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Guild Wars 2 |OT3| Two Week Updates, One Box, Zero Subscriptions
- Thread starter Retro
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You and me both. But what about once you've already figured it out? Or what if it wasn't something you had any desire to figure out for yourself in the first place?Retro said:
Does looking up her guide to the karma vendor in Orr "ruin the surprise" of learning which stat distribution is at which vendor? Does going to one page to see all the options available for making ascended back pieces really result in unreasonable expectations? Does checking the route of a bounty you're trying to hunt with a skeleton crew- one you've tracked 15 times before- make it less fun for you than failing? Does her overview with screenshots of the somewhat-opaque new in-game achievement rewards system take all the "magic" out of a new UI panel?
Even considering those who rely on following Dulfy's guides to complete content, I honestly can't even begin to relate when you talk about causing unnecessary friction and drama in a group environment. Almost every one of the detailed content guides she has put together focus on the aspects (scavenger hunt/filling in achievement bars/where to spot things in jumping puzzles) that are could very nearly be considered singleplayer content. You're describing the phenomenon as though she's posting raid build guides that have grown so ubiquitous that people would be excluded from groups for not following them. But in reality she barely focuses any time on group instances whatsoever.
I'm baffled at the idea that easily-accessible guides for content is exclusive of new or returning players. We all know that we've beaten every guild challenge, puzzle, rush, and killed every bounty. We know that collectively we've seen a ton of the game world for treks. Some of us are very confident with jumping puzzles; others know all the available Ascended stat combos offhand. But I also know that there are guilds that have yet to complete a single challenge or bounty hunt, and I know that there are people who get incredibly frustrated without knowing exactly where to go in a jumping puzzle, and I surely know that new players have no idea what the full set of Ascended gearing options look like, and that players who haven't played in a while and come back in a week and a half can't possibly go about hunting sky crystals as leisurely as I did. Hell, I used her guide to track down the last handful of baubles for the SAB achievement (I hate collect-a-thons in platformers)... I have no qualms reconciling that experience with "the spirit of the game."
I don't like to use guides in general. I like exploring, I like figuring things out for as long as it takes, I like novelty. I think relying on them makes things boring, and is likely to lessen your enjoyment if you do so your first time through something new. But I know that not everybody feels the same, or has the same patience threshold. I don't begrudge people using guides because it doesn't affect me. And I certainly don't begrudge someone who takes the time to put those guides together. Most importantly, I don't see any rational reason to specifically hate on the one who does it the best.
Why are you guys doing it solo? This is an MMO ffs
Also are we going to make a peace treaty for the Centaur!?!??!
I doubt they'd just eliminate nearly all of the events in the human zones for a two week update.
However, what if our "next hero" is a centaur? We've seen multiple centaurs defect, it's not surprising that one might want to pledge support to Jennah in hopes that they might one day force a treaty.
Edit: Most definitely a centaur. Went back and looked at some screenshots of a few.
I'm expecting a group ready to roll out for some Horde mode marathoning when I get back from work.
I'm already anticipating the Candidate Trials speed run videos.
Kryta ain't ready for all that.
edit: That picture is definitely a centaur, though.
I'm already anticipating the Candidate Trials speed run videos.
Kryta ain't ready for all that.
edit: That picture is definitely a centaur, though.
Here's the rational reason. It's not about begrudging people, it's about the constant reliance on extremely simple breakdowns of the new content to allow players to rush through it, complete it, and complain that content is too short. The guide allowed them to complete it mechanically instead of organically. It removed the sense of wonder, something completely lost nowadays usually replaced with a sense of urgency because of how hectic peoples' lives are. I don't begrudge someone using it to save time between their busy schedules, I begrudge those who use it, complain that there isn't any more content to do, and contribute to the whole system of "consuming the content on day one, then moan lack of content until next patch" cycle.
@Lunar
So a current theory going around on Reddit is that the character in the next update's preview art is a Centaur;
Some Concept Art: Centaur on the left is clearly rocking a pair of forward-swept horns.
That face definitely doesn't look like a Charr's muzzle.
It's definitely a centaur. Looks exactly like one.
EDIT: I think all the characters in the image are centaurs, looking at it closer.
We both know Retro's got some Grumpy Old Man tendencies. You should hear him when there's kids playing outside and he can hear them. The horror.
It definitely goes back to other MMO experiences (at least for me) where if you didn't read the strategy guide or install certain mods (I'm thinking of the one where it announced bosses' attacks to the raid, but can't remember the name of it) you couldn't join the group or attend the raid. Luckily, I have seen very little content in GW2 that encourages that. The only things I can think of are dungeon speed runs and that's not what everyone does. I do remember that the Guild Trek guide became problematic for us that one time. We had a few people upset when someone (we think) used Dulfy to get to all the spots in 5 minutes where others were running around, using their money on waypoints to actually look, etc. But that's about it.
I'm not a fan of breaking down games into "Go here, do this" checklists, but strategy guides only exist because there's demand for them and as long as their use is not mandatory, I'm fine.
