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Fitness |OT4| Squat Booty, Summer Cuts, and Super Swoletrophy

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ToxicAdam

Member
What do you think Potassium and water are? Electrolytes....

Potassium specifically helps with intra-muscular water storage. While sodium leads to subcutaneous (below the skin) water storage.

Spinach is loaded with potassium. So, I am clearly getting enough during the day .. and I am drinking 1-2 liters of water during my nightly workouts. Maybe I need to mix in a gatorade or something.

Like I said, it only happened twice in the past 4 months .. it's not like a chronic problem, just a funny story that I thought was relatable.
 

GiJoccin

Member
you might be drinking too much water... why are you drinking that much? 3 liters?

drinking so much water you might be diluting your electrolytes, which could cause the cramps - just a thought

you get lots of water from foods, you really don't need an awful lot of water every day.
 

ToxicAdam

Member
3 liters is only 6 standard bottles of water (17 oz). 3 during the day at work, 1 at dinner and 2 during my workout. Doesn't seem too excessive to me.
 
Spinach is loaded with potassium. So, I am clearly getting enough during the day .. and I am drinking 1-2 liters of water during my nightly workouts. Maybe I need to mix in a gatorade or something.

Like I said, it only happened twice in the past 4 months .. it's not like a chronic problem, just a funny story that I thought was relatable.

You seem to be missing the point. You want "more electrolytes" but it appears you don't know what "electrolytes" are.

Why would you drink more Gatorade? Gatorade is just sugar water with some potassium thrown in there. You'd be much better off eating a banana or adding a multivitamin that has ALL the electrolytes in it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-Vw2CrY9Igs
 

ToxicAdam

Member
I don't want more electrolytes. I was just wondering if the timing of when I get them mattered.

Why would you drink more Gatorade? Gatorade is just sugar water with some potassium thrown in there.

Because it's portable and can be carried around in a gym.
 

entremet

Member
So what are the best upper back exercises? I know pull ups are awesome, any others? It seems my upper body is lagging in both strength and size compared to my lower body.

Also is 5/3/1 BBB good for upper back development or should I switch to the Bodybuilding template?
 
So what are the best upper back exercises? I know pull ups are awesome, any others? It seems my upper body is lagging in both strength and size compared to my lower body.

Also is 5/3/1 BBB good for upper back development or should I switch to the Bodybuilding template?

Upright rows, bent over rows, and if you're including your traps as well then Shoulder Shrugs.
 
Z

ZombieFred

Unconfirmed Member
Ok I think I got this bulking idea right for me to gain muscle on a clean food diet still so I don't add much excess fat, is this good? 6'3 and my body fat% is 9.1 percent so bulking is no problem but how long do I bulk before I want to cut? I know this might sound daft but say if I wanted my body to look like something that Archer is at 83 kg and I am currently 66kg. What do I have to do? I have a Mesomorph body type so I have no problem hitting a similar frame like this.

Calories level – 1.5 times your BMR

2700 calories a day to eat

Do cardio at 80 percent body heart beat for warm up for 5-10 minutes and then also again at the end of weights to cool down.

Do weights at 70-80 per cent of your 1rep max

*enter neogaf three day beginners strength program*

1080cal--270 grams of protein
810cal- 203 grams of carbs
810cal- 90 grams of fat

So if I hit those targets then it should all be good? I know I might go over my carbs a little by 20-30 grams due to the milk diet but that's not going to kill me right? :)

Thanks in advance guys.
 

ToxicAdam

Member
So what are the best upper back exercises? I know pull ups are awesome, any others?


I don't know if they are the best, but my main two pulls are the T-bar rows and then the seated pulls. Then I blast it out with pyramids (lower weight, higher volume) of one-armed, bent-over rows with dumbbells. With a focus on keeping my elbows tight to my body. Take a break and do something else (cardio or abs) then come back and finish it off with lat pulldowns and machine rear flys.
 
Ok I think I got this bulking idea right for me to gain muscle on a clean food diet still so I don't add much excess fat, is this good? 6'3 and my body fat% is 9.1 percent so bulking is no problem but how long do I bulk before I want to cut? I know this might sound daft but say if I wanted my body to look like something that Archer is at 83 kg and I am currently 66kg. What do I have to do? I have a Mesomorph body type so I have no problem hitting a similar frame like this.



