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Hi-Def Media Lovefest: The war is over and we can all go home.

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S

StoOgE

First tragedy, then farce.
Maxwell House said:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=915664&page=36

If true, I know what I am buying my family for Christmas. :D

I doubt the HD-DVD player price is true, but the $14.88 HD-DVD sale does seem to have merit. I hope that's true. I need to buy more movies.
Click to expand...

If HDDVD players are 100 bucks even for a day, that is huge. Also, I bought an HDA2 like a month ago for 240 bucks. Oh well.

If true.. 100 bucks + 5 free movies = free standalone player. Your just paying for the movies.
 
S

StoOgE

First tragedy, then farce.
WULFER said:
Stooge I totally agree with you. I was so looking forward to seeing Spider-man 3 (even went a one of the special previews and I walked out thinking I paid for that? It's like the director had no care in how he used Venom and I was pissed because of that! Don't get me started on the Peter I've cool coffee pub scene (I thought to myself what the hell is this shit) for 10-15 minutes. Sandman was the only thing done right in this movie! I too still love Spider-man 1&2 but, I'm going to forget Spider-man 3 was ever made!
Click to expand...

I thought Sandman was done pretty badly as well. The charachter was "right", but they just kinda threw his story at you real quick. Because of the amount of stuff they tried to jam in the script everything just felt rush. There was just too much going on, and alot of it (That 70s show guy, Venom, emo peter, dance club peter) was bad/out of place.

The only really good stuff in the movie was Harry forcing MJ to break up with Pete. Then the coffee scene later between him and Pete. There was a real good movie hidden in some of those scenes. Instead they just dumped that story, threw in some amnesia for good measure then just ruined everything with the butler "I saw it all, I know everything" Deus Ex Machine fluff at the end.

Then Venom teams up with sandman out of nowhere? :lol

This was just a bad movie. They didnt know what they wanted to do with it at all.. its kinda like the old football axiom, if you have 2 QB's you have none. If you have 10 subplots all competing with each other you have none.
 
V

VanMardigan

has calmed down a bit.
Kolgar said:
Fo realz.

http://www.bestbuy.com/site/olspage.jsp?skuId=8021767&type=product&id=1158323325814

What the hell is going on?
Click to expand...


We knew HD DVD was going to be competivively priced this holiday season, but I don't think anybody expected it this fast, this aggressive, this soon.

BRD companies have had to drop their prices as well. No way that new Panny sells for $499 if HD DVD isn't around.

Gentlemen, this war just got real. Neither side is playing around now

Oh snap, it's SOLD OUT. That was quick.
 
S

sonycowboy

Member
Cold-Steel said:
Oddly enough, I felt the same way.

I absolutely hated Spiderman 3 after seeing it in theatres. But now that I've run through the movie (on its own) the second time, I find myself actually liking it.

Spiderman 2 > Spiderman > Spiderman 3.

That's exactly how it should be.
Click to expand...

The original holds up better to repeated viewings than S2 does, IMO. Plus, I'm a sucker for the origin parts. Geeky Peter, cute Mary Jane, getting powers, fight w/ Flash, etc.

S2 just didn't have the charm of the original, although it had much better action sequences, and much better villain (you just can't go wrong with Alfred Molina).
 
D

DC R1D3R

Banned
VanMardigan said:
We knew HD DVD was going to be competivively priced this holiday season, but I don't think anybody expected it this fast, this aggressive, this soon.

BRD companies have had to drop their prices as well. No way that new Panny sells for $499 if HD DVD isn't around.

Gentlemen, this war just got real. Neither side is playing around now
Click to expand...

This will definately seperate the men from the boys.
 
I

Ignatz Mouse

Banned
Well, if Warner goes HD, this'll make it a lot easier to switch-- which was part of my justification for being an early adopter int eh first place.
 
