MVXvk

4+ Hours of Melty Blood
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lj01qgRzNxY
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fqPkxOhQDQU
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EB1tdPBTolc

4+ Hours of Under Night InBirth
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TZlCZ_GQ6w4
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JVFZ-UUDuBU
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9pAovQXBoZ4

2 Hours of Sengoku Enbu
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h8GUSeQ8v1s
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t9hNMM9OBeQ
 
K

Karsticles

Member
Beckx said:
here's an archive of Koogy teaching a friend to play Dizzy. It's Rev rather than Rev2 but stuff should be applicable

https://www.twitch.tv/videos/135015656
Click to expand...
Saved! And thank you!

I'm actually amazed by my muscle memory. Someone should do studies on how fighting games improve your ability to acquire new muscle movements, because right when I picked Dizzy I my hands went right to the right buttons for her combos. When I played DotA2 with Dahbomb a week ago, I still remembered the hotkeys for all of the characters I picked. I played Dizzy once on her release day, and I haven't played DotA in about...7 years?

Tripon said:
Check out Tekken 7 world championships last Dec as well.

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLjw4VUNxDgU60A72B3a44sioVetKGRQeN
Click to expand...

Thanks, I'm watching it now. But this also shows onemic what I was talking about with Tekken movement jank:
https://youtu.be/lzHCu2OW_jc?list=PLjw4VUNxDgU60A72B3a44sioVetKGRQeN&t=166

You don't have prolonged moments like that in Marvel - wavedashing might look weird, but it's a blip in the fight.

I can see how Jack's pokes are significantly better than Alisa's, but goddamn he looks dumb. -_-
 
F

FACE

Banned
Anne said:
OW movement and mechanics definitely can't measure up to things like Quake and CS, but it's definitely got a lot more going for it as a shooter than the disaster known as Destiny lol
Click to expand...

I'm not going to deny that Destiny is a dumpster fire, just wanted to take a shot at OW.
 
M

MrDaravon

Member
Ed looks like he might be the first SFV DLC character (S1 OR S2) that interests me, but not sure that I'm hot to give Capcom SFV money at this point. More importantly though Tekken 7 is out in a few weeks and I am all aboard that train, first Tekken I'm picking up since 3.

Ed's hat is a goddamn abomination, the fact that multiple people had to have approved that at some level is kind of insulting
 
C

CO_Andy

Member
so many lapse Tekken fans coming back on board

i haven't played a Tekken seriously since 5 DR, and i'm really interested in getting back into the series, but ARMS arrives a couple weeks after... hmm, can't decide
 
S

sixteen-bit

Member
MrDaravon said:
Ed looks like he might be the first SFV DLC character (S1 OR S2) that interests me, but not sure that I'm hot to give Capcom SFV money at this point. More importantly though Tekken 7 is out in a few weeks and I am all aboard that train, first Tekken I'm picking up since 3.

Ed's hat is a goddamn abomination, the fact that multiple people had to have approved that at some level is kind of insulting
Click to expand...

I think u get enough FM just doing some of the characters stories to be able to "buy" Ed
 
M

MechaX

Member
I do have to give Tekken credit in that it's looking like it might scratch that 3D fighter itch that has been absent for quite some time if you're not really that into DOA
eh, who am I kidding, I just want another Virtua Fighter at this point.

I spent most of my weekend and off-day today playing SFV, and... man, there is just something about this game that is not gelling with me and I can't put my finger on it. Some of my sessions today were plagued with situations where I am just like "okay, this character's block string is absurd. But they used a slow fierce, maybe I can punish it no-CRUSH COUNTER." Rashid was a notorious offender of this and I need some more experience with this shit.

I go to reddit for some research, and a lot of their responses consists of "look at the frame data bruh." Fuck that frame data shit, give me a character with some honest to god zoning that is not a charge character like Guile and wasn't knee-capped like Ryu. I had more fun dicking around with Laura in casuals today simply because I at least had a projectile to slow all this down.

But Ed's cool I guess. He's like a JoJo Psycho Powered Rock Howard I guess.
 
O

Onemic

Member
MechaX said:
I do have to give Tekken credit in that it's looking like it might scratch that 3D fighter itch that has been absent for quite some time if you're not really that into DOA
eh, who am I kidding, I just want another Virtua Fighter at this point.

I spent most of my weekend and off-day today playing SFV, and... man, there is just something about this game that is not gelling with me and I can't put my finger on it. Some of my sessions today were plagued with situations where I am just like "okay, this character's block string is absurd. But they used a slow fierce, maybe I can punish it no-CRUSH COUNTER." Rashid was a notorious offender of this and I need some more experience with this shit.

I go to reddit for some research, and a lot of their responses consists of "look at the frame data bruh." Fuck that frame data shit, give me a character with some honest to god zoning that is not a charge character like Guile and wasn't knee-capped like Ryu. I had more fun dicking around with Laura in casuals today simply because I at least had a projectile to slow all this down.

But Ed's cool I guess. He's like a JoJo Psycho Powered Rock Howard I guess.
Click to expand...

Your only choice would be sim
 
M

MechaX

Member
Onemic said:
Your only choice would be sim
Click to expand...

Man... I have been avoiding him because I have never been that big into him in any SF, but it's looking like I may have no choice. The more I play, the more I realize that I just inherently feel uncomfortable in these rush down positions, regardless of whether I am the one rushing, or the one getting rushed.
 
