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GAF Indie Game Development Thread 2: High Res Work for Low Res Pay

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Mine took a few months. MS took a few weeks and Sony was literally 1 week from 1st contact to Title approval. All were good experiences dealing with 3rd party relations, timing aside.

My time with Sony and Nintendo was the complete opposite.

Within a week of contacting Nintendo I was fully registered, while it took months with all the Sony paperwork. I did this back in 2013, so I wonder if they've changed or if it just shows it's pretty random.
 

GulAtiCa

Member
Cool!
Be sure you have both spanish, castillian spanish and neutral spanish (that is not really neutral as it uses different south american mannerisms) because its pretty different and one side doesnt usually like the other and viceversa.
Scribblenauts games on PC had a lot of problems with the language only being "neutral" spanish and people of Spain couldn't play the game well

Hmm. Well, my friend tutors in Latin America Spanish. Never really heard of castillian spanish before. Is it a big difference between Spain Spanish & Latin America Spanish? The game's text is mainly just menus & simple texts/etc. There is no story really (an arcade tower defense type game).

If you think it might help, I would be glad to have you help and make a castillian spanish version.
 

friken

Member
Getting excited..... StarDiver's first teaser trailer is being made. Few more revisions and I can't wait to share it with my fellow GAFers.

And in other news.... stardiver.com is now ours! My OCD can't handle not having a root level domain for a game and I didn't want to change the name, so happy we could purchase the domain for a nominal cost.
 

friken

Member
There are few things that feel worse than reviewers finding bugs. Oh well...I couldn't have delayed the game any longer...time to fix em!

I feel your pain. It seems anytime I go to show off StarDiver, I hit some new unexpected bug or oversight. Yep, all you can do is roll with it and fix it.
 
My time with Sony and Nintendo was the complete opposite.

Within a week of contacting Nintendo I was fully registered, while it took months with all the Sony paperwork. I did this back in 2013, so I wonder if they've changed or if it just shows it's pretty random.

I was sent an email from Sony letting me know when their new registration system was going live.

I was hitting F5 every few minutes. Quite sure if I wasn't first in queue i was in the top 5 XD
 
I was sent an email from Sony letting me know when their new registration system was going live.

I was hitting F5 every few minutes. Quite sure if I wasn't first in queue i was in the top 5 XD

I was told I couldn't work with Sony so long as I was a sole proprietorship. Going to get some stuff in order before I contact them again.
 

Blizzard

Banned
LLC and elect to file as an S. Best of both worlds.
My only issue with this is that if you elect to file as an S corporation to pay less self-employment tax, it gets a bit more complicated and I wasn't sure about the salary thing.

You have to pay yourself a "reasonable" salary (not too much, not too little), and if I'm going a year without making any money because I don't have a product out yet, or I sell only a few copies, I don't want the government going "OH HE SAYS HE'S A SOFTWARE ENGINEER AND THEY HAVE A HIGH AVERAGE SALARY" and assuming I'm lying. Also, since you're an "employee" in that case, I would assume some extra state requirements come into play, such as unemployment/reemployment fees/taxes/whatever.

You also have to do two income tax returns instead of just one (unlike the disregarded entity LLC case).
 

Jobbs

Banned
Getting excited..... StarDiver's first teaser trailer is being made. Few more revisions and I can't wait to share it with my fellow GAFers.

And in other news.... stardiver.com is now ours! My OCD can't handle not having a root level domain for a game and I didn't want to change the name, so happy we could purchase the domain for a nominal cost.

I tried to get oldmoon.com from the domain squatters and they asked $3400... I was more looking to pay 1/10 of that or less -- and so oldmoongames.com it is.

also tried to get ghostsong.com, which is being squatted as well, and no response.

the system so needs reform. everything is just being sat on and not used. it seems wrong.
 
My only issue with this is that if you elect to file as an S corporation to pay less self-employment tax, it gets a bit more complicated and I wasn't sure about the salary thing.

You have to pay yourself a "reasonable" salary (not too much, not too little), and if I'm going a year without making any money because I don't have a product out yet, or I sell only a few copies, I don't want the government going "OH HE SAYS HE'S A SOFTWARE ENGINEER AND THEY HAVE A HIGH AVERAGE SALARY" and assuming I'm lying. Also, since you're an "employee" in that case, I would assume some extra state requirements come into play, such as unemployment/reemployment fees/taxes/whatever.

