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[gblues]

As someone who buys organic for 99% of all the stuff in our house, it's totally worth it in terms of taste and health. Don't confuse health with healthy. Organic food is not healthier in the sense that it has less calories, less sugar, more nutrition..it's healthier in the sense you don't have a fuck ton of chemicals that you don't need in your body. I'm not an expert, but my gut tells me a lot of the illnesses experienced nowadays stem greatly from all that shit you're fed. At least in certain nations.

Everything you eat has "a fuck ton of chemicals that you don't need in your body." It's called waste. If food didn't have those fuck ton of chemicals, you'd never have to take a shit.

On topic: It's not a scam because the product itself isn't being misrepresented (i.e. something claiming to be grown organically but actually was treated with DDT), and the prices, while higher, reflect increased costs to the producer to user lower-yield techniques.

The study in question shows that the benefits of organic food are a lot narrower than the people selling organic products want you to believe (SHOCKING NEWS: advertisers lie), but that's different from having zero benefit.

So, at that point it's a simple cost-benefit analysis. If the benefits are worth it, buy it. If they're not, don't. Too easy.

TL;DR: Not a scam, but possibly not worth the money.

 

[I'm an expert]

It's hit or miss though, lots of organic stuff is just as shitty as the non-organic stuff. For example, I tried 'Organic' coffee the other day and it just straight up tasted like dirt. It was the worst coffee I've ever tried.

I'm not a coffee person at all, but like I said above people usually have the opposite reaction of you when they try it. Might have been the brand.

 

[that1dude24]

I'm not a coffee person at all, but like I said above people usually have the opposite reaction of you when they try it. Might have been the brand.

of course it's the brand, being "organic" or "natural" doesn't equate to being better in any sense.

 

[Admiral Bone to Pick]

Most people will only make an active effort to avoid added chemicals if they find it convenient. Diet soda and sunscreen? Can't buy those, they could have dangerous chemicals! Conventional, non-organic produce? Whatever, no biggie. Not like pesticides used in the past have been linked to cancer or anything. Besides, organic produce would just be too expensive!

Basically, most people are full of crap when it comes to the "dangers" of chemicals.

 

[marrec]

I'm not a coffee person at all, but like I said above people usually have the opposite reaction of you when they try it. Might have been the brand.

I don't take my coffee very seriously (I take it with a just a bit of sugar, which would probably make coffee nuts have an apoplexy) but this stuff was the equivalent of putting 'organic' on Satan's asscrack.

Also, you fucking hippies better not mess with my GMO eggs (once they are eventually produced). I need them to be hypoallergenic so I can have scrambled eggs again. You can protest everything else, just fucking back off the eggs!

 

[DJ_Lae]

I would still much rather buy local than buy organic, though my move to Edmonton from Victoria has made that much more difficult as lower mainland produce is no longer really 'local.'

I also have no idea what farmers markets there are in the US but the ones I've been to up here have been nowhere near affordable. They set up their little booths and charge $3 for an English cucumber, $3+ a pound for tomatoes, five bucks for a little couple pound bunch of carrots and holy fuck don't even go near any of the meat. They come out to hawk their stuff to crowds who eat that shit up and they gouge because they can.

 

[marrec]

I would still much rather buy local than buy organic, though my move to Edmonton from Victoria has made that much more difficult as lower mainland produce is no longer really 'local.'

I also have no idea what farmers markets there are in the US but the ones I've been to up here have been nowhere near affordable. They set up their little booths and charge $3 for an English cucumber, $3+ a pound for tomatoes, five bucks for a little couple pound bunch of carrots and holy fuck don't even go near any of the meat. They come out to hawk their stuff to crowds who eat that shit up and they gouge because they can.

It's the opposite where I'm at. I suppose it's up to supply and demand though right?

You can't swing a dead cat without hitting some shirtless amish dude selling yams up here.

 

[Kitsunebaby]

I'm not a coffee person at all, but like I said above people usually have the opposite reaction of you when they try it. Might have been the brand.

Or they're two completely different types of coffee. Trying to gauge the worth of "organic" coffee by taste is kind of silly, as both the organic and non-organic versions would have to be the same type of bean, grown in the same soil, and given the same roast for a comparison to have any validity. Somehow I doubt you've gone to that trouble.

 

[I'm an expert]

Or they're two completely different types of coffee. Trying to gauge the worth of "organic" coffee by taste is kind of silly, as both the organic and non-organic versions would have to be the same type of bean, grown in the same soil, and given the same roast for a comparison to have any validity. Somehow I doubt you've gone to that trouble.

