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[Boogiepop]

Uuuuuuugh, like 2-3 battles on both sides in Chapter 3 and... I feel like I'm at a breaking point on staying on Hard/Classic, because I'm just getting constantly killed right now because something just plain outclassing my characters keeps popping up no matter which direction I go, feels like.

And so I said "screw it, I'm probably getting thrown off by how different things are, and I don't wanna take forever on this, so I'll drop it down!" Only to find out... you can't?! Why the hell did they lock you to a difficulty when at least Fates let you drop down freely?

Uuuuugh, guess I'm stuck with what I've got, but yeah... not liking that I don't have an out for if I get really, seriously and truly stuck. Bleh.

Edit: Okay, went ahead and plowed back to the shrines required to just say screw it and upgrade everyone who could, and now I at least seem to be doing a lot better. OP better be right about doing so not being an issue down the road... (It feels so wrong not grinding everyone up to 20! But... that wasn't reasonably happening, so we'll see how this works out for me.)

 

[PK Gaming]

Thanks for the response. The problem with the character building is it is very poorly done. Almost all conversations between characters are them explaining their personalities to each other or proclaiming how they are or not as people. The remaining conversations are about who is in love with whom.

A lot of the Awakening/Fates era supports revolve around an idea or quirky sequence of events... introductions are pretty rare past the first few lines of dialogue, with characters often having an idea of who the other is. Love talk usually happens at ran S.

I'm not defending or denigrating it, but I just wanted to set the record straight.

 

[The Awesomest]

I'm on a warpath with Celica in Act 3, but for some reason I can't build certain supports? Like, I have people fight right next to each other but there's no heart icon to show that they're building support.

Celica and Atlas are stuck at C, Mae and Boey are stuck at B, as is the archer guy with his buddies. Other ones seem to work, like Ginny and her friend, the mercs, and the Whitewings. What's going on? Do I need to progress further in the game before supports can resume building?

 

[KirbYuuYuu]

I'm on a warpath with Celica in Act 3, but for some reason I can't build certain supports? Like, I have people fight right next to each other but there's no heart icon to show that they're building support.

Celica and Atlas are stuck at C, Mae and Boey are stuck at B, as is the archer guy with his buddies. Other ones seem to work, like Ginny and her friend, the mercs, and the Whitewings. What's going on? Do I need to progress further in the game before supports can resume building?

I think supports are locked based on where in the game you are. Like Clair A-support with Grey is locked until a certain point since it revolves around her realizing that she can't get her Almond joy so she'll just settle for a cup of tea.

 

[Forward]

Okay I need to take a breathe before storming the Temple of Mila in Act 3.

Tried three time now, I had one very close chance of beating the boss, right positioning and all, but he just had to summon eight gargoyles out of the wazoo and basically killed anyone that is weak.

Tried to play defensively by luring the mages with Pegasus Sisters first, but I get swarmed by the gargoyles he summoned every other turn.

Edit: FINALLY BEAT THAT SHIT

I only took in Genny, and Celica, I think. I did the same thing on Sonya's map, but with more Leo.

 

[GeekyDad]

Okay...I really don't know what's going on in this game. I promoted most of my early units, and...they're casting spells, using weapons...I never gave them. I never equipped a lance to this dude, or a spell book to my cleric. And since when can an archer shoot back from an adjacent square? Am I even playing a Fire Emblem game? Dafuq

 

[Aveyn Knight]

Okay...I really don't know what's going on in this game. I promoted most of my early units, and...they're casting spells, using weapons...I never gave them. I never equipped a lance to this dude, or a spell book to my cleric. And since when can an archer shoot back from an adjacent square? Am I even playing a Fire Emblem game? Dafuq

Haha, you may need to rethink some mechanics.

You don't need to equip anything to fight. By default, characters will fight with a 0 Might weapon. Of course, if you give them a weapon, they will do more damage.

Spell-casters learn spells as they level up and always keep their learned spells (unless they reclass). Unlike physical units, they never ever need weapons (and cannot equip any), but they must expend HP to cast spells.

