Phoenician_Viking
Banned
I just caught up. It´s really great. Having not read the books, i have to say Geoffrey and the short guy are really making the show great.
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Game of Thrones - Season 2 - George RR Martin's Song of Ice and Fire - Sundays on HBO
- Thread starter Cornballer
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That was bad last night.
Catelyn and Bryen were overacting horrible dialogue. Littlefingers dialogue was also horrible. Danny's acting looked like Jake floyd in Episode 1. The Renly seen looked like shit and the Arya scenes were boring.
A disaster of an episode.
Catelyn and Bryen were overacting horrible dialogue. Littlefingers dialogue was also horrible. Danny's acting looked like Jake floyd in Episode 1. The Renly seen looked like shit and the Arya scenes were boring.
A disaster of an episode.
Basileus777
Member
ASOS stuff.
The whole scene hinted at it, including all the talk about how they need to do something because they can't beat Robb on the field. It's not very subtle if you've read the books.
Lol'ed.
Anyways, the changes from the books are really starting to get to me now. Why didn't Renly get his throat slit? Why didn't he say "cold" before it happened? I mean, sure they're small changes but I don't understand why they couldn't even follow that...
But my biggest problem is the fact that there is no foreshadowing or any mysteries going on (like they showing Melisandre birthing the shadow that kills Renly when that was supposed to be a mystery until we actually found out that she was the one that did it). They skip so much right now (Tickler, anyone? That's major right there) that it feels like everything is blazing on at 110 mph, but at the same time the important characters only get 5 mins of screen time per episode.
Buckethead
Banned
Doreah is incredibly attractive.
That is all.
That is all.
Basileus777
Member
It's probably easier on the budget. Less make-up, they don't have to worry about making an open throat look right. The direction in that scene was a bit lacking, but I don't think the method of murder was the issue.
Emerson
May contain jokes =>
To be fair last night you could see one of them (the green one, can't remember which) in the box as Drogon was being put away.
You're right, they are insanely small changes and could not possibly matter any less. If you approach this show this way you will never be satisfied. Seriously it's in your best interest to just relax, watch the show, and enjoy it for what it is.
They could've done Renly's death so much better. The shadow assassin should not have been the cheesy CGI Venom looking thing that we got. It should have always just been a shadow that moved along the ground and walls.
That way they could've gotten great use out of the really prominent shadows in Renly's last scene.
That way they could've gotten great use out of the really prominent shadows in Renly's last scene.
I was disappointed in the wildfire scene. The pyromancer had a very important line in the book that was omitted. He mentioned that it had become easier to create wildfire, that the output was speeding up, and he didn't know why. It was actual verbalization that something had changed - another sign that magic was returning to Westeros. The reappearance of the walkers, the stirrings and rumors of giants and other things north of the wall, the ever present red comet (which has been totally de-emphasized in the show for some unknown reason), Melissandre and her shadow baby, Bran's visions and his connection to his wolf, and the birth of Dany's dragons.
The show is pretty good at telling the stories of the individual characters from the book, but they've done a poor job of presenting the big picture.
The show is pretty good at telling the stories of the individual characters from the book, but they've done a poor job of presenting the big picture.
All wrong with the exception of Renly's scene. You suck.
For what its worth...
she makes the same mistake in the books...I remember a passage where she suddenly considers how wasted her choices were. She remembers Tywin, Cersei, and others but she was lost in her own world to think of the larger context. The difference is that in the books she has no direct contact with Tywin and her role as cup bearer was with Roose Bolton.
I agree with you though...It's a big hole that they dug even deeper when they wrote in the scene her line to Tywin that "anybody can die".
I agree with you though...It's a big hole that they dug even deeper when they wrote in the scene her line to Tywin that "anybody can die".
Because he didn't get his throat slit? Wasn't he split from neck to groin? With that in mind, I understand the decision.
I kinda agree about the rest tho.
Infinite_Daremo
Member
Everything happens so suddenly and without warning. Both major deaths
both seemed to come out of nowhere. Its got to the point now where im expecting every major character who you think is the crux of the entire series is going to be killed instantly.
Amazing episode though. I hadnt even realised how much time had passed when the credits rolled.
Renly and Ned Stark
Amazing episode though. I hadnt even realised how much time had passed when the credits rolled.
It looked like she was a walking ice cream cone. Just cut and paste Natalie Dormer's head and shoulders into this:
Renly's death was disappointing.
