-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
Game of Thrones *Tagged Book Spoilers, Please Read OP* |OT| Season 3 - Sundays on HBO
- Thread starter Steelyuhas
- Start date
- Status
Right when Daenarys asked if the deal was done, I started getting pumped up because I finally realized her plan. I suppose I should have seen it coming way sooner, but apparently I'm an idiot.
When we've seen how completely programmed the Unsullied are, (the slaver cut one's nipple off just to demonstrate this, and he didn't even flinch) is it realistic to think they'd toss aside their purpose, as slaves, so quickly? To disregard the golden whip so quickly? I guess it's not neat and tidy for TV, but I found myself wondering if the unprogramming of the Unsullied in the span of 30 seconds was completely believable or not. It didn't decrease my enjoyment of what happened, but I did find myself wondering.
When we've seen how completely programmed the Unsullied are, (the slaver cut one's nipple off just to demonstrate this, and he didn't even flinch) is it realistic to think they'd toss aside their purpose, as slaves, so quickly? To disregard the golden whip so quickly? I guess it's not neat and tidy for TV, but I found myself wondering if the unprogramming of the Unsullied in the span of 30 seconds was completely believable or not. It didn't decrease my enjoyment of what happened, but I did find myself wondering.
I would love to have seen Robert and Ned in their prime.
kittoo
Cretinously credulous
Same here. It was slightly unrealistic. If they are so dedicated to the whip and thats what they have been brought up on, I doubt they would have a change of heart so easily. Conditioning is a powerful force.
They aren't unprogrammed. When faced with freedom or servitude not a single one chose freedom. They don't know anything else but how to be soldiers.
Emerson
May contain jokes =>
What indication is there that the Unsullied have actually changed their frame of thinking? You're projecting that.
toddhunter
Member
Well that is because [Books after ASOS very unspecific spoilers]
this very issue gets later explored in detail. So if you read this then stay tuned!
She tossed the whip onto the ground and they still followed her after that, which makes it quite reasonable to project. They showed us that for a reason.
BenjaminBirdie
Banned
That whole episode perfectly rendered my favorite rad shit probably from the entire series.
Perfect.
Perfect.
Emerson
May contain jokes =>
The whip is not a magical artifact of control for the slaves. It's symbolic. Ownership of the Unsullied was passed to Dany from Kraznys and she owns them as far as they are concerned.
I didn't expect the Dany scene to be this good. Damn.
She really sounds like a badass when she speaks Valyrian. And I got a kick out of listening closely to what she says and understanding that Valyrian imperative is "das" at the end of the sentence, but that's just me geeking out about language.
Probably her best performance so far. She and Jason Momoa (Drogo) really know how to make an artificial language come alive.
She really sounds like a badass when she speaks Valyrian. And I got a kick out of listening closely to what she says and understanding that Valyrian imperative is "das" at the end of the sentence, but that's just me geeking out about language.
Probably her best performance so far. She and Jason Momoa (Drogo) really know how to make an artificial language come alive.
Maybe in ADWD
when tree-Bran starts speaking to him, I remember him having a breakdown over the Starks and how they were more of a family to him than his blood family
As others have said, it's not unrealistic at all. They chose servitude, because that's all they really know.
ThisWreckage
Banned
I have no idea what happened in the cave and I would imagine a lot of other people don't either. I don't remember who the guy with the bandanna draped over one eye was and I'm confused about which God they're talking about.
Lol.
I can imagine a lot of people who have not read the books are going to feel the same way, but I think they explained it on the show if ever so briefly.
That was Beric Dondarrion, he had to be recast for season 3 so it's even harder to recognize. They follow the Lord of Light, same as Melisandre.
ThoseDeafMutes has been notified and will purify the unbelievers with fire.
Or, more likely, just put the fear of Mod into them.
There was a brief time period in the first season where King Robert was out hunting and Ned was taking his place sitting on the throne. One of the things Ned did during that small amount of time was sentence the Mountain to death. He sent a bunch of his best people out to get him. The leader of that group was Beric - the guy who now has one eye.
I wish the show had done a better job at explaining this.
Hmmm, thing is, is it me, or does the series diverge A LOT from the book regarding Daenery's plot in Meeren. I mean, I might be wrong, but it does look as if
ASOS
ASOS
Daenerys has opted to outright destroy Meeren and moving on with her voyage rather than sitting down and rule there. This is something that I do want to happen. The show correcting some of the narrative traps that Martin brought into himself would be all kinds of awesome, I swear by the gods
Lol keep dreaming.