 

[PsionBolt]

Were Path of Radiance and Radiant Dawn as poorly written and chock full of anime stuff as the last few games in this series? I can't tell if they were actually less painful to read or if I just got a decade older. Well, the latter definitely happened.

Also, does Lukas always suck? I ground him to level 18 or so pre-promotion and he just got 6 speed. Almost everything hits him twice. Clive also sucks.

Every entry in the franchise is maximum anime drivel, from aesthetics to writing and back again. The reason folks don't mind so much with some entries is because the definition of anime drivel changes with the times, and everyone has their own taste in which flavour of anime drivel they find most palatable.

While the plot outline is 100% standard, the writing quality of the dialogue and narration in Echoes is the best the series has ever had, so it doesn't make much sense to me that someone would see FE's writing as being on the decline.
Even with regards to the plot outline, we've seen that this series can hand out a lot worse than just standard -- Fates and Radiant Dawn being examples of that.

And yes, Lukas sucks. But then, everyone sucks in Echoes except like four people and you don't get many knights, so Lukas is serviceable. You can dump Clive, since you get multiple superior cavaliers.

 

[Maintenance]

.

 

[tebunker]

So after crushing Awakening this year, I bounced hard off Fates-Conquest about midway through even though I liked a lot of the QOL changes and some of the maps/different goals, but I decided to start up Echoes and I really like it. Hoping it keeps up.

I know it can get to be a slog later on but going to keep plugging. For some reason having the game be majority voice acted helps and I like the different style of the dungeons.

 

[GeekyDad]

Haha, you may need to rethink some mechanics.

You don't need to equip anything to fight. By default, characters will fight with a 0 Might weapon. Of course, if you give them a weapon, they will do more damage.

Spell-casters learn spells as they level up and always keep their learned spells (unless they reclass). Unlike physical units, they never ever need weapons (and cannot equip any), but they must expend HP to cast spells.

I see. Thanks.

Is this how the original game was? Or is this new for the series. Played FE games on GBA, DS, GCN, Wii, and the previous two 3DS games, and don't ever remember these kinds of mechanics in any of those games.

 

[Erheller]

I see. Thanks.

Is this how the original game was? Or is this new for the series. Played FE games on GBA, DS, GCN, Wii, and the previous two 3DS games, and don't ever remember these kinds of mechanics in any of those games.

Gaiden (the game Echoes is remaking) is known to be really weird compared to other FE games. So a lot of the mechanics were in Gaiden, but nowhere else in the series.

 

[GeekyDad]

Gaiden (the game Echoes is remaking) is known to be really weird compared to other FE games. So a lot of the mechanics were in Gaiden, but nowhere else in the series.

Ah, I see.

I'm still early on, but I notice some indication that certain units seem to pair together. The game, however, hasn't offered any tutorial yet about that.

Also...whew, Alm is an annoying character -- good lord! I hope the dialogue gets better...

But I kinda like the dungeon aspect. That being said, I seem to have accidentally aggroed three enemy avatars at once and now I'm facing a shit-ton of units in one battle.

 

[Aveyn Knight]

Ah, I see.

I'm still early on, but I notice some indication that certain units seem to pair together. The game, however, hasn't offered any tutorial yet about that.

Also...whew, Alm is an annoying character -- good lord! I hope the dialogue gets better...

But I kinda like the dungeon aspect. That being said, I seem to have accidentally aggroed three enemy avatars at once and now I'm facing a shit-ton of units in one battle.

Hmm, I don't think there's a tutorial for that. The support system in this game is a lot more subtle, harking to the GBA era.

You cannot Pair Up like in the other 3DS games, but you earn points and get stat boosts for fighting nearby. There are full details here.

For dungeons, enemies will indeed group up if they're close by. By the way, if you cause sound by running or using your sword, enemies will notice you. Otherwise you can sneak past.

 

[GeekyDad]

Hmm, I don't think there's a tutorial for that. The support system in this game is a lot more subtle, harking to the GBA era.

