-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
Forza Motorsport 3 - October 2009 release (ignore the OP at your peril)
- Thread starter DuckRacer
- Start date
WHOAguitarninja
Member
SSM25 said:
Hahaha, yeah. It definitely does. Forza 2 doesn't look as bad in motion as those shots suggest though.
panda21 said:
Haven't you payed any attention to Yamauich? It's not a videogame.
WHOAguitarninja
Member
bee said:
True, but a big part of these games is the car lust which is amped up much higher when the cars look this nice.
eso76
Member
nib95 said:
while i would give the crown to F3 Ferrari in those particular screens (but i don't think that GT5p pic is a very good one), the images you posted show exactly what i think sets gt apart.
I don't know what they call it, but there's this particular white 'ceramic' like paint finish now; started on bmw's i think, probably porsche cayenne and it's now being used by everyone. Any other developer would have applied a white tone to the already existing shader and called it a day, but this has very different reflective, diffuse, specular properties and PD nailed it.
I do quite some 3d modelling and surfacing in my job and i wouldn't know how to obtain such results in renderings, not to mention in realtime.
Tbh, though, i think we've only seen FM3 rendition of 'metallic' paint so far
Littleberu
Banned
Iberian said:
Not when you're drunk.
skybaby said:
To be fair:
As has been said before, it all depends on what environment you're in.
The biggest challenge we have right now is getting it right in motion, the lighting in the environment, where we can get something that looks as good as this:
http://www.thesupercars.org/wp-content/uploads/2007/01/ferrari-599.jpg
If you ask the Forza engine guys, I'd bet they'd tell you the greatest strides they made to make it look so much better from FM2 to FM3 were those in the environmental lighting depeartment, not working on paint shaders.
Also:
http://image.com.com/gamespot/images/2008/050/942026_20080220_screen016.jpg
Is this GT:HD, GT5
, or GT5? Anyone know for sure?
I assume it's one of the first two, in which case it doesn't quite count, but additionally, there's a hell of a difference if it's GT:HD, and not GT5.
http://image.com.com/gamespot/images/2008/050/942026_20080220_screen016.jpg
Is this GT:HD, GT5
, or GT5? Anyone know for sure?I assume it's one of the first two, in which case it doesn't quite count, but additionally, there's a hell of a difference if it's GT:HD, and not GT5
.abacab driver
Banned
kIdMuScLe said:
Only comparable pic I could find from Prologue (different color though).
http://o.aolcdn.com/gd-media/games/gran-turismo-5-prologue/playstation-3/23.jpg
Iknos said:
So many of the 'which console sim is best' arguments amuse me. It's like trying to argue whether or not 'Die Hard 2' or 'Die Hard 4' is better completely ignoring the fact that 'Die Hard' and 'Die Hard With a Vengeance' even exist.
I'll be enjoying FM and GT but if I was really worried about getting the absolute best sim I probably wouldn't be playing on console in the first place.
I've actually been playing a lot of Forza 2 recently. Trying to figure out what my problem is with my Elise and the Ford GT NY time trial. Maybe I'm sending too much power to the wheels at the wrong time, but high-power mid engine RWD cars seem to be giving me fits. They get too squirrely on the straight after I complete a turn.
I'm pretty clueless as well. I searched around to see if I could buy the Logitech G25 pedals, since they seem well loved, and are presumably not too expensive. I couldn't find any for sale. So far, it appears that they are only sold bundled with the G25 wheel.Psychotext said:
Fanantec sells their pedals separately. There's the $50 set that comes with some of their wheel packages, and then there's the $199 set. Nice, but ouch.
I'm a little confused how things can be connected. The Clubsport pedals are listed as being USB. The crappy Microsoft racing pedals connect via a telephone-looking connector. And yet both of these pedal sets allegedly connect to the Porsche wheel. I should probably download a Fanatec manual.
WHOAguitarninja
Member
Recoil said:Also:
http://image.com.com/gamespot/images/2008/050/942026_20080220_screen016.jpg
Is this GT:HD, GT5
I assume it's one of the first two, in which case it doesn't quite count, but additionally, there's a hell of a difference if it's GT:HD, and not GT5
GT5
. That track isn't in GTHD.CrunchinJelly
formerly cjelly
There are high-res pics of the Fanatec Turbo S Wheel here: http://www.fanatec.de/html/index.php?id=411&lang=enDing said:
Only input I can see is PS/2 on either side; one for gear stick, one for pedals. Not sure how MS pedals would work if you say they use an RJ25 for connection. :-/
Odd, as Fanatec's website say they do work.
