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[BobsRevenge]

Maybe Forza 3 really is better?

Spoiler

Shocking I know, but a lot of people had trouble believing Forza was better than GT4 also.

I loved Forza and played it a lot, but GT4 is easily the better game there. Hell, GT3 was better than Forza.

 

[Metalmurphy]

I loved Forza and played it a lot, but GT4 is easily the better game there. Hell, GT3 was better than Forza.

GT3 was a better game then GT4. Content aside

 

[REMEMBER CITADEL]

Forza 3, last I checked, still has that damn permanent active steering driving aid that doesnt actually let you steer the car on your own, but guesses for you as Dan Greenawalt described it.

There has been some talk in the OT that a recent update finally removed it, but I'm not sure whether that has been confirmed or debunked.

That said, with the latest improvements, it seems GT5 finally managed to take over the crown of the most realistic driving model on consoles. We'll see if Forza 4 (or GTR3?) can retake it.

Also, Forza looks great. GT looks great. Lets all be friends and enjoy some racing.

Yeah, how 'bout it, huh?

 

[Gek54]

As far as the difference in the reviews, and sorry if this has already been beaten to death, GT5s driving model being that much more realistic most likely means that it is that much more frustrating for those who want a game that allows them whip around a track with the apparent car control of a pro. And that's what Forza 3 does, they can lecture us all day about their supposedly amazng tire physics but at the end if the day that all means dick when the car steers for you. Even with all the optional driving aids off, you have to be a total asshole to lose control in Forza 3. It keeps the masses of asses from flying off the track so they are happy in their idealistic dream world. Take the unrealistic training wheels off, stick them in an unforgiving sim and watch them cry for their Mario Kart.

 

[SmokyDave]

As far as the difference in the reviews, and sorry if this has already been beaten to death, GT5s driving model being that much more realistic most likely means that it is that much more frustrating for those who want a game that allows them whip around a track with the apparent car control of a pro.

Speaking as someone that loves sims, this is fantastic news. My biggest gripe with F3 was the ridiculous amount of grief you had to give a car in order to lose control. I like to feel like I'm on the edge of losing it all the time, otherwise there's no danger or excitement.

Having said that, Forza 3 does make a competent driver look like a fucking hero, it's a good game to show off your flashy driving to others.

 

[Gek54]

There has been some talk in the OT that a recent update finally removed it, but I'm not sure whether that has been confirmed or debunked.

Whoa, when did this happen? ...*digging out Forza 3 from storage*

 

[Diablohead]

I can agree to that, Forza 3 has too many hidden aids which the user has no control over, this makes a lot of the cars feel like they handle the same dispite a difference in like 150 bhp.

 

[LCfiner]

I can agree to that, Forza 3 has too many hidden aids which the user has no control over, this makes a lot of the cars feel like they handle the same dispite a difference in like 150 bhp.

I always wondered why i was so shit at GT5 with a controller but was OK with one in Forza 3.

now I play both with a wheel and the difficulty gap doesn't feel as large

 

[REMEMBER CITADEL]

Whoa, when did this happen? ...*digging out Forza 3 from storage*

I suggest you check out the OT first. Like I said, I have no idea whether that's actually been confirmed.

 

[Windom Earle]

That said, with the latest improvements, it seems GT5 finally managed to take over the crown of the most realistic driving model on consoles. We'll see if Forza 4 (or GTR3?) can retake it.

Yes, the physics are really really good. Btw, do you own a PS3 RC?

As far as the difference in the reviews, and sorry if this has already been beaten to death, GT5s driving model being that much more realistic most likely means that it is that much more frustrating for those who want a game that allows them whip around a track with the apparent car control of a pro.

See: Gamespot "racing expert" sucking in behind car view :lol

 

[Cuban Legend]

GT3 was a better game then GT4. Content aside

Guys, were talking current-gen, remember? GT3 was great, loved my Escudo Pikes Peak! And GT4 had my favorite Subaru! i like both.

But remember this thread is about debating the current-gen racing king, so in that respect:

PGR4 STILL REIGNS SUPREME

CHECK IT

 

[REMEMBER CITADEL]

Yes, the physics are really really good. Btw, do you own a PS3 RC?