O

Oni Jazar

Member
Warener is waiting until 2008 to decide exclusivitiy:

"A Warner source said the studio is watching what happens now that Wal-Mart and other big retailers are selling entry-level Toshiba HD DVD players for less than $200, about half what the cheapest Blu-ray player costs. If there is a significant spike in HD DVD software sales, the studio may cast its lot with that format, whereas if there is no real impact, Warner may go Blu-ray only."
Click to expand...

http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/hr/content_display/news/e3ic868cb7073298c939b2bb7aed90a45d6

Told ya so.
 
O

Oni Jazar

Member
Sales for top HDM titles:

bd1_3.jpg


http://www.watch.impress.co.jp/av/docs/20071031/bd1.htm

Also here's a slightly older (no Transformers) but more lenghy (top 20) list:

http://www.hometheaterforum.com/blu/Welcome.html

Code: 
1  300                  BD       Warner
2  Casino Royale        BD       Sony
3  300                  HD DVD   Warner
4  The Departed         BD       Warner
5  Planet Earth         HD DVD   BBC Video
6  PotC DMC             BD       Disney
7  Planet Earth         BD       BBC Video
8  PotC CBP             BD       Disney
9  Apocalypto           BD       Disney
10 Ghost Rider          BD       Sony 
11 The Departed         HD DVD   Warner
12 Batman Begins        HD DVD   Warner
13 The Prestige         BD       Disney
14 Night at the Museum  BD       Fox
15 Black Hawk Down      BD       Sony
16 Deja vu              BD       Disney
17 Happy Feet           BD       Warner
18 Crank                BD       Lionsgate
19 Superman Returns     BD       Warner
20 Underworld Evolution BD       Sony
 
I

Ignatz Mouse

Banned
One thing to note is that Warner is looking at software sales, not player sales ("standalone" or not). Which is what a bunch of us have been saying all along.
 
I

Ignatz Mouse

Banned
If we take that unnamed source at its word, it would seem that today's press conference is a public statement that they are going to decide to back one format, and that they will decide after Q4 is over. Which seems more likely that declaring outright, for the following reasons:

1) They have a bunch of stuff announced (and probably produced) already
2) Q4 will likely do more business than the rest of the year put together
and the real kicker....
3) announcing this now gives all the players time to jack up the size of their moneyhats
 
S

StoOgE

First tragedy, then farce.
Ignatz Mouse said:
If we take that unnamed source at its word, it would seem that today's press conference is a public statement that they are going to decide to back one format, and that they will decide after Q4 is over. Which seems more likely that declaring outright, for the following reasons:

1) They have a bunch of stuff announced (and probably produced) already
2) Q4 will likely do more business than the rest of the year put together
and the real kicker....
3) announcing this now gives all the players time to jack up the size of their moneyhats
Click to expand...

number 3 is the real key.

If you read what that "source" says, its says they are looking for a bounce in HDDVD sales. So, at the end of the year they can say

1) HDDVD sales went up we are HDDVD exclusive.
2) BRD outsold HDDVD, we are BRD exclusive.

Most likely both 1 and 2 will be true, but they could use either as justification for the moneyhatz.
 
K

Kolgar

Member
Ignatz Mouse said:
One thing to note is that Warner is looking at software sales, not player sales ("standalone" or not). Which is what a bunch of us have been saying all along.
Click to expand...

Zuh? I've seen more than one quote from Warner recently, specifically stating that they are interested in hardware sales and that they would prefer not to rely heavily on a game console.
 
M

Mrbob

Member
Does Wal Mart offer their specials online?

I will bite on a 99 dollar A2 player, but there is no way in hell I am traversing Wal Mart on Black Friday. Don't want to get trampled.
 
B

Bulla564

Banned
Despite the aggressive pricing, it is bad for HD-DVD that Warner will be looking at this Holiday season for who comes out on top software-wise.
 
I

Ignatz Mouse

Banned
Kolgar said:
Zuh? I've seen more than one quote from Warner recently, specifically stating that they are interested in hardware sales and that they would prefer not to rely heavily on a game console.
Click to expand...

We've got an article right here referencing a source (unnamed) that says otherwise.

You got links? I've heard that line from many a fanboy or "avs insider" never in an actual article.
 
Alcibiades

Alcibiades

Member
Mrbob said:
Does Wal Mart offer their specials online?