Psychotext
Member
Has anyone here used the standard Fanatec peddles? How are they?
There's been some discussion about this in the GT5 thread, but I thought I'd post it here because it's a great feature for FM3. It's about the rewind feature.
There are some butthurt fangirls there who aren't really interested in getting sim racing more exposure, and to get people into sim racing (they're more interested in console wars and that crap), and they've tried to slag off this feature, but as I'll point out it's an incredible learning tool.
Thus far we have a few learning tools in Forza:
-Racing line: line demonstrates an ideal racing line, and is color coded to help you brake and accelerate at the right times
-Ghost Car Time Trials: You can see how a particular driver raced a track, and learn a bit more about how they did certain things (racing line doesn't show you when a driver leans the opposite direction, and then back, for proper weight transfer), and see if they did certain things like cut off-track to coax the back end to slip out (more for drifting).
Both tools are excellent, IMO. But I think that there's another important element missing. How to deal with other racers?
Imagine a scenario where an amateur driver is coming up to a hairpin turn where the 2 cars ahead of him are right in the apex of a hairpin. So you can't pass on the inside...do you simply tail them and keep your position or attempt to pass around them on the outside? Obviously, there are other factors like how banked the turn is. But you never know until you try. Someone who is new to sim racing may not have considered that the road is banked enough for them to keep traction at higher speeds. So they can try it out without worry, and learns these lessons through application.
With the rewind feature, you can try out these different scenarios. And when it comes to a REAL race (ie. online versus human competitors), you'll know a bit more about how the car behaves in those situations.
It has to be kept in mind, when it comes to racing with competitors, the best racing line is not always an option. You have other racers on the track, with different capabilities. Some car ahead of you may break early because they have to, and you may have to do so as well if you can't pass them. Some opponents may always take the insides of turns very well never allowing you to pass them on the inside. Learning which corners are best for your car to pass on the outside would be an invaluable tool.
You read dumb shit on that other thread like "why not make an X button to win"...obviously not realizing that assists affect the money you earn in career mode.
But I can think of a legitimate complaint, if a racer used this feature to get stellar leaderboard track times. Dan did mention in an interview that using assists will hurt your time postings, but "how much" is something I'm wondering.
Part of posting good Time Trial times is the fact that you are as perfect as you can be for all 8-15 corners. Rewind allows you to take the perfect turn all of the time, which again, is great for a learning tool, but bad if you want to have a reputable leaderboard system. So Che, if you could comment more on this I'd appreciate it.
There are some butthurt fangirls there who aren't really interested in getting sim racing more exposure, and to get people into sim racing (they're more interested in console wars and that crap), and they've tried to slag off this feature, but as I'll point out it's an incredible learning tool.
Thus far we have a few learning tools in Forza:
-Racing line: line demonstrates an ideal racing line, and is color coded to help you brake and accelerate at the right times
-Ghost Car Time Trials: You can see how a particular driver raced a track, and learn a bit more about how they did certain things (racing line doesn't show you when a driver leans the opposite direction, and then back, for proper weight transfer), and see if they did certain things like cut off-track to coax the back end to slip out (more for drifting).
Both tools are excellent, IMO. But I think that there's another important element missing. How to deal with other racers?
Imagine a scenario where an amateur driver is coming up to a hairpin turn where the 2 cars ahead of him are right in the apex of a hairpin. So you can't pass on the inside...do you simply tail them and keep your position or attempt to pass around them on the outside? Obviously, there are other factors like how banked the turn is. But you never know until you try. Someone who is new to sim racing may not have considered that the road is banked enough for them to keep traction at higher speeds. So they can try it out without worry, and learns these lessons through application.
With the rewind feature, you can try out these different scenarios. And when it comes to a REAL race (ie. online versus human competitors), you'll know a bit more about how the car behaves in those situations.
It has to be kept in mind, when it comes to racing with competitors, the best racing line is not always an option. You have other racers on the track, with different capabilities. Some car ahead of you may break early because they have to, and you may have to do so as well if you can't pass them. Some opponents may always take the insides of turns very well never allowing you to pass them on the inside. Learning which corners are best for your car to pass on the outside would be an invaluable tool.
You read dumb shit on that other thread like "why not make an X button to win"...obviously not realizing that assists affect the money you earn in career mode.
But I can think of a legitimate complaint, if a racer used this feature to get stellar leaderboard track times. Dan did mention in an interview that using assists will hurt your time postings, but "how much" is something I'm wondering.