You realize they were in Astapor, not Meereen yet, right? We don't know what they are going to do as far as that plot line yet.
I think part of the problem is the recasting, and Dondarrion's admittedly small role in the series up to this point. I think one way the could have remedied this was by having Tywin and his council discuss Dondarrion's activities at length a bit more last season.
Pai Pai Master
Banned
She's not in Mereen. She takes the Unsullied from Astapor first, then conquers the other slaver cities (the hardest being Mereen).
whoops beaten
But that would have taken out screentime they needed for titties, Ros, and the stupid Tywin/Arya plotline from last season that went nowhere. This is a perfect example of the showrunners not planning things out very well. A character as crucial as Beric Dondarrion should have been recognizable to the average TV viewer, or they should at least be familiar with him. I wouldn't blame anyone for being lost in his re-introduction scene because no one has mentioned him once since he last walked off-screen in season 1 and was never mentioned again.
Jibbajabbawockky
Member
Great episode. My only little nitpick was how they portrayed the Night's Watch mutiny. In the books [ASoS]
Dany's moment there at the end was very badass. The music was great too. [ASoS]
[Series spoiler/speculation]
The Sansa and Loras thing is a pretty good adaptation too. [ASoS]
Yeah, the leader of the Brotherhood is Beric Dondarrion. He is briefly in season 1, episode 6 when Ned is on the throne talking to the one peasant/commoner that tells him how Gregor Clegane is going through the countryside being a menace. Ned tasks Beric with taking 100 men to go find and execute Gregor Clegane.
But in that episode, Beric is basically a glorified extra- they recast him for this season.
you have a lot more build up to that, where even before the attack at the Fist of the First Men, people were getting disillusioned. Not a bad scene in the show, but I feel like they could have done a better job laying the groundwork for the fact that there was some growing discontent that was actually somewhat organized. In the show it just kind of comes out very suddenly.
Dany's moment there at the end was very badass. The music was great too. [ASoS]
Unfortunately that's about the last cool thing she does in the books. Now we have several seasons of her parked in Mereen going DAARIO DAARIO DAARIO.
[Series spoiler/speculation]
I'm still hoping for a Dornish Red Wedding for Dany. Seeing how arrogant she is in the show in that scene makes me really hope GRRM knocks her down a peg or two. Her plot armor is so damn thick, while seemingly everyone else in the books is being dragged through knee deep shit.
The Sansa and Loras thing is a pretty good adaptation too. [ASoS]
It replaces somebody who is never physically present in King's Landing from the books with Loras well enough. And it makes more sense for Loras joining the Kingsguard now too. That bit actually makes me pretty happy with the writers since it seems they sort of had this planned out for a little while- not having Loras join the Kingsguard last season, but saving it for this year.
It works with how they're making Littlefinger's intentions more clear, so its framed as the Tyrell's versus Littlefinger fighting over Sansa, and then the Lannisters step in and seemingly blow everything up by likely asking Loras into the Kingsguard and marrying Sansa off to Tyrion. Making Loras join the Kingsguard that way would kind of be a funny callback to how Aerys made Jaime join the Kingsguard too.
I do recall reading some interview recently with Benioff and Weiss saying that Dontos might still have some role to play, FWIW.
It works with how they're making Littlefinger's intentions more clear, so its framed as the Tyrell's versus Littlefinger fighting over Sansa, and then the Lannisters step in and seemingly blow everything up by likely asking Loras into the Kingsguard and marrying Sansa off to Tyrion. Making Loras join the Kingsguard that way would kind of be a funny callback to how Aerys made Jaime join the Kingsguard too.
I do recall reading some interview recently with Benioff and Weiss saying that Dontos might still have some role to play, FWIW.
Yeah, the leader of the Brotherhood is Beric Dondarrion. He is briefly in season 1, episode 6 when Ned is on the throne talking to the one peasant/commoner that tells him how Gregor Clegane is going through the countryside being a menace. Ned tasks Beric with taking 100 men to go find and execute Gregor Clegane.
But in that episode, Beric is basically a glorified extra- they recast him for this season.
