Right, because we have so much laissez-faire capitalism in Germany, lol. And what is "neocorporatism" supposed to be?
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German Federal Elections 2017 |OT| Electing the new leader of the free world
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Right, because we have so much laissez-faire capitalism in Germany, lol. And what is "neocorporatism" supposed to be?
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Bitch Pudding
Member
Those are the current survey findings btw:
Asked who they preferred as chancellor, we got the following results:
CDU/CSU: 95% Merkel
SPD: 73% Schulz
Linke: 55% Schulz
FDP: 82% Merkel
Grüne: 44% Schulz, 39% Merkel
http://www.forschungsgruppe.de/Aktuelles/Politbarometer/
Asked who they preferred as chancellor, we got the following results:
CDU/CSU: 95% Merkel
SPD: 73% Schulz
Linke: 55% Schulz
FDP: 82% Merkel
Grüne: 44% Schulz, 39% Merkel
http://www.forschungsgruppe.de/Aktuelles/Politbarometer/
ClosingADoor
Member
Aren't a lot of German companies pretty good for their employees? And with the current unemployment rate, they can negotiate better benefits. Car companies for example seem to give out a lot of profit sharing in Germany, in the thousands of dollars per employee, no matter their rank or job there.
Patrick Bateman
Member
In my opinion big coalitions are never really "healthy" in a bigger country like Germany. The argument is a bit weird considering Germany has a good run right now but I'd rather have coalitions with a certain same direction of politics.
Wahlkampf is going to start soon.
We heard several politicians talking about tax cuts and removing the "Kalte Progression" though they could already have done it in the past I don't how many years now. Wahlkampf has already started.
On that note: Can someone explain the popularity of Wolfgang Schäuble?
It's 3 months from now and campaign is about to start.
Looked at other election threads and they all went up around 3 months before Election Day.
1.21Gigawatts
Banned
People think he is competent.
Bedameister
Member
Where's the Schulzzug at? Seems it got lost :/
Supporters of this kind have a short attention span. So it's not surprising.
The power of the Schwarze Null?
Lmao, no. Lots of companies treat their employees like total shit. The fear of getting thrown into Hartz4 and getting treated like worthless garbage by kafkaesque bureaucracy ("Jobcenter") is real and corporations use this as a threat so people take any job and endure shitty working conditions. Just because it isn't as bad as in the US it doesn't mean that everything is fine. A few years back they invented "One-euro-jobs", basically telling jobless people to go work for one euro/hour, so they take away jobs from others while also getting exploited hard, and when people complain, they tell them to be grateful to have work, since work is good for character.
The relatively good standing of the German economy, which Macron shills now claim was caused by the neoliberal Agenda 2010 reforms so they need them in France as well, was mostly bought by massive cuts to worker's rights, stagnation of wages and the development of a massive sector of precarious employement and low-wages. It was also bought by emposing Schäublonomics on the rest of Europe, meaning hard austerity, and the German economy profiting massively from having absurdly high exports (then proceed to complain about other countries debts).
AFD and Pegida taped successfully into the fear of parts of the middle class of losing their social status and making refugees and minorities to be the scapegoats for the effects of globalized capitalism and the shrinking solidarity in German society which liberal media and oh-so-funny comedians exactly like in the US explained by "Lol dumb Saxons are so racist". Wealth inequality in Germany is very high (just google "wealth inequality Germany" for serious studies and news articles).
There was, by the way, a few years back an UN report that detailed that in few countries in the developed world educational success, which translates into class status, was as determined by your class ("socioeconomic circumstances") as in Germany. Can't find it right now.
Patrick Bateman
Member
I never understood how a guy like Schäuble, who was so deeply involved in the CDU donations scandal, could become minister of finance and even become so popular.
The common people seem to forget alot..
Did you read the memorials about Kohl? Guy was corrupt as fuck, not only because of the donation scandal, stopped the fight for liberalization of society and minority rights dead on tracks for 16 years and by all accounts was a Machiavellian asshole in both politics and private life, but all is forgiven even by liberal media because something about "Europa" and "Einheit", even though he mishandled both in dramatic fashion - see how the whole Euro thing and the fundamentally misconstructed European Union turned out, and how devastating the rampart corruption and sellout of former DDR property (Treuhand etc.) was for the new eastern German states. We still have to deal with the political (right-wing extremism, mistrust of democracy) and economical fallout of that period. For many citizens of the DDR, the Re-unification was just a disaster - they were now more free, in theory, but their lives worsened dramatically, while Kohl promised the opposite without ever delivering.
Schäuble is one of the leftovers or the pre-Merkel, patriarchal, high-handed Men's club Kohl-CDU who thought that they could get away with everything. She got rid of everyone of them, including the Andenpakt guys, but she kept Schäuble around.
Fair enough
To quote a formerly famous rockband about the media circle:
We're building it up
To bring it back down
We're building it up
To burn it down
The circus was goddamn predictable and Schulz and SPD walked straight up into the trap. There is a reason Merkel survives almost everything out, instead of reacting, she sits pretty much everything out.
If it ain't on the Bild frontpage, it might as well not exist.