You also have to do two income tax returns instead of just one (unlike the disregarded entity LLC case).
Gub doesn't lean on you for not being able to pay out if you have no earnings or not enough due to being a startup. If you make enough to pay a fair wage then you have to. If not, you don't and your earnings will reflect that.

There is more timekeeping with minutes and a separate filing but the money kept is well worth a couple of extra hours per year to run the numbers. I would, however, recommend not doing it until you need to. You can elect to file when the time is right for those kinds of savings. Its the most common setup for LLCs because of the money, hands down. Remaining disregarded is not a good choice if you make a decent earning, IMO. You will lose more than the ease of operating is worth by a mile. Pay a good accountant to file for you, if you don't want to spend the time or worry about errors, you will still be ahead of the game.

Like I said, best time to elect is when you will be making a good profit. Its not needed in the first year or two with nothing but losses or minor gains.

Just my .02
 

Blizzard

Banned
Gub doesn't lean on you for not being able to pay out if you have no earnings or not enough due to being a startup. If you make enough to pay a fair wage then you have to. If not, you don't and your earnings will reflect that.

There is more timekeeping with minutes and a separate filing but the money kept is well worth a couple of extra hours per year to run the numbers. I would, however, recommend not doing it until you need to. You can elect to file when the time is right for those kinds of savings. Its the most common setup for LLCs because of the money, hands down. Remaining disregarded is not a good choice if you make a decent earning, IMO. You will lose more than the ease of operating is worth by a mile. Pay a good accountant to file for you, if you don't want to spend the time or worry about errors, you will still be ahead of the game.

Like I said, best time to elect is when you will be making a good profit. Its not needed in the first year or two with nothing but losses or minor gains.

Just my .02
Thanks, and yeah that's the plan -- to stay disregarded for the next year or so, and if I end up making a decent profit, switch over to S corporation.
 
No. Just a store with our app for sale. I don't personally know how people pull APKs but I have seen it happen plenty of times with mobile games on Android.



I'm assuming this is another reason the market turned to free apps with IAP.



I was expecting it but not that quick. Sucks but there's not much I can do other than ask them to remove it. Most of those websites operate outside of the country so it is basically a lost cause.

Next time if I ever do mobile i go free with ADS or IAP. Which will be never.

that really sucks :( hope we can do something about those thieves! , burn em to hell?

due to that I am still thinking about pricing and distribution model, but no real answer yet
 

Pehesse

Member
As with every past week, here's a new character for screenshot saturday.

OrnateRelievedAlabamamapturtle.gif
(gif shouldn't be too big I hope, but if it is, I'll remove it and link the gfy only!)

The complete video's here, too: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_1f1v1Ruqu0

I've also fixed what was mentioned earlier about the background intro slide, it's now faster and there are no more standing sliding character issues I could find so far - I'll have to check back through every event to verify it's actually completely working, though!
 
Hmm. Well, my friend tutors in Latin America Spanish. Never really heard of castillian spanish before. Is it a big difference between Spain Spanish & Latin America Spanish? The game's text is mainly just menus & simple texts/etc. There is no story really (an arcade tower defense type game).

If you think it might help, I would be glad to have you help and make a castillian spanish version.

Usually when you write character yes, theres a big change in the way they talk. But for menus and things like that, usually they use the same words. And I mean usually, because there are times they change (like Spain calling Ordenador to a computer while latin american calls it Computadora, etc...).

If you want I can take a look to your english text and latin american spanish text and only change (if theres need) the words that are different so you can have another language (more options is always great). Im glad to help in these things, so its not a problem with me.
 

The Real Abed

Perma-Junior
A little disappointed there isn't a mention of Löve2d in the OP. It's a pretty capable game development tool based on Lua and it deserves some attention. I'm developing my own game with it actually.
 
New shot of more buildings finished for screenshot saturday. Little by little, the hub town is getting finished. I also started elevating the sidewalk (it was going to be flat at the biggining, becuase the pixel artist and me think it looks much better like this). Hoping me and the programmer can think how to do the wind waker type water today.

As with every past week, here's a new character for screenshot saturday.