Here's how I would have done it: Have Renly sort of freeze up, maybe frown a bit. The wind blows in, candles gutter. A shot of the tents entrance. Then we return to Renly who now looks frightened. A cut slowly appears across his throat, blood spurts etc. Then the shadow man appears out of thin air, hand pulling the shadow knife away from Renly's throat. It disappears just as quick and Renly collapses.
Other than that and a few scenes with irritating dialogue (Tyrion and Cersei, Daenerys and... everyone, Theon and crew), I enjoyed this ep.
Nth of the wall, Arya and Pyat Pree were awesome.
Here's how I would have done it: Have Renly sort of freeze up, maybe frown a bit. The wind blows in, candles gutter. A shot of the tents entrance. Then we return to Renly who now looks frightened. A cut slowly appears across his throat, blood spurts etc. Then the shadow man appears out of thin air, hand pulling the shadow knife away from Renly's throat. It disappears just as quick and Renly collapses.
Other than that and a few scenes with irritating dialogue (Tyrion and Cersei, Daenerys and... everyone, Theon and crew), I enjoyed this ep.
Nth of the wall, Arya and Pyat Pree were awesome.
Harry Potter
Banned
The Reeds may still appear. I recall reading an interview with Benioff and Weiss about how S2 just introduced too many characters that they had to push some of the introductions to S3. (ACOK)
And I don't think it makes too much of a difference if Bran meets up with the Reeds after he's fled Winterfell, or while still there. I think I'm more upset that they haven't casted Reek, afaik.
Also, regarding Jon's storyline (ACOK question)
Are they speeding up his story, cause I thought he doesn't meet up with Ygritte until the very end of CoK? Maybe they'll also include the prologue from SOS this season in the finale
Ned's death definitely didn't come suddenly, there was a lot of set-up for that.
If there's one major death that came without a warning, it's Robert.
John Dunbar
correct about everything
I don't think so, I'm pretty sure Renly got his throat slit. I recall Loras even saying that he tried to cut through a gorget like whatever it was that killed Renly had done and couldn't do it.
Cornballer
Member
Content roundup:
Reviews:
- Onion A|V Club
- Sepinwall
- Televisionary
- WiC.net
- memles
- Maureen Ryan
- Westeros.org
- EW.com
- Poniewozik
- Grantland
- NY Magazine
- The Atlantic
- Alyssa Rosenberg @ Think Progress
- Rolling Stone
- OtakuASSEMBLE
HBO vids:
- Inside the Episode
- Preview for next week's episode (youtube, please spoiler tag any discussion)
Reviews:
- Onion A|V Club
- Sepinwall
- Televisionary
- WiC.net
- memles
- Maureen Ryan
- Westeros.org
- EW.com
- Poniewozik
- Grantland
- NY Magazine
- The Atlantic
- Alyssa Rosenberg @ Think Progress
- Rolling Stone
- OtakuASSEMBLE
HBO vids:
- Inside the Episode
- Preview for next week's episode (youtube, please spoiler tag any discussion)
This needs descending sunglasses and then the words "deal with it".
Emerson
May contain jokes =>
There's still no evidence that Joffrey had her killed, and it certainly seems less likely considering no big deal was made of the situation.
Basileus777
Member
Imaginations have run wild with this. There's nothing to suggest anything more was done to her than being beaten with that rod. Tyrion's reaction makes it pretty likely there was no rape or murder.
Starting to think that reading the books has ruined the show for me. Reading the no spoiler thread and seeing the positive impressions of this episode has made me realise that I've completely lost touch with the tv viewer's perspective.
I'm just not able to shake off the deviations even when I can rationalise that it's a budgetary thing. For example, I know they can't afford to cast the first guy Arya has killed because he's nobody and it would have no impact on the tv audience, but this doesn't change the fact that its removes the possibility of (ASOS)
. A while back in this thread someone jokingly said Arya needs her own show, but I actually think that'd be the only way to do her story any justice.
