HarryHengst
Member
Those extra 5 pounds are probably the water weight from the creatine you're using, just like this dude experienced. And yes, that makes you feel more bloated.
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Fitness |OT3| BroScience, Protein Dysentery, XXL Calf Implants, and Squat Rack Hogs
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goldenpp72
Member
Oh I don't plan on quitting post 2012, I just find that I delay this build up and then decide against it for stupid reasons, but I feel if I ensure I make progress and keep it up that i'll be able to blend it as a permanent life style, just when I was younger, I made the mistake of weight training a ton while not eating a lot, so I was lean enough but never got 'buff', so trying to do it right I have tons of fears going into it now, I just want to make sure I don't go backwards by sticking to something because I understand it, and want to make sure I find what will work for me.
Also, is creatine something that is helpful at all, I mean, it's pretty annoying to take if it's just a placebo. I will read the OP in depth but I feel I have an unusual problem in that I'm not only skinny, but also still able to gain weight in the gut and.. kinda no where else :/
Also, is creatine something that is helpful at all, I mean, it's pretty annoying to take if it's just a placebo. I will read the OP in depth but I feel I have an unusual problem in that I'm not only skinny, but also still able to gain weight in the gut and.. kinda no where else :/
cuevas. PhD.
Member
Creatine is one of the few supplements that actually helps most people, you don't have to take it every day either. I take it 3 times a week right now.
goldenpp72
Member
Alright i read the op, a lot of stuff there I have never heard of before. Here is my post in the form of the template. I'll read and re read it trying to absorb all I can from it, but it's going to be a lot of filtering out shit I thought I knew :/
Age: 26
Height: 5'10
Weight: 160
Goal: 180 lean, i'm not near a lean 160.
Current Training Schedule: Max OT from ast, entails 5 days a week doing compound movements, working one muscle group at a time (so a couple per day once a week)
Current Training Equipment Available: Gym membership, so most.
Comments: Basically, I have the drive and passion to do this, and will do whatever it takes to hit my goals as long as it's natural. I fear over the years I have gained so much bullshit knowledge and understanding that, it's better to say i'm brand new and try to learn the correct method. No matter how often I lift, I'm not seeing gains of any sort in muscle, the only place I can ever recall gaining any reasonable amount of muscle was my legs, but even that was pretty minimal. I have a a huge aversion to vegetables in that they basically like to come back out before they even go down, but if it is required in order to achieve my goal I am willing to force feed myself.
My frame is that of a thin person, but i'd not say i'm straight up ectomorph. I have a belly and am not 'lean' anywhere right now, aside maybe my calves which is pretty typical. Upon starting my membership I started a few supplements and have been doing about, 2300 calories on top of creatine, with most of those calories coming from protein, then carbs (carbs from weight gainer shakes/post work out shakes, rice, whole wheat bread), and then some fat. I used to weigh like, 115 in my late teens, but upon losing all my care for physique I also got up to about 190 and was just as weak then as I am now. To me this proves I can gain weight and it doesn't take a whole lot, unfortunately it seems to come from body fat rather than muscle. Obviously when you do nothing you won't get muscular, but my fear is to try to hard to put on mass and in the end just get chubbier.
I read the beginner routine that has you doing only 3 days a week in the gym, is that normal? I'm so accustomed to 5 days a week at this point..
I think I just feel truly fucked here yet I don't want that to be an excuse to not try, I can weight lift, push myself to my limits, feel the burn, the fatique, eat, and yet if i'm doing a bench of 100 (generic number) for one week, that number won't increase the next, or for 5 months. It just seems like I have to be doing something wrong. Yet, each time I do the muscle group, it's not like I quit because it's kinda hard, I simply can not do another rep or another set without outright failing, and to me this means in the following weeks I should be able to tackle a bit more, and it never comes.
i feel like i'm a super hard gainer muscle wise who can also become fat if I decide to let it go, the OP is filled with a lot of stuff i've never heard of before, but I suppose by posting, I was hoping to see someone who may have had a similar issue to me to inspire some hope into what someone like myself can accomplish in the span of 3 months, 6 months, a year, etc. There is another issue, my career has me at home for months at a time doing nothing, which is great, but when I go to work I leave the state and will be gone 2-3 months, I start my next job in february and will be gone through april, but despite working 12 hour shifts 6 days a week while working, I want to make sure i'm doing something that will aid me so when I return I can hit the ground running.