I will bite on a 99 dollar A2 player, but there is no way in hell I am traversing Wal Mart on Black Friday. Don't want to get trampled.
Click to expand...
two things:

1. it's just a rumor, the $99 price could be (probably is?) complete BS

2. the rumor says it's for THIS friday, not black friday...


the $14.99 software sounds plausible, it's only $5 cheaper than their normal prices for old titles...
 
K

Kolgar

Member
Ignatz Mouse said:
We've got an article right here referencing a source (unnamed) that says otherwise.

You got links? I've heard that line from many a fanboy or "avs insider" never in an actual article.
Click to expand...

You'll have to take my word. Or don't. They're out there. I've seen them. But I'm at work and I'm already taking up enough bandwidth waiting for news or not without scouring around looking for press quotes. ;)
 
I

Ignatz Mouse

Banned
Kolgar said:
You'll have to take my word. Or don't. They're out there. I've seen them. But I'm at work and I'm already taking up enough bandwidth waiting for news or not without scouring around looking for press quotes. ;)
Click to expand...

I have *never* seen a WB guy (or anyone outside of Toshiba or Universal) take that line. And I've been watching for it.
 
M

mrklaw

MrArseFace
"One thing that may be changing is our strategy," he said. "When both formats launched and hardware prices were high, we made a decision to support both formats and let the consumer decide. But now that hardware pricing is affordable for both Blu-ray and HD DVD, it appears consumers no longer want to decide — so the notion of staying in two formats for the duration is something we are re-evaluating now that we are in the fourth quarter."
Click to expand...

This doesn't suggest they are waiting to see how things go. It suggests they've already done that, and don't think they can leave the market to decide on its own.
 
M

MechDX

Member
Alcibiades said:
two things:

1. it's just a rumor, the $99 price could be (probably is?) complete BS

2. the rumor says it's for THIS friday, not black friday...


the $14.99 software sounds plausible, it's only $5 cheaper than their normal prices for old titles...
Click to expand...


The $98 for the player is incorrect from my latest info, the $14.88 titles are real.
 
Goldrusher

Goldrusher

Member
I'm not so sure if a really low priced HD-DVD player is the best thing to do...
People will think it's just some kind of upscaling DVD player...an HD DVD player.
 
O

Oni Jazar

Member
Goldrusher said:
I'm not so sure if a really low priced HD-DVD player is the best thing to do...
People will think it's just some kind of upscaling DVD player...an HD DVD player.
Click to expand...

I would think so as well unless they are packing in an HD DVD movie.
 
V

VanMardigan

has calmed down a bit.
Ignatz Mouse said:
I have *never* seen a WB guy (or anyone outside of Toshiba or Universal) take that line. And I've been watching for it.
Click to expand...

You see what you want to see, mousey. WB has repeatedly stated that they think standalone sales are the real barometer for format success, not trojan horse consoles. It has definitely been brought up in this thread before, but like I said I don't expect you to remember. I did a quick google search and found this quote from July:

gamesdog.uk said:
Earlier this week sales figures from the European HD DVD Promotion Group announced that Toshiba has taken a leading share of the European market for standalone high definition players, according to independent pan-European research by GfK.

Following what they describe as a strong period of sales and momentum for the format, HD DVD’s share of the market averaged 74% from January to May 2007.

Taking a swipe at the Blu-ray stats that are bolstered by the number of PS3's sold, Steve Nickerson, senior vice president, high hefinition media at Warner Bros sates:

"These figures are especially important because the standalone player market is by far the biggest driver of movie sales in the long-term."

"This is simply because those who buy a standalone player are interested solely in buying and watching movies and other video content, whereas those with HD drives built into games consoles are primarily interested in games."
Click to expand...

edit:

Strange for Disney to be so vocal. I would have expected a more measured response.
Click to expand...

What are you referring to? I've only seen recent quotes from Warner and Fox on here.
 
G

gkryhewy

Member
sonycowboy's article post said:
The publication writes that Warner is watching how the Toshiba sub-$200 HD DVD player performs over the next several weeks. If there's little impact on sales, Warner may endorse Blu-ray
Click to expand...