No, not yet, I only have a PS2 and I'm really short on money at the moment. I plan on getting it eventually, but I have to get a 360 first (it appeals to me more and I'll need it for the work I'm doing).

 

[Pride]

So far the Metacritic rating for GT5 is 86, it has some ground to make up if it's going to catch up with Forza 3 which is sitting at a 92

Will it eventually catch up? Doesnt seem likely based on early reviews.

 

[kevm3]

One of the more valid complaints is with the shadows. The shadows are pretty ugly in this game with the stairstepping effect.

 

[RSTEIN]

So far the Metacritic rating for GT5 is 86, it has some ground to make up if it's going to catch up with Forza 3 which is sitting at a 92

Will it eventually catch up? Doesnt seem likely based on early reviews.

No, impossible at this point.

The thing to keep in mind is that GT5 is held to a higher standard. So many years, dollars, promises, etc. Plus the legacy of the series. So we have horrendous looking car models, bad tracks, etc., that mask the fact that it is a phenomenal game. After so much hype and waiting the bar was basically set at perfection. Forza 3 was coming off Forza 2 and was viewed from more of a "hey, way to go guys, great improvement, great game" perspective I think.

However, the bottom line is this: Forza 3 is the better game based on the best measure we have: the aggregate opinion of critics. I'm not saying this measure is good, but it's all we got. Everyone has voted, the votes have been tallied, and Turn 10 wins.

 

[watership]

No, impossible at this point.

The thing to keep in mind is that GT5 is held to a higher standard. So many years, dollars, promises, etc. Plus the legacy of the series. So we have horrendous looking car models, bad tracks, etc., that mask the fact that it is a phenomenal game. After so much hype and waiting the bar was basically set at perfection. Forza 3 was coming off Forza 2 and was viewed from more of a "hey, way to go guys, great improvement, great game" perspective I think.

Exactly. GT's legendary status doesn't help expectations in the least. Then there is a huge gap between releases with reasons given for delays and the long dev time is that the lead producer is a perfectionist and he wants to do things the right way. Then the game isn't perfect... It's illogical, and it's impossible to meet those standards, but they set those standards. It's not like Killzone 1, where a magazine said it was a Halo killer and doomed that game to comparisons and crazy expectations.

The thing I don't get is why put something in like Nascar and Gocarts? Did anyone ASK for that? Content is great. No would would debate GT5 on content, but it seems it came at the sacrifice of car models. I think everyone would agree, more premium cars and higher quality tracks would have been preferred, nine times out of ten.

 

[Tiago Leite]

Sometimes less is more...

 

[saladine1]

So i've been playing GT5 for 2 days now.
The driving model is excellent. Cars react beleievably depending on track surface. The roof cam is pretty playable imo, after I thought it wouldn't be. That's good news for me when using the standard cars.
Graphically, it's a mixed bag imo. While premiums do look quite good, sometimes they do not. That goes for tracks as well. Some of the standard vehicles aren't too bad to be honest but most are obviously not good at all. Strange graphical glitches when smoke and dust are on screen, aliasing etc..to a point where it's very bad to say the least. Damage I don't care about so nothing to say there.
Weather effects are a welcome inclusion but honestly, it's not that convincing. Rain/snow drops on the windshield look pretty dodgy. Although, night racing looks great.
I love the 'demo' of the cars around the track. I love all the tests. I love GT TV. I love the history portrayed in the game as well as the love for cars that PD have. I love the fact it has 1000+ cars even if most are standard...that doesn't really bother me. The menus are slick and eye catching.
Sound is also a mixed bag as some cars sound menacing while others sound like glorified vacuum cleaners. This area I though PD would absolutely nail but they haven't. The tuning and upgrades aren't that different from previous games. There's nothing really new to be honest. There's plenty of limitations on certain cars.
Overall, a terrific game so far that will be played for a long time to come even with it's inconsistincies and strange feature choices. The game is a driver's paradise but isn't exactly a revolution in the genre either.