Me? Nah. Coffee is crap.

 

[Devolution]

I would still much rather buy local than buy organic, though my move to Edmonton from Victoria has made that much more difficult as lower mainland produce is no longer really 'local.'

I also have no idea what farmers markets there are in the US but the ones I've been to up here have been nowhere near affordable. They set up their little booths and charge $3 for an English cucumber, $3+ a pound for tomatoes, five bucks for a little couple pound bunch of carrots and holy fuck don't even go near any of the meat. They come out to hawk their stuff to crowds who eat that shit up and they gouge because they can.

Yeah those aren't like the farmer's markets I've been too lol. And if you're in a lucky spot where you're like the last stop or they're going home they give shit away.

 

[Deleted member 17706]

I would still much rather buy local than buy organic, though my move to Edmonton from Victoria has made that much more difficult as lower mainland produce is no longer really 'local.'

I also have no idea what farmers markets there are in the US but the ones I've been to up here have been nowhere near affordable. They set up their little booths and charge $3 for an English cucumber, $3+ a pound for tomatoes, five bucks for a little couple pound bunch of carrots and holy fuck don't even go near any of the meat. They come out to hawk their stuff to crowds who eat that shit up and they gouge because they can.

The farmer's markets here in Seattle are pretty great in my experience. Prices tend to be more than fair.

 

[Like the hat?]

I signed up for a CSA at a farm literally a five minute drive away from my house. It's amazing how much better things taste when they aren't shipped from hundreds of miles away, because things are able to ripen in the dirt instead of in a warehouse. They are an "organic" farm but I don't think the fact that they are matters nearly as much taste wise as much as them being close does. Them not using traditional pesticides and stuff is definitely a bonus to me, though.

I also try to buy hormone and antibiotic free meat whenever possible, because my kids don't need additional antibiotics and all that shit in their systems.


The best though is pasture raised, hormone free, farm fresh eggs. Man, the stuff you buy at the supermarket is nothing in comparison. It's like a store bought tomato in January compared to one you pick from your own garden in July.

 

[V_Arnold]

My current organic, Fair Trade coffee tastes better than any other coffee I have ever tried. And the taste of not fucking up others for saving a few bucks...delicious.

 

[3phemeral]

I see people mentioning bananas, but isn't the supposed benefit of organic (sans the "better for you" and "tastes great" claims) the idea that you'd be limiting your exposure to ingested pesticides? If so, then unless you actually eat the banana peel, wouldn't the banana be a low-risk food in terms of potential pesticide ingestion?

I always figured that produce that gain the greatest benefit from "organic" methods are those where the outer skin is eaten.

[edit] After thinking about it, there is probably a risk with washed-off pesticide making it into the soil and being absorbed through the roots. I'll have to read up on this in a bit.

 

[AbsolutBro]

It's the opposite where I'm at. I suppose it's up to supply and demand though right?

You can't swing a dead cat without hitting some shirtless amish dude selling yams up here.

Agreed. Im central east coast and there are two markets near my office and three near my house. A lot of the smaller family farms sell their produce at markets rather than try to deal with the grocery store. Even my local grocer has started dedicating a section to local produce, but whether thats from local family farms or local agri-business I can't say.

 

[fredrancour]

I would still much rather buy local than buy organic, though my move to Edmonton from Victoria has made that much more difficult as lower mainland produce is no longer really 'local.'

I also have no idea what farmers markets there are in the US but the ones I've been to up here have been nowhere near affordable. They set up their little booths and charge $3 for an English cucumber, $3+ a pound for tomatoes, five bucks for a little couple pound bunch of carrots and holy fuck don't even go near any of the meat. They come out to hawk their stuff to crowds who eat that shit up and they gouge because they can.

Where I am in the US the farmer's market has superior produce to the local supermarkets. Sorry to hear your local ones suck.

 

[Divvy]

I would still much rather buy local than buy organic, though my move to Edmonton from Victoria has made that much more difficult as lower mainland produce is no longer really 'local.'

I also have no idea what farmers markets there are in the US but the ones I've been to up here have been nowhere near affordable. They set up their little booths and charge $3 for an English cucumber, $3+ a pound for tomatoes, five bucks for a little couple pound bunch of carrots and holy fuck don't even go near any of the meat. They come out to hawk their stuff to crowds who eat that shit up and they gouge because they can.

I have the same problem where I live, the local farmer's market sucks and is overpriced. I tried a farmshare and that sucked and was overpriced too.