Kos Luftar
Member
I will play all these mini games but I will be very sad because I would have preferred a story mission or dungeon but that is never coming because ANET hates me specifically!
Boo this update, give me centaur update already with zero mini games.
Boo this update, give me centaur update already with zero mini games.
Ooo
Going to miss the 15 vuln in one hit on hunter's shot, but can't complain too much about a small bit of stealth.
Point Blank Shot range up...gonna be nice for wvw
Maul change is nice for zerk rangers like me. Small whirling defense boost and now an easy to trigger blast finisher on call of the wild?
Yet the shortbow is still in a terrible state for my build. RIP ponies
Edit: remorseless will actually compete now for slot time with signet of the beastmaster. Well, it would require me bringing longbow in dungeon so maybe not...
and the ranger forum seems actually....happy? bizarre
Going to miss the 15 vuln in one hit on hunter's shot, but can't complain too much about a small bit of stealth
. Point Blank Shot range up...gonna be nice for wvw
Maul change is nice for zerk rangers like me. Small whirling defense boost and now an easy to trigger blast finisher on call of the wild?
Yet the shortbow is still in a terrible state for my build. RIP ponies
Edit: remorseless will actually compete now for slot time with signet of the beastmaster. Well, it would require me bringing longbow in dungeon so maybe not...
and the ranger forum seems actually....happy? bizarre
Rangers community wide weep with joy.
In defense of raid leaders everywhere, this was entirely out of necessity and not out of malice. The only reason we required such mods and guides is because the developers were too incompetent to actually design their games right. It's not something we LIKED doing.
Luckily, this doesn't apply to Guild Wars 2 for the most part. That said I do wish there was better in game information on how to play certain classes.
In defense of raid leaders everywhere, this was entirely out of necessity and not out of malice. The only reason we required such mods and guides is because the developers were too incompetent to actually design their games right. It's not something we LIKED doing.
Oh, I know! I was in a hardcore raiding guild in WoW, so I understand the necessity of it. Just commenting that I would in no way consider it fun if GW2 were to implement anything that would drive that kind of gameplay.
Not shortbow rangers. But yay for support rangers I guess.
It doesn't happen in GAF because GAFers aren't tools, but I'd hate to see the environment that these sort of guides create in other games spread into GW2. That kind of environment where people who haven't read the guides are mocked or even kicked for not knowing how to do something. The excitement of playing a game and figuring things out for yourself is impossible if you're grouping with people who expect you to know everything.
Beyond that, it's lame that she's just going through dissecting everything and posting raw data when other people are actually taking the time to write previews like they're supposed to. It doesn't affect me but it still seems obnoxious.
It could be that one of the Centaur Tribes wants to defect from the grip of the Modnir Ulgoth. There's already a centaur outcast in Lion's Arch who was driven out because she disagreed with his leadership. There's also centaurs north of Divinity's Reach, I believe, in the Woodland Cascades. I think it will be a single individual though.
We both know Retro's got some Grumpy Old Man tendencies. You should hear him when there's kids playing outside and he can hear them. The horror.
In defense of raid leaders everywhere, this was entirely out of necessity and not out of malice. The only reason we required such mods and guides is because the developers were too incompetent to actually design their games right. It's not something we LIKED doing.
It's because in Diku-style MMOs, you don't fight an enemy, you fight the mechanics; aggro, rage timers, crushing blows, etc. You had to have stuff like DeadlyBossMod and Threat Meters because the mechanics dictated how everything was meant to play out. The enemy itself was just a cool thing you weren't able to look at because it was buried behind all those mod UIs. Everything else was dance steps and timers.
The only thing that's really predictable like that in GW2 are when the World Events actually spawn, and even those are open windows in which they can spawn.
The best bosses in WoW and Everquest 2 were always the ones where you felt like you were fighting an actual enemy, and not the mechanics. I can't speak for Everquest 2 because SOE nickeled and dimed it so bad I quit playing, but it was a shame that WoW went increasingly away from this.
I've liked almost every boss battle I've seen in GW2 so far, so that's a good sign.
Centaur Update features a new minigame: Ulgoth's Hummingbird Trivia Challenge.
@Ash
Then I think the thing we're actually overlooking is this acronym in the url: "bjaoz". Or perhaps that's a name?
Agreed; the ones that hid it well were always the most interesting. Fights like Heigan (The "dance" boss in Naxx) were fun and just made everything else pale in comparison. That was the fight that showed you who was good at gaming and who couldn't pay attention to simple queues (they were the ones finding out what the floor tastes like). No alt-tabbing to watch Youtube videos during that one... too bad they were so few and far between, maybe they did more like that after Wrath, but I doubt it.
bjaoz is most likely scramble code to prevent anyone from seeing the image early.
Kos Luftar
Member
d3b4yo2b5lbfy.cloudfront.net/wp-content/uploads/2013/07/cc8218-6_QJ_NextHero_EN.jpg
bjaoz is just something that got added once Retro uploaded it to abode whatever.
Looks like centaurs in Ascalon to me, but that's reaching.