Forza 3 is still king in my eyes due to it's across the board appeal. Imo, graphics are very close to GT5, has fantastic sound engine, tuning and upgrades are second to none, cockpits in all cars,auction house and livery editor. It would've been great to see some variety in weather/day/night conditions but I'm confident we'll see them in Forza 4 and will be waiting in great anticipation for it.

 

[daxter01]

I think everyone would agree, more premium cars and higher quality tracks would have been preferred, nine times out of ten.

no just no

 

[skyfinch]

So in the forza vs gt thread we have come to the conclusion pgr4 is the winner.

:lol Looks that way. PGR4 is a beast!

 

[h3ro]

:lol Looks that way. PGR4 is a beast!

If that's the case. Then we ALL win.

 

[watership]

no just no

So you're the one out of 10 then?

 

[Tashi]

Its dev cycle is legendary, not the series itself.

 

[Chrange]

So in the forza vs gt thread we have come to the conclusion pgr4 is the winner.

 

[Peff]

PGR4 is indeed fantastic. I think I'll be playing it later thanks to this thread :lol

 

[Gek54]

I suggest you check out the OT first. Like I said, I have no idea whether that's actually been confirmed.

Ok, got Forza 3 back out and downloaded all the updates. Still the game babies you around the track, steering for you.

Point your wheel in the direction you want to go and the game figures out the rest.

Its insulting.

 

[skyfinch]

After looking through videos of its menu, I gotta disagree. It's chockfull of minibanners in a layout that I find more befitting of a brochure spread or an exhibition panel. Gotta give it to Turn10 for revamping Forza's UI with a minimalist and uncluttered theme, with practical functions like how your inbox stays just a button away; no need to navigate to an icon to access it.

And Lance Hayes aka DJ Drunken Master did an excellent job producing music solely for the menus. Nice chillout/ambient tunes to accompany hours upon hours of livery editing.

Completely agree. Sleek and simple to use and look at, with great music. I wish I could get the Xbox's dashboard to look the same.

The HUD in the actual game is also done very well.

 

[skyfinch]

If that's the case. Then we ALL win.

I saw the game for $9! at Ebgames the other day. Even more win.

 

[dark10x]

:lol Looks that way. PGR4 is a beast!

I suppose this demonstrates the difference between aiming for 30 fps and aiming for 60 fps.

I'll take a small hit to the visuals if it means 60 fps, but obviously many would not.

 

[skyfinch]

I suppose this demonstrates the difference between aiming for 30 fps and aiming for 60 fps.

I'll take a small hit to the visuals if it means 60 fps, but obviously many would not.

30 plus motion blur. As you probably already know, motion blur takes a huge hit. My renders in Maya practically double when I enable motion blur.

Anyway, I'd would also take 60 over 30 any day of the week, but this generation.......

 

[skybaby]

This thread is pathetic. Then: only 400 cars? pffft Now: who plays with more than 200 anyway?
(It goes both ways btw)

 

[Tiago Leite]

Hi ppl...
Let me tell one thing: i'm not a fanboy, just a graphics maniac. If you search what I said @ Neogaf, I don't care who is better, FM3, GT5, NFS, GRID, etc. I just point what I think it needs improvements...
So... today it's a sad day for me... Why? (ps: i'm not trolling, i'm just sad)

 

[TheOddOne]

This thread is pathetic. Then: only 400 cars? pffft Now: who plays with more than 200 anyway?
(It goes both ways btw)

Well in this threads defence... its made for a purpose.

 

[Metalmurphy]

Hi ppl...
Let me tell one thing: i'm not a fanboy, just a graphics maniac. If you search what I said @ Neogaf, I don't care who is better, FM3, GT5, NFS, GRID, etc. I just point what I think it needs improvements...
So... today it's a sad day for me... Why? (ps: i'm not trolling, i'm just sad)
[]http://d.imagehost.org/t/0670/Go-Kart-007.jpg[/img]
[]http://b.imagehost.org/t/0064/London-001.jpg[/img]
[]http://b.imagehost.org/t/0145/London-010.jpg[/img]

... Too easy

 

[Tiago Leite]

... Too easy

A game with so many time to make, it wasn't suppose to be "too easy" to spot those ones... Or was supposed?