So if I hit those targets then it should all be good? I know I might go over my carbs a little by 20-30 grams due to the milk diet but that's not going to kill me right? :)

Thanks in advance guys.
Couple of things. Adding 17kg (~34 lbs) of muscle is something it would take the average person YEARS to gain. Adding it clean at 2700 calories is just not gonna happen.

Second, 207g of protein is way too much. You only need 1g of protein per pound of body weight (so at 66kg you need 145g a day).

A diet that is aimed at producing lean body mass should be very high carbs (like 60% of your calories) , and relatively low in fat, 90g is too much fat, keep it closer to 60. Fat converts directly into fat other than the necessary fat for daily bodily functions (which only requires about 45-50g a day) unless you burn it off by being on a caloric deficit which is obviously not the goal here.
 
Z

ZombieFred

Unconfirmed Member
Couple of things. Adding 17kg (~34 lbs) of muscle is something it would take the average person YEARS to gain. Adding it clean at 2700 calories is just not gonna happen.

Second, 207g of protein is way too much. You only need 1g of protein per pound of body weight (so at 66kg you need 145g a day).

A diet that is aimed at producing lean body mass should be very high carbs (like 60% of your calories) , and relatively low in fat, 90g is too much fat, keep it closer to 60. Fat converts directly into fat other than the necessary fat for daily bodily functions (which only requires about 45-50g a day) unless you burn it off by being on a caloric deficit which is obviously not the goal here.

Ok thanks for the input, so if I do the changes here and do my strength building, would it be fair to say in a few months time that my body will shape and tighten skin around my body that helps gives some shape around my body, say the glutes? I wouldn't want to add 34 pounds of muscle don't worry, it's more hitting that weight target with a few pounds of muscle so I got a little bit of shape. I don't want to look bulk or anything but "toned" with some small muscle definition.
 

thomaser

Member
Went to the gym for the first time in a week today. I've been travelling a lot the last week, driving long distances, walking a lot on showroom floors and eating twice as much as I normally do. Buffets everywhere. Spent the whole day yesterday driving home. Expected the training to go smoothly, but damn it was much harder than usual, especially for my calves. I could barely lift weights that were easy just two weeks ago. I guess driving a car for long stretches is much more taxing on the muscles than it seems.
 
So.... one of only two squat racks at my gym was missing its bar and there was an "out of order" sign on it.

I'm trying to figure out what happened to it. I'm not even sure if I want to know.
 

Archon473

Member
The problem is you can't maintain proper form the way some of these WODs are designed. Today we did an AMRAP 5 min (as many reps as possible) of power cleans (4), box jumps (6), keg carries. You should have seen the clean form breakdown in the later sets. I just did what I could and didn't push myself too hard. Just wasn't worth it to me

Once your form falters, you STOP, take a deep breath and continue at a slower pace correcting the faults in your form. Sloppy reps do not count. Improper form also makes lifts more difficult which always encouraged me to go slower and maintain form. Being hasty and forgoing a second or two for necessary rest also makes failing a rep more likely, which wastes the most time. And Greg Glassman said it himself, "You go faster and faster and faster until you make a mistake, then you slow down and stop making the mistake." You do not make a mistake and tell yourself, "Oh well. It's CrossFit! It ain't about form. It's about reps, baby!" That is incorrect.

Also, AMRAPs are endurance workouts. You're supposed to maintain an above-average pace for an extended period of time. The reps are low to moderate (think 15) and the movements compliment one another; the time performing one movement allows you to rest from the previous. A 5 minute AMRAP would not train you to endure anything other than arithmetic.

I have been Crossfitting for five years and have lung capacity I thought was not possible. You'll hit a point where you are practically never out of breath; burpees will hit your legs before your lungs. Bodyweight stuff is a joke, and such focus on form carries over to heavy lifting. I always felt emphasis on bodyweight movements reinforced my weightlifting form because I was aware of my body's movement and knew what felt comfortable and powerful and what felt uncomfortable. It's easy to get pulled into the attitude of Crossfit. Hell, that's all the site has been selling since 2010 (take a look at their t-shirts). Do not swoon over the marketing junk. Look at the Crossfit Games athletes - the most perfect form throughout the hardest WODs. I never admired the fools rolling on the floor gasping for breath; I watched Chris Spealler rip through long workouts without ever stopping to rest and finishing standing, walking around like he was not phased.