I mean, we generally avoid relying on anything outside of our own wit and guile to get us through and it's done us very well so far! So we've been able to enjoy ourselves just about exactly as we would've never knowing that the guides existed, and people that feel like relying on them can do so without intruding on our fun. Meanwhile a huge amount of the stuff posted on her site is just resource references that don't even help you complete content quickly, they just explain or demonstrate things- like a list of all the weapons with particle effects, where to find fun consumable items, or what skimpy female armor options are available. I honestly believe she does put a massive amount of effort into supporting the community (especially with that last one), beyond just posting "raw data."
I guess it just feels a lot like hating on Dulfy (or hoping her site doesn't get clicks) is blaming the content creator for those who would (and always will) misuse it, when the content itself is actually pretty valuable and useful in the right context.
Yeah, in that case, a bunch of us were pissed because one of us was using a guide, not because the rest of us weren't
I mean, we generally avoid relying on anything outside of our own wit and guile to get us through and it's done us very well so far! So we've been able to enjoy ourselves just about exactly as we would've never knowing that the guides existed, and people that feel like relying on them can do so without intruding on our fun. Meanwhile a huge amount of the stuff posted on her site is just resource references that don't even help you complete content quickly, they just explain or demonstrate things- like a list of all the weapons with particle effects, where to find fun consumable items, or what skimpy female armor options are available. I honestly believe she does put a massive amount of effort into supporting the community (especially with that last one), beyond just posting "raw data."
I guess it just feels a lot like hating on Dulfy (or hoping her site doesn't get clicks) is blaming the content creator for those who would (and always will) misuse it, when the content itself is actually pretty valuable and useful in the right context.
Kos Luftar
Member
Obviously QJ stands for Quality Jumping...new jumping puzzles where you transform into a centaur to jump...you also control front and back legs separately.
Looks like DR to me. Centaurs are joining the cause finally and they are saluting to Queen Jennah.
It's actually a jumping puzzle inside a set of mini games just for you.
Jest Chillin
Member
Kos Luftar
Member
In yesterday's preview I didn't see that but that could be because it was just a test server. I also have a feeling that will be hidden and we will only know on August 5th or after August 5th.
If they do not have an in-game poll, they should do a daily update on the website or twitch with the count, like a news story.
Obviously QJ stands for Quality Jumping...new jumping puzzles where you transform into a centaur to jump...you also control front and back legs separately.
Someone on reddit darkened it a bit.
Looks like DR to me. Centaurs are joining the cause finally and they are saluting to Queen Jennah.
Yeah, the banners up top definitely imply DR.
Perhaps this will relate to Kasmeer in some way.
Edit: Guys, I've got it: Quaggan Justice. It's about a loose-cannon centaur that teams up with a by-the-book quaggan who's too close to retirement for this shit. Together, they clean up the mean streets of Divinity's Reach.
Pumpkin King
Member
Quite the early lead for one...
Kos Luftar
Member
You are getting cold...try again.
I can dream.
Complistic
Member
nnooooo, they're moving my greater marks up a tier. Damn them. I think I'll move from 30/30/10/0/0 to 30/30/0/0/10 and start using deathshroud more since it looks like they're giving me a ton of life force to use. Although, they are making normal marks 3/4 the size of the old greater marks, so I guess it's not a total lost.
Da DreadLord
Member
So apparently my account is: Da DreadLord.5608
I'll delete characters and switch servers tomorrow or so
I'll delete characters and switch servers tomorrow or so
So apparently my account is: Da DreadLord.5608
I'll delete characters and switch servers tomorrow or so
Invited, it's a done deal!
Da DreadLord
Member
Thanks, accepted and representing yo!
This may or may not be motivated by me missing half my weekly guild comms, but I would like to be a part of your magnificent guild.
My account is Saprol.1389
Invited!
Be sure to check out our schedule in the OT!This may or may not be motivated by me missing half my weekly guild comms, but I would like to be a part of your magnificent guild.
My account is Saprol.1389
That reminds me- hythloday, did we push the sunday comms forward an hour while I was out? I seemed to have accidentally started early the other day according to the MOTD.
Da DreadLord
Member
Transfer in progress hehe.
I actually don't know! I have been putting 4 in the schedule but then I seem to remember at some point we discussed doing 3:00 PM because it was a little bit earlier for EuroGAF. But the times we did it at 4, nobody complained.
Ah yeah, it's 3 according to our schedule in the OT!
OT sure is nice btw, can't believe you're updating it with each release Retro!
OT sure is nice btw, can't believe you're updating it with each release Retro!
Not til you're on our server.
Update is live!
HOLY SHIT AT THOSE AETHERBLADE WEAPONS.
It's nice to be able to edit our own OP for once, instead of having a butchered version of the OT1 shoved in there. The Updates, as they fall off, are being collected for something special in the next month too.
HOLY SHIT AT THOSE AETHERBLADE WEAPONS.
It's nice to be able to edit our own OP for once, instead of having a butchered version of the OT1 shoved in there. The Updates, as they fall off, are being collected for something special in the next month too.
No; they scale you up to 80 for whatever content is new. You'll have a harder time of it since you don't have an 80's gear or traits, but it's still doable.
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