OrnateRelievedAlabamamapturtle.gif
(gif shouldn't be too big I hope, but if it is, I'll remove it and link the gfy only!)

The complete video's here, too: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_1f1v1Ruqu0

I've also fixed what was mentioned earlier about the background intro slide, it's now faster and there are no more standing sliding character issues I could find so far - I'll have to check back through every event to verify it's actually completely working, though!

Oh my, now it looks PERFECT without the character sliding. Good job, Pehesse!
Love how the word of the location enter with the waving animation.
 

anteevy

Member
I've gotten quite far with my rhythm-based ball rolling game Roll Playing Game in the past few months. It's fun to read the game design document from a year ago and see how it all turned out.

The jump from Unity Free to UE4 really payed off. I'm going to put together a first teaser trailer as well as a small website in the next weeks and then maybe put it on Greenlight.

RPG1s.jpg

RPG2s.jpg

RPG3s.jpg

RPG4s.jpg
 

Blizzard

Banned
A little disappointed there isn't a mention of Löve2d in the OP. It's a pretty capable game development tool based on Lua and it deserves some attention. I'm developing my own game with it actually.
The OP is based on suggestions offered from people in the thread, after suggestions were asked for. If you PM the OP it might be added! Any additional links or details you can provide about it for the OP (such as positives and negatives of choosing it) would be helpful.
 
Thanks, and for pointing it out in the first place, too! :-D

No biggie, your game looks amazing (im a sucker for simulation jobs like being a athlete of some sport, with character interactions of visual novel and stats) and im going to buy it in a heartbeat. I always wanted to do a game like that and have something similar in my mind for the far future.
 

mooooose

Member
I've gotten quite far with my rhythm-based ball rolling game Roll Playing Game in the past few months. It's fun to read the game design document from a year ago and see how it all turned out.

The jump from Unity Free to UE4 really payed off. I'm going to put together a first teaser trailer as well as a small website in the next weeks and then maybe put it on Greenlight.
This game looks beautiful. What benefits did you see when you jumped from Unity to UE4?
 

bumpkin

Member
Ugh... Who knew writers block could happen with programming?

I'm at that point where there's nothing simple or fun to do. I have the basics working like a character on screen that you can make it do stuff with the keyboard (or a controller), "enemies" trolling around that you can kill, even got an item drop happening when they die. But now it's down to the brass placeholder tacks.
 

The Real Abed

Perma-Junior
Ugh... Who knew writers block could happen with programming?
Every programmer who ever lived.

Eventually you get to that point where the inspiration has dried up and you can't figure out where to go from here because the only major stuff left to do is implement features and fix bugs you really don't want to do right now so you end up constantly testing your game/app over and over trying to find that inspiration and motivation.

At that point I just go and play some Minecraft or another game until the inspiration hits me again.
 
Ugh... Who knew writers block could happen with programming?

I'm at that point where there's nothing simple or fun to do. I have the basics working like a character on screen that you can make it do stuff with the keyboard (or a controller), "enemies" trolling around that you can kill, even got an item drop happening when they die. But now it's down to the brass placeholder tacks.

Pish posh. There's nothing fun about the simple stuff. It's slamming your face off of your desk implementing the seemingly impossible that makes you all warm and fuzzy inside (or cold and stiff from the hemorrhaging of your face from all that slamming).
 

anteevy

Member
This game looks beautiful. What benefits did you see when you jumped from Unity to UE4?
Thanks!

The benefits for this game in particular were mostly on the graphics side. Much better material/shader/lighting/particle/camera effects options available than in Unity Free. I'm no artist, the game maybe has like 10 (really simple) static meshes and 5 (even simpler) textures, but with the UE4 tools (material editor etc.) I was able to put together a graphics style I'm quite happy with. :)

I'm sure much of this can be done with some Unity Free Plug-Ins or Unity Pro, but with UE4 I have that all out of the box and (as a student) without any costs (at least until I sell it, then there's the 5% share).
 

friken

Member
Hi all. I would love feedback on our first teaser video for StarDiver. We have time for a couple revision passes before GDC, so please give us any and all feeback. Don't hold back. What to you like, dislike, think needs revision? Help us make it the best we can before getting it out there.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DXu2M6Gg0gI
 
Hi all. I would love feedback on our first teaser video for StarDiver. We have time for a couple revision passes before GDC, so please give us any and all feeback. Don't hold back. What to you like, dislike, think needs revision? Help us make it the best we can before getting it out there.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DXu2M6Gg0gI

For the cuts to the concept art in the start of the video I think it would be better, for the one where the camera pans over them, to have the movement already happening when the transition happens. Looks a bit odd to cut to the art, have it hang for a half a second then have the movement start.
 
