You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an alternative browser.
You should upgrade or use an alternative browser.
Hillary Clinton to CNN: "I will be the nominee"
- Thread starter Fracas
- Start date
- Status
- Not open for further replies.
Pretty much. Even if it does go to a contested convention (it won't, Hillary will win by a landslide in California) pretty much all the delegates will still vote for Hillary.
In fact, I'll straight up say it...if Donald Trump is elected President, it's Bernie Sanders' fault.
No, it will be Clinton's fault for not being a honest person. She tries to cater to everyone. I hope Bernie runs 3rd Party so I can vote for him.
boiled goose
good with gravy
Pretty much. Even if it does go to a contested convention (it won't, Hillary will win by a landslide in California) pretty much all the delegates will still vote for Hillary.
In fact, I'll straight up say it...if Donald Trump is elected President, it's Bernie Sanders' fault.
Nah, If Hillary loses it is her fault and that of the democrats who propped up a weak candidate.
No, it will be Clinton's fault for not being a honest person. She tries to cater to everyone. I hope Bernie runs 3rd Party so I can vote for him.
Bernie won't run third party and running third party would be stupid.
He had the courage to run against Hillary as a progressive foil when no one else stepped up, ran a competitive campaign, and unfortunately lost.
Hillary has flaws, but come GE time the contrast between Trump and Hillary will be stark. Think Hillary is in bed with Wall Street? Sure, well Trump just said he would repeal Dodd Frank....
DragonSworne
Banned
No, it will be Clinton's fault for not being a honest person. She tries to cater to everyone. I hope Bernie runs 3rd Party so I can vote for him.
You can still vote for Bernie in the general election even if he doesn't run. Nothing is stopping you from writing in a name.
Are you sure there isn't another reason why you want Bernie to run third party?
Suikoguy
I whinny my fervor lowly, for his length is not as great as those of the Hylian war stallions
Pretty much. Even if it does go to a contested convention (it won't, Hillary will win by a landslide in California) pretty much all the delegates will still vote for Hillary.
In fact, I'll straight up say it...if Donald Trump is elected President, it's Bernie Sanders' fault.
Too early to say that.
If Sanders makes a decent effort in bridging the divide (he mostly created mind you), and Clinton still loses, it will have probably been something else.
Pretty much. Even if it does go to a contested convention (it won't, Hillary will win by a landslide in California) pretty much all the delegates will still vote for Hillary.
In fact, I'll straight up say it...if Donald Trump is elected President, it's Bernie Sanders' fault.
I was waiting for NeoGAF to get to this narrative point. Glad to see it didn't take long.
The NYT/CBS poll from yesterday showed that more Bernie supporters say they will vote for Clinton then Hillary votes said they would vote for Obama in May 2008.
May 2008 60% of Hillary supports will vote for Obama
May 2016 72% of Bernie supports will vote for Hillary
Yes but if Sanders doesnt get behind Clinton the way she got behind Obama, I could see those numbers flipping. Still an interesting stat.
Mushroomer25
Member
While I see how you could make this conclusion, it's just too early to say. If Sanders hasn't endorsed her by September and the polls have Hillary losing (with holdout Bernie voters being the difference) - then we can talk about the man throwing the election.Pretty much. Even if it does go to a contested convention (it won't, Hillary will win by a landslide in California) pretty much all the delegates will still vote for Hillary.
In fact, I'll straight up say it...if Donald Trump is elected President, it's Bernie Sanders' fault.
Pretty much. Even if it does go to a contested convention (it won't, Hillary will win by a landslide in California) pretty much all the delegates will still vote for Hillary.
In fact, I'll straight up say it...if Donald Trump is elected President, it's Bernie Sanders' fault.
He'll certainly deserve part of the blame.
To think I started this cycle supporting him... Never again. Hopefully the party just lets him wither away on an island all by himself after this. Hope it was worth his moment in the sun.
I was waiting for NeoGAF to get to this narrative point. Glad to see it didn't take long.
Do you ever have anything substantive to add to any conversation? All you do is show up and complain about any criticism thrown Bernie's way... So how about this- Try actively engaging in the conversation.