Whats the problem with the euro? The french fucked up here, they wanted us to give up the D-Mark to "hold us back" (sayin this cause I dont find the right term right now, dont read to much into it) but it backfired and became our biggest advantage.
Patrick Bateman
Member
This is the complete opposite of what I read in the "Kohl is dead"-thread..
Woah. Germany has a lot of political parties, as a foreigner it can be kinda confusing. All of these parties hold some type of power?
Which parties are most comparable to the Democratic and Conservative parties of USA?
Imma need a ELI5 for German government cause I feel like an idiot.
Which parties are most comparable to the Democratic and Conservative parties of USA?
Imma need a ELI5 for German government cause I feel like an idiot.
Imp the Dimp
Member
In terms of fiscal policy, democrats are somewhat comparable to CDU/CSU. On social matters they're very much in line with the social democrats though.
No real equivalent to the Republicans around tbh.
Muffin1611
Banned
Good to see that The Greens are making "marriage for all" a condition for any government coalition. That's a step in the right direction for the party imo.
Still have to pick up the fight and escape this slump of under 10%.
They should stop attacking Merkel with the wrong things though. That shit brings them nowhere.
Still have to pick up the fight and escape this slump of under 10%.
They should stop attacking Merkel with the wrong things though. That shit brings them nowhere.
sankt-Antonio
:^)--?-<
Refugee crisis? Unjust participation in the Syrian war? The rise of the AfD perhaps? Unemployment is still at 6 % and Germans would have given Schulz an comparable amount of votes two months ago.
She is the frontrunner atm imo, but not without recent faults for other people to exploit.
Frankfurter
Member
All of these parties, except for the right wing populist AfD, are part of atleast one coalition in German states, so yeah they hold quite some power. The two parties that are in a coalition on the federal level right now are the two biggest though (CDU/CSU and SPD). Linke and Greens are in opposition, while both FDP and AfD didn't make the 5% threshold in the 2013 election, i.e. currently they are not represented in the federal parliament (both are expected to get more than 5% this fall, though).
A comparable party to the Conservatives (I assume you mean the GOP?) doesn't really exist in Germany, the closest one is probably the AfD (anti-science, kind of anti-gay, anti-immigrant etc.).
The conservatives in Germany (CDU/CSU) are kind of close to the US Democrats I'd say, but it really depends on the subject at hand. Greens and Linke are far left of the major US parties.
The refugee crisis is pretty much done. People realized that it actually... didn't change anything. Unemployment at 6% (below 4% with ILO standards) is exceptionally low for Germany since the reunification, it's a HUGE plus for Merkel!
Edit: What certainly helped Merkel though is Brexit and Trump. People see all this crazy stuff going on and look at Merkel and think "Strong and stable" (TM), why risk this?
Muffin1611
Banned
No party can attack her because of the refugee crisis besides the AfD tbh. And even that is getting old. The other parties are even more left, and sure, they can claim that they would have handled the situation better, but I don't think anybody is going to believe that.
Nah, screw the Greens. I wish they would end up below 5%.
Not really. The crisis is just under the rug. No real news, so barely anyone cares.
1.21Gigawatts
Banned
Its about fucking time.
CDU will stay in power thats pretty certain at this point. But I hope that the opposition can achieve a few socially liberal goals.
Marriage equality and a more liberal drug policy are probably the main issues where the governing party deviates most from the publics view.
sankt-Antonio
:^)--?-<
Yeah, I think Brexit and the Trump shitshow stoped the Schulz train right in its track. People want stability more then ever now, I think.
Muffin1611
Banned
Sure, lets kill the party which has one of the core problems of this century, climate change, at it's foundation and is the only major party really pushing for gay rights while not being complete Russophiles.
SPD has shown again and again that it won't push for any of that against its coalition partner.
Yup, I agree completely.
No. As in many parliamentary democracies, after an election, parties either rule if they get an absolute majority of the seats (which very rarely happens) or several parties have to form a coalition. That means two or more parties who are close to each other get together to write down a "coalition treaty" with projects they agreed on to implement. Ministers are assigned more or less according to what every party wants (and how many seats they got in comparison to the other).
The chancellor will usually come from the stronger of the two parties, but there's no judicial necessity to do that. In principle, there's even a left-wing majority in the current parliament (SPD, Greens, and the Left, thus excluding the party with the most seats), but some of the Left's ideas make them more or less unfit for government, so they couldn't get together.
In terms of policies, it's a bit complicated. In some aspects, the CDU (the German conservatives, part of the current government and Merkel's party) are in line with the Democrats (e.g., universal health care, although the American version isn't (wasn't?) quite as universal as the German one; taking in refugees isn't universally loved, but they're more or less supporting Merkel's course), but in others, it's more around the Republicans (you probably won't get same-sex marriage with them). In general, though, the German conservatives are more left-leaning than the Republicans but do share some societal policies with them. They're catering far less to the, err, more nutty aspects of religious policies though. You won't find a single party in Germany supporting teaching magical stories about how the world came to be, and climate scepticism can only be found in the right-wing AfD.