Hi all. I would love feedback on our first teaser video for StarDiver. We have time for a couple revision passes before GDC, so please give us any and all feeback. Don't hold back. What to you like, dislike, think needs revision? Help us make it the best we can before getting it out there.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DXu2M6Gg0gI

Looks good! lots of features mentioned but something I feel is missing, something that can glue the whole trailer, I don't know if you have seen the initial galactic princess trailer, keep you interested but not giving too much, probably for me, those trailers that have some context or story make me wonder more and get more my attention, like darkest dungeon as another example. I feel it looks like more like a tech trailer showing up what you have, but maybe making people to wonder more will excite them more.

Anyway, keep the good work!

Screenshot saturday, got my shuttle on a planet now and my crew started exploring, somehow after walking a little bit on the planet I got lost haha! I couldn't find my shuttle to get back but I was lucky that another crew member was still inside the shuttle and help me get the others back, I need to think now if I should add some way to easily return back to my ship or allow the player to get lost and maybe use something to get back...

ExploringAPlanett.png
 

friken

Member
For the cuts to the concept art in the start of the video I think it would be better, for the one where the camera pans over them, to have the movement already happening when the transition happens. Looks a bit odd to cut to the art, have it hang for a half a second then have the movement start.

Good eye. Absinthe caught that too. added to revision list, thanks!



Looks good! lots of features mentioned but something I feel is missing, something that can glue the whole trailer...
Anyway, keep the good work!

ExploringAPlanett.png

Can you describe what you think would help not feel like something is missing? I will watch those other trailers. I have to admit it is difficult to decide what to show and what not to, while at the same time not having all the parts complete that I would love to show (ship upgrades, planet roving. etc).


and nice screensot. Looking fun as always.
 

bumpkin

Member
Pish posh. There's nothing fun about the simple stuff. It's slamming your face off of your desk implementing the seemingly impossible that makes you all warm and fuzzy inside (or cold and stiff from the hemorrhaging of your face from all that slamming).
heheh. I just meant the sort of stuff that doesn't take more than an hour or two to implement but is damn cool. You know, little shit like making an item drop after an enemy plays his death animation.
 
Good eye. Absinthe caught that too. added to revision list, thanks!

I don't know if it's the best way to include it but maybe include the player choosing a response in one of the first alien dialogue clips. Good way to make sure folk watching understand that those scenes aren't entirely passive.
 

friken

Member
I don't know if it's the best way to include it but maybe include the player choosing a response in one of the first alien dialogue clips. Good way to make sure folk watching understand that those scenes aren't entirely passive.

Good idea.... I didn't even consider that it may not be obvious that all the dialogue is interactive. Thanks.

Assuming revisions, is the teaser good? Do you think it will get people excited about the project? 1-10 rating of it assuming revisions you suggest?
 
Good eye. Absinthe caught that too. added to revision list, thanks!





Can you describe what you think would help not feel like something is missing? I will watch those other trailers. I have to admit it is difficult to decide what to show and what not to, while at the same time not having all the parts complete that I would love to show (ship upgrades, planet roving. etc).


and nice screensot. Looking fun as always.

I just watched a couple of times, now I think what may help you.

1- there are two parts in your trailer because the music stops in the middle, that makes me feel that there is a disconnection between the first part and the second when the music starts again, the pace is broken for me

2- when you start the second part with the cloud blue planet, I don't feel there is anything special to see there, there is no connection, I feel like you are showing different parts of your game but there is no cohesion, planets are nice, but usually people do not look at them that much in a trailer unless you show up the main actor of your game arriving from hyperspace for example, so you understand ah! I am getting there...