T

The Lone Dragon

Member
MechaX said:
I do have to give Tekken credit in that it's looking like it might scratch that 3D fighter itch that has been absent for quite some time if you're not really that into DOA
eh, who am I kidding, I just want another Virtua Fighter at this point.

I spent most of my weekend and off-day today playing SFV, and... man, there is just something about this game that is not gelling with me and I can't put my finger on it. Some of my sessions today were plagued with situations where I am just like "okay, this character's block string is absurd. But they used a slow fierce, maybe I can punish it no-CRUSH COUNTER." Rashid was a notorious offender of this and I need some more experience with this shit.
Click to expand...

I mean, it's not like Tekken doesn't also have obnoxious, powerful stuff in it that can only be overcome with experience, studying, and a little (a lot of) spur of the moment guesswork.

Bullsh*t is the stuff of fighting games. You can't escape it by running from one to another. It'll just change form and find you.
 
S

Skilletor

Member
MechaX said:
I do have to give Tekken credit in that it's looking like it might scratch that 3D fighter itch that has been absent for quite some time if you're not really that into DOA
eh, who am I kidding, I just want another Virtua Fighter at this point.

I spent most of my weekend and off-day today playing SFV, and... man, there is just something about this game that is not gelling with me and I can't put my finger on it. Some of my sessions today were plagued with situations where I am just like "okay, this character's block string is absurd. But they used a slow fierce, maybe I can punish it no-CRUSH COUNTER." Rashid was a notorious offender of this and I need some more experience with this shit.

I go to reddit for some research, and a lot of their responses consists of "look at the frame data bruh." Fuck that frame data shit, give me a character with some honest to god zoning that is not a charge character like Guile and wasn't knee-capped like Ryu. I had more fun dicking around with Laura in casuals today simply because I at least had a projectile to slow all this down.

But Ed's cool I guess. He's like a JoJo Psycho Powered Rock Howard I guess.
Click to expand...

Yeah...you're not going to like Tekken much if you want to ignore frame data.
 
M

MechaX

Member
Skilletor said:
Yeah...you're not going to like Tekken much if you want to ignore frame data.
Click to expand...

The Lone Dragon said:
I mean, it's not like Tekken doesn't also have obnoxious, powerful stuff in it that can only be overcome with experience, studying, and a little (a lot of) spur of the moment guesswork.

Bullsh*t is the stuff of fighting games. You can't escape it by running from one to another. It'll just change form and find you.
Click to expand...

Just because I was not too keen on looking up frame data in SFV at the moment does not mean I can or have ignored it in other fighting games.

Every game has it's own share of bullshit. SFV's combination of said bullshit is just somewhat off putting at the moment.
 
Z

ZeroTheShadow

Member
I'll never understand how you can call Tekken's movement jank. Since when is the ability to instantly cancel your dashes & SS jank? That would mean Marvel & Melee are jank as well. More control=jank now?
 
Kalamari

Kalamari

Member
Unemployment is down, the Tekken scene will be stronger than ever

I think the Tekken jank is reffering to the smoothness and realism of the animation, not necessarily the movement ability itself. Let's be honest, Tekken movement animation isn't the most natural loooking.
 
S

Slamtastic

Member
ZeroTheShadow said:
I'll never understand how you can call Tekken's movement jank. Since when is the ability to instantly cancel your dashes & SS jank? That would mean Marvel & Melee are jank as well. More control=jank now?
Click to expand...

Videogame-y responsive animation canceling is jank for lots of people, who want smooth full animations to play out completely for every action with transitions between every state, especially if the graphics are realistic.
 
notworksafe

notworksafe

Member
ZeroTheShadow said:
I'll never understand how you can call Tekken's movement jank. Since when is the ability to instantly cancel your dashes & SS jank? That would mean Marvel & Melee are jank as well. More control=jank now?
Click to expand...

the animation cancels look jank, the control is not. folks just don't know the words they want to write so they say "jank".
 
shaowebb

shaowebb

Member
Retropi is in and tested and working wonderfully. Ran some Rage of the Dragons and Matrimelee earlier. Good times. Then I discovered I had quality rom hacks as well of Sonic the Hedgehog...one had Sally Acorn with no spin or jump attack but instead using Nicole to zap things and the other had Shadow with a spindash and homing attack. There were more but damn those were nice. Totally different in how you gotta play it with them.

Gonna see if the retropie has Garou Densetsu Special Dominated Mind so that I can play against WHITE in Real Bout Fatal Fury finally. Heard he was BS and wanted to try him out.

doDxA5k.jpg


Good times ahead. Next up is the arcade stick with the 680 in 1 and finally I'll get my measurements to setup my cabinet build. Personal arcade glory awaits me! From Vampire Savior to Progear to Twinkle Star Sprites and X-men Children of the Atom I should be set now.
 
D

Dahbomb

Member
ZeroTheShadow said:
I'll never understand how you can call Tekken's movement jank. Since when is the ability to instantly cancel your dashes & SS jank? That would mean Marvel & Melee are jank as well. More control=jank now?
Click to expand...
The word they are looking for is "twitch" not jank.

What they are referring is to when the momentum of a character stops abruptly and then does another action unnaturally. And yes this "twitch" animation applies to Marvel and Melee too.

The reason it sticks out more in Tekken is because all the animations are very realistic in presentation whereas in Marvel/Marvel it's more stylistic.
 
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