 

[AbsolutBro]

I see people mentioning bananas, but isn't the supposed benefit of organic (sans the "better for you" and "tastes great" claims) the idea that you'd be limiting your exposure to ingested pesticides? If so, then unless you actually eat the banana peel, wouldn't the banana be a low-risk food in terms of potential pesticide ingestion?

I always figured that produce that gain the greatest benefit from "organic" methods are those where the outer skin is eaten.

[edit] After thinking about it, there is probably a risk with washed-off pesticide making it into the soil and being absorbed through the roots. I'll have to read up on this in a bit.

Tubers and other root vegetables will generally be safe from most common crop destroying bugs by their nature. Carrots, beets, turnips, parsnips, ginger, radish, etc., etc. Because the bulk of what you eat is below the soil. Onions especially.

Things like bananas or oranges (or most citrus really) will be safe from anything but borer insects. Your biggest culprits are soft fleshed fruits (tomatoes especially) and lettuces or any kind of green like collards, kale or spinach.

.

 

[diamount]

It's all marketing.

Low Fat, low carb, organic, and now gluten free.

Gluten is a real problem for some people though, thing is those 'gluten free' foods have worse stuff in them.

 

[joelseph]

Of course they are. I thought this was accepted long ago? Labels such as organic, green, farm fresh, free range, etc. are marketing ploys to get you to spend more money.

 

[cbrun44]

As a Whole Foods shopper, I definitely find myself spending far less than I ever did at a conventional grocery store. Processed shit is expensive...

 

[Kinitari]

Some claims made by the organics industry seem to be entirely unsubstantiated or even incorrect.

If someone claims that they use less pesticides, more likely than not that is incorrect (depends on the plant I guess).

If someone claims that organic pesticides are healthier than non-organic pesticides, they are either incorrect or have no conclusive evidence to show this.

If someone claims that non-GMOs are healthier than GMOs they are incorrect.

If someone claims 'natural' is always better, they are both incorrect and misuses the word natural.

 

[Dennis]

I am scientist and I can tell you right now that scientists have no fucking clue what a cocktail of pesticides will do to you over many years.

What we now is that there is a correlation between various the exposure of farmers to common pesticides and their rate of Alzheimers and Parkinson's.

When I hear a fellow scientist declare that a poison is not harmful to humans in the doses they are exposed to when eating normal food I laugh.

No one has a clue really, its not possible to do those long term experiments on humans.

All we have is observations from poisonings of mostly third world farmers with pesticides and the aforementioned correlations.

I see no reason not to use the precautionary principle and minimize my exposure to pesticides.

 

[3phemeral]

.

Ah, thanks. I hadn't finished reading the whole thread yet. I wanted to reply to the banana mentions as soon as I saw them.

As a Whole Foods shopper, I definitely find myself spending far less than I ever did at a conventional grocery store. Processed shit is expensive...

What Whole Foods do you go to? hah

When I shopped at Whole Foods, they had quite excellent deals on local farmers. I would raid them of apples all the time. Local produce was super cheap. But organic -- holy heck was that expensive.

 

[someday]

As a Whole Foods shopper, I definitely find myself spending far less than I ever did at a conventional grocery store. Processed shit is expensive...

Really? I found the opposite to be true. Whole Foods was much more expensive but I didn't mind the cost since I loved the variety of organic foods available. Their meat section is incredible.

 

[fader]

they surely do taste different to me. after eating organic bananas, i cannot stand regular ones now. Organic ones are alot sweeter.

 

[Kinitari]

I am scientist and I can tell you right now that scientists have no fucking clue what a cocktail of pesticides will do to you over many years.

Which cocktail of pesticides, specifically Which pesticides? Scientists know a looot about what pesticides do to a human body, depending on the pesticides of course.

What we now is that there is a correlation between various the exposure of farmers to common pesticides and their rate of Alzheimers and Parkinson's.

Do you know which pesticides?

When I hear a fellow scientist declare that a poison is not harmful to humans in the doses they are exposed to when eating normal food I laugh.

Mmm, well depending on what they mean by harmful, I can agree with this.

No one has a clue really, its not possible to do those long term experiments on humans.

All we have is observations from poisonings of mostly third world farmers with pesticides and the aforementioned correlations.

I see no reason not to use the precautionary principle and minimize my exposure to pesticides.

I assume as a scientist, you're aware that organic foods use a shit ton of pesticides quite often, correct? Usually more often than conventional, and again even more often than GMOs with built in pesticides - right?