You cannot Pair Up like in the other 3DS games, but you earn points and get stat boosts for fighting nearby. There are full details here.

For dungeons, enemies will indeed group up if they're close by. By the way, if you cause sound by running or using your sword, enemies will notice you. Otherwise you can sneak past.

Ah, thanks! Old Serenes Forest -- still around. Had the site in my favorites at one time, spending a lot of time there every day.

So, when you say, "sneak," is there a way to make Alm not run, because even if you're not pressing the B button to dash, he still seems to run.

 

[Aveyn Knight]

Ah, thanks! Old Serenes Forest -- still around. Had the site in my favorites at one time, spending a lot of time there every day.

So, when you say, "sneak," is there a way to make Alm not run, because even if you're not pressing the B button to dash, he still seems to run.

Yup, still around XD

Nah, that's fine. As long as you don't hold B, you won't alert enemies with sound. Of course, they can still see you if you're in their line of sight, so you need to be careful.

Otherwise if you "walk" behind or to the sides of an enemy, most of them shouldn't notice you.

 

[GeekyDad]

Well, having played through a bit more, it's definitely growing on me. I enjoy the art design a little more in this one than the previous two. It feels more like the GBA games in its style. The story is still ridiculous. I wish they would hire on some better writers. This series really deserves it. But I'm enjoying the gameplay. I like the idea that units build relationships on the battlefield, but there (so far) isn't the in-depth waifu thing going on here. Don't get me wrong, it was fun and enjoyable the first time in Awakening, but I was ready for a break from that.

 

[Aveyn Knight]

Well, having played through a bit more, it's definitely growing on me. I enjoy the art design a little more in this one than the previous two. It feels more like the GBA games in its style. The story is still ridiculous. I wish they would hire on some better writers. This series really deserves it. But I'm enjoying the gameplay. I like the idea that units build relationships on the battlefield, but there (so far) isn't the in-depth waifu thing going on here. Don't get me wrong, it was fun and enjoyable the first time in Awakening, but I was ready for a break from that.

To be fair, don't forget the game is a remake of a 20 year old game. So they were very limited with what they could do with the story.

Still, I'd agree the writing team could get a little help, haha.

Anyway, glad you're enjoying the game for it is though and not what it isn't ^^

 

[Lord of Ostia]

To be fair, don't forget the game is a remake of a 20 year old game. So they were very limited with what they could do with the story.

Still, I'd agree the writing team could get a little help, haha.

Anyway, glad you're enjoying the game for it is though and not what it isn't ^^

The writing isn't that bad honestly, especially not compared to Awakening and Fates. Some of the plot points are stupid but most of the characters in the remake are well written (Faye aside). Localization is good too, and as you said, the plot was already predetermined because it's a remake of a 20 year old game, back when writing done for games was basically an afterthought.

 

[dreamlongdead]

Still working through the post game dungeon, and I'm about to wrap it up for now. I will give my thoughts.

This game has strong presentation, and the new mechanics introduced for this remake prove that Intelligent Systems still has a lot of new ideas.

The story is really standard FE setup, but I was really impressed at how much care was put into the side characters. Echoes is definitely above average in this respect. Voice acting and performances were very solid, and the game did have a couple of memorable cutscenes.

The gameplay has tons of issues. None of these are new discoveries, but I am very disappointed by the lack of distinct classes, weapon triangle, and unique map objectives. These deficiencies are all a step back and make Echoes' replayability lower than average compared to most Fire Emblem games.

The difficulty is also poorly done, and the game is not really balanced. I tried to do a Hard run without grinding. After initially abuse the random battles and retreat options, my rule for a separate playthrough was that dungeon enemies would only be fought once. Skirmishes would be avoided entirely. Mila's Turnwheel was definitely allowed, since that doesn't affect the EXP distribution.

The game really makes it hard for you to avoid non-story battles, so you don't get the satisfaction of winning like you do in every other Fire Emblem game besides Awakening. I didn't list Sacred Stones, because it is actually easy to avoid skirmishes in that game. Due to major world map issues in Act 3, I ended up scrapping these limitations and just accepted the game for what it is.

