and regis and luna too
Final Fantasy XV SPOILER THREAD
- Thread starter Kagari
- Start date
and regis and luna too
ShadowSoldier89
Member
Starting in chapter 10 and the game is trying to lay on the depressive atmosphere thick. Everyone is speaking softly, Noctis has become insufferable but I guess in a way that's a step up for his non existent personality this far, prompto tries to show photos at camp and Noctis just says nah. Super depressing atmosphere, except it doesn't feel earned at all. It was caused by the death of a character that was barely there and a character being blinded by fuck all cause.
But why even now. How about 7 chapter ago when you found out half your kingdom was killed including your father
But why even now. How about 7 chapter ago when you found out half your kingdom was killed including your father
orthodoxy1095
Banned
Fair enough, take Aerith out of the examples then. Hell, take the "fridging" gender-politics issue out completely.
For me, the issue still remains that you can kill off characters in your story...but you need to put in adequate leg-work to make me give a damn. When Jarred died, I wondered why they were all so broken up. When Luna died I actually did feel a little sad, but not for Luna since I didn't give a damn about her, but for Noct who seemed sad. Otherwise, her death has such a little emotional investment that it just seems so anticlimactic.
We had this discussion in the other thread about the game's treatment of women, but this is the exact issue I think many people will end up having.
She's not actively that bad of an inclusion in the game (compared to something like how actively gross Cindy is). She's just kind of "meh," and while I wouldn't want a complete rehash of her, the problem is that we've kind of already seen this type of character before and done better too. It was Yuna. She was strong, and dynamic (had some appropriate flaws), and in love with Tidus, but she didn't exist solely for Tidus' sake, which is what Luna seems to be. Luna existed as more than a simple narrative contrivance to move along the story that appeared for a grand total of maybe fifteen minutes, instead she was an active, visible participant in almost all of the events.
I think people said that since she's an Oracle, she could feel the (literal) darkness inside of him and tried to heal him? Which of course pissed him off because he needed that darkness to complete his goals?
WaterAstro
Member
Holy crap, what the garbage story it turned out to be. So many forced emotional plots with no build up.
Ignis goes blind for no reason. Gladio keeps bitching at you about it like I was supposed to feel sorry for this sudden blindness out of nowhere.
Prompto is one of those robot zombie monsters for no reason. "Oh, okay, you're one of THOSE dudes. Whatever"
"I'm Luna and I want to help Noctis!" Gets stabbed out of nowhere. It's like they wanted to recreate Aeris's death, except you played dozens of hours with Aeris and didn't have enough time to know about Luna.
And as much as people like the first few chapters of bro-ing out, I think it worked against the main story. Your dad died, your fiance is dead or missing, your home city is destroyed, and you go camping, fishing, and taking souvenir photos. I was so emotionally detached from the main story because of it.
Ignis goes blind for no reason. Gladio keeps bitching at you about it like I was supposed to feel sorry for this sudden blindness out of nowhere.
Prompto is one of those robot zombie monsters for no reason. "Oh, okay, you're one of THOSE dudes. Whatever"
"I'm Luna and I want to help Noctis!" Gets stabbed out of nowhere. It's like they wanted to recreate Aeris's death, except you played dozens of hours with Aeris and didn't have enough time to know about Luna.
And as much as people like the first few chapters of bro-ing out, I think it worked against the main story. Your dad died, your fiance is dead or missing, your home city is destroyed, and you go camping, fishing, and taking souvenir photos. I was so emotionally detached from the main story because of it.
orthodoxy1095
Banned
I said I had this feeling early on.
The game should have stayed a side-project and have been Final Fantasy: Camping Simulator instead. That part was way more fun than the actual story.
Vincent Alexander
Member
Mrm. I can't really disagree with you. Especially about Yuna, now that II think about it. She is the better and much more fleshed out version of Luna.
It seems like she has a similar power that Ardyn had? He helped purge demons, but pulled them into himself to contain them, which eventually led to him having too much darkness in him. Luna seems like she has the power to cleanse that presence. So my interpretation, though cheesy, is this....re-watching the final scene I see that Ardyn has gone full demon crazy-eyes when he lifts his hand to challenge Noct in the afterlife. At this time one could assume Ardyn has completely lost control. But then she appears, and touches his hand again (not very subtle...they don't trust us remembering this happened or something?) Then the demon pulls his hand back and doesn't defend against Noct. My feeling is that Ardyn gained control of his hand again, and the good in him (the part of him that was ready to die as well) held back.