Yes but if Sanders doesnt get behind Clinton the way she got behind Obama, I could see those numbers flipping. Still an interesting stat.
I said it in another thread but Obama's going to have to give the speech of his life at the convention.
RustyNails
Member
Exact same reasoning people voted for Ralph Nader.Nah, If Hillary loses it is her fault and that of the democrats who propped up a weak candidate.
No, it will be Clinton's fault for not being a honest person. She tries to cater to everyone. I hope Bernie runs 3rd Party so I can vote for him.
Do you care if your vote matters? Do you care if a vote actively works in your self interest?
I keep seeing people on the Bernie side saying things like 'I refuse to vote against Trump. I'm voting for Bernie bc it's the right thing to do", and then people saying he will be their write in candidate. Seems bizarre and a complete misunderstanding of how the system works.
Voting isn't about feeling good, it's about getting someone in there that most aligns with your self interests while simultaneously keeping out the guy that you feel works against it. As a 3rd party candidate, a vote for Bernie is effectively a vote for Trump. No amount of fairy dust changes that.
Exact same reasoning people voted for Ralph Nader.
Yep.
There's a good chance the US never enters into the quagmire that is Iraq and the ME, no rise of Isis...
It's all about ideological purity though. Nothing else matters.
No they won't. Bernie choosing to be obstinate after the official nomination isn't going to make people who say they'll vote for the dem nominee, while Bernie is currently being obstinate, change their minds.Yes but if Sanders doesnt get behind Clinton the way she got behind Obama, I could see those numbers flipping. Still an interesting stat.
excelsiorlef
Member
I was waiting for NeoGAF to get to this narrative point. Glad to see it didn't take long.
15 pages and one person? That's a funny definition of it didnt take long
Dubbedinenglish
Banned
I'm not ignoring it, as much as I'm flat out calling it a dumb line of argument. The Republican attack machine argument is the same one Obama supporters were being feeding 2008 in by Clinton supporters then (I was here). Maybe it works this time, maybe it doesn't, but there's only one way to really find out.
As for the Florida issue, that would make more sense if, you know, Clinton didn't have a 30-point lead in Florida for the entire duration of the primary.
As for the thin skinned thing, a) the assertion that it has sunk candidates in the past is more myth than reality and b) the Republican candidate is Trump, the most thin skinned person alive, so even if that line of argument holds water, great, no problem.
Difference is Clinton was earnestly attacking Obama. Obama was/is just so damn clean there was nothing there, the biggest thing was the preacher anti-American stuff. Sanders has piles of skeletons in his closet that hasn't been touched by the Clinton campaign, they know about it but haven't touched it. Again he completely failed in his NV response and his responses in the week before NY. He hasn't been been attacked like Obama was with more skeletons and somehow he will learn to roll with the GOP attacks in GE?
He would be a disaster.
Karsticles
Member
Wasn't there some evidence that Clinton's team started the whole "Obama is a Muslim" thing? I remember reading a Huffington Post article about it. I can find it later if anyone cares.Difference is Clinton was earnestly attacking Obama. Obama was/is just so damn clean there was nothing there, the biggest thing was the preacher anti-American stuff. Sanders has piles of skeletons in his closet that hasn't been touched by the Clinton campaign, they know about it but haven't touched it. Again he completely failed in his NV response and his responses in the week before NY. He hasn't been been attacked like Obama was with more skeletons and somehow he will learn to roll with the GOP attacks in GE?
He would be a disaster.
Wasn't there some evidence that Clinton's team started the whole "Obama is a Muslim" thing? I remember reading a Huffington Post article about it. I can find it later if anyone cares.
That claim is false
Wasn't there some evidence that Clinton's team started the whole "Obama is a Muslim" thing? I remember reading a Huffington Post article about it. I can find it later if anyone cares.
Ive seen this debunked, there is evidence that some of her supporters suggested that. But Clinton, or her campaign, or even surrogates? No evidence for that claim.
EDIT: Beaten like 08 Clinton...
DeaconKnowledge
Member
I mean, there's no way she'd choose Bernie to be her VP, right?