I've been told a few times this is a good topic for custom advice, i'm going to continue to read and re-read the op, I just finished my last workout of the week but am supposed to go again monday, for someone like me would that 3 day set per week get me anywhere? Is there any supplement I should (or shouldn't) be taking, drinking a gallon of milk a day as a diet sounds so crazy, but maybe thinking outside of what i've been doing unsuccessfully is what I need.
Sorry for rambling, I just feel like at one point, I knew exactly what I was doing, and now I feel that nothing i ever did actually worked and that i'm basically a newborn in this fitness world.
Age: 26
Height: 5'10
Weight: 160
Goal: 180 lean, i'm not near a lean 160.
Current Training Schedule: Max OT from ast, entails 5 days a week doing compound movements, working one muscle group at a time (so a couple per day once a week)
Current Training Equipment Available: Gym membership, so most.
Comments: Basically, I have the drive and passion to do this, and will do whatever it takes to hit my goals as long as it's natural. I fear over the years I have gained so much bullshit knowledge and understanding that, it's better to say i'm brand new and try to learn the correct method. No matter how often I lift, I'm not seeing gains of any sort in muscle, the only place I can ever recall gaining any reasonable amount of muscle was my legs, but even that was pretty minimal. I have a a huge aversion to vegetables in that they basically like to come back out before they even go down, but if it is required in order to achieve my goal I am willing to force feed myself.
My frame is that of a thin person, but i'd not say i'm straight up ectomorph. I have a belly and am not 'lean' anywhere right now, aside maybe my calves which is pretty typical. Upon starting my membership I started a few supplements and have been doing about, 2300 calories on top of creatine, with most of those calories coming from protein, then carbs (carbs from weight gainer shakes/post work out shakes, rice, whole wheat bread), and then some fat. I used to weigh like, 115 in my late teens, but upon losing all my care for physique I also got up to about 190 and was just as weak then as I am now. To me this proves I can gain weight and it doesn't take a whole lot, unfortunately it seems to come from body fat rather than muscle. Obviously when you do nothing you won't get muscular, but my fear is to try to hard to put on mass and in the end just get chubbier.
I read the beginner routine that has you doing only 3 days a week in the gym, is that normal? I'm so accustomed to 5 days a week at this point..
I think I just feel truly fucked here yet I don't want that to be an excuse to not try, I can weight lift, push myself to my limits, feel the burn, the fatique, eat, and yet if i'm doing a bench of 100 (generic number) for one week, that number won't increase the next, or for 5 months. It just seems like I have to be doing something wrong. Yet, each time I do the muscle group, it's not like I quit because it's kinda hard, I simply can not do another rep or another set without outright failing, and to me this means in the following weeks I should be able to tackle a bit more, and it never comes.
i feel like i'm a super hard gainer muscle wise who can also become fat if I decide to let it go, the OP is filled with a lot of stuff i've never heard of before, but I suppose by posting, I was hoping to see someone who may have had a similar issue to me to inspire some hope into what someone like myself can accomplish in the span of 3 months, 6 months, a year, etc. There is another issue, my career has me at home for months at a time doing nothing, which is great, but when I go to work I leave the state and will be gone 2-3 months, I start my next job in february and will be gone through april, but despite working 12 hour shifts 6 days a week while working, I want to make sure i'm doing something that will aid me so when I return I can hit the ground running.
I've been told a few times this is a good topic for custom advice, i'm going to continue to read and re-read the op, I just finished my last workout of the week but am supposed to go again monday, for someone like me would that 3 day set per week get me anywhere? Is there any supplement I should (or shouldn't) be taking, drinking a gallon of milk a day as a diet sounds so crazy, but maybe thinking outside of what i've been doing unsuccessfully is what I need.
Sorry for rambling, I just feel like at one point, I knew exactly what I was doing, and now I feel that nothing i ever did actually worked and that i'm basically a newborn in this fitness world.
You need to eat more. You're also over-thinking things.
Eat like a horse, follow Starting Strength and be consistent in getting to the gym. Push yourself every time to increase either weight or reps -- even 1 more rep than the week prior = progress.
Seriously, stop worrying about the minutiae and just lift smart. Try to make progress on compound movements, give your body ample time to rest, and eat.
goldenpp72
Member
But is it wise to do that if you are definitely not lean, I mean, I don't want to be that guy with a huge ass belly but with big arms either. I do over think things a lot though, and in this subject it's quite a nightmare to distinguish what is real and what is marketing hype, especially when something might actually work for some and not others.
entremet
Member
Eat clean and you won't get a belly.
