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Halo |OT8| A Salt on the Control Room

Pop

Pop

Member
UNKNOWN iXi said:
Nice avatar btw, seems like the sides were pushed in though..
Click to expand...
Had to resize to fit the requirements but that's the original image.

Announcers voice and the white text doesn't bother me, it's the ability to not be able to drop the flag. Why 343i...whyy
 
K

kylej

Banned
Alienshogun said:
Didn't he actually say he would talk to some people and it would go in the "look at but not a priority list?"

I wouldn't take that as "working on it."

At this point I would imagine what we see is pretty much what we get.
Click to expand...

No he said the UI team had planned on implementing it but he wasn't sure what the status was.

Overdoziz said:
They keep saying that Halo 4 multiplayer is all about creating your own Spartan and customizating it to fit your playstyle but I don't see that reflected in the game options at all. From what I seen it seems like they just copied Reach's option menu and kept it to that. No music settings, no assassination toggle, no vertical sensitivity, no sensitivity slider, no HUD customization, no aim acceleration toggle, no safe area adjustment option, nothing. Really disappointing stuff. Those relatively small additions can make a huge difference.
Click to expand...

Yep. The refusal to allow you to change settings that only you are privy to - that do not interfere in any way with other people's enjoyment of the game - is truly mind-numbing.
 
mhi

mhi

Member
Pok3R Fac3D said:
i really hope there are some lockout sized maps. big enough for 4v4, but a 1v1 works just as well...

haven just seems HUGE compared to it
Click to expand...

Lockout, Midship, Wizard etc is not possible. Esp. with sprint being built in. Not enough movement area. Think Sanctuary as the smallest it can be now.
 
S

senador

Banned
heckfu said:
Oh I understand that completely but none of us here found it detracting from gameplay at all, in complete honesty.
Click to expand...

Steelyuhas said:
Agreed, I didn't even notice it while playing, just like you don't notice the text on the screen, but you can look slightly up and read it if you want to.
Click to expand...

To be fair though, you guys played it in a crazy environment. It'll likely be very different night after night in my quiet house.

All the new things about the announcer are just too much IMO. Louder, more frequently, and more aggressive sounding. At least tone the volume down on him and balance him out with the rest of the audio.

It's going to be annoying but also lead to me feeling crazy.
 
H

Homeboyd

Member
This is what I was able to round up (mostly thanks to Cyren and THC folks, but some other sources in here as well). I know there are some more impressions I'm missing but as I mentioned previously, I was catching up on 30+ pages.. so if anyone else dropped some impressions here, please add. This should be helpful for those of us lttp and want a single list of content to go through;

...

Halo 4 - Media/Info Dump - PAX 2012

Halo 4 Panel
Halo Reborn - PAX Panel

Vidoc
Halo 4: A Hero Awakens - Vidoc
Gameplay & Cutscenes from the Vidoc (Only)

Gameplay

Haven
Haven Gameplay (Light Rifle/Hologram)
Haven Gameplay (Incinerator Canon)
Haven Gameplay (Binary Rifle) - @ 38s
Haven Gameplay w/ Walshy (+ loadout options)
Haven Gameplay (LightRifle)

Exile
CTF on Exile Gameplay
CTF on Exile Gameplay (Boltshot) - @ 18s
CTF on Exile Gameplay w/ Bravo (Light Rifle, Sniper, Thruster Pack)
20+ min CTF on Exile Gameplay w/ Nak3d Eli - Lots of new content
Halo Waypoint's Original Exile Gamplay Teaser
CTF on Exile Gameplay
HaloGAF vs 343 CTF on Exile Gameplay via Wu | HD Youtube Link
Exile Gameplay Mirror D/L Links (Plywood)
CTF on Exile Gameplay (Scorpion)

Demos
Oddball Demo on Exile
Grifball Demo in New Forge Environment*
*Grifball arena shown here is a small part of a new Forge environment