Even if I miraculously avoid EXP from extra battles in Echoes, your team probably won't be able to handle later maps due to enemy stat inflation and their sheer density. I can tolerate reinforcements, but endlessly respawning enemies are indefensible.

Cantors (and Witches) are horrible design, and I never want to see them return again. They turns map design from dull to just plain frustrating. The best battles never rise above serviceable.

Despite my list of grievances, I still really enjoyed Echoes and got my money's worth. It is overall a successful reimagining that adds even more polish and innovation to the series, though unfortunately retains a lot of what made Gaiden so disliked in the first place.

I want to see FE Switch take story and presentation cues from Echoes and build off the Fates' gameplay refinements. That would be one hell of a Fire Emblem game.

 

[Ninferno]

Finally got around to beat Thabes today and despite the unforgiving BS that is ”no saves allowed", it actually is very satisfying to finish such hours' long iron-man styled dungeon raid. As for the game itself as a whole, I think enough have been said in previous posts and dreamlongdead above has summed up quite nicely already. I will instead just talk about personal feelings.

I started playing the game from launch but due to traveling a lot lately, both business and leisure, didn't get to play it very often. However, I think this slower paced, on-and-off play time allocation actually helped my experience with the game. Gaiden was my first Fire Emblem back in the 90s. Though it is not my favorite FE overall, I can't help but be emotionally attached to it and its characters. I was so hyped when I first got my hands on SoV on May 19, and astonished by how well it started up, fantastic character re-designs and music remixes, top-notch voice acting and well written dialogues and such. By then I had such high hope for it to fix what Gaiden was lacking that had I speed-through the game and rush to the end, I might be somewhat disappointed. For example, one of the issues I had with Gaiden was the really unsatisfying and unbalanced ending. I really wanted SoV to improve on that but apparently it didn't quite get the job done. However, with enough pause time for me to reflect on the game, temper my expectation and get myself level-headed, by the time the dust settled and I finally saw the credits roll, I remained appreciative of what the game has achieved (and the very well written and sung The Heritors of Arcadia helped a lot too).

In the end, I think I'm content with how IS has fleshed out Gaiden with SoV. There are a few failures but I feel the accomplishments have far outweighed them. I wish new additions like Mila's Turnwheel, weapon arts, and voice acting are here to stay. Overall, I will call Operation Echoes a success in both giving older fans a chance to relive their childhood and providing a more accessible gateway for newer fans to experience older games. I just hope Genealogy and Thracia are the next to receive such ”Echoes" treatments, and when they do, I hope IS can give themselves a bit more liberty in changing thing around as opposed to SoV in which they seemed to have restricted themselves too much.

 

[FantasticMrFoxdie]

Sorry if a bit OT, Whats the best 3DS Fire Emblem game for a newbie/first timer???

Going to be my first entry in the series, despite knowing a ton of the characters from Fire Emblem Heroes.

 

[DecoReturns]

Sorry if a bit OT, Whats the best 3DS Fire Emblem game for a newbie/first timer???

Going to be my first entry in the series, despite knowing a ton of the characters from Fire Emblem Heroes.

Fire Emblem Awakening. Tons of content. Options for casual play. Charming characters and a decent story.

Gameplay is simplistic, but it helps out for newcomers. Gaiden is also pretty good but it's gameplay is worst then Awakening but it's presention is much better.

 

[Dot-N-Run]

Sorry if a bit OT, Whats the best 3DS Fire Emblem game for a newbie/first timer???

Going to be my first entry in the series, despite knowing a ton of the characters from Fire Emblem Heroes.

Awakening is the one I always recommend for new players. Very easy to get into and will give you a good taste of what the series has to offer.

 

[tiebreaker]

Sorry if a bit OT, Whats the best 3DS Fire Emblem game for a newbie/first timer???

Going to be my first entry in the series, despite knowing a ton of the characters from Fire Emblem Heroes.

Awakening is the most accessible I think. For the classic and probably my favourite, I'd suggest FE VII on GBA.