Stick to a Paleo type diet with lots of whole milk.
goldenpp72
Member
So you're saying you can gain muscle mass without much fat gain? I thought the process of bulking and later cutting was kind of required, obviously I want to cut body fat from where I am someday, but if I can gain muscle from where I am without getting any fatter that would be spectacular as well.
Do you just drink the whole milk straight? I haven't had whole milk since I was 8, lol.
Also, here are the exact supplements I have going right now, should I move away from them or will they help me?
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0015R3CPW/?tag=neogaf0e-20
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0015R3A1S/?tag=neogaf0e-20
And creatine, I just finished the loading phase it says you should do.
Do you just drink the whole milk straight? I haven't had whole milk since I was 8, lol.
Also, here are the exact supplements I have going right now, should I move away from them or will they help me?
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0015R3CPW/?tag=neogaf0e-20
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0015R3A1S/?tag=neogaf0e-20
And creatine, I just finished the loading phase it says you should do.
I believe you're mostly correct. Phosphocreatine is a short-term energy storage used within the first few seconds of intense movement (ie lifting weights). A higher creatine store allows you to generate more phosphocreatine (via the use of excess ATP), which is then usable later, in which phosphocreatine loses that phosphate group to an ADP to make ATP and creatine.
HarryHengst
Member
Yes, three days a week is enough for you, because you are a beginner. You are not a special snowflake, Starting Strength is designed for people like you, has loads of people making great gains on it and it says to workout three times a week. So do it three times a week. If you really want to workout more do some cardio on the other two days.
Also, in my opinion, no need for weightgainers and creatine and whatever other supplements you're thinking of using, except protein powder. Just focus on your diet and your lifts for now, because thats what's important. Bodies are mostly shaped in the kitchen, so learn how to eat rght. Once you know what the hell you're doing you can do things like drinking gallons of milk a day or overdose on supplements.
You don't have to be lean. I definitely wasn't lean when I started lifting. I wasn't really overweight but I had soft ass arms, doughy stomach and just a puffy, skinny-fat physique. My weight on the scale (which I check once a month purely for curiosity's sake) has increased, while my body fat has dropped considerably. I'm more vascular now than I have ever been.
Weight lifting will change the composition of your body. You're not going to have huge ass arms with a tiny chest and huge flabby belly. Compound movements - shoulder press, squat, bench, rows, pulldowns, deadlifts - will build your arms, chest, back, thighs, quads, etc. That's why something like Starting Strength is so good, it forces you to do the best bang-for-your-buck lifts while building strength.
Just worry about getting in the gym and lifting consistently right now, and make sure you're eating enough to build muscle with a calorie surplus.
Weight lifting will change the composition of your body. You're not going to have huge ass arms with a tiny chest and huge flabby belly. Compound movements - shoulder press, squat, bench, rows, pulldowns, deadlifts - will build your arms, chest, back, thighs, quads, etc. That's why something like Starting Strength is so good, it forces you to do the best bang-for-your-buck lifts while building strength.
Just worry about getting in the gym and lifting consistently right now, and make sure you're eating enough to build muscle with a calorie surplus.
goldenpp72
Member
Well you sound similar then to what I am now, did you follow a specific guideline (X amount of carbs, protein, calories) or did you just 'eat like a horse', heh.
Ate like a horse but within reason. I don't eat fast food, drink alcohol or soda (outside of an occasional diet coke), and make my own meals. But I also don't micromanage or worry about what I eat, so if I want to go out to lunch with coworkers, or have dinner with friends, I do. As long as I'm making progress in my lifts and not eating garbage I really don't even think about it, honestly. Just remember if you want to get big and swole you need to eat at a caloric surplus. Unless your genetics are extraordinary it's going to be close to impossible to get huge while eating tiny portions.
Just lift and eat. Seriously.
Just lift and eat. Seriously.
Yep. This sums it up.
goldenpp72
Member
If you lift 3 days in a week (under the beginner guidelines) should you still maintain the same dietary habits all days of the week?
Yes, proper nutrition is even more important in the 24-48 hour period following a heavy weight training session, in order to support recovery and muscle growth. The few hours immediately after a session is by far the most important time period of that time period, period.
Jason's Ultimatum
Member
MY DL form isn't bad. I think an old, old injury kinda prevents me from doing any kind of lifts off the ground like the DL.
I'd rather do back squats, but my elbows are still causing problems. Front squats suck. I hate doing them.
I'd rather do back squats, but my elbows are still causing problems. Front squats suck. I hate doing them.