Forward Unto Dawn
New Halo 4 "Cryo" Video

Screenshots
Exile Screenshots I
Exile Screenshots II
In-game Roster Pic

Impressions
Time Glitch
Ghaleon (Part I - Movement, "Feel," Golden Tripod)
Ghaleon (Part II - AA's/Mods, New UI, Sound Design)
Heckfu

Gifs
Assassination
FOTUS Stick From the Grave
Plasma Pistol vs Ghost

Other
Halo 4 Helmets Poster
Mark VI Helmet (In-game) | Mark VI Helmet (In Menu)
Deadly Cyclone's PAX Pics I
Deadly Cyclone's PAX Pics II
Halo 4 AA's, Tactical Packages, and Support Upgrades
Kevin Grace and Kynan Pearson Interview at PAX
Xbox Press Site (Media Downloads)

*Will continue to update as I find more content.
 
S

Something Wicked

Member
Shake Appeal said:
It was weird when they talked about 'rebalancing' the Banshee so it maneuvers more slowly (and is thus more vulnerable) but fires faster (and is thus more powerful), when the problem most people seemed to have with the Banshee in Reach was that it was simultaneously too powerful and too vulnerable. It's like they set out to make it even more of a glass cannon than it was before, likely shortening average lifespans for both Banshee pilots and those on foot. That doesn't make sense to me.

Why not make the Banshee more nimble, more challenging to fly and fight (in terms of its maneuvering), and more of a suppression/assistance vehicle rather than being a easy-to-use devastating killing machine for the thirty seconds it can stay in the air before being shredded by small arms?

It seems to be a game where you die frequently, but that's not punishing because you can just jump back in and rack up more points, brah. Comeback kill, you bad thing you! I like slower-paced building of sprees, staying alive, withdrawing from situations to fight another day, while from all the footage I've seen 343 seem to want to make everything as cluttered and hectic as possible.
Click to expand...

You basically summarized my feelings on the Reach Banshee and it sucks the Banshee may be even worse in Halo 4. The Banshee used to be my favorite vehicle in Halo 2/3, and I got pretty good at weaving in and out of battles, harassing infantry, and allowing my teammates to mop 'em up. I would very rarely attempt splatters, as getting "skyjacked" was perhaps the most shameful thing for Banshee pilot. Also, staying out of plasma grenade arc range and avoiding/flying behind cover in areas of the map most likely to have opponents holding anti-air weapons were important in the Halo 2/3 as well. The Reach Banshee is just a clunky, ticking time tomb, yet with a sizable turbo boost, which only encourages mindless splatter and up-close bomb attacks. The skill of piloting is lost, and so is the fun.

And for Halo 4 in general, it does seem to encourage "clusterfuck" type battles, akin to Reach's underwhelming Invasion mode. BTB games become stupid when everyone's essentially funneled into one confined area of a map for the entire match. Set weapon locations were important to spread players around a given map to prevent such "clusterfucks."


GhaleonEB said:
I didn't have to adjust this time around; I was just parking grenades where I wanted them to go. I think that means they throw similar to Reach, since that's what I'm used to.
Click to expand...

While I like hearing that the default grenade damaged has been lessened, but if grenade tossing precision is again lessened, like in Reach, then even a "classic" playlist would not stop H4 from being less fun than H1-3 to me.



As for some positives, I do like the supposedly somewhat larger sized maps. They absolutely needed to be so, as with sprint being a default option this time. And the Warthog looks useful again, as it seems the 'Hog won't tip over from driving over a small pebble, like in Reach.
 
B

Brolic Gaoler

formerly Alienshogun
kylej said:
No he said the UI team had planned on implementing it but he wasn't sure what the status was.



Yep. The refusal to allow you to change settings that only you are privy to - that do not interfere in any way with other people's enjoyment of the game - is truly mind-numbing.
Click to expand...

Ah, I must have missed that one.
 
M

Mister Negative

Member
so the flag carrier has a waypoint over him and you pick up the flag whenever you walk near it

hahahahaa what the fuck 343 why would you do something like that


edit: thanks so much, homeboyd. i chose a bad time to stop paying attention and that helps a lot.
 