It just seems like the scenes I like and dislike directly correlate to how closely they follow the book. Not something I'm happy about just to be clear, just something I don't seem to be able to help; GoT was my favorite show last year but now my excitement for the series is dwindling rapidly
I'm just not able to shake off the deviations even when I can rationalise that it's a budgetary thing. For example, I know they can't afford to cast the first guy Arya has killed because he's nobody and it would have no impact on the tv audience, but this doesn't change the fact that its removes the possibility of (ASOS)
perhaps her best scene in the series
It just seems like the scenes I like and dislike directly correlate to how closely they follow the book. Not something I'm happy about just to be clear, just something I don't seem to be able to help; GoT was my favorite show last year but now my excitement for the series is dwindling rapidly
(ACOK)
Well they have sped up Jon's story because he has had a lot cut. However he meets Ygritte after he climbs up that cliff face and attacks the wilding sentries, he captures her and is ordered to kill her but he lets her live. Then at the end of the book she is with Rattleshirt when Jon kills Halfhand.
Emerson
May contain jokes =>
Starting to think that reading the books has ruined the show for me. Reading the no spoiler thread and seeing the positive impressions of this episode has made me realise that I've completely lost touch with the tv viewer's perspective.
I'm just not able to shake off the deviations even when I can rationalise that it's a budgetary thing. For example, I know they can't afford to cast the first guy Arya has killed because he's nobody and it would have no impact on the tv audience, but this doesn't change the fact that its removes the possibility of (ASOS). A while back in this thread someone jokingly said Arya needs her own show, but I actually think that'd be the only way to do her story any justice.perhaps her best scene in the series
It just seems like the scenes I like and dislike directly correlate to how closely they follow the book. Not something I'm happy about just to be clear, just something I don't seem to be able to help; GoT was my favorite show last year but now my excitement for the series is dwindling rapidly
Did you read the books before season 1 or between seasons?
We had a little bit of this last season but a whole hell of a lot less of it than we're having now. It seems like a lot of initial show-only people read the books and are now too attached to them to handle any changes. It seems to me that the long-time book readers are less commonly upset about the adaptation changes.
fallengorn
Bitches love smiley faces
Thought that was a good episode. Renly's death was abrupt, but that seems to be a trend this season. (Like Rodrik's first scene at Winterfell... at least they mentioned he was going back a few episodes ago.)
After watching this week's Inside the Episode, somehow got the idea in my head of Littlefinger talking in the third-person... which would be hilarious.
"Littlefinger does what Littlefinger wants to do and right now it's Littlefinger talking to you, not Stannis."
After watching this week's Inside the Episode, somehow got the idea in my head of Littlefinger talking in the third-person... which would be hilarious.
"Littlefinger does what Littlefinger wants to do and right now it's Littlefinger talking to you, not Stannis."
IAmtheFMan
Member
Yeah, I've noticed this too.
Outdoor Miner
Member
The show is really starting to suffer because of the 10 episode limit. Thank god they're splitting ASoS into 2 seasons.
Infinite_Daremo
Member
I just made the typical assumption that big name and early introduced characters are important to the entire story line. I should have just assumed its Sean Bean he's going to die again, I just didn't expect it so soon.
Everything has came as a surprise to me. Its a nice change to the usual, "hes going to die" and being right.
For me it's been so long since I've read the book that I don't remember all the details or specific scenes too well. That makes it much easier to separate the book and show from each other and just enjoy the ride.
Basileus777
Member
Agreed. I'm assuming she was well compensated for the torture too considering what he gave the hooker who was just there for that one guy's arrest.
I liked the story progression this episode and loved the Stannis parts as well as the Arya parts (Although I am surprised Tywin has not pieced together that his cupbearer is Arya unless he doesn't know she's missing).
However, I felt my hand was being held the whole time. The Renly death was incredibly predictable down to knowing Brienne &/or Cat would be framed for it. Renly should have had the equivalent of his attorneys in there with him, so the meeting alone with Cat (After it was clear why she was there) seemed to lend itself to a convenient shadow baby assassin murder.
COK Spoilers
The silent sisters, the ones that brought in Ned's bones in the show, are tasked with taking them back to Winterfell in the book.
Ned's death came as a huge shock to me because somewhere along the line I had misunderstood what ASoIaF was about. I had thought it was about Ned being on the iron throne, a position he never wanted, after Robert's death. I thought it was about him trying to hold the Seven Kingdoms together while dealing with Lannister treachery, the impending winter, the reappeared white walkers, his own family, and who knows what else. I thought the first book was supposed to be the setup for how he ended up on the throne. Imagine my shock, LOL.
BTW I still think the above would make for a good series of its own, though obviously set in its own world with its own characters.
BTW I still think the above would make for a good series of its own, though obviously set in its own world with its own characters.
I had to rewind Brienne destroying those guards multiple times because it was so fucking awesome/awkward at the same time.