I would still go and punish myself with extra cardio and secondary work (abs/traps/calves).

I love that Nike slogan 'Every. Damn. Day.'

I love their slogan, "Yesterday you said, 'Tomorrow.'" I have gotten a surprising amount of motivation out of goofy slogans.
 
I began doing Starting Strength last February, I'm a former 285lbs teenager so I got too self conscious about the weight gain, couldn't feel good. If working out doesn't feel good what's the point right? so I switched to not eating above maintenance, actually was in a deficit mostly, but I ate meat and fish like an animal, so my protein intake was well in check.

I gained considerable muscle and strength, started at 165lbs (5"10) now at 156lbs, but everyone tells me I got bigger, my pictures do, too. Feels good but I still got a decent amount of fat on my thighs and butt, I'm aiming to get rid of it before engaging a serious bulk this winter.

I might post some before/after pics next month for fun.
 

Oblivion

Fetishing muscular manly men in skintight hosery
Possibly stupid question, but here goes.

Sadly my work schedule makes me unable to go to my college's gym, which I've been going to when things were slow. At home, I don't have many weights, just two 10 pound dumb bells. I'm pretty damn skinny, but even for me, these are not heavy at all, and I can easily do 50 reps on each arm.

Now my question is, is it a good idea to simply increase the number of reps? Will I see results?
 

snoopen

Member
Possibly stupid question, but here goes.

Sadly my work schedule makes me unable to go to my college's gym, which I've been going to when things were slow. At home, I don't have many weights, just two 10 pound dumb bells. I'm pretty damn skinny, but even for me, these are not heavy at all, and I can easily do 50 reps on each arm.

Now my question is, is it a good idea to simply increase the number of reps? Will I see results?

Nope. You need to up the weights, do other lifts and eat a lot more.
 

despire

Member
Possibly stupid question, but here goes.

Sadly my work schedule makes me unable to go to my college's gym, which I've been going to when things were slow. At home, I don't have many weights, just two 10 pound dumb bells. I'm pretty damn skinny, but even for me, these are not heavy at all, and I can easily do 50 reps on each arm.

Now my question is, is it a good idea to simply increase the number of reps? Will I see results?

And you won't get big doing only bicep curls like you are apparently doing.

I'd get my ass to a gym or if it's absolutely impossible I would start doing some good and proven bodyweight routine.
 

Oblivion

Fetishing muscular manly men in skintight hosery
Nope. You need to up the weights, do other lifts and eat a lot more.

And you won't get big doing only bicep curls like you are apparently doing.

I'd get my ass to a gym or if it's absolutely impossible I would start doing some good and proven bodyweight routine.

Lame to the max. :/

Okay, second question. Can I get big by doing exercises that don't involve lifting weights?
 

ToxicAdam

Member
After 3 months of continually doing leg workouts, today is the first day where I didn't wake up with crippling DOMs the next morning. Thank baby Jesus. I can walk up stairs like a normal human being.
 
After 3 months of continually doing leg workouts, today is the first day where I didn't wake up with crippling DOMs the next morning. Thank baby Jesus. I can walk up stairs like a normal human being.

I think you might be pushing yourself too hard, your diet needs some work, or you need to take a week off because my DOMS is hardly noticeable and I've been lifting 5 days a week for about 2 and half months now. I also don't cramp up.

Believe it or not there is such a thing as overdoing it.
 

sphinx

the piano man
so regarding crunches... i was being able to do "as many as I wanted". Starting from 160 some months back, I was at 360 last week and was noticing I could go through all sets with relative ease so I thought I might be doing something wrong, cause I was barely feeling any impact.

yesterday I went back to only 30 reps per set instead of 45-50 but decided to up the difficulty by staying in the tension position for around 1 second every rep, making my abs feel the impact (and the pain) in every repetition, as much as possible.

it as the hardest ab workout I have done ever...I was getting dizzy.