 

[viciouskillersquirrel]

I am scientist and I can tell you right now that scientists have no fucking clue what a cocktail of pesticides will do to you over many years.

What we now is that there is a correlation between various the exposure of farmers to common pesticides and their rate of Alzheimers and Parkinson's.

When I hear a fellow scientist declare that a poison is not harmful to humans in the doses they are exposed to when eating normal food I laugh.

No one has a clue really, its not possible to do those long term experiments on humans.

All we have is observations from poisonings of mostly third world farmers with pesticides and the aforementioned correlations.

I see no reason not to use the precautionary principle and minimize my exposure to pesticides.

There is also a strong correlation between living to a ripe old age and rates of Alzheimer's, Parkinson's, cancer, diabetes and gout. In previous times, our ancestors often avoided developing cancer in old age by starving to death at an early age.

they surely do taste different to me. after eating organic bananas, i cannot stand regular ones now. Organic ones are alot sweeter.

That's more a function of the food being fresher. That's what makes the biggest difference in taste.

 

[Price Dalton]

Several studies show that organic produce is higher in "secondary metabolites," which include polyphenols, flavonols, and other antioxidant compounds. This makes sense, because most plant phytonutrients exist to protect the plant against predation. Without so many pesticides, herbicides, and fungicides applied externally, the plants have to fend for themselves and upregulate production of their own protection mechanisms.

Organic soils, being richer in microbial life, can also be more naturally resistant to pests like fungus.

http://www.ncl.ac.uk/afrd/research/publication/168871
http://www.plosone.org/article/info:doi/10.1371/journal.pone.0012346
http://www.altmedrev.com/publications/15/1/4.pdf

A recent study just came out suggesting that polyphenol intake is pretty important: http://jn.nutrition.org/content/early/2013/06/25/jn.113.177121.short

Older people with the most polyphenols in their urine (a marker of polyphenol and thus produce intake) had the lowest mortality risk.

 

[Kinitari]

Several studies show that organic produce is higher in "secondary metabolites," which include polyphenols, flavonols, and other antioxidant compounds. This makes sense, because most plant phytonutrients exist to protect the plant against predation. Without so many pesticides, herbicides, and fungicides applied externally, the plants have to fend for themselves and upregulate production of their own protection mechanisms.

Organic soils, being richer in microbial life, can also be more naturally resistant to pests like fungus.

http://www.ncl.ac.uk/afrd/research/publication/168871
http://www.plosone.org/article/info:doi/10.1371/journal.pone.0012346
http://www.altmedrev.com/publications/15/1/4.pdf

Well, I don't know if that's true about organic farms - the thing is in the US the government apparently doesn't measure the amount of pesticides used on organic farms - but

According to the National Center for Food and Agricultural Policy, the top two organic fungicides, copper and sulfur, were used at a rate of 4 and 34 pounds per acre in 1971 1. In contrast, the synthetic fungicides only required a rate of 1.6 lbs per acre, less than half the amount of the organic alternatives.

 

[Hank Scorpio]

Fruit and veg I don't really care for the organic vs non-organic argument.

It's when it comes to meat. Organic v Free-range v factory farmed chicken...

 

[Dynamic3]

Everyone seems fixated on pesticides, but I'm more concerned with meat and dairy and the antibiotics passed through the non-organic variants. We know continued exposure to antibiotcs lowers their efficacy when they are truly needed, and who wants to drink milk filled with puss from the inflamed, over-worked udder of a cow who's kept in motion by an abundance of antibiotics?

 

[Price Dalton]

Well, I don't know if that's true about organic farms - the thing is in the US the government apparently doesn't measure the amount of pesticides used on organic farms - but

Interesting, thanks for that. It's important to note that both copper and sulfur are important nutrients for humans. The question is, then, does organic farming give us too much of both?

 

[Divvy]

Everyone seems fixated on pesticides, but I'm more concerned with meat and dairy and the antibiotics passed through the non-organic variants. We know continued exposure to antibiotcs lowers their efficacy when they are truly needed, and who wants to drink milk filled with puss from the inflamed, over-worked udder of a cow who's kept in motion by an abundance of antibiotics?

Well, there's non-organic meats that are also anti-biotic free as well. They're quite common in the supermarkets I go to.

 

[Freshmaker]

I was wondering if no chemicals are used, then how do farmers keep the bugs out? I don't want to pay a premium price if there aren't much benefits eating organic foods.

They still use chemicals. Sulfur is popular. Has to be reapplied a lot more tho.