 

[FantasticMrFoxdie]

Fire Emblem Awakening. Tons of content. Options for casual play. Charming characters and a decent story.

Gameplay is simplistic, but it helps out for newcomers. Gaiden is also pretty good but it's gameplay is worst then Awakening but it's presention is much better.

Awakening is the one I always recommend for new players. Very easy to get into and will give you a good taste of what the series has to offer.

Awakening is the most accessible I think. For the classic and probably my favourite, I'd suggest FE VII on GBA.

Thanks y'all. Awakening it is.

 

[PK Gaming]

The writing isn't that bad honestly, especially not compared to Awakening and Fates. Some of the plot points are stupid but most of the characters in the remake are well written (Faye aside). Localization is good too, and as you said, the plot was already predetermined because it's a remake of a 20 year old game, back when writing done for games was basically an afterthought.

Faye being a badly written character is one of the biggest FE:Echoes biggest myths.

Right up there with "The map design isn't that bad", "Promote at level 10", and "Berkut is a fantastic villain."

 

[SolVanderlyn]

Faye being a badly written character is one of the biggest FE:Echoes biggest myths.

Right up there with "The map design isn't that bad", "Promote at level 10", and "Berkut is a fantastic villain."

One of these things is right

 

[Boogiepop]

Oh god, that Nuibaba map. I ended up just sending in infinite waves of those spawned soldiers to slowly, slowly lure out the enemies to defeat them (thanks stupid Ally AI for making that take longer!). That was probably the biggest war of attrition I've ever had in a Fire Emblem, all because

Spoiler

oh hey you have 1 hp now

lololol, and the attack has crazy range, and the stage is a fortification of ranged enemies who can heal, is dumb for a Fire Emblem. In theory I probably should've been making use of Rescue, though, which likely would've helped break through a lot sooner...

Also, I got up like 2/3s of the way through Chapter 4 before realizing "huh, I never got Est's sisters." Assumed they would come at some point after I got her, and I DID go back to one town, but... did not go back to that harbor town. So I backtracked way back to grab them now, and yeah... they're fairly unusable at this point. In theory I can back to grind them up, but for now I'll just manage as is and do what I can.

 

[clay_ghost]

Oh god, that Nuibaba map. I ended up just sending in infinite waves of those spawned soldiers to slowly, slowly lure out the enemies to defeat them (thanks stupid Ally AI for making that take longer!). That was probably the biggest war of attrition I've ever had in a Fire Emblem, all because

Spoiler

oh hey you have 1 hp now

lololol, and the attack has crazy range, and the stage is a fortification of ranged enemies who can heal, is dumb for a Fire Emblem. In theory I probably should've been making use of Rescue, though, which likely would've helped break through a lot sooner...

Also, I got up like 2/3s of the way through Chapter 4 before realizing "huh, I never got Est's sisters." Assumed they would come at some point after I got her, and I DID go back to one town, but... did not go back to that harbor town. So I backtracked way back to grab them now, and yeah... they're fairly unusable at this point. In theory I can back to grind them up, but for now I'll just manage as is and do what I can.

I forget about them till post game lol.

Thanks y'all. Awakening it is.

FYI , Conquest its on sales on Amazon now and i will say the Conquest is the best FE on 3DS in terms of game play but its hard and the story is insulting at its worst lol.

 

[Xenoflare]

Berkut is a well voiced villain.

Spoiler

That's what really matters to me in this game anyways

FYI , Conquest its on sales on Amazon now and i will say the Conquest is the best FE on 3DS in terms of game play but its hard and the story is insulting at its worst lol.

I'd agree with that too, it's still well worth it if you skip all the story, one game where I vastly prefer spoiling yourself to avoid sordid disappointment

 

[GeekyDad]

Wow @ that sniper range.

 

[Thud]

Just started playing this game, I got to chapter 3 on gaiden so the added prologue was a nice touch.

 

[clay_ghost]

On post game. "Died" in B9 of the post game Dungeon on hard mode.BS difficulty scaled up @ the end too. Made a silly mistake of ending my turn during turn 3 , and 4 of my party members died lol.