Wow, way to slant the Hollywood Reporter article. Christ.

EDIT: Wait - what happened to the article?
 
S

sonycowboy

Member
gkrykewy said:
Wow, way to slant the Hollywood Reporter article. Christ.

EDIT: Wait - what happened to the article?
Click to expand...

It had already been posted before essentially from HollywoodReporter.com, only without the part about Disney blasting the HD-DVD camp.
 
O

Oni Jazar

Member
sonycowboy said:
Strange for Disney to be so vocal. I would have expected a more measured response.
Click to expand...

Disney has been quite strong in their BD support. They have put multi-page ads in HM zines that go into detail the success and benefits of blu-ray. People keep assuming that they are willing to go neutral at the first hint of failure but if you look at what they have done I won't be surprised if they stay BD longer then even Fox would.
 
M

mrklaw

MrArseFace
*software* is what will drive the market in the short term. I agree that standalone players will be the overall market driver in the long term, but what do you define as 'long term'? i wouldn't define current sales as long term.

So PS3 can be a perfectly valid means to drive software sales to a point where bluray is a successful format, and then lower priced standalone players will take over as prices come down.

Warner's comments about standalones don't mean that they tend towards HDDVD just because HDDVD are selling more now.

Of course its possible for it to be interpreted that way if desired.
 
I

Ignatz Mouse

Banned
When the cheapest standalone BluRay player *is* a PS3, you can't completely discount it. People who would otherwise buy just a player may buy it because it's the cheapest option, not to mention has advanced features.
 
K

Kolgar

Member
Sorry Ignatz, no link, but I came across one of the statements I mentioned, from an interview with TWICE.

TWICE: What do you expect will happen?

Sanders: It’s really hard to handicap. I can’t tell, which side, if any, will win.

Right now it’s like a Mexican standoff. If the consumer continues to support both formats, the industry will as well.

It will be really pivotal what Toshiba does this fourth quarter in hardware.

If they sell through everything they ship, and it’s a big number at the price points that are coming out, then I think [HD DVD] will be around for a long time. If they don’t, then it could go Blu-ray’s way.

But Toshiba is getting very, very aggressive on pricing, which is putting pressure on Blu-ray player manufacturers to bring prices down. As a content company we just want more hardware in the homes. So whatever drives more hardware is good to see. Right now it looks like there is price pressure on both sides because there are two formats — more pressure than there would be if there was only one format.

So, for our interests, more razors means we’ll sell more razor blades down the road.
Click to expand...

So, now announcement today? :lol
 
D

dallow_bg

nods at old men
Cosmic Bus said:
Didn't see it mentioned yet, but BD+ -- one of those key factors for Fox and Buena Vista -- has apparently already been cracked after less than a month.
Click to expand...
It was mentioned and I think debunked.

I think someone said that from the info it works 20% of the time, and even then, they can just change something on the disc, and the the old system won't work.

OR SOMETHING.

I'm glad to see Wall Street get announced for BD.
 
O

OokieSpookie

Banned
Kolgar said:
Sorry Ignatz, no link, but I came across one of the statements I mentioned, from an interview with TWICE.



So, now announcement today? :lol
Click to expand...

Nothing in that quote says anything about "stand alone" sales, so it does nothing for the point you were trying to make.
BR still and will continue to have that advantage ( as much as people seem to enjoy not counting the PS3)

Edit: Sorry it was Van who was saying stand alone sales.
 
K

Kolgar

Member
OokieSpookie said:
Nothing in that quote says anything about "stand alone" sales, so it does nothing for the point you were trying to make.
BR still and will continue to have that advantage ( as much as people seem to enjoy not counting the PS3)

Edit: Sorry it was Van who was saying stand alone sales.
Click to expand...

This quote addresses hardware sales--it was a DIFFERENT quote that addresses standalones, and no, it's not the same one Van quoted.

But as I told Ignatz, I'm at work and don't have time for Easter-egg quote hunts right now. :)
 
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