 

[Disheveled_Zen]

While the base food is not overly different, the biggest factor comes into play with how they are grown/produced.

Take strawberries for instance, upwards of 60 different pesticides have been found on strawberries being sold in the US, and California is looking to pass a bill that would allow methyl iodide to be used as a pesticide. Methyl iodide is what is used in cancer research to actually give rats cancer because it easily binds to DNA. A Stanford study found upwards of an 81% less risk of running into harmful pesticides when eating organic vs non organic foods.

Organic grass feed cows that produce milk and meat are generally higher in omega and linoleic acids which help lower bad cholesterol. Also growth hormones have been linked to everything from cancer to overly early puberty in children. Hell it was only a few years ago that the FDA finally banned arsenic from being included inside animal feed compounds.

Of course simply eating organic foods isn't the end all and isn't going to automatically make you live to be 100 with 0 diseases, but if I have to pay a few extra dollars to keep a level of harmful toxic elements out of my body then I am ok with it. Really it's not even that expensive, I pick all mine up from Trader Joes at nearly the same price as I would any major food store.

 

[Defyler]

Under the FDA's umbrella term of "organic" fruits and and vegetables can still be sprayed with copper sulfate etc and retain their labeling. The definition of organic is fairly cheesy

 

[Kinitari]

Interesting, thanks for that. It's important to note that both copper and sulfur are important nutrients for humans. The question is, then, does organic farming give us too much of both?

I'm looking into it right now, the effects of organic vs inorganic specifically, in terms of environmental health this study talks about how organic had a stronger impact on the environment, because much more needed to be used.

This isn't a study or anything, so take it with a grain of salt, but it talks about the toxicity of organic pesticides.

 

[Dynamic3]

Well, there's non-organic meats that are also anti-biotic free as well. They're quite common in the supermarkets I go to.

Absolutely true, being organic simply goes a few steps further, especially (if it matters to you) for the treatment of the animals.

 

[Kinitari]

While the base food is not overly different, the biggest factor comes into play with how they are grown/produced.

Take strawberries for instance, upwards of 60 different pesticides have been found on strawberries being sold in the US, and California is looking to pass a bill that would allow methyl iodide to be used as a pesticide. Methyl iodide is what is used in cancer research to actually give rats cancer because it easily binds to DNA. A Stanford study found upwards of an 81% less risk of running into harmful pesticides when eating organic vs non organic foods.

Organic grass feed cows that produce milk and meat are generally higher in omega and linoleic acids which help lower bad cholesterol. Also growth hormones have been linked to everything from cancer to overly early puberty in children. Hell it was only a few years ago that the FDA finally banned arsenic from being included inside animal feed compounds.

Of course simply eating organic foods isn't the end all and isn't going to automatically make you live to be 100 with 0 diseases, but if I have to pay a few extra dollars to keep a level of harmful toxic elements out of my body then I am ok with it. Really it's not even that expensive, I pick all mine up from Trader Joes at nearly the same price as I would any major food store.

Is this the study?

The review yielded scant evidence that conventional foods posed greater health risks than organic products. While researchers found that organic produce had a 30 percent lower risk of pesticide contamination than conventional fruits and vegetables, organic foods are not necessarily 100 percent free of pesticides. What’s more, as the researchers noted, the pesticide levels of all foods generally fell within the allowable safety limits. Two studies of children consuming organic and conventional diets did find lower levels of pesticide residues in the urine of children on organic diets, though the significance of these findings on child health is unclear. Additionally, organic chicken and pork appeared to reduce exposure to antibiotic-resistant bacteria, but the clinical significance of this is also unclear.

See more at: http://med.stanford.edu/ism/2012/september/organic.html#sthash.pOUL9fZ7.dpuf

 

[cbrun44]

Really? I found the opposite to be true. Whole Foods was much more expensive but I didn't mind the cost since I loved the variety of organic foods available. Their meat section is incredible.

It's all about getting what they have on sale. Great sales that rotate all the time.

If blueberries are cheap one week and strawberries are expensive, I get the blueberries...

Same with meats.



If you literally stick to whole foods at Whole Foods, it's really not bad.

 

[Price Dalton]

I'm looking into it right now, the effects of organic vs inorganic specifically, in terms of environmental health this study talks about how organic had a stronger impact on the environment, because much more needed to be used.

This isn't a study or anything, so take it with a grain of salt, but it talks about the toxicity of organic pesticides.

Cool study, thanks. It makes a good point, that each chemical (organic or non-organic) must be judged separately on its own merits. Organophosphate pesticides in particular seem pretty bad, particularly for developing kids.