Period?
Domino Theory
Crystal Dynamics
What's the consensus on stretching? I believe there was a post a few pages back that said stretching develops flexibility minus the strength and that's bad or something along those lines.
Is stretching good after a day's session of weight lifting or not at all?
Is stretching good after a day's session of weight lifting or not at all?
I don't believe there really is a consensus, and it varies from person to person. I'd recommend dynamic stretching over static stretching for most people (i.e. ankle mobilizations vs. calf stretches), though there are exceptions where static stretching is a good idea.
Also, only light stretching post-workout. Your muscles are too wound up and filled with fluids to receive the benefits. Save the main stretching for say 6 hours later, possibly before bed.
Postural issues should also be taken into consideration before people start static stretching muscles they think are tight. For example, you may think your hamstrings are tight but that's only because they're in a constant state of elongation because of an anterior pelvic tilt. Correct the APT and your hamstrings are not tight anymore.
I'm sure others could chime in. I'm mostly a foam roll/self massage and mobilization guy. I only do a couple static stretches.
Brolic Gaoler
formerly Alienshogun
So my bald fat brother in law just called me bald and fat. (he's fatter than me and legitimately bald, I am chubby go to the gym a lot and shave my head.)
I'm so confused/enraged right now I don't know wtf to think, lol.
I mean, I know I have substantial fat on me, I know that, but my muscle is plain as day too. It's clear I work out a lot. This guy is just a pile of fat.
I don't fucking know how to process this.
I'm so confused/enraged right now I don't know wtf to think, lol.
I mean, I know I have substantial fat on me, I know that, but my muscle is plain as day too. It's clear I work out a lot. This guy is just a pile of fat.
I don't fucking know how to process this.
Jason's Ultimatum
Member
Maybe he saw a reflection of himself.
Brolic Gaoler
formerly Alienshogun
My wife went off on him, and all I could think to say was," Fat?! Mother fucker I can press you over my head!
Then my other sister in law stopped it from escalating.
I've never had a situation like this happen before.
I would understand if he was thinner than me calling me fat, but this dude is exactly what he called me.
I would decimate him, wouldn't prove a damned thing.
Jason's Ultimatum
Member
And do the Sly mouth thing, too.
Brolic Gaoler
formerly Alienshogun
I loled.
Brolic Gaoler
formerly Alienshogun
FallingEdge
Member
Did he say this in a moment of jealously? I'm generally curious on how this all got started.
Brolic Gaoler
formerly Alienshogun
It was my turn to open my gift from my mother in law. My sister in law said "quick, everyone watch wayne and make him nervous."
I replied: Everyone should be watching me anyway because I'm fucking awesome.
My other brother in law said: Yeah, because you're so hot (sarcastic joke).
I replied: I know I'm hot!
The fatass brother in law said: Why? Because you're bald and fat? (the tone wasn't even joking either)
Then it went from there.
My wife seems to think it was out of jealousy since he's fat ugly and bald, with a fat ass wife (she looks like pizza the hut, honestly) and 2 kids that aren't disciplined for shit.
Sounds like jealousy, he sees you're making progress while he's on that slippery slope to a D cup.
Pizza the Hut?
Brolic Gaoler
formerly Alienshogun
Probably, it just blew my mind. If it was a skinny guy saying that shit to me it would be better because at least then it would make sense.
You've never seen space balls?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=33n-IS8a1S4
Brolic Gaoler
formerly Alienshogun
Aww, thanks man!
Don't eat me.
Brolic Gaoler
formerly Alienshogun
I only eat processed cheese and salami mixed with beefaroni on a deep fried baguette, you're good.
I have more fat jokes in me but I don't want you to actually end up eating me, so I'll stop.
<3
Brolic Gaoler
formerly Alienshogun
Lol, you're skinny, so I have to accept them. It's a law or something.
Plus I like you guys.
Lol, you're skinny, so I have to accept them. It's a law or something.
Plus I like you guys.
Must resist urge to tell more jokes...
Brolic Gaoler
formerly Alienshogun
Merry Christmas guys, be safe today!
Merry Christmas to all of Fitness-GAF! It's been quite a journey for me over the past year in progress and actually sticking to this life style and knowing how much better I feel these days when I look in the mirror.
Keep up the great work everyone!
I thought fat men were supposed to be jolly.
What are your lifts and how fat are you? It sounds like you're obsessed with physique and that's going to fuck up your training. Relax and try reading some of the sources at Startingstrength.com.
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