3- I like how it starts, but the pace is quite strange by the end, but once you go into the second part saying save the universe..etc.. the pace turns strange when you start showing all the other races and no words?, I am not quite sure how to tell you but makes me feel awkward. :) maybe when you say in the first part befriend or survive hostile races you can show up some quick clip of the others? so you don't really know who are the good / bad ones, that leaves people to think and explore for later

4- gameplay is important to show, so people understand about your game, how you show it is up to you, but sometimes showing up some close ups to make your ships look more awesome makes bigger impact, there are just only very few portions in which I can see the ships, most of the other parts are from far away so it is difficult to see the ship, for you game I feel that your ship is the main actor, so show it in a glorious way.

Well these are my personal opinions and hope some of them help you, your game looks very good and I am looking to play it :)
 

friken

Member
I just watched a couple of times, now I think what may help you.

1- there are two parts in your trailer because the music stops in the middle, that makes me feel that there is a disconnection between the first part and the second when the music starts again, the pace is broken for me

2- when you start the second part with the cloud blue planet, I don't feel there is anything special to see there, there is no connection, I feel like you are showing different parts of your game but there is no cohesion, planets are nice, but usually people do not look at them that much in a trailer unless you show up the main actor of your game arriving from hyperspace for example, so you understand ah! I am getting there...

3- I like how it starts, but the pace is quite strange by the end, but once you go into the second part saying save the universe..etc.. the pace turns strange when you start showing all the other races and no words?, I am not quite sure how to tell you but makes me feel awkward. :) maybe when you say in the first part befriend or survive hostile races you can show up some quick clip of the others? so you don't really know who are the good / bad ones, that leaves people to think and explore for later

4- gameplay is important to show, so people understand about your game, how you show it is up to you, but sometimes showing up some close ups to make your ships look more awesome makes bigger impact, there are just only very few portions in which I can see the ships, most of the other parts are from far away so it is difficult to see the ship, for you game I feel that your ship is the main actor, so show it in a glorious way.

Well these are my personal opinions and hope some of them help you, your game looks very good and I am looking to play it :)

Great points, thanks for expanding.
 

friken

Member
One more thing, take a look at this one https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F5O8Al-mPhk

it is galactic princess, the trailer is good for me, but this version is the extended one with all the previous ones into one big one, the first part makes you wonder, and the second part show you the gameplay , in general that one makes you want to see more of it.

I saw a shorter version a while back, agreed -- great stuff. The one you pasted, while good, is quite long for what we are wanting to put out there at this stage of dev. I found myself wanting to skip through a lot of it. I would assume their game is near completion?

I am finding it hard to decide when during dev we have 'enough' for a reasonable teaser. Have you made a teaser for junkyard yet? If so/not at what stage of dev?
 
I was intimidated about getting into collision seriously and reached out to a Unity Developer. He gave me some great resources that are really gonna revolutionize my workflow.

This UnityWiki is a repository of information that run the gamut of Unity 3d's various aspects including but not limited to scripts, programming, particle library and shaders, tutorials, tips and tricks. In all my hours of googling I never came across it and just wanted to share because I thought it was an amazing repository. Any one interested in picking up the engine should definitely give it a look.

I learn so much faster with examples so being able to drag and drop and reverse engineer some of this stuff has been really helpful.

This Tutorial is helping me learn to edit the editor so that I can start creating custom windows and workflows more like the more polished assets in the store. I hope this info can do as much for you guys as it's done for me.
 

Roubjon

Member
I'm so happy that Olympia Rising is almost completed. It's taken much longer than anticipated but that's because I've had to revamp and redo and restructure a fuck ton of shitty code.

All I need to do now is finish creating the sound effects and then do some play testing and bug fixing. I'm so ridiculously excited not only to finally be finished with the game, but also so I can start working on something else.
 
I'm so happy that Olympia Rising is almost completed. It's taken much longer than anticipated but that's because I've had to revamp and redo and restructure a fuck ton of shitty code.

All I need to do now is finish creating the sound effects and then do some play testing and bug fixing. I'm so ridiculously excited not only to finally be finished with the game, but also so I can start working on something else.

Looking forward to this one. Good luck hunting bugs!
 

