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Forza 3 vs Gran Turismo 5 Comparison Thread of John, Chapter 11, Verse 35

I

Iknos

Junior Member
I can't mention this in the GT5 thread because of the rules the mods laid down so I suppose I have to say it here.

I have a suspicion that GT5 was delayed because PD played Forza 3 at E3. Whether it's the physics or the amount of features that are in the game it's quite possible.

It was only after they played FM3 that they announced that they were upgrading the physics in GT5 and a few more features. We are now hearing about rewind.

The physics one is big because they probably realized that people could tell the physics were better than Prologue and wanted to clarify that GT5 will not have the same physics as Prologue. There were very hints at things like weather or night racing but to my knowledge no hints at the physics being improved.

OTOH not much of the game was shown at E3 or GC...so maybe the game wasn't even close to being ready in the first place. So I could be wrong about them delaying the game because of FM3...but it's easy to see that they are being influenced by the Forza series.

-racing line
-livery editor
-more focus on tire physics
-on screen telemetry
-real-time tuning
-drag racing
-focus on car upgrades and tuning with real licensed manufacturer parts
-damage...performance wise to the detail that Forza has
-gifting/trading/selling cars to other users
-weight reductions and rollcages being seen in cockpit view

These are features that I predict will be in GT5 largely in part thanks to the Forza series. We might not see all of these things but I can see PD wanting to at least try to implement these things. Kaz has already spoken about car upgrades using real world parts. We've seen a glimpse of drag racing. We know there will be a livery editor to some degree. We've never heard of the ability to sell cars to other users but it seems like a natural fit for the game.

We'll see what ends up happening. There was this notion that PD is very closed minded about the sort of game they want to make but I don't think that's the case.
 
S

Scottlarock

Banned
^^ I also doubt the game is launching worldwide in march, but your about to get some hate on your post when people wake up. and have we seen anyone do a 180 on the rewind feature since it looks like GT will feature it?
 
C

CrushDance

Banned
Scottlarock said:
^^ I also doubt the game is launching worldwide in march, but your about to get some hate on your post when people wake up.
Click to expand...
It's all in the wording.

And yeah, GT5 was probably delayed due to F3. They might have had a mole inside T10 for the past five years. Pretty obvious they weren't working on the game, 60m on hookers and crack.
 
S

Scottlarock

Banned
CrushDance said:
It's all in the wording.

And yeah, GT5 was probably delayed due to F3. They might have had a mole inside T10 for the past five years. Pretty obvious they weren't working on the game, 60m on hookers and crack.
Click to expand...
true.
 
eso76

eso76

Member
Psychotext said:
You could all probably learn something from this pic...

14lnj82.jpg


...and as a huge fan of both games this is the first and last time I'll post in this fanboy filled shithole of a thread.
Click to expand...

Kaz is probably thinking "who the hell is this guy ?"
:)
 
M

mujun

Member
CrushDance said:
It's all in the wording.

And yeah, GT5 was probably delayed due to F3. They might have had a mole inside T10 for the past five years. Pretty obvious they weren't working on the game, 60m on hookers and crack.
Click to expand...

So you think they make their game in a vacuum. That would be pretty stupid if they do. Smart choice would be to keep an eye on your competitors and try to out do them where you can. That's one way to stay on top.
 
S

SonnyBoy

Member
I'm not a big racing fan but it seems as though the healthy competition between the franchises has benefited the fans of both series. If only such competition was allowed throughout the gaming industry. *cough* :D :lol
 
L

lord pie

Member
Iknos said:
....
Click to expand...

I would expect that isn't the case. No developer in their right mind would willingly choose to do that sort of feature creeping / risky rewrites so late in a project. With a project the size of GT5 they must have been feature locked months ago.

I would say similar things to the notion of adding weather effects, etc. Unless these have been planned from day one I'd expect there is practically zero chance they will be in there. Certainly not in a PGR4 level of polish (otherwise there really isn't that much point).
You finialise the design goals as early as you can (ie, in pre-production), lock things down, prioritize and polish. Otherwise you end up late, over budget and with an inconsistent product.

...

The game looks stunning, and has an insane amount of content. No question that was one of their highest priorities. But I feel some others here are setting themselves up for disappointment if they assume it'll have every feature forza, etc has (and then some) for the sake of it. That's just not practical at all. It'll do what they prioritised very well, just like forza/pgr/grid/blur/etc does.
 