What would she gain by doing that?
Hellsing321
Member
Yeah he doesn't bring anything to the ticket except Bernie or bust people. I could see her offering him a cabinet position.What would she gain by doing that?
jack_package_200
Banned
What would she gain by doing that?
Not much except the Bernie or Bust crowd
It would just add a target for the GOP to attack.
I honestly think that with all his supporters and the ones he could pull from Trump, that he'd have a fighting chance.No, it will be Clinton's fault for not being a honest person. She tries to cater to everyone. I hope Bernie runs 3rd Party so I can vote for him.
T
Transhuman
Unconfirmed Member
Perfectly healthy people die from brain hemorrhages all the time.
DrForester
Kills Photobucket
I honestly think that with all his supporters and the ones he could pull from Trump, that he'd have a fighting chance.
It would result in a Trump presidency. Either by an outright win, or when no one gets enough Electoral votes and Congress decides.
TheLostBigBoss
Banned
Guys, pretty sure TheLaughingStock is just a troll trying to get you guys all up in arms
gutter_trash
Banned
Bernie supporters forget that President Obama will eventually deliver an important speech about party Unity, right?
Obama is 30 years younger but 5x wiser. Any dissenters will look extensively foolish and juvenile.
If 75 year old Bernie decides to go in kicking and screaming after a big Obama speech, Bernie will look like a senile fool
Obama is 30 years younger but 5x wiser. Any dissenters will look extensively foolish and juvenile.
If 75 year old Bernie decides to go in kicking and screaming after a big Obama speech, Bernie will look like a senile fool
bernie should probably stay in the race just in case she gets assassinated though
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/05/24/us/politics/24clinton.html
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/05/24/us/politics/24clinton.html
It would result in a Trump presidency. Either by an outright win, or when no one gets enough Electoral votes and Congress decides.
To be fair the congress would probably pick someone who isn't Trump. Probably Mitt Romney.
No, it will be Clinton's fault for not being a honest person. She tries to cater to everyone. I hope Bernie runs 3rd Party so I can vote for him.
She's an honest person in that she does try to cater to everyone. That is the job of a good politician, especially the POTUS. Once in office there needs to be some capacity to set aside Red v. Blue and even one's own ideas to instead govern in a way that best reflects the will of the American people's desires and interests (and making tough choices when those two conflict with one another, like on free trade).
Pretty much. Even if it does go to a contested convention (it won't, Hillary will win by a landslide in California) pretty much all the delegates will still vote for Hillary.
In fact, I'll straight up say it...if Donald Trump is elected President, it's Bernie Sanders' fault.
If he votes for and/or endorses Trump, sure.
Bernie Sanders' anti-trade rhetoric has done a lot of damage to the traditional democratic party platform of globalization as a net positive for Americans as well as humanity in general. That is going to take some serious time to fix, sadly enough.
But if Trump wins the people at fault will be those who voted for him. People so eager to see the "establishment" displaced as to vote for an overt fascist. It's really that simple.
Hillary Clinton is by far the best candidate we've had this cycle. She knows the job better than all the rest. She has been involved with all facets of the job and has more experience than all the rest. She is able to sublimate her own views to meet those required for pragmatic compromise and the passage of good policy to the benefit of the American people, unlike all the rest. She is even the most intelligent of all the candidates.
The choice is as clear as it can possibly be. An incredibly qualified, dedicated, and engaged woman campaigning on pragmatic progressiveness versus an exploitative con artist silver spooner who has never been challenged in his life campaigning on a platform of racist fascism and white supremacy.
How you vote decides blame. Sanders being a petulant fuck doesn't suddenly make him own the votes of his radical fringe when they "protest vote" Trump or Stein or Johnson or whatever they decide to do. They aren't automaton he controls. Hell, if/when he does eventually get behind Clinton I'm expecting some small segment to accuse him of selling out and being "bought by the establishment".
To be fair the congress would probably pick someone who isn't Trump. Probably Mitt Romney.
They can only pick a POTUS and VP from those who were on the ticket.
