From Tupac to Rosa Parks: KY county clerk Kim Davis says "Only God can judge me now"

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Theresa, you are right. Nothing in the Constitution mentions any kind of marriage. "Pursuit of happiness" does not equal to gay marriage. Justices Kennedy, Sotomayor, Ginsburg, and the other justices have Hell to pay for leading our country into deeper decadence and debauchery.
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Pursuit of happiness does not equal gay marriage?


What?
 
Netherscourge said:
How the hell is she a DEMOCRAT?
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I'm not sure why it's so surprising.

Politics is pretty much just team sports, most voters don't even know the details of their party's platform, and will support or oppose an idea simply based on whether their team's guy or the other team's guy is behind it.
 
C.Dark.DN said:
Watch her get a few million dollars and be impeached. She'll retire on a load of cash, be martyr, not have to work again in her life.
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That's fine. It'll be going from bigots to bigots so no net change there and she will be out of power and safely sequestered in her Fortress of Normal so a positive there.

Seems like a positive change to me.
 
Metaphoreus said:
But think about this: the deputy clerks are delegates of the county clerk's authority. To the extent of the delegation, the deputy clerks are, for all intensive porpoises, the county clerk.
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Not constitutionally they aren't. And being as this is going to be a legal argument thing we'd have to look hard at the constitution. Obviously in practice this is exactly what they do, but it doesn't have a constitutional basis. That is apparent from the provision about a "vacancy in the office" ...

So, as long as a deputy of the county clerk is fulfilling the duties of the clerk, the clerk isn't "absent" for purposes of the statute, even when the person elected to that office is not, herself, present to fulfill the duties.
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... so we'd need to consider whether the Clerk is "absent" independently of whether in practice the rest of the office is getting the day-to-day job done.

I guess the easiest way of doing that is if the judge/executive announces tomorrow morning that he is invoking 402.240 being as the Clerk is in jail. That would clarify everything immediately.

The second easiest way is for the judge/executive to in fact comply with 402.240 by memorialising the Clerk when she gets out of jail - that would defacto legitimise everything done in the meantime even there is some short-term uncertainty.

The hardest way is to do it all by legal challenges afterwards, which just leads to uncertainty all round - though I reckon 402.240 is strongly arguable right now.

Another consideration is 402.100(1)(a) and (c):

(1) A marriage license which provides for the entering of:
(a) An authorization statement of the county clerk issuing the license for any
person or religious society authorized to perform marriage ceremonies to unite
in marriage the persons named;
(b) Vital information for each party, including the full name, date of birth, place
of birth, race, condition (single, widowed, or divorced), number of previous
marriages, occupation, current residence, relationship to the other party, and
full names of parents; and
(c) The date and place the license is issued, and the signature of the county clerk
or deputy clerk issuing the license.
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Notice that in (c) the signature may be that of the clerk or a deputy - but in (a) the authorisation statement must be that of the clerk - a deputy will not do. That's the bit where the judge/executive needs to take over. But otherwise ...

402.105 Marriage license valid for thirty days.
A marriage license shall be valid for thirty (30) days, including the date it is issued, and after that time it shall be invalid.
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... so once it is issued in accordance with 402.100 there is no problem with validity.

It is just that authorisation statement that is the problem, and that can be easily got over by invoking 402.240.
 
Mecha said:
So will she stay in jail until she decides to issue marriage licenses?
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She can agree to do her job, resign, or wait until she is either removed from office (at the earliest that would be January from what we are hearing now) or her term runs out.
 
She is so stupid, she'd rather sit in jail rather than give up the charade and honor marriage licenses or resign? Simply astounding.
 
You know you're from nowhere important when the height lines for mug shots are painted on by hand in a 1950s font.
Netherscourge said:
How the hell is she a DEMOCRAT?
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She's following in her mother's footsteps and given her timeframe in office she was likely a Dixiecrat (racist jackasses that neither party really wanted and what pushed Reagan; Liberal social policy but hated LBJ/Carter for Civil Rights things). Daughter took the same party affiliation to keep the family thing going. No actual organized portion of the DNC is going to waste any time on someone who claims allegiance at a position this low-end.
 
ZombiePlatypus said:
So how long before fundies, and other conservatives start a money raising campaing and shower her with donations for being a bigot?
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She may get money but as long as people can get gaymarried in her county, we won. Money helps her for a short time, equality helps everyone for a very long time.
 
alr1ght said:
mug
umCpEJD.jpg
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For a moment I thought this said she was 6'4"
 
The "religious freedom" talking point infuriates me because it's so broad and completely devoid of logic. "Hey my religion says I can only give marriage licenses to white Christians" but I should still get to keep my job because "religious liberty."
 
GitarooMan said:
The "religious freedom" talking point infuriates me because it's so broad and completely devoid of logic. "Hey my religion says I can only give marriage licenses to white Christians" but I should still get to keep my job because "religious liberty."
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To me it also violates the separation of church and state as this is church in the state.
 
I always love protests. It brings out the idiot in everyone. So called "Christians" shouting hate speak when the religion teaches to love people despite sin. Then there's the guy holding a sign that says "Kim Davis Fuck You" Way to get your point across idiot.
 
Preachers around the country this Sunday will be quick to point to this as 'Christian persecution' by the state.
 
Scrooged said:
Preachers around the country this Sunday will be quick to point to this as 'Christian persecution' by the state.
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They'll continue their persecution complex in any possible way. Hell, they continue it despite being the prevalent and most listened-to religion in the nation.