Quality >>> Quantity
 

JB1981

Member
Once your form falters, you STOP, take a deep breath and continue at a slower pace correcting the faults in your form. Sloppy reps do not count. Improper form also makes lifts more difficult which always encouraged me to go slower and maintain form. Being hasty and forgoing a second or two for necessary rest also makes failing a rep more likely, which wastes the most time. And Greg Glassman said it himself, "You go faster and faster and faster until you make a mistake, then you slow down and stop making the mistake." You do not make a mistake and tell yourself, "Oh well. It's CrossFit! It ain't about form. It's about reps, baby!" That is incorrect.

Also, AMRAPs are endurance workouts. You're supposed to maintain an above-average pace for an extended period of time. The reps are low to moderate (think 15) and the movements compliment one another; the time performing one movement allows you to rest from the previous. A 5 minute AMRAP would not train you to endure anything other than arithmetic.

I have been Crossfitting for five years and have lung capacity I thought was not possible. You'll hit a point where you are practically never out of breath; burpees will hit your legs before your lungs. Bodyweight stuff is a joke, and such focus on form carries over to heavy lifting. I always felt emphasis on bodyweight movements reinforced my weightlifting form because I was aware of my body's movement and knew what felt comfortable and powerful and what felt uncomfortable. It's easy to get pulled into the attitude of Crossfit. Hell, that's all the site has been selling since 2010 (take a look at their t-shirts). Do not swoon over the marketing junk. Look at the Crossfit Games athletes - the most perfect form throughout the hardest WODs. I never admired the fools rolling on the floor gasping for breath; I watched Chris Spealler rip through long workouts without ever stopping to rest and finishing standing, walking around like he was not phased.



I love their slogan, "Yesterday you said, 'Tomorrow.'" I have gotten a surprising amount of motivation out of goofy slogans.

I think Crossfit is just fine for conditioning work. I don't think it's particularly good when it involves multi-joint/compound barbell movements, especially when they are timed and the WOD design encourages besting your previous time. I'm afraid you paint a picture of Crossfit that really doesn't exist, and if it does it exists in very, very few Crossfit circles. Also, unless you are some kind of elite athlete, form breakdown is inevitable when you combine loaded movement at high reps/high volume. I guess, at best, you could keep the weight light and focus on form but the concept of keeping good form whilst pushing yourself faster, further and for more reps AND moving as fast as possible onto the next stage of the w
WOD, seems like two competing concepts to me.
 

ToxicAdam

Member
I think you might be pushing yourself too hard, your diet needs some work, or you need to take a week off because my DOMS is hardly noticeable and I've been lifting 5 days a week for about 2 and half months now. I also don't cramp up.

Believe it or not there is such a thing as overdoing it.

Everyone is different.
 

MjFrancis

Member
so regarding crunches...

Hanging leg raises > crunches.

Working the abdominals in the context of stabilizing the entire body produces a more noteworthy training response than an ultra-high repetition isolation movement like the crunch. The stabilization required can even be evident if you do a lot of pull-ups and wake up the next day with sore abs. To make leg raises easier, reduce the lever arm (your legs) by bending your knees and keeping them close to your body. Extend them as you gain strength until both legs reach each repetition parallel to the ground. Bring the ankles to the bar if you desire increasing difficulty. Alternatively, perform the movement slower or even isometrically. Never swing or use momentum.
 
so regarding crunches... i was being able to do "as many as I wanted". Starting from 160 some months back, I was at 360 last week and was noticing I could go through all sets with relative ease so I thought I might be doing something wrong, cause I was barely feeling any impact.

yesterday I went back to only 30 reps per set instead of 45-50 but decided to up the difficulty by staying in the tension position for around 1 second every rep, making my abs feel the impact (and the pain) in every repetition, as much as possible.

it as the hardest ab workout I have done ever...I was getting dizzy.

Quality >>> Quantity

Your abs are no different than any other muscle in your body, if you want them to get bigger and stronger you have to increase the amount of resistance. Use medicine balls, do decline cruches/situps, do weighted leg lifts, do ab pulldowns, hanging leg raises.

Doing a billion crunches is only going to increase endurance, and the only way your puny abs will be visible is if you weigh like 120lbs. Not to be insulting, it's just the truth. If that's the look you're going for, that's cool.

Crunches are great for atrophied muscles, but once you've become accommodated to them they do little more than burn calories. Even things like squats and deadlifts will do a better job of building your abs than crunches as they require a high amount of ab stabilization.