All in all, I think the evidence is pretty clear that organic produce is better for individuals eating the produce (more polyphenols). It's unclear whether it's better for the environment, though. Some evidence in favor, some against. Ultimately it comes down to what the individual farmer is actually doing, not what label he's got.

For anyone on the fence, I'd suggest buying local produce, preferably from farmer's markets. That allows you to talk to the farmers, whose operations are often smaller than the conventional and organic produce you find in grocery stores, which allows them to pay closer attention to soil quality and use non-chemical (organic or conventional) means to reduce pests. The result is better tasting, healthier, more antioxidant-rich produce. Often cheaper, too.

 

[cbrun44]

Ah, thanks. I hadn't finished reading the whole thread yet. I wanted to reply to the banana mentions as soon as I saw them.



What Whole Foods do you go to? hah

When I shopped at Whole Foods, they had quite excellent deals on local farmers. I would raid them of apples all the time. Local produce was super cheap. But organic -- holy heck was that expensive.

I don't stick 100% to organic with produce. Even, the non-organic produce at Whole Foods destroys the produce at Publix, Kroger, etc.

 

[Disheveled_Zen]

Is this the study?

Should have said based on the Stanford test as it was redone -

Putting aside whether pesticide “safety limits” are really safe, organic produce contains significantly lower residues than chemically grown produce. The Stanford researchers found a 30% "risk difference" between organic and conventional food. To the casual reader this sounds like organic foods carries a relatively unimpressive 30% lower risk of exposing you to pesticides – right?

Wrong, says Charles Benbrook. To arrive at the 30% number, the Stanford team used a statistical method that understates the true risk differential, he says. Crunching the authors’ raw numbers, Benbrook finds "an overall 81% lower risk or incidence of one or more pesticide residues in the organic samples compared to the conventional samples."

Moreover, he adds: “People should be concerned about pesticide health risk, not just the number of residues they are exposed to.” Benbrook notes "a 94% reduction in health risk" from pesticides when eating organic foods. This health risk is important during stages of life when humans are particularly vulnerable to the adverse effects of pesticides and animal drugs, for instance before and during pregnancy, through the first years of a child’s life, when battling a degenerative disease and after 60, Benbrook highlights. These individuals may be constrained in their ability to break down and clear pesticides from their bodies and/or deal with the toxic insult caused by the residues, he says.

Full study is here - http://www.tfrec.wsu.edu/pdfs/P2566.pdf

Also http://www.tandfonline.com/doi/abs/10.1080/07352689.2011.554417#preview helps shed some light on the math behind finding around a 12% increase in nutrients behind organic foods.

Really it just comes down to personal choice. Personally I feel that there is enough evidence supporting the choice to buy organic but of course it'll be different for everyone. I am lucky enough to live in an area where I can easily buy locally grown, which probably helps drive down the price for me.

 

[Az987]

Doesn't it depend on the fruit or vegetable?

I'm pretty sure they sometimes use different pesticides for different fruits and vegetables. Sometimes stronger pesticides are used on one fruit that aren't used on another.

For example, in 2010 California approved the use of methyl iodide as a pesticide for strawberries. It's been linked to cancer and they banned it in 2012.

 

[Kinitari]

It does seem the organics tend to consistently show a slight increase in nutritional value, except for that stanford meta study most studies I've read kind of show that - nothing crazy, but nothing insignificant at least.

I'm curious about it, and have to look into it more - it would be interesting to see how it all pans out. I'm not particularly convinced by the value of organic foods, but I wouldn't begrudge someone for preferring it based on the evidence available.

 

[greepoman]

This headline reminded me why all you people saying buy local have the right idea:

More frozen fruit recalled over hepatitis A outbreak

I remember from the original recall even though they were "organic" they were imported from other countries where the standards might not apply.

 

[dreamcastfan]

Well the idea that they "taste better" or "are better for you" is definitely not true, so in that regard they are a scam, yes.

I COMPLETELY disagree. I get organic meat from US wellness meats, and there is a WORLD of difference it the way it smells, tastes and the way it has made me feel since switching to it. The things they feed cows these days that you buy at the local grocer is sickening. I could go on and on about it, but it would take forever to type it all out.

 

[ClassyPenguin]

Yes. The nutritional advantage is so slight that it doesn't matter.

 

[Mdeezy]

I sometimes buy organic but I cant fill my frig with that stuff on a weekly basis due to money. I pretty much buy the same stuff every week anyway