Speaking of which, the AfD are a new party to the right of the conservatives (CDU). They're basically the more right-wing (and racist) part of the Republicans, but they're a little bit confused regarding how big they want their government to be. In general, though, they're more like the Front National in that they support a strong state with social safety nets and such. Except not for those pesky foreigners.
The SPD (social democrats, also part of the current government) are in general a bit to the left of the Democrats. The traditional workers' party, they lost a lot of trust when they invoked harsher rules for the unemployed. Again, American and European political systems cannot be compared 1:1, but the SPD under its current leader is probably what the Democrats would be with someone like Warren in the lead.
The Greens are the "ecological" party who pushed green energy when they were in charge (1998-2005). Traditionally an anti-war party, they nowadays are more in the realms of realpolitik (i.e, accepting that German military has some role to play on the world stage). They're probably the most left-leaning party in terms of societal order, e.g., the strongest supporters of LGBT rights or recreational drug usage. They got a bit marginalised in the last few state elections because their no. 1 topic was totally co-opted by Merkel -- she decided to get rid of nuclear power in favour of more green energy (well, at least in theory).
Finally, the FDP are traditional European liberalists, thus probably closest to the American idea of a small state. That also means, however, that they're the strongest voice in terms of restricting surveillance. They got voted out of the last parliament because they were seen as being mere stirrup holders for the CDU.
I think its more that Merkel managed to look fantastic against Trump and the germans most likely want a strong woman stand against him
Bitch Pudding
Member
Muffin1611
Banned
Any chance of Schulz as next Außenminister?
If Merkel wants to continue the big coalition, sure. He is perfect for the job IMO.
I am a bit worried that the FDP could become the junior-partner again, because thats always horrible.
1.21Gigawatts
Banned
I think that Germans, even though it doesn't often look like that, have a strong sense for liberal western values.
Even though we like to flirt with right wing populists here and there, at the end of the day we have a strong majority defending the very values this right wing populism tries to undermine.
Trump and Brexit made many Germans, who might have thought about voting right wing because of the refugee crisis, realize that this is not a route they want to go down.
If you look close enough you'll probably find some in all parties (except maybe Greens because who join them if he would be skeptic of it?). There was an article recently where the Berliner Kreis of the CDU (I think Bosbach is a member of it) said that the climate change should be re-evaluatet to be not entirely bad. And that we should consider the economically chances he gives us as bigger than the ecological consequences.
Not like climate change isn't an issue for the other parties. I'm alright with how they are proceeding.
About equal marriage (since 1.21Gigawatts mentioned it), it's a funny thing because there's like 2-3 things that aren't equal. Everything else is the same. It's not really an issue for a lot of gay people yet some people with too much time on their hands who like shouting are pushing hard for it, despite the actual group not really caring as much.
Muffin1611
Banned
Yeah. Kinda reinforces my post of there being some shitheads in almost every party.
That article was embarrassing to read.
2-3 things like being able to marry or adopt children, yeah. Kinda glaring equality issues.
And my bi and gay friends not sitting in my face yelling at me that these issues need to be fixed won't stop me from pushing for that, really. Doesn't mean it's any less of an issue for them. Many people just aren't politically interested.
Imp the Dimp
Member
I don't vote CDU but she's a great chancellor. However, I find your insinuation that she's responsible for the economic boom disputable. It's generally attributed to Schroeder's Agenda 2010 set in motion 2 or 3 years before she became chancellor.
Dictator93
Member
Man, I wish the Linkspartei had better candidates :/
1.21Gigawatts
Banned
Its about the symbolism. As a progressive modern society we just can't justify not having complete marriage equality without any caveats.
Yes, it wouldn't change much technically, but it sends an important message.
I think that might even a bad move for the FDP. They just regained voter's trust. If they disappoint so soon again, that might be their "end". Or at least it would be very hard for them again. Going for opposition within the parlament might be better for them for now.
I don't know. My mother actually expects another big coalition. I wouldn't be surprised as well. But I wouldn't be surprised if something like black-green might happen. Hard to say at the moment.
Muffin1611
Banned
Adoption rights for gay couples would change plenty.
1.21Gigawatts
Banned
I wonder how far Lindners changes reached within the base of the party.
What I heard from him so far seemed like a far more left leaning form of liberalism than the previous economically liberal but socially conservative standpoints of the party.
I wonder what gave the FDP the trust of voters (at least in NRW) again. As far as I see they aren't really different than four years ago. Is it really just Christian "I'm like you! I bought my first Porsche when I was nineteen." Lindner popularity?
You are not listening to them, that is all.
Who really cares about marriage these days anymore though? A lot of the younger people certainly don't. If you are religious and it matters more, it's probably less likely that you are gay and actually want to marry (I would think but I can't say too much about it as most here are non-religious).
Adoption is a tough issue though. So it's no surprise there.
How do you know that? From my perspective, it always seems like you guys are doing it simply for self-gratification and that really rubs me the wrong way. "I'm doing it for them!" Sure, but maybe they don't really care? I have made the experience that it's not really an issue. Sure, there is room for discussion but it's nothing that needs hard pushing.
I actually just talked about it last Tuesday, again.
....ok, that's not the worst reason, I'll give you that.
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