Apex

Apex

Member
Iknos said:
-racing line - Present in others games before Forza.
-livery editor - Announced since GTHD.
-more focus on tire physics - They're constantly updating the game physics since GTHD, so is obvious, GT4 already had tire wear, tire heating and dirt tires effect so GT5 with more tunning options announced only can go better.
-on screen telemetry - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8hldfxr00Lk
-real-time tuning - Already in Prologue.
-drag racing - Already in GT4(two lanes) but limited to one player because the canned online mode.
-focus on car upgrades and tuning with real licensed manufacturer parts - Already in GT4, and announced since GTHD.
-damage...performance wise to the detail that Forza has - Mechanical damage was present in GT2 on a more severe form than GT5 demos, so is obvious it will be better, also already confirmed the car could be totaled.
-gifting/trading/selling cars to other users - Already possible in previous GT with a memory card trading feature.
-weight reductions and rollcages being seen in cockpit view - They already modeled a much detailed cockpit and animations in GT5P so is obvious they will show that details, examples are present in the Prologue's 'Tuned by GT' cars.
Click to expand...
The world don't turn around Forza all that features are already announced or present in a lot of games before and you can't expect a 5 years of work being showcased in a very limited demo, and now all the big features being worked in a 6 months basis, that's ridiculous. PD are famous for not showing the goods until the last hour.
 
L

Lion Heart

Banned
Apex said:
The world don't turn around Forza all that features are already announced or present in a lot of games before and you can't expect a 5 years of work being showcased in a very limited demo, and now all the big features being worked in a 6 months basis, that's ridiculous. PD are famous for not showing the goods until the last hour.
Click to expand...

Wow Ownzered. I came to post the telemetry but you did all of it :lol
 
2

2real4tv

Member
Apex said:
The world don't turn around Forza all that features are already announced or present in a lot of games before and you can't expect a 5 years of work being showcased in a very limited demo, and now all the big features being worked in a 6 months basis, that's ridiculous. PD are famous for not showing the goods until the last hour.
Click to expand...

So the other way around basically?
 
Truespeed

Truespeed

Member
Iknos said:
I can't mention this in the GT5 thread because of the rules the mods laid down so I suppose I have to say it here.

I have a suspicion that GT5 was delayed because PD played Forza 3 at E3. Whether it's the physics or the amount of features that are in the game it's quite possible.

It was only after they played FM3 that they announced that they were upgrading the physics in GT5 and a few more features. We are now hearing about rewind.

The physics one is big because they probably realized that people could tell the physics were better than Prologue and wanted to clarify that GT5 will not have the same physics as Prologue. There were very hints at things like weather or night racing but to my knowledge no hints at the physics being improved.

OTOH not much of the game was shown at E3 or GC...so maybe the game wasn't even close to being ready in the first place. So I could be wrong about them delaying the game because of FM3...but it's easy to see that they are being influenced by the Forza series.

-racing line
-livery editor
-more focus on tire physics
-on screen telemetry
-real-time tuning
-drag racing
-focus on car upgrades and tuning with real licensed manufacturer parts
-damage...performance wise to the detail that Forza has
-gifting/trading/selling cars to other users
-weight reductions and rollcages being seen in cockpit view

These are features that I predict will be in GT5 largely in part thanks to the Forza series. We might not see all of these things but I can see PD wanting to at least try to implement these things. Kaz has already spoken about car upgrades using real world parts. We've seen a glimpse of drag racing. We know there will be a livery editor to some degree. We've never heard of the ability to sell cars to other users but it seems like a natural fit for the game.

We'll see what ends up happening. There was this notion that PD is very closed minded about the sort of game they want to make but I don't think that's the case.
Click to expand...

That's quite the fantasy. First of all, GT5 was never delayed because there was never a firm release data given by PD until Kaz announced the March 2010 date. So as far as I'm concerned it was always on track. Secondly, the breadth of scope in GT5 is massive and what they're including dwarfs the features found in Forza 3 (Rally, NASCAR, weather, head tracking, etc). But, if there truly was a delay then I would have to blame the PSP version of GT. PD staff were ripped from the GT5 team to work on this irrelevant title.
 
V

vanty

Member
Ballistictiger said:
Even Gran Turismo 3 had subtle racing lines. The tire tracks are telling you how to turn.
Click to expand...
Uh, almost all racing games have tire marks on the track that follow the racing line. That's how rubber works... It's not the "racing line" feature that Forza and now other racers have.
 
C

CrushDance

Banned
vanty. said:
Uh, almost all racing games have tire marks on the track that follow the racing line. That's how rubber works... It's not the "racing line" feature that Forza and now other racers have.
Click to expand...
yar
 
A

adelante

Member
Ballistictiger said:
Even Gran Turismo 3 had subtle racing lines. The tire tracks are telling you how to turn.
Click to expand...
bububububut forza's racing lines are dynamic! they remain red in color until u slow down to the optimum speed needed to take a turn! haha :p
 
A

AndyD

aka andydumi
Zaptruder said:
:lol @ Iknos. Damn fool.
Click to expand...