H

Homeboyd

Member
Slightly Live said:
You've missed the amazing, officially leaked leaks. :D
Click to expand...
lol I thought about posting those... and then I saw the reaction to them the first go around. Should I add them?

I clicked your spoilers, btw, and was unaffected by them haha... I don't keep up with a lot of the canon/lore, etc.. so it didn't do much for me.
 
S

Shake Appeal

Member
heckfu said:
The announcer is not a huge deal. You hear him but I can't express how frenetic a lot of the gameplay is, it is super helpful to have him yell "kill the carrier" or whatever.

And what a silly criticism, he already used to yell "flag taken" so how is a change in wording any different?
Click to expand...
Right now it has a distinct sound cue (a little whining sound), then the announcement "Kill their carrier!", then a constant waypoint saying "KILL". When you kill the carrier it says, surprise, "Carrier kill!", while the flag waypoint changes to read "PROTECT 0:30", counting down, accompanied by the helpful announcement "Protect your flag!" and a print to the left side of the screen reading "ENEMY TEAM DROPPED YOUR FLAG", and then, if it's not picked up again -- restarting the whole process -- it finally announces, "Flag reset!" (and prints "RED/BLUE TEAM FLAG RESET" to the left side of the screen).

Which is all fine in context (and not that different from earlier games), when it's not being spammed as a result of the aforementioned frenetic gameplay, and I actually really like the KILL, PROTECT, and ESCORT waypoints (though I think "KILL" should only be visible when the carrier is) and understand their inclusion. But it starts to get kind of tiring once it's intermingled with a constant barrage of other announcements and text in two different places (for things as mundane as "KILL" or "ASSIST" or "RELOAD THIS" -- which bear in mind will also have medals popping out in the final build, more than ever before). And some of these are downright condescending: the game announces "Carrying flag" when you walk over it, in case you didn't realize. And in case you really didn't realize you get "CARRYING FLAG" at the top of your screen over an insert bigger than your health bar. Don't get me started on Oddball's "+5 BALL HOLDER!"

Also, one of the major things for expert players is that "Flag dropped" and "Flag taken" were passive voice. "Kill their carrier" and "Protect your flag" are active commands, and risk being patronizing, or even downright obnoxious when you're trying to do what you are told and repeatedly failing (Ghaleon alluded to exactly this, in fact). And it all adds to the sneaking (and likely unfair) suspicion some long-terms fans have that 343 doesn't really care about courting them as much as it does dredging in a larger fanbase with all these added tooltips and backpatting announcements. When Frankie appeals to focus testing and so on, as true as that may all be, it gets established fans' heckles up. Because they are not in the focus groups, but they have a strong suspicion of who is.

None of this is helped by 343's dearth of explanation to those same long-term fans. 343 are obviously passionate people who go out of their way to engage with the likes of us both here and in person, but the general marketing and explanation of what we are seeing (courtesy of noisy, fuzzy, off-screen youtubes from diligent fans) has been, well, lacking.
 
FUNKNOWN iXi

FUNKNOWN iXi

Member
Shake Appeal said:
It seems to be a game where you die frequently, but that's not punishing because you can just jump back in and rack up more points, brah. Comeback kill, you bad thing you! I like slower-paced building of sprees, staying alive, withdrawing from situations to fight another day, while from all the footage I've seen 343 seem to want to make everything as cluttered and hectic as possible.
Click to expand...

lmfao frikkin hilarious whenever you mock the new notifications.. Rock on with your bad self! You score that damn flag!

*Ordance Ready*

-Right on D-Pad for high five!-
 
K

kylej

Banned
Shake Appeal said:
Right now it has a distinct sound cue (a little whining sound), then the announcement "Kill their carrier!", then a constant waypoint saying "KILL". When you kill the carrier it says, surprise, "Carrier kill!", while the flag waypoint changes to read "PROTECT 0:30", counting down, accompanied by the helpful announcement "Protect your flag!" and a print to the left side of the screen reading "ENEMY TEAM DROPPED YOUR FLAG", and then, if it's not picked up again -- restarting the whole process -- it finally announces, "Flag reset!" (and prints "RED/BLUE TEAM FLAG RESET" to the left side of the screen).
Click to expand...