 

[Atomski]

I saw the game for $9! at Ebgames the other day. Even more win.

5.99 used at gamestop

All this talk of PGR really makes me hope MS buys Bizzare and they make a PGR5. One of my fav series. I was crushed when they went to Activision.

 

[Metalmurphy]

What's going on with the half screen tearing btw. Never seen that happen before, can someone explain technically why that happnes?

 

[szaromir]

I suppose this demonstrates the difference between aiming for 30 fps and aiming for 60 fps.

I'll take a small hit to the visuals if it means 60 fps, but obviously many would not.

It's not a small hit though. PGR4 oozes with detail (compared to FM3 which is an exclusive on the same platform).

 

[kevm3]

As a graphics whore, did you spot this in Forza?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CUxVNENan6g&feature=related

Here's another one:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WiShmTEYpY8&feature=related

 

[Lagspike_exe]

As a graphics whore, did you spot this in Forza?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CUxVNENan6g&feature=related

Here's another one:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WiShmTEYpY8&feature=related

Arab drifting!

 

[Pallaris]

Hi ppl...
Let me tell one thing: i'm not a fanboy, just a graphics maniac. If you search what I said @ Neogaf, I don't care who is better, FM3, GT5, NFS, GRID, etc. I just point what I think it needs improvements...
So... today it's a sad day for me... Why? (ps: i'm not trolling, i'm just sad)

I'm still really suprised they never re-did their engine or did whatever they had to do to get the game to 60fps, locked no bullshit. If Forza managed it there are no excuses. Especially after the prologue debacle and all this extra time.

Tearing and slowdown in a flagship game like this is just plain wrong.

Has anyone confirmed a flawless framerate in SD mode yet?

 

[Ace 8095]

If anyone wants to play some PGR4 online tonight or later this week add me. I bought the game almost two years after its release so I didn't get much of an online experience.


GT: Ace 8095

 

[evolution]

I'm still really suprised they never re-did their engine or did whatever they had to do to get the game to 60fps, locked no bullshit. If Forza managed it there are no excuses. Especially after the prologue debacle and all this extra time.

Tearing and slowdown in a flagship game like this is just plain wrong.

Has anyone confirmed a flawless framerate in SD mode yet?

Forza doesn't have to push as much on screen at any moment, its pretty simple.

 

[Tiago Leite]

As a graphics whore, did you spot this in Forza?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CUxVNENan6g&feature=related

Here's another one:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WiShmTEYpY8&feature=related

Yep, those ones and some more... like in previous versions of FM3 the car didn't get shadowed under a bridge for example... (said the same thing in FM foruns about FM2 @X06 event). I know, everybody wants the game to be perfect, but sawn shadows are, at very best, strange...

EDIT: If anyone is complaining about my "neutrality", I said this, and this about FM.

 

[skybaby]

Forza doesn't have to push as much on screen at any moment, its pretty simple.

Well then don't go overboard with it. I figured they'd fix fucking vsync problems in a track from gt5p...

 

[nib95]

Speaking as someone that loves sims, this is fantastic news. My biggest gripe with F3 was the ridiculous amount of grief you had to give a car in order to lose control. I like to feel like I'm on the edge of losing it all the time, otherwise there's no danger or excitement.

Having said that, Forza 3 does make a competent driver look like a fucking hero, it's a good game to show off your flashy driving to others.

Believe me. Simulation mode steering settings along with assists off with the G25 is mad. I was even having to fight myself correct steering even with a bloody Civic!

 

[duk]

Forza doesn't have to push as much on screen at any moment, its pretty simple.

nonsense, tracks and track side objects/detail in FM3 > GT5

 

[szaromir]

Does GT5 support custom soundtracks?

 

[evolution]

nonsense, tracks and track side objects/detail in FM3 > GT5

I just did a race with 16 cars all premium all on screen in the rain, show me that in forza 3. Im waiting.

 

[-viper-]

Believe me. Simulation mode steering settings along with assists off with the G25 is mad. I was even having to fight myself correct steering even with a bloody Civic!

Wait till you try using the Zonda R on Leguna Seca.

It's hell.