And the reason you were probably getting dizzy is because I'll bet your breathing was awful (it's hard to keep tight abs, while breathing normally), and you were probably either hyperventilating (breathing deep breaths too fast) or giving yourself an exhaustion headache (holding your breath under extreme stress), which can cause you to pass out. The bottom line is that getting dizzy isn't a good thing, it doesn't make you hardcore.

I feel like I might be coming off as a bit of dick, but I'm not trying to be. I'm just trying to help you out.
 

ToxicAdam

Member
Do you sit a lot? Walking around and foam roller work help with my leg DOMS. Sitting for long periods makes it worse.

No, I threw away my office chair about 4 months ago and never looked back.

I've always had bad leg DOMs, even back when I was training all the time in my 20's. When I say bad, I mean they are really bad the next morning, but are gone by day 3. I've met/talked to guys that have them almost every day because of they way they do their splits. Thankfully, I'm not like that.

I think a big contingent of pain/discomfort is mental... I clearly have some mental baggage with leg discomfort that I need to work past. Today was a good step in he right direction.
 

Bit-Bit

Member
so regarding crunches... i was being able to do "as many as I wanted". Starting from 160 some months back, I was at 360 last week and was noticing I could go through all sets with relative ease so I thought I might be doing something wrong, cause I was barely feeling any impact.

yesterday I went back to only 30 reps per set instead of 45-50 but decided to up the difficulty by staying in the tension position for around 1 second every rep, making my abs feel the impact (and the pain) in every repetition, as much as possible.

it as the hardest ab workout I have done ever...I was getting dizzy.

Quality >>> Quantity

For abs, I use to do a routine that had around 400 reps of various core workouts. I saw huge noticable improvements but they weren't as well define as I wanted them to be. Then I changed my diet and within a month I saw more abs.

Nowadays, I just do some leg raises and then planks for as long as I can. Usually two sets of 3 minutes.

My abs aren't as define as they could be but right now I'm focused on eating as much as possible and lifting heavy again.
 

Archon473

Member
I guess, at best, you could keep the weight light and focus on form but the concept of keeping good form whilst pushing yourself faster, further and for more reps AND moving as fast as possible onto the next stage of the w
WOD, seems like two competing concepts to me.

The concept is intensity. If this means decreasing weight to maintain speed and thus intensity, so be it. Maintaining both form and speed does not conflict; that's virtuosity, and that is what elite athletes strive to achieve.
 

Brolic Gaoler

formerly Alienshogun
Not sure why, but I'm back down to 220 as of this morning. I don't know if it's a combination of doing intermittent fasting and taking a week off or what. I thought for sure I'd weigh more today since I've been eating like shit.

I'll have to keep a closer eye on it.

Oh, and I've been saving a shit ton of money on protein now after that article Rando posted about protein, and my strength has not dropped off, in fact I've continued to progress.
 

despire

Member
Oh, and I've been saving a shit ton of money on protein now after that article Rando posted about protein, and my strength has not dropped off, in fact I've continued to progress.

What article? The one that said you only need 0.8g/lbs (or even as little as 0.64g/lbs) of protein a day?


Also tried barbell shrugs today like Rip teaches them (power shrugs) which is essentially incomplete hang cleans (due to weight). Feel them much more in my traps than when I've previously done shrugs the old fashioned way.
 

Mully

Member
Not sure why, but I'm back down to 220 as of this morning. I don't know if it's a combination of doing intermittent fasting and taking a week off or what. I thought for sure I'd weigh more today since I've been eating like shit.

I'll have to keep a closer eye on it.

Oh, and I've been saving a shit ton of money on protein now after that article Rando posted about protein, and my strength has not dropped off, in fact I've continued to progress.

Same thing happened to me earlier this summer when I took a week and a half off to go to Ireland. I ate and drank like shit. It was a 9 day drinking binge. I was certain I gained 5-10lbs.

To my surprise, I lost 10lbs. Having said that, I looked like shit and felt horrible for two weeks. My lifts were down and my endurance was completelty sapped.
 
What article? The one that said you only need 0.8g/lbs (or even as little as 0.64g/lbs) of protein a day?