Which wouldn't be an issue if you could disable... any of it. Oh well.
 
Vire

Vire

Member
Shake Appeal said:
None of this is helped by 343's dearth of explanation to those same long-term fans. 343 are obviously passionate people who go out of their way to engage with the likes of us both here and in person, but the general marketing and explanation of what we are seeing (courtesy of noisy, fuzzy, off-screen youtubes from diligent fans) has been, well, lacking.
Click to expand...

We just got a 10 minute Behind the Scenes look. I don't think now is the best time to complain about lack of inside scoops.

There will be a time and place for a multiplayer ViDoc, and I'm certain it'll happen, but let's enjoy this one for now. :)
 
V

ViewtifulJC

Banned
Vire said:
We just got a 10 minute Behind the Scenes ViDoc. I don't think now is the best time to complain about lack of inside scoops.

There will be a time and place for a multiplayer ViDoc, and I'm certain it'll happen, but let's enjoy this one for now. :)
Click to expand...

Fans have questions about the changes made to CTF

Release 10-min campaign vidoc

/343marketing
 
T

thezerofire

Banned
I think I'd be less annoyed about the constant announcing if there were a couple options regarding it. First, an option to turn it off, except for stuff that was announced previously. A Classic Announcer, if you will. And Second, an option for Quake/Unreal style announcing

Also if the guy didn't put quite so much emphasis on every single thing he says
 
Vire

Vire

Member
ViewtifulJC said:
Fans have questions about the changes made to CTF

Release 10-min campaign vidoc

/343marketing
Click to expand...

Let me rephrase that for you

*NeoGAF have questions about the changes made to CTF

Release 10 min campaign vidoc.

Believe it or not, there's more Halo fans out there than just GAF and a video like this has way more utility than just serving the hardcore.
 
T

The P of Poland

Member
Vire said:
Let me rephrase that for you

*NeoGAF have questions about the changes made to CTF

Release 10 min campaign vidoc.

Believe it or not, there's more Halo fans out there than just GAF.
Click to expand...

Do you honestly think GAF is the only place that is puzzled and somewhat angry over these changes?
 
R

Ragnarok Flames

Banned
Vire said:
Let me rephrase that for you

*NeoGAF have questions about the changes made to CTF

Release 10 min campaign vidoc.

Believe it or not, there's more Halo fans out there than just GAF.
Click to expand...

GAF, THC, gameinformer forums, IGN, gamefaqs. They all had concerns about the flag thing. but 343 decides to release a campaign vidoc instead
 
L

L1NETT

Member
Ragnarok Flames said:
GAF, THC, gameinformer forums, IGN, gamefaqs. They all had concerns about the flag thing. but 343 decides to release a campaign vidoc instead
Click to expand...

And there are probably millions of Halo fans who would never even go near a Halo or even game forum who want Campaign stuff.

I understand where you are coming, but there are a lot of other Halo fans many of whom love campaign.
 
S

Shake Appeal

Member
Vire said:
Believe it or not, there's more Halo fans out there than just GAF and a video like this has way more utility than just serving the hardcore.
Click to expand...
You can both produce and release an awesome Campaign Vidoc and announce, explain, discuss, and even defend multiplayer design decisions through a variety of avenues, perhaps even in advance of confused fan footage leaking out, so that you are conditioning the responses people are inevitably going to have to changes to a decade-old franchise people feel like stakeholders in.

Here's an example of how it might be done:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hzpbrNdZk0w
 
Vire

Vire

Member
L1NETT said:
And there are probably millions of Halo fans who would never even go near a Halo or even game forum who want Campaign stuff.

I understand where you are coming, but there are a lot of other Halo fans many of whom love campaign.
Click to expand...