Lavpa Jasai
Member
Does anyone have any clue what the name of the song was at the very end of the episode? The super epic final shot had some bad ass music playing in the background (that I think carried over to the credits)
Anyone have a name or know where I can listen to it?
Anyone have a name or know where I can listen to it?
They really nailed that Danny scene probably better than almost anything else in the series so far. The look on her face, her tone, everything was amazing and at that moment you could see just how much of a badass she can really be. Love when she switched languages. Really good acting in that scene.
I'll be honest with you.
ASOS
Even when reading the books, with semi-frequent references to the Brotherhood and Dondarrion, I couldn't remember who he was, or why he was important until he rejoins the story at this point. And in the grand scheme of things, I can understand why he was overlooked.
It'll assumedly be on the soundtrack to season 3 when that is released. But it is an expansion of the theme used during the last scene of season 1, when we see Dany with her dragons for the first time. That track is called Finale, and you can listen to it here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=586NFJhasdI
The similar theme starts to build at :40
Anton Sugar
Member
Some things I loved:
Theon saying his real father died at King's Landing. That says a TON about his character in a single sentence. Good on Alfie for that entire segment.
Theon's "savior" switching from sympathetic nice guy to psycho at the turn of the hat was great.
Brienne and Jaime's relationship. There were hints of a mutual compassion for each other but you really felt it here. I loved that Brienne tried to stop them even though she herself was tied up.
Margaery playing dat game.
Queen of Thorns. Nuff said. GF and I died laughing at her "what happens when..." line with Varys. Varys has met his match!
Varys, of course, is always great to see. This season needed some more of him.
The brotherhood scene was probably a bit confusing for any non-book reader (my GF was a bit confused) but I think they knocked the actors for Beric and Thoros out of the park. Beric, especially, left a spectacular impression in his first scene. I don't remember if the Hound had the same reaction as he did in the book, but he kinda had a "well, this will be interesting" look on his face once he realized he was going to fight Beric.
Dany is now a straight up dragon queen. No more mispronouncing Qarth or shit like that.
I wish that Mormont's death was a bit more ceremonious. I thought he'd at least get to choke out that asshole like a champ or speak with Sam--that was a shame.
Theon saying his real father died at King's Landing. That says a TON about his character in a single sentence. Good on Alfie for that entire segment.
Theon's "savior" switching from sympathetic nice guy to psycho at the turn of the hat was great.
Brienne and Jaime's relationship. There were hints of a mutual compassion for each other but you really felt it here. I loved that Brienne tried to stop them even though she herself was tied up.
Margaery playing dat game.
Queen of Thorns. Nuff said. GF and I died laughing at her "what happens when..." line with Varys. Varys has met his match!
Varys, of course, is always great to see. This season needed some more of him.
The brotherhood scene was probably a bit confusing for any non-book reader (my GF was a bit confused) but I think they knocked the actors for Beric and Thoros out of the park. Beric, especially, left a spectacular impression in his first scene. I don't remember if the Hound had the same reaction as he did in the book, but he kinda had a "well, this will be interesting" look on his face once he realized he was going to fight Beric.
Dany is now a straight up dragon queen. No more mispronouncing Qarth or shit like that.
I wish that Mormont's death was a bit more ceremonious. I thought he'd at least get to choke out that asshole like a champ or speak with Sam--that was a shame.
Moff
Member
I was ready to name varys, tywin and olenna the highlights of the episode, as usual. these 3 actors just manage to amaze me every time. the sorceror was pretty cool, and quite a change to varys character in my opinion. or when did he ever do anything in his own interest? isnt it one of his most imporant characteristics that he - as a eunuch - has no legacy and only the good for the realm in mind?
but anways, what blew me away was of course the end, I didnt feel a fracture reading that chapter of what I felt today watching it, this was one of the mist epic moments I ever say on TV, or even movies. absolutely stunnung. [series]
but anways, what blew me away was of course the end, I didnt feel a fracture reading that chapter of what I felt today watching it, this was one of the mist epic moments I ever say on TV, or even movies. absolutely stunnung. [series]
but its really a shame danys story falls completely apart now and will only bore us from now on, and of course everyone thinks it will really get off now. poor bastards. well, they shouldnt be better of than us, should they? I really hope benioff&weiss change a lot, though, I would really welcome that, it cant possibly be worse than the books
Lavpa Jasai
Member
Thanks a bunch!