Turfster

Member
Hi all. I would love feedback on our first teaser video for StarDiver. We have time for a couple revision passes before GDC, so please give us any and all feeback. Don't hold back. What to you like, dislike, think needs revision? Help us make it the best we can before getting it out there.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DXu2M6Gg0gI

Looks great.
Is there any way you can bridge the different tracks slightly better than the fade at 45ish seconds in? That's about the only thing that didn't really work for me.
(Also, maybe put the "come closer, learn the truth" at the start of the trailer? Just a thought.)
(Also, I'm pretty sure love letter is 2 words...)
(Now that I think about it, maybe you can overlay the static black with white text screen over the images of the aliens that currently have no text... or pull them *into* the trailer somehow anyway.)

Now for my "wtf Unreal", which has replaced my usual "wtf Unity" shtick:
When importing an FBX with uniform scaling set to anything besides 1, it seems that... rotations also get scaled in the bind pose, for some reason.
Import a mesh at scale 10, and if you want to rotate something in the bind pose 90 degrees, you've only done 9 degrees by the time you've dragged the gizmo a quarter of a circle, so you need to basically do 2.5 circles to get your 90 degree change.
I cannot for the life of me wrap my head around why this would be the case, since a degree is a degree. It's not because your mesh vertices and bone offsets are further apart due to the scaling, that the meaning of a degree changes too, right?

Edit: Hrm, it could be a perfect storm of Blender's broken-yet-again FBX exporter too...
 
Hi all. I would love feedback on our first teaser video for StarDiver. We have time for a couple revision passes before GDC, so please give us any and all feeback. Don't hold back. What to you like, dislike, think needs revision? Help us make it the best we can before getting it out there.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DXu2M6Gg0gI

I really like the opening quote, but it has a completely different feel than the rest of the trailer. Since the quote really only works if it's before you show aliens, I think it'd be best to just cut the first 6 seconds completely. Jump right into "An Epic Space Opera..."

Also at 16 seconds the transition from 3D planet to the alien is bad. It doesn't flow well. You could help this by at 15 seconds doing the same transition as the three before, the fade to black then quick cut in. Also slightly speed up the fade transition itself. I think that would help this little hiccup area and keep the same tone you're going for.

As mentioned the lack of sound around 46 seconds kinda makes that an awkward transition as well. It starts out feeling like it's the end of the trailer. If you extend the first music track so it fades out as the new one just begins, it might work better.
 
I saw a shorter version a while back, agreed -- great stuff. The one you pasted, while good, is quite long for what we are wanting to put out there at this stage of dev. I found myself wanting to skip through a lot of it. I would assume their game is near completion?

I am finding it hard to decide when during dev we have 'enough' for a reasonable teaser. Have you made a teaser for junkyard yet? If so/not at what stage of dev?

well a teaser I think should be like 20 to 60 seconds from my point of view, that trailer is quite long but the original one is ok, and I think they are far from a complete game, so far, from what I read a few months ago they have just few system modules enabled and knowing how much time it takes to do that I think they may need a year or more to get it finished, since I am doing something similar and now implementing planets and cities I really need to think more about procedural cities.

I don't have a trailer yet, just a few movies trying/testing things and I think I am maybe at 20% of my game? I really don't know yet since I keep adding more and more things every day, but once I have a few more things running (like smooth transitions between screens) I will make a trailer, that's a good point! I haven't though about it until you asked.
 

Barryman

Member
Couple of GIFs since the last time I posted:

1423896482633

1424565897840


We're finally starting to shoot the live action that the character animations are based on, which is super exciting and means that I have started putting together assets for the actual game, not just temp stuff.

I'm hoping to put together a vertical slice within the next few weeks and start testing it...
 
I've been recovering from surgery so I haven't been able to post here / or work much on my game. But I am basically better now and worked a bit on testing out different textures/tilesets I want to use for levels. Here they are.


EDIT: 2 more pics, don't mind the framerate, it is high it just went down for the split second I took the screenshot

 
Couple of GIFs since the last time I posted:

1423896482633

1424565897840


We're finally starting to shoot the live action that the character animations are based on, which is super exciting and means that I have started putting together assets for the actual game, not just temp stuff.

I'm hoping to put together a vertical slice within the next few weeks and start testing it...

I *love* these. She seems so alive.

In other news...

I just e-mailed in my pitch for a UE4 grant from Epic. *gulp*. Fingers tightly crossed. A budget could do a lot for my little game.
 
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