Fuck this , not going to retry. Great game though , may get story DLCs if its on sales.

 

[tiebreaker]

On post game. "Died" in B9 of the post game Dungeon on hard mode.BS difficulty scaled up @ the end too. Made a silly mistake of ending my turn during turn 3 , and 4 of my party members died lol.

Fuck this , not going to retry. Great game though , may get story DLCs if its on sales.

Lol. I think I got done in B8 just when I started thinking of retreating and to upgrade my weapons first.

I don't know if I'll try again as it seems almost impossible without excessive grinding or DLC.

 

[Mcdohl]

Finished the game yesterday without any units dying in the whole game

Loved this FE entry, more than Fates, by far.

Nintendo, feed me more retro-ish FE please.

 

[BlackJace]

I'm still forming my initial thoughts on the gameplay after four hours, but I gotta say, the presentation here is fire.

The new combat animations are great, I love seeing characters charging into battle whilst drawing their weapons, and now ranged units are animated so that their attacks actually show...range!

Whew, I hope Echoes is a test run of FE Switch style and presentation, cuz if so, the battle scenes will be fantastic!

 

[L95]

I'm still forming my initial thoughts on the gameplay after four hours, but I gotta say, the presentation here is fire.

The new combat animations are great, I love seeing characters charging into battle whilst drawing their weapons, and now ranged units are animated so that their attacks actually show...range!

Whew, I hope Echoes is a test run of FE Switch style and presentation, cuz if so, the battle scenes will be fantastic!

I'd love to see a ballista with the SoV style ranged animation. Flying across the map with the bolt would be wild

 

[Currygan]

Fuck

Spoiler

Jedah

. Hated his gimmick way more than anything else in the game. Superb FF entry though, now I'm craving for more already

 

[Forward]

One of these things is right

Promote at level 10?

 

[Aveyn Knight]

I'd love to see a ballista with the SoV style ranged animation. Flying across the map with the bolt would be wild

Here's the next best thing : P

Also, I finally returned to my minimal grinding low-turn count (ish) playthrough.

Argh, I never want to do Nuibaba's Abode ever again.

Thankfully Faye learned Rescue right near the end of the battle so I could snipe Nuibaba with Alm.

 

[Shifty1897]

Spoiler

Was in the postgame dungeon

and I swear the AI is programmed to OHKO Alm if you're caught grinding. Twice I spent an hour grinding three characters up to level 20, and just as I was finishing up, the next battle would be 12 mages who would solely target Alm. The third time I got smart and moved Alm away from every encounter towards the end of my grind session, and was able to evacuate successfully.

 

[L95]

Here's the next best thing : P

.....I.... this really is. Amazing.

 

[Thud]

Cleared Act 1, way easier than Gaiden .

 

[Elfforkusu]

Here's the next best thing : P

Also, I finally returned to my minimal grinding low-turn count (ish) playthrough.

Argh, I never want to do Nuibaba's Abode ever again.

Thankfully Faye learned Rescue right near the end of the battle so I could snipe Nuibaba with Alm.

Hold up!

What weapon is that?

 

[Aveyn Knight]

Hold up!

What weapon is that?

It's a hacked Javelin with infinite range, I think.

 

[Thud]

Act 2 cleared as well. I love Mae, so full of energy yeah. The two necrodragons gave me a lot of trouble. First time I saw the game over screen haha.

From now on everything will be new for me as I haven't played Gaiden further before.

 

[Forward]

Act 2 cleared as well. I love Mae, so full of energy yeah. The two necrodragons gave me a lot of trouble. First time I saw the game over screen haha.

From now on everything will be new for me as I haven't played Gaiden further before.

You finally went it with Celica and Genny alone? Wise lad.

 

[Thud]

You finally went it with Celica and Genny alone? Wise lad.

Actually soloed it with Celica. Poor guy waiting for his ham in the shrine.

 

[Touch fuzZy. get BizZay]

Wow, I'm really liking this. The most I've enjoyed a fire emblem in a long time