My favorite of his was a few months back where he said he didnt follow racing games and he just took a bunch of stuff at face value that he read on forums when he was stirring up crap/trolling GT here. I was real close to adding him to the ignore list then. But now, he is definitely on there.
 
L

LCfiner

Member
Just wanted to pop in here and say I'm super glad that GT5 is putting in rewind. It's an awesome feature and Kaz recognizes it.
 
S

SmokyDave

Member
LCfiner said:
Just wanted to pop in here and say I'm super glad that GT5 is putting in rewind. It's an awesome feature and Kaz recognizes it.
Click to expand...

Aaargh!

I'm off to gnash my teeth and nerd-rage in a corner.
 
L

LCfiner

Member
SmokyDave said:
Aaargh!

I'm off to gnash my teeth and nerd-rage in a corner.
Click to expand...


hey man, just cuz you got no self control and hate yourself for using the feature doesn't mean the rest of us can't enjoy it :p
 
S

SmokyDave

Member
LCfiner said:
hey man, just cuz you got no self control and hate yourself for using the feature doesn't mean the rest of us can't enjoy it :p
Click to expand...

:D To be fair, you've hit the nail on the head there. I actually took Psychotexts suggestion and whipped the 'Back' button out of an old controller so I'm pretty cool now. Until March when I have to remove a select button!
 
L

LCfiner

Member
SmokyDave said:
:D To be fair, you've hit the nail on the head there. I actually took Psychotexts suggestion and whipped the 'Back' button out of an old controller so I'm pretty cool now. Until March when I have to remove a select button!
Click to expand...

holy shit :lol

extreme measures.

well, I guess if you can enjoy the game now then that's all that matters. I'm much less hardcore so I have no issues rewinding when I screw something up bigtime.
 
S

SmokyDave

Member
LCfiner said:
holy shit :lol

extreme measures.

well, I guess if you can enjoy the game now then that's all that matters. I'm much less hardcore so I have no issues rewinding when I screw something up bigtime.
Click to expand...

I'm not hardcore, I'm just weak willed. I knew that as long as I had a rewind button on the pad I wouldn't be able to resist using it in the event of a huge pile up. That filtered down to "well, if I'm going to use it for big mistakes, I might as well use it for little ones" and that removed (for me) the risk of racing.

At the end of the day, Forza 3 has got people that I know had no interest in racing games playing a racing game and enjoying it and for that, I tip my hat to Turn 10. I'm now shutting up about rewind, I promise :D
 
B

bran

Member
Does anybody find the lack of AI difficulty setting making the game a little too easy? I mean, I'm playing with all assist off, no ABS, no tracking control, no stability management, simulation tires, manual with clutch, and...

I can come in first every race?
Despite having to start from the last position every time?

AI drivers don't do enough to block passing lane imo, and simply aren't flooring it on easy exits.
 
T

Tideas

Banned
bran said:
Does anybody find the lack of AI difficulty setting making the game a little too easy? I mean, I'm playing with all assist off, no ABS, no tracking control, no stability management, simulation tires, manual with clutch, and...

I can come in first every race?
Despite having to start from the last position every time?

AI drivers don't do enough to block passing lane imo, and simply aren't flooring it on easy exits.
Click to expand...

that's the thing. I think these AI drivers needs to be programmed as a singular unit. menaing, they're not there to prevent YOU to win, they're there to WIN

or else, it'll just be 15 cars versus you. I mean, if you're fighting a 4th place guy for 4th place, he isn't supposed to take unnecessary risk that would make not allow him to get 1st first.

That's now racing AI should be.
 
S

ShapeGSX

Member
bran said:
Does anybody find the lack of AI difficulty setting making the game a little too easy? I mean, I'm playing with all assist off, no ABS, no tracking control, no stability management, simulation tires, manual with clutch, and...

I can come in first every race?
Despite having to start from the last position every time?

AI drivers don't do enough to block passing lane imo, and simply aren't flooring it on easy exits.
Click to expand...


Since you are starting in last place every time, I can be fairly sure you haven't played the game that much. Your driver level determines where you start in the pack. Higher levels mean you start closer to the front.

And there is an AI difficulty setting. Easy, Medium and Hard.

The difficulty ramps up as the game progresses. The game gets quite a bit harder later on. I'm in an R3 championship now, with all assists off and AI on hard, and I'm finding it hard to finish the race, let alone win! :)
 
A

AndyD

aka andydumi
Hmm, it seems I definitely missed something...

Let's see...

Nothing in this thread or the Gt5 official thread... AHA ... its NPD day!! :lol :lol I should have known that when the 500's show up I need to look for that thread.

Now I get it.
 
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