Part of posting good Time Trial times is the fact that you are as perfect as you can be for all 8-15 corners. Rewind allows you to take the perfect turn all of the time, which again, is great for a learning tool, but bad if you want to have a reputable leaderboard system. So Che, if you could comment more on this I'd appreciate it.
DOBERMAN INC
Member
Just to clarify,Does the rewind feature affect your winnings for the race?
Psychotext
Member
...and now it's going to be in here too.
StriKeVillain
Banned
I'm a fan of options in general. Anyone who doesn't want them can just turn them off. Pretty simple.
bloodforge
Member
DOBERMAN INC said:
Everything else does, I would expect this would as well.
Psychotext said:
It's already a confirmed feature for the game, people are either going to use it or they aren't, I see no reason to argue about it.
Technosteve
Banned
hey does FM3 have bumper car physics online?
DOBERMAN INC
Member
Iknos said:
Exactly what I was thinking,If so then I see no issue with it.
What I don't get in that GT thread is the series is known for weak a.i. and bumper car problems in every GT game,yet are forgivable. So how come a rewind feature can't exist if all those other screwups can then?
That GT thread is fucking scary though. Its like KillZone part II with their arrogance and hostility towards anything that poses a threat towards GT.:lol
That GT thread is fucking scary though. Its like KillZone part II with their arrogance and hostility towards anything that poses a threat towards GT.:lol
bloodforge
Member
Angelus said:
It's always been that way, there is no point trying to discuss something or criticizing the game in any GT thread unless you want torn apart by a rabid GT fanboy.
I love GT just as much as the next guy, but it has its issues.
Psychotext
Member
I meant more that the crazed fanboys aren't going to stop arguing just because this is a different thread.bloodforge said:
Iknos said:
Good point, but they already thought of the solution.
http://www.cnet.com.au/forza-motorsport-3-339296770.htm
Another source:
http://xbox360.ign.com/articles/990/990267p1.html
So you can use the feature to help you learn the course, and track you progress with lap times. But it only really counts if you can post a certified time.
Technosteve said:
It's interesting you mention online. I know for PC sims if you are having weird collisions it has more to do with lag and how some of the calculations as a result are just simply bizzarre.
From my experience in FM2 the collision physics are very good, so I garner FM3 wouldn't have an issue.
Psychotext said:
The basis of their argument was that "it's for fucking lazy people" and "it makes FM3 less of a sim". There was no real basis for why it's a bad feature. Most of their beliefs stemmed from the fact that it's a feature on a racing game that doesn't appear on their console of choice.
I think the racing fans should be able to discuss the pros and cons of a feature in this thread mainly because any legitimate cons could be considered by Che and the rest of Turn10.
I listed good things about the feature, and a legitimate concern. I hope that concern is addressed. I don't think leaderboards should feature times where a person uses the feature. I think it's a great tool for new drivers and people who want to use it. But using it to get best times for a leaderboard is not a good thing. Psychotext, I don't think I'm going out of line saying this and I think it's a legitimate concern that should be debated.
It is a very new feature to racing games too. So why not debate it's worth?
KRS7 said:
Thanks! Sounds great.
bloodforge said:
Yeah its not game breaking issues in the series,just don't grind with the cars I guess. Just as you could choose not to use the rewind feature if you didn't wish to. But some people just refuse to reason about an inbetween. Glad I vented in here though,over in the other thread it would cause too much chaos and I don't want a bannning over such silliness.
Can't say I'm fond of the feature, just like I wasn't fond of GT4's AI teammate that could race for you. Even though both are optional, the mere pressence of these finds of features work against the ism aspect of the game.
Now on to more important matters: Please tell me there will be an easier way to mirror liveries from one side to the other this tiem around
Now on to more important matters: Please tell me there will be an easier way to mirror liveries from one side to the other this tiem around
Psychotext
Member
It sounds stupid... but I'm so looking forward to seeing what people do with the customisation tools in Forza 3. Some of the cars created in 2 were absolutely mindblowing.
I just really hope that they've improved the auction house significantly. I gave up trying to buy cars in Forza 2 because you had to babysit auctions.
I just really hope that they've improved the auction house significantly. I gave up trying to buy cars in Forza 2 because you had to babysit auctions.
Yeah,the time it takes to paint a car to your liking definitely could be toned down some,takes away from actually racing more. Still though I find it a refreshing break when my head is buzzing from too much game playing. Thats what makes Forza so damn sweet though: Variety in what you can actually do. Like taking a break from the game,having the computer race for you(taking a good portion of your winnings so as you do not abuse the feature) while you maybe buy and sell your rides at the auction house.