Awesome because she destroyed them handily, but awkward because her movements are mechanical. But she's an awkward to begin with so it really fits in so perfectly.
Awesome because she destroyed them handily, but awkward because her movements are mechanical. But she's an awkward to begin with so it really fits in so perfectly.
Basileus777
Member
I'm talking about the show, I know what happens in the book.
I enjoyed the episode. Renly's death was handled well. I would have preferred that they stuck closer to the book but t didn't differ that much so I'm okay with it. I liked Theon's scene at the docks. It's crazy how much more enjoyable he is one the show compared to how he was in ACOK...
Love how Bronn's getting more lines. Rickon smashing the nuts... Lol. The Daenery's stuff has been kind of disappointing. Pyat looked pretty close to what I imagined... Total creep. Quaithe on the other hand looks retarded. All they had to do was to give her something to cover her face. Who the hell designed that? The Arya stuff was good in this episode. Jaqen fucking rules. The only thing that bothered me with the Arya stuff in this episode was once again the lack of violence. I felt the Harrenhal chapters were tense since she was caught in the middle of a very violent/sadistic group of people, and yet I don't get any sense of that in this episode.
My biggest problem with the episode was discovering that Meera and Jojen were gone. The writing was on the wall but fuck it blows. I loved those two characters. Big part of the reason why I've enjoyed the Bran chapters. Without them
I love the Theon stuff in ADWD.
My biggest problem with the episode was discovering that Meera and Jojen were gone. The writing was on the wall but fuck it blows. I loved those two characters. Big part of the reason why I've enjoyed the Bran chapters. Without them
he has no one to relate to with his family either dead or gone along with everyone at Winterfell. Can't really have much of a companion in Hodor... I guess they won't split Rickon and Osha from Bran and Hodor now. That may not be bad since it would make Rickon somwhat more relevant.
Emerson
May contain jokes =>
series
I'd assume the bones were left there which would kind of put them out in the ether, sort of how they are in the books. They'd pretty much be free to have them turn up wherever later down the line.
Yeah, I picked up the books straight after watching the season 1 finale. Personally though I would have thought people who's first exposure to the story was through the tv show would be more tolerant of changes. It might just be that people like myself have read all of the books within the last year so everything is still very fresh in our minds.
Cornballer
Member
Did anyone watch the HBO Go "Interactive Feature" with this episode? Supposedly they shot the Renly death differently the first time around, then it was changed for one reason or another. Westeros.org was discussing it in his twitter timeline.
Might be worth a quick look for anyone that has HBO Go set up.Westerosorg said:
Count of Monte Sawed-Off
un33dab@dpu$$y
The Silent Sisters take them to Winterfell, not Catelyn. ACOK
Of course it's likely that by the time they get there, it's possible Theon will have already taken the place. But it's more likely they will be forgotten, just like in the book.
It's as Emerson said. The first season I had a tough time adjusting. For about half the season I had to watch each episode twice to appreciate it. The first time through I was just bitching to myself at everything that was changed and how quickly it was all going. With that out of the way on my initial viewing I appreciated my second viewing more. I adjusted. This season changes and other stuff don't bother me at all, minus a few things.
I'd be really interested to know why they changed the Renly's death. The version they ran with was weak.
They changed the dynamic with Tywin's arrival. He doesn't put up with his soldiers being violent in his presence. (series spoiler)
he sends the mountain and others out to rape and pillage where he can't see them, though that hasn't happened yet on the show
Emerson
May contain jokes =>
I'm sure that has something to do with it. Then again, there are a fair number of people like me who read the books in the month or so prior to the show airing. I read them all in 2011 and the events are very clear in my head as well, I'm just able to enjoy an adaptation without having to contrast it with the books. But I never had an issue with other big adaptations like LOTR or Harry Potter either.
Outdoor Miner
Member
I imagined it would have been the shadow baby slithering into the tent bringing with it a gust of wind that blows out all the candles save for one so you could see Cat and Brienne's reactions. Followed by a shot of Renly looking in the mirror with the shadow image now rising behind him and proceeding to slit his throat, ear to ear.
Damn. That sounds much better than what we got. I knew they had those really prominent shadows in that scene for a reason.
Basileus777
Member
The silent sisters weren't shown were they? Anyone who hasn't read the books will just think Ned's bones were abandoned.
I don't think he's against violence, just unproductive violence.
Reaving the Riverlands serves a useful military and political purpose, torturing random peasants doesn't.
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