I think it all comes down to not allowing the scenes to breathe. Not giving the audience time to think. They're being rushed from one scene to another. Scenes should be longer. Small pointless scenes like Bran's should not be in it at all.
As a book reader, for me that episode was a 9.5 in entertainment value, but I feel bad for people that haven't read the books. I don't know how they're not constantly confused.
Jay Shadow
Member
It's been a big problem this year. The repeated mentions of the identity of Theon's capter has really been pissing me off. Especially when they get called out on it by non-book readers who wonder how they came to that conclusion and they say it was obvious. Every clue they've left on the show has pointed to Iron Born. Even though several of those clues were left by sources that are unreliable, but that hasn't been revealed to non-book people yet.
TestOfTide
Banned
Was anyone else reminded of [AGOT/Series]
during bran's dream?
Promise Me, Ned!
BrokenEchelon
Banned
The whole Theon/
Ramsay
Do people who haven't read the books even know who he is? Should I spoiler his name? Censored it just in case.
Agreed, definitely a highlight of the series. I was also very impressed with the scale -- this was the first time an army actually looked like an army. Obviously there was some CG work done on the last shot.. but you could tell in some of the scenes that they had a LOT of extras.
With that being said, I wish we'd seen about 30 seconds more at least of the actual sacking. I'll miss Missandei's outfit...
You guys are alright, I got mixed this first slave city (Astapor) with some of the latter locations
T_T you all know that it would be awesome if showrunners could avoid the whole knot, really. Specially considering the pace of Dany's plot in the series compared to the one of the books.
That makes me wonder if they will mix ADWD's plotlines with the upcoming 4th season which will comprise the second half of ASOS. This could be a very clever way to adapt the show, for it will speed one of the most boring parts of the books, ADWD
and balance it out by mixing it with what is arguably some of the best parts of the saga (A Storm of Swords).
It could work, me thinks, specially considering that Martin's original idea before taking the horrible decision of splitting POVs between Westeros and Essos was to make a contrast between AFFC
T_T you all know that it would be awesome if showrunners could avoid the whole knot, really. Specially considering the pace of Dany's plot in the series compared to the one of the books.
That makes me wonder if they will mix ADWD's plotlines with the upcoming 4th season which will comprise the second half of ASOS. This could be a very clever way to adapt the show, for it will speed one of the most boring parts of the books, ADWD
the bajillion pages devoted to show how Danerys can't rule shit
It could work, me thinks, specially considering that Martin's original idea before taking the horrible decision of splitting POVs between Westeros and Essos was to make a contrast between AFFC
Daenerys style of Queenship with Cersei's
diunxx
Member
how is the heir of Highgarden a slap in the face? she leaves with dontos because they fucking marry her to the Imp, not because her rich proposed husband had to use a cane to walk.
BFIB
Member
Some exposition on Beric would have went a long way to his re-introduction.
Same with Barristan. For those of us who have read the books, its easy for us to remember these things (for the most part), but for those who haven't, I can see where you could easily be confused. Especially for Beric, since he was recast.
Same with Barristan. For those of us who have read the books, its easy for us to remember these things (for the most part), but for those who haven't, I can see where you could easily be confused. Especially for Beric, since he was recast.
Exterminieren
Banned
Series:
I'd be absolutely fine were they to invent entirely new material for Dany from this point on.
That, unfortunately, won't happen.
That, unfortunately, won't happen.
The recasting is not an issue. No one who hasn't read the books has the slightest idea who Beric is or was. He is essentially a new S3 character.
Moff
Member
I dont agree at all. when I read the books, I had pretty much no idea who he was when arya reached the BWB, and it didnt change a thing. you simply do not need to know who he is up until that point.
and I think they did a great job they didnt waste any time introducing him too long in season 1, because I am sure most show watchers would not recognize or remember him even if they doubled or tripled his screen time in season 1, and since he doesnt play any vital part in season 1 and they even changed the actor, I think they did absolutely the right thing. this is pretty much a perfect example of planning things out very well.
Series
don't think they'd invent stuff, but pulling things from book 6 and 7 would be fine with me.
Anton Sugar
Member
I don't necessarily agree that the books don't prep you for Beric at all. IIRC, there are a number of characters or moments where rumors of Beric's death are discussed, along with the Brotherhood. The books make you aware that the Brotherhood exists and is a thorn in the side of "unjust" men; we didn't really get that in the show at all.
- Status