It's why the whole "omg no she'll be martyr!" reasoning is pointless (I know you're not saying it, but still). People like her will continue to support her bullshit no matter what happened.
 
Aselith said:
She may get money but as long as people can get gaymarried in her county, we won. Money helps her for a short time, equality helps everyone for a very long time.
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That's a great outlook. Very well said.

Baraka in the White House said:
I can just about guarantee she'll at least make the AM radio circuit once she gets out. That crowd will be dying to hear how she stood up for theocracy against brutal state tyranny.
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Yea, probably the most predictable path.
 
3N16MA said:
She should have just left her job and find another that falls inline with her religious beliefs. She had several opportunities to follow the law or step down.
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She is dumb, uneducated trash. I doubt she could have found another job. Now she can though because the idiots that support her will look out for her.
 
Scrooged said:
Preachers around the country this Sunday will be quick to point to this as 'Christian persecution' by the state.
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Some will. Most of the ones I know are pleased with this result and plan to use it as a platform to talk about how Christians should not live.
 
Metaphoreus said:
It doesn't? But if it's so that:



then who are you to decide that her conversion doesn't annul the sinfulness (if any) of her current marriage? That interpretation doesn't strike me as so implausible that no one could legitimately adopt it. In the end, the charge of hypocrisy is weak when we don't know her specific beliefs on the question of divorce. More importantly, it's irrelevant. What she's doing is wrong for reasons that go beyond petty personal attacks.
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Look this isn't rocket science but for the sake of argument let's say there is such a thing as sin and being a born again Christian. Even if she became "born again" after her divorces it does make the divorces forgiven, however, as long as she is still having sex with a man that is not her first husband she us now committing another sin of adultery every time she does it. Are you arguing that being born again nulls all present and future sins? Because if that's the case I'd better be born again right now and sin like crazy. Also, if she's a Christian then she needs to know all of the sins and not just a few. I hate cherry picking Bible thumpers as they d it too fit their own selfish needs.

This is all silly to argue anyways as I don't believe in sin, just transgressions against your fellow man and everything on this planet, but I know how much you like to play Devils advocate. I personally don't feel like arguing this anymore.
 
Thequietone said:
Look this isn't rocket science but for the sake of argument let's say there is such a thing as sin and being a born again Christian. Even if she became "born again" after her divorces it does make the divorces forgiven, however, as long as she is still having sex with a man that is not her first husband she us now committing another sin of adultery every time she does it. Are you arguing that being born again nulls all present and future sins? Because if that's the case I'd better be born again right now and sin like crazy.

This is all silly to argue anyways as I don't believe in sin, just transgressions against your fellow man and everything on this planet, but I know how much you like to play Devils advocate. I personally don't feel like arguing this anymore.
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Just to make a semantic argument, if those prior marriages were not made in the church of her new God, they don't really count from a religious standpoint.

There's all kinds of fiddly things like that with religion that can absolve people making mental gymnastics to get what they want and not have to take responsibility for it.
 
As far as her divorces go, it's not really worth arguing. Obviously it doesn't make sense if you don't believe in being "born again" and if you do believe in being "born again" then your logic isn't accepted. Trying to bridge those gaps is near impossible.
 
blackflag said:
She is going to get rich off of this unfortunately. That's what I'm worried about.....or worse, elected to a legislature.
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Small-minded people with questionable decision-making skills who win the lottery tend not to keep that wealth for very long. I foresee another divorce in her future and a bitter fight over who gets to keep the new F-150.
 
http://www.esquire.com/news-politics/a37637/kim-davis-discrimination/

Kim Davis, because of her deeply-held belief in a religion to which she converted four years ago (her whole thing makes so much more sense when you think about how fresh she is to Christianity, doesn't it? Hers is the zeal of the brand-new convert. It's like she's six months into Crossfit) refused to issue marriage licenses out of her office so that she would never endorse a same-sex union with her signature, and now she's going to jail. As Mark Joseph Stern points out in Slate, good lawyers– lawyers who are working for the good of their clients, not lawyers who are trying to stay relevant in a world that has outgrown them–tend to do what they can to keep their clients out of jail. The Liberty Counsel, who counsels for the liberty to oppress gay people and pretty much nothing else, should be out of business in 2015. When we get that picture of Kim Davis in handcuffs, they'll have the image they need to stay afloat until 2025*.

*Your nastiest, cleverest Kim Davis tweets are going in that same fundraising mailer. Your words and actions in this moment are just as important as hers. Avoid the heel turn, my friends.
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I've been uncomfortable about this situation ever since the last thread went up with her name in the title. We shouldn't have given her a name. "How about this Kentucky clerk lady, huh?" was the place to be. You don't get to claim religious freedom if you're holding elected office, especially as a clerk where you aren't expected to use discretion but only to execute the office faithfully. "Religious freedom" doesn't have a place in any useful model of civil service. Her hypocrisy and her history simply don't matter. We shouldn't be giving her a personality or any regard at all really. She stood for an office, she failed it, the system sanctioned her as intended.
 
The line drawn where she feels sinful by association for issuing licenses seems rather arbitrary. She lives in a country where same-sex marriage is legal. Working, paying taxes, etc means she supports, in some degree, the state's view on equality.

I hope her martyrdom doesn't cause more broad laws in favour of religious freedom like the "Religious Freedom Restoration Act" or similar rubbish.
 
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