Lemme explain it slowly for them.

I was watching the "A Hero Awakens" video with my lady friend and she was absolutely blown away by the visuals. Even she, showed interest in seeing this game and she isn't a gamer.

A video that explains the inner workings and minutia of Capture The Flag, is not going to do anything for the average consumer. If anything, it might turn them off. It's not going to determine if they purchase a game or not.

Personally, I'm more excited about the campaign, so I much rather see something like this.

Creating ViDocs take a lot of time and effort, your questions will be answered in due time.
 
M

Mister Negative

Member
Hydranockz said:
They decided to release a campaign ViDoc looooong before anyone had any questions about the flag :p
Click to expand...

the point remains that 343 has done very little clarifying on what they think the changes they've made to one of the the franchise's classic gametypes bring to the table.

i'd love to see a large post on waypoint about just why it was that they made the controversial decisions that they made, because right now, the only thing I can think of is "make the game easier to appeal to the casuals"
 
R

Ryaaan14

Banned
Mister Negative said:
the point remains that 343 has done very little clarifying on what they think the changes they've made to one of the the franchise's classic gametypes bring to the table.

i'd love to see a large post on waypoint about just why it was that they made the controversial decisions that they made, because right now, the only thing I can think of is "make the game easier to appeal to the casuals"
Click to expand...

If players are finding things out firsthand before they're even announced, we sure as fuck aren't going to be given detailed explainations about why they made those decisions. They have made themselves pretty clear through their actions how they feel about the design changes. It is all shady as hell, and as much as I respect them, I feel like a fool making up excuses for them in my mind.
 
G

Gui_PT

Member
thezerofire said:
I think if a spartan is able to throw a ball, they should be able to throw a flag. Hell, let us impale people with a thrown flag
Click to expand...

2338374_o.gif
 
S

Shake Appeal

Member
Vire said:
Lemme explain it slowly for them.

I was watching the "A Hero Awakens" video with my lady friend and she was absolutely blown away by the visuals. Even she, showed interest in seeing this game and she isn't a gamer.

A video that explains the inner workings and minutia of Capture The Flag, is not going to do anything for the average consumer. If anything, it might turn them off. It's not going to determine if they purchase a game or not.

Personally, I'm more excited about the campaign, so I much rather see something like this.

Creating ViDocs take a lot of time and effort, your questions will be answered in due time.
Click to expand...
Different audiences, different spaces, different content. I fully appreciate the Campaign Vidoc is what should be shown at PAX, and why.

But if 343 had released -- months ago, via the Bulletin -- direct feed footage of a CTF game with commentary and explanation (and heavy caveats about changes and tweaks and alpha content) they could satisfy their base while showing that they "get" how the game is played by its devoted fans and presenting their vision for how it should be played. They could wink at the idea that they are curators of a franchise, and the fans its constituents, and most importantly get out ahead of potential objections before forums everywhere start frothing.

We live in an age of digital media and fractured audiences. It is no big deal to do this stuff, it's the best way to engage the hard core of your audience, and it's much cheaper to produce, and to place, than Vidocs or inaccurate IGN articles.
 
H

Hydranockz

Member
Mister Negative said:
the point remains that 343 has done very little clarifying on what they think the changes they've made to one of the the franchise's classic gametypes bring to the table.
Click to expand...

Totally areed but I'm just saying that the decision to release a ViDoc on Storytelling was made quite a while ago.

I'd rather they fully disclose the Multiplayer ViDoc clser to launch incase anything changes between now and then.

Example: 343 releases a MP ViDoc yesterday. The video details how the flag cannot be dropped as well as numerous changes. But, between PAX and let's say 2 weeks before release, they change it so the flag can be dropped, it'll render the 'MP Explanation ViDoc' obselete and no longer useful.

The approach to Storytelling between now and launch isn't going to change. Different beasts. Like I've been saying, by all means, tell us more about the toys. Promothean and Covie weapons, armour mods, spartan customisation, the deal with sharks/rays/unicorns/wolves and everything else but only if that's how they'll be once the game is in my hands.
 