Yes. I've been trying it too but I feel good so far. I think in the end, what really matters is the amount of calories. Protein is important but total number is even more so. I haven't been hitting 1 g/lb but yet my strength is still increasing.
 

despire

Member
Yes. I've been trying it too but I feel good so far. I think in the end, what really matters is the amount of calories. Protein is important but total number is even more so. I haven't been hitting 1 g/lb but yet my strength is still increasing.

Yes, that's how I see it also. Get just enough protein but there's no benefit of ingesting any more than you'r body can turn to muscle. Rest is up to how many calories you eat during the day.

I myself have perhaps eaten less protein lately but my lifts are getting up so no complaining there :)
 
That research even stated the more advanced you are the less protein your body needs, what a heartbrake for the dudebros.

Myself I eat at least 1g per pound everyday, but only because protein helps fill me up and I love meat.
 

Cudder

Member
What's with the difference between actual weight in weight stacks on machines? At my old gym for tricep pushdowns, the max I could do was 80lbs on the stack. In my new gym, one of the stacks goes all the way down to "150lbs" and it's easy as shit. I don't get it.
 

Brolic Gaoler

formerly Alienshogun
Yes. I've been trying it too but I feel good so far. I think in the end, what really matters is the amount of calories. Protein is important but total number is even more so. I haven't been hitting 1 g/lb but yet my strength is still increasing.

Yes, that's how I see it also. Get just enough protein but there's no benefit of ingesting any more than you'r body can turn to muscle. Rest is up to how many calories you eat during the day.

I myself have perhaps eaten less protein lately but my lifts are getting up so no complaining there :)

That research even stated the more advanced you are the less protein your body needs, what a heartbrake for the dudebros.

Myself I eat at least 1g per pound everyday, but only because protein helps fill me up and I love meat.

Yep, that's what I'm talking about.

Same thing happened to me earlier this summer when I took a week and a half off to go to Ireland. I ate and drank like shit. It was a 9 day drinking binge. I was certain I gained 5-10lbs.

To my surprise, I lost 10lbs. Having said that, I looked like shit and felt horrible for two weeks. My lifts were down and my endurance was completelty sapped.

Probably dehydration in your case.
 

TheExodu5

Banned
Same thing happened to me earlier this summer when I took a week and a half off to go to Ireland. I ate and drank like shit. It was a 9 day drinking binge. I was certain I gained 5-10lbs.

To my surprise, I lost 10lbs. Having said that, I looked like shit and felt horrible for two weeks. My lifts were down and my endurance was completelty sapped.

I go through binges every few months and that's always when I lose weight. Really weird.

Started low carb and eating well again back in June. Went on for 6 weeks and didn't lose any weight. Went on vacation for 2 weeks and ate lots of bad foor during that period...dropped 5 lbs. Been eating good since and binged 2 weeks ago...dropped another 5 poinds.
 
Hey guys, I need an answer within an hour:

Question:
Today I am going to try jogging for the first time in probably 2 years. How long should I go for? Is 2 miles reasonable? Too high, too low?

Details:
I used to run on the treadmill 3x a week but it destroyed my shins. Back then, I was able to do 45 min at 6mph (I think) just fine, I probably could have pushed myself harder but whatever. I've been doing elliptical ever since (3x a week, 2x 20 min, 1x 60 min). The machine tells me to keep my heart rate above 151 and I usually have it in the 160-170 range. No idea of my speed or distance.
 

Cheeto

Member
Hey guys, I need an answer within an hour:

Question:
Today I am going to try jogging for the first time in probably 2 years. How long should I go for? Is 2 miles reasonable? Too high, too low?

Details:
I used to run on the treadmill 3x a week but it destroyed my shins. Back then, I was able to do 45 min at 6mph (I think) just fine, I probably could have pushed myself harder but whatever. I've been doing elliptical ever since (3x a week, 2x 20 min, 1x 60 min). The machine tells me to keep my heart rate above 151 and I usually have it in the 160-170 range. No idea of my speed or distance.

Jog until you feel any pain in your legs/ankles or you're too out of breath, walk till it goes away, repeat as many times as you like, but I'd keep it conservative. Don't push too hard when you're just starting up again...especially if you're like me where you weigh a lot more than the last time you ran regularly.
 
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