WHOAguitarninja
Member
X26 said:
It wasn't that hard before I didn't think. It usually had it positioned wrong by a couple clicks but that was pretty easy to fix.
Warm Machine
Member
RSTEIN said:
Looks right as the camera is exposing for bright outdoors, which allows the sky to be blue.
RSTEIN said:
Looks right as the camera is exposing for in shadow, forcing the sky to white. After the Sun, the clouds and sky are the brightest things in our world.
They both look right under those conditions. You'd really have to get both cars in the same local with the same colour in the same lighting conditions to see who has done a better job at the shaders.
Psychotext
Member
Hmm... I really don't want to pay the extra £100 for the clubsport pedals. The thing is expensive enough as it is.bee said:
I don't think I've seen anywhere that sells the G25 pedals on their own either.
bee
Member
Psychotext said:Hmm... I really don't want to pay the extra £100 for the clubsport pedals. The thing is expensive enough as it is.
I don't think I've seen anywhere that sells the G25 pedals on their own either.
i have the g25 with brake modded pedals and there great, although i'm definitely gonna upgrade to the fanatec clubsport pedals soon if logitech don't announce a g27 or whatever soon. i wouldn't however pay the extra for the gt3rs clubsport vs the g25, its something like £330 vs £128 for the complete package shipped, no brainer imo
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=54iQktxDQOM&fmt=18 the amount of tweaking they allow makes them a total bargain when you consider the cost of the pro pedals
Wow, I just stepped into the GT5 thread *for a second* and see this:
Anyway, I'd like to give a massive amount of kudos to T10 for the way they're handling community interaction. I don't think I've quite seen it with a developer before (at least, with a game I'm interested in) but it really does make a massive difference when you feel your opinion means something, or in the very least, can be discussed with logic and reasoning with people who are close to the production of the game.
And just let me say, I'm so, SO pumped for the release of this. October cannot come soon enough.
Ugh.SSM25 said:
Anyway, I'd like to give a massive amount of kudos to T10 for the way they're handling community interaction. I don't think I've quite seen it with a developer before (at least, with a game I'm interested in) but it really does make a massive difference when you feel your opinion means something, or in the very least, can be discussed with logic and reasoning with people who are close to the production of the game.
And just let me say, I'm so, SO pumped for the release of this. October cannot come soon enough.
Psychotext
Member
Well... I'm pretty much stuck with the Fanatec (Porsche 911 Turbo S Wheel) as I need the multiplatform compatibility. Plus, unfortunately I just looked and it's not just £100 more as I thought, it's ...bee said:
£420 - Clubsport Edition (with clubsport pedals)
vs
£288 - Standard (standard pedals)
So it's actually £132 more. Which is a hell of a chunk. I could in theory get the Pure (£166) and add the dongle (£44) and shifters (£44) for a total of £254. But as I said before, I don't believe you can get the G25 pedals standalone anywhere so I don't think that would be of any help.
Stupid expensive world.
squatingyeti
non-sanctioned troll
SSM25 said:
Is that what you came in here for, or are you going to only fire shots at T10 in the other thread?
SSM25 said:
or this gem:
SSM25 said:
bee
Member
Psychotext said:Well... I'm pretty much stuck with the Fanatec (Porsche 911 Turbo S Wheel) as I need the multiplatform compatibility. Plus, unfortunately I just looked and it's not just £100 more as I thought, it's ...
£420 - Clubsport Edition (with clubsport pedals)
vs
£288 - Standard (standard pedals)
So it's actually £132 more. Which is a hell of a chunk. I could in theory get the Pure (£166) and add the dongle (£44) and shifters (£44) for a total of £254. But as I said before, I don't believe you can get the G25 pedals standalone anywhere so I don't think that would be of any help.
Stupid expensive world.
i'd say they were worth an extra £132 myself, its not like your gonna be replacing them for maybe 10 years
i just hope the console games your gonna be playing cater for the adjustments you can make with them or its pointlessan example of pro pedals would be http://www.cannonsimulationtechnologies.com/category-1.htm i wouldn't pay that much myself but it shows how good a price the clubsport ones are selling for
And I thought the G25 was expensive as fuck....!bee said:i'd say they were worth an extra £132 myself, its not like your gonna be replacing them for maybe 10 years
an example of pro pedals would be http://www.cannonsimulationtechnologies.com/category-1.htm i wouldn't pay that much myself but it shows how good a price the clubsport ones are selling for