T

Tha Robbertster

Member
So from that Walshy video, it seems that the light rifle is a 4-shot kill unscoped and a 5-shot kill when scoped. Also, the standard shield recharge time is 6 seconds.

I couldn't really tell how many shots the BR needed to kill but it still looked like a 5-shot kill :(
 
Vire

Vire

Member
Ryaaan14 said:
If players are finding things out firsthand before they're even announced, we sure as fuck aren't going to be given detailed explainations about why they made those decisions. They have made themselves pretty clear through their actions how they feel about the design changes. It is all shady as hell, and as much as I respect them, I feel like a fool making up excuses for them in my mind.
Click to expand...

The sense of entitlement here is pretty embarrassing. They don't owe anyone any explanation to be honest. They make the changes they make because they feel it'll improve the game somehow.

They put out a product and whether you like it or not is up for debate, but that's an entirely different point.

Would it be nice if they did so in a bulletin or something? Absolutely, but it's hardly necessary.

Sometimes you guys come off as petulant crying children.
 
D

Devolution

Member
Demoncarnotaur said:
Exactly, while she certainly looks like she could be a real woman, they exaggerated her features from past iterations seemingly to make her more sexy, which is strange since she was fine before. Now she is super curvy, with huge hips and plus sized breasts and it just seems weird for Cortana. As you said, its not an unbelievable body type, but for her it seems out of place.
Click to expand...

Ironically I have less of an issue with it in DoA like games. Shit isn't meant to be taken seriously. Devs talk a lot about immersion then create characters or morph the physicality of characters into nothing but fappable material, for me that just breaks immersion and the idea that the game is supposed to be seriously. I hate to harp on it but it's one of the things that just drives me further away from gaming, the idea that every female NPC or character model is designed like a barbie.
 
H

Homeboyd

Member
thezerofire said:
Hell, let us impale people with a thrown flag
Click to expand...
Yeah, this would be awesome.

JAVELIN'D

As others have mentioned, the non-ability to drop the flag seems like it would suck (considering the accidental pick ups that basically lead to losing your weapons, esp. if you had rockets or some other power weapon), but the waypoint is the bigger issue for me. I LOVED going for sneaky steals/caps. Clearing out the base, stealing the flag and trying to sneak out/kill enemies as they try to find you was always a lot of fun for me. I could request help from my teammates to secure the safe sneak out and it felt great to take the long route back to my base and cap the flag.

Now as soon as you grab the flag you have to book it straight back home as the whole team will be on you the second you touch it. I get the intent and it may work out in the games as I haven't played any Halo 4 yet, I just prefer my old playstyle in CTF matches. I was never great at juggling (and still preferred sneaking the flag anyways) so I'm really not sure how this will work out for players like myself. As with everything else, I'm still more than happy to give these new things a try before I judge, but I'm hoping the option to alt these things is fairly simple if it does play out like most of us think it will.
 
S

Shake Appeal

Member
Vire said:
They put out a product and whether you like it or not is up for debate...
Click to expand...
Marketers who still think like this in 2012 make less money. They aren't selling toothpaste, or a hit movie. They are the stewards of an evolving, participative franchise with rules, both explicit and implicit, understood and negotiated by an audience of millions, an audience which cares deeply about the slightest addition or alteration to those rules. They do better, everyone does better, when a release cycle is a conversation among stakeholders.
 
T

The Librarian

Banned
ViewtifulJC said:
No fuckin' shit, boys.
Click to expand...
The way the post is structured is what's at fault. It implies that all of these decisions are made in one day, or on the fly, rather than being planned out. For all we know, discussion of fans' questions surrounding CTF changes could be coming in a short while. I'm open to the argument that 343 should have understood that fans would have questions surrounding the changes and should have rolled out appropriate answers alongside the reveal, but if that's coming within the next one or two weeks, a "CTF" bulletin so to speak, I don't see the problem with releasing a ten-minute ViDoc at the panel instead.
 
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