Everything going on in the background of this game felt like a great Final Fantasy game. But somewhere along the line, kind of like orthodoxy hits at, someone wanted to make a camping simulator. Joking aside, someone let MMOs inspire way too much of this game.
I don't disagree. Luna was just a completely botched opportunity for a character that mattered to the game in general, forget being a strong female character
Tabata took Aerith, Yuna and tried to combine elements of them into Luna, but completely missed the point it seems
ShadowSoldier89
Member
Considering I haven't enjoyed the combat, open world, or any of the main game loop. Couple in this Shitty story and I really dislike this game
Vincent Alexander
Member
On paper, I still think she is good. What they delivered on though was poor. It would go against the convention of this game being a bro-hangout, but I think her death could've had a lot more impact if we broke off from the main gang and played a chapter as her. We were told she traveled quite a bit to speak to Titan and Ramuh. Maybe others, before they were killed? Give us some of that.
orthodoxy1095
Banned
I definitely think the sections with Aranea and Iris proved you could have a female character join the bro-cast temporarily without remotely ruining the dynamic.
I don't think there's a compelling reason to not have included a section where we interact more closely with her. Even a completely slowed down chapter in Altissa with a tragic "date night" before she gets killed the next day might have been more effective.
WaterAstro
Member
Talking about inspiration...
Boss Fights were like God of War
Base infiltration was like Metal Gear
A number of action set pieces were out of Uncharted
That stupid chapter 13 was Resident Evil
They really tried to cram a lot of things into this game that really didn't need it.
ShadowSoldier89
Member
Tabata seems obsessed with killing characters without caring about making it valuable to the story
Just beat it. I enjoyed the ride, no pun intended, for what it was. It's such a strangely told story, and the structure is so unconventional. I respect what they did since I'm pretty tired of many conventional JRPGS in terms of plot structure, progression and such, so even though a lot of what was happening didn't care to make sense of itself, my genuine surprise to the way the story was playing out structurally kept me engaged (except for chapter 13 that shit was god awful).
That, and I actually really just love playing the game. Needless to say, I'm a fan of the combat overall. I'm satisfied with the how the game began and ended because it seems to be aware that nothing is as important as the relationship between the guys.
Not a great story by any means, but at least it accomplished what it needed to, and that was making me care for the main cast (not including Luna). Excited to get back and finish the side-stuff and do more dungeons.
Message for Square:
That, and I actually really just love playing the game. Needless to say, I'm a fan of the combat overall. I'm satisfied with the how the game began and ended because it seems to be aware that nothing is as important as the relationship between the guys.
Not a great story by any means, but at least it accomplished what it needed to, and that was making me care for the main cast (not including Luna). Excited to get back and finish the side-stuff and do more dungeons.
Message for Square:
pls put Noct and bros in KH3
Vincent Alexander
Member
Damn, that's cold. Almost made my heart drop thinking what a downer her death really would've been with this.
I think so to, and I'm willing to bet somewhere along the line there was plans for Luna to temp in to the party but it got cut along with a metric fuckton of other stuff. There are at least four cutscenes with her from trailers that our just gone. They didn't handle her well at all, but you can tell they planned for more then what we got just like with everything else in this story
ChosenPredator
Banned
damn the end at the camp is probably the saddest moment ever in final fantasy, that actually made me feel sad. lol
That imo is easily the best moment in the story, both of Noct"s VA's knocked it outta the park, the facial animation was great and sense the bros are the core all the way through it felt earned
ChosenPredator
Banned
I agree everything was on point , that just made everything come together, such a simple scene but really powerful.
Does Ignis, Prompto and Gladio know what theyre getting themselves into when the game opens up? And just Noctis is kept in the dark? Like did they know that the trip wasn't meant to wed Noctis but instead groom him into a martyr for the light of the world? Because apparently Regis knew this all along, which makes his concerned sadness in the beginning a lot more understandable.
nice
Vincent Alexander
Member
I'm about 99% certain that only Luna and Regis knew. But what I'm confused about is why there needed to be a martyr in the first place. What terrible thing was going on in the world that the 117th or whatever king needed to set straight? Because neither Luna or Regis know of Ardyn's existence at this point.
XD took me a good minute to find the bolded word. Unintentional pun i promise!