I'd honestly like to see him stay in the race just to give everyone a chance to vote while also getting a progressive message out to more people.bernie should probably stay in the race just in case she gets assassinated though
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/05/24/us/politics/24clinton.html
But he needs to follow Clinton's example in the 2008 race and remove the negative campaigning, the "FRAUD!" and "ESTABLISHMENT CONSPIRACY" rhetoric from his narrative. He needs to focus on what he can actually work with Clinton on to build a stronger transition to empower the only side of the political discourse who isn't looking to throw us back into the 1950's.
If she gets assassinated they'd just nominate Biden so Bernard doesn't have to worry about that and can just drop out now.bernie should probably stay in the race just in case she gets assassinated though
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/05/24/us/politics/24clinton.html
you guys are kind of missing the point
Not at all. If he wants to ape Hillary's dubious statement from 2008 he can feel free, but he should also be following her lead in how to modify the narrative of his campaign in a positive way, instead of running in the opposite direction.
balladofwindfishes
Member
To be fair the congress would probably pick someone who isn't Trump. Probably Mitt Romney.
They can't. Has to have ran in the race and been in the top 3. Congress' choice would be Hillary, Trump or Bernie.
Not at all. If he wants to ape Hillary's dubious statement from 2008 he can feel free, but he should also be following her lead in how to modify the narrative of his campaign in a positive way, instead of running in the opposite direction.
i'm not insinuating that bernie is or will make the same kind of argument, i'm just pointing out that complaints about negative campaigning and calls for sanders to drop out are ironic after the 2008 primary
if she wins and sanders doesn't support her, at that point she'll have an opportunity to get on a high horse and chide him for it
Bel Marduk
Banned
The NYT/CBS poll from yesterday showed that more Bernie supporters say they will vote for Clinton then Hillary votes said they would vote for Obama in May 2008.
May 2008 60% of Hillary supports will vote for Obama
May 2016 72% of Bernie supports will vote for Hillary
Thank you. I think people here forgot how acrimonious the 2008 Democratic primaries were and how nasty the Clinton camp was toward Obama and his supporters despite the fact that it was apparent that Obama would win.
No, it will be Clinton's fault for not being a honest person. She tries to cater to everyone. I hope Bernie runs 3rd Party so I can vote for him.
So you hope Trump is president. Good to know.
Bernie supporters who say they'll vote in a way that helps Trump are pretty selfish, which is a little sad considering the policies they support are meant to actually help the country.
Thank you. I think people here forgot how acrimonious the 2008 Democratic primaries were and how nasty the Clinton camp was toward Obama and his supporters despite the fact that it was apparent that Obama would win.
Think the reason ppl are getting riled up about it is the other option is that trump (how the hell does he look so orange) back them a bad democratic showing meant McCain . I prefer democrats (not tha it matters I'm Indian ) but McCain is still good enough (yes then plain showed up but that was later on )
Bel Marduk
Banned
Yeah he doesn't bring anything to the ticket except Bernie or bust people. I could see her offering him a cabinet position.
He would be a good head of the Department of Labor.
User 73706
Banned
#BerningSensation
So you hope Trump is president. Good to know.
Bernie supporters who say they'll vote in a way that helps Trump are pretty selfish, which is a little sad considering the policies they support are meant to actually help the country.
berating people for voting how they want to vote is the same thing people (rightfully) got mad at sanders supporters for doing to black people
it also doesn't work so i don't know why people keep doing it
i'm not insinuating that bernie is or will make the same kind of argument, i'm just pointing out that complaints about negative campaigning and calls for sanders to drop out are ironic after the 2008 primary
if she wins and sanders doesn't support her, at that point she'll have an opportunity to get on a high horse and chide him for it
She had already stopped negative campaigning by this point. Sanders is doubling down on it. Her comments were made a week after Ted Kennedy's seizure and Robert Kennedy's own son didn't find them offensive, so lets give her the benefit of some perspective. The same perspective we can give to a Sanders campaign substantially behind her 2008 pace, with a fan base already more vitriolic towards her and the party and only increasing further.