Unless Regis did? Regis had to have realized at some point that Noctis would have to face insurmountable odds, and require the power from the ring. To be honest, I'd be more confused if I didn't see the same thing happen to Nyx in Kingsglaive. But that's the only explanation that seems to make sense to me. Or maybe Luna knew all along because of her oracle status and got word to Regis? Thus putting this whole thing into motion
the nights were getting longer for a while before the story started. Regis and Luna were bound to have already known that Noctis would be the one to get rid of the threat of the daemons. The world of ruin was going to happen regardless eventually. The only question was, would the successor to the line of lucius be ready to combat it
Vincent Alexander
Member
They were? I knew part of the Oracle's power was holding off the starscourge, and that is why night's took over that much quicker once she died. I didn't realize they were already lengthening before.
In altissia it becomes night time around the 16th hour. While in Lucis at the 20th hour
ChosenPredator
Banned
I am so curious how the world reacts after all of those events especially with no king, im guessing they are going to release 15 part 2.
Yeah, very early in the game its remarked on the radio that the nights had been getting longer for a while and that scientists had not yet found the actual cause of it, even though we know now that it was the encroaching scourge of stars.
It also plays into why the demons are super powerful at night, to the point where you cant really move around during the night, which i thought was a clever mechanic to tie the plot in as foreshadowing.
Luna dying essentially sped it up and fast forward 10 years, of course most of the humans who had not taken refuge in the last safe havens were all killed off
Just cashed in 450k xp at 3x. Everyone is 97 except Noct who is 98. Gonna finish up the game tomorrow.
It starts getting dark in Lucis before you leave too, I noticed it while doing quests and hunts before I left for Altissia.
It starts getting dark in Lucis before you leave too, I noticed it while doing quests and hunts before I left for Altissia.
There is no need for a part 2. The kingdom of luciuswas only one kingdom out of many in the land. That should have no effect on the rest of the world outside of magic and daemons no longer existing, thus eliminating any need for another game.
Presumably, all kingdoms and civilization itself collapsed after the 10 year skip anyway due to the scourge of stars becoming more and more intolerable.
The small amount of humans who had managed to survive in the world of ruin would have nothing to do but rebuild
Vincent Alexander
Member
Well, let's hear it! Or credits still rolling? I wanna hear your thoughts.
Also, not to do with Final Fantasy necessarily, but I feel empty since I beat this game. I need to find a quick game to jump into so I don't feel hollow inside. I'm stuck between replaying Final Fantasy 7, Final Fantasy 9, Final Fantasy 10, or Darksiders 1. Can't make up my mind...
orthodoxy1095
Banned
I said in the other thread, but I've got to hear your thoughts.
Nomura and Nojima not being credited just adds to my pain.
Lol, well it wasn't their scenario anymore, but we both know this. Nomura atleast gets credit for character design.
My issue is that generally speaking the final game is a mess of ideas in a lot of ways.
WaterAstro
Member
A lot of the core Versus staff who initially started the 15 project left early on. Its been almost 3 years since the actual exodus and around 2.5 years since we first heard news about it, most notably about Nomura and Nojima leaving the project.( but also jun akiyama
)orthodoxy1095
Banned
Lmaooo.
I think the only cutscenes I genuinely liked in the whole game was the post credits campfire one and the one where the bros say goodbye to Noct.
Does anyone know what happens to Verstael? I killed Loqi and the other general who you capture (then ignis in the span of 2 minutes gives him over to the hunters and he escaped WTF ROFL) at a base, Ravus might as well not have even been a char and Iedolas gets turned into a Foras.
Does anyone know what happens to Verstael? I killed Loqi and the other general who you capture (then ignis in the span of 2 minutes gives him over to the hunters and he escaped WTF ROFL) at a base, Ravus might as well not have even been a char and Iedolas gets turned into a Foras.
Vincent Alexander
Member
In a good or bad way? I just beat it today and still feel empty.I'm having an emotional crisis right now
orthodoxy1095
Banned
Aw, I'm sorryI'm having an emotional crisis right now
Hopefully you'll feel better about it after you process it some?
longdi
Banned
Does Noctis need to kill Ardyn twice? Or it was just a flashy scene for the sake of it?
DarkLordMalik
Member
DLC boss for Prompto where he reveals: 'Prompto, I am your Father' and Prompto is like :'NOOOOOOOOOOO'
Ardyn is immortal. He needed to vanish him for good from the afterlife and this required the help of the 13 Lucis Kings, or Knights of the Round. The only way they could help was through sacrifice.
Ardyn was immortal, Noct needed to gain "providence" by sitting on the throne to finally kill him.
I'm having an emotional crisis right now
Hope this doesn't keep you down for long, cheer up soon <3
Vincent Alexander
Member
Once for physical form. Second was finishing him off in the afterlife, else he'd come back (I assume).
Noctis killed Adryn, but he would revive since he was immortal. Noctis needed to die, go into the void and kill him for good.