He absolutely has the right to stay in, but he needs to reset the tone of his campaign into something positive, not negative, as this winds down. Not for Clinton's sake mind you, the vast majority of Sanders' supporters aren't going to be facing much of a real dilemma in voting for Clinton over Trump, but for his own benefit and how history will view his campaign.
Will it be seen as a meaningful step from this new generation to remove the stigma from the concept of social progress? A campaign proving the power and merit of outsiders with individual based funding as a viable first step towards the White House? Or will it be remembered as a campaign that in the face of defeat gave up the moral high ground, descended into giving a tacit endorsement to harassment and blind outrage, further degrading an already decayed public discourse? It is ultimately his choice. He isn't likely to run for much of anything ever again so he personally has very little to lose either way, but letting the last of those scenarios be the final footnote of his campaign is doing disservice to the very causes he's been championing throughout his career.
He would be a good head of the Department of Labor.
I've suggested this before and it would be an ideal setup if Clinton does choose Tom Perez for VP.
berating people for voting how they want to vote is the same thing people (rightfully) got mad at sanders supporters for doing to black people
it also doesn't work so i don't know why people keep doing it
Saying "why you vote against your own interests!" between candidates who are 93% similar in voting history, who argue over universal healthcare v. single payer universal healthcare, a minimum wage increase to $12/Hr. versus $15/Hr., etc. is entirely different than pointing out how not voting Clinton is either directly or indirectly aiding an over fascist on record as wanting to commit war crimes.
adamsappel
Member
Exact same reasoning people voted for Ralph Nader.
Is Ralph Nader remembered as a consumer advocate whose work saved millions of lives? Nope. He's just the guy who cost Al Gore the presidency. Welcome to your future, Bernie.
Difference is Clinton was earnestly attacking Obama. Obama was/is just so damn clean there was nothing there, the biggest thing was the preacher anti-American stuff. Sanders has piles of skeletons in his closet that hasn't been touched by the Clinton campaign, they know about it but haven't touched it. Again he completely failed in his NV response and his responses in the week before NY. He hasn't been been attacked like Obama was with more skeletons and somehow he will learn to roll with the GOP attacks in GE?
He would be a disaster.
Nameless piles of skeletons, I'm sold.
The Republicans don't care if you're squeaky clean or have piles of skeletons. If there are none, they'll make some (swiftboating, anyone?).
You're more than welcome to choose your Democratic candidates based upon which one will get the warmest reception by the RNC and their associated campaign supporters, but it's an incredibly poor way to choose a candidate IMO.
It's literally the same nonsense Obama supporters got 8 years ago, but now the shoe is on the other foot. Who's going to answer the damn phone at 3am? :: terror ::
15 pages and one person? That's a funny definition of it didnt take long
We're already seeing a pick up. You need to let these things marinate a bit.
She had already stopped negative campaigning by this point. Sanders is doubling down on it. Her comments were made a week after Ted Kennedy's seizure and Robert Kennedy's own son didn't find them offensive, so lets give her the benefit of some perspective. The same perspective we can give to a Sanders campaign substantially behind her 2008 pace, with a fan base already more vitriolic towards her and the party and only increasing further.
He absolutely has the right to stay in, but he needs to reset the tone of his campaign into something positive, not negative, as this winds down. Not for Clinton's sake mind you, the vast majority of Sanders' supporters aren't going to be facing much of a real dilemma in voting for Clinton over Trump, but for his own benefit and how history will view his campaign.
Will it be seen as a meaningful step from this new generation to remove the stigma from the concept of social progress? A campaign proving the power and merit of outsiders with individual based funding as a viable first step towards the White House? Or will it be remembered as a campaign that in the face of defeat gave up the moral high ground, descended into giving a tacit endorsement to harassment and blind outrage, further degrading an already decayed public discourse? It is ultimately his choice. He isn't likely to run for much of anything ever again so he personally has very little to lose either way, but letting the last of those scenarios be the final footnote of his campaign is doing disservice to the very causes he's been championing throughout his career.
i don't think it hurts her chances in the long run for sanders to shit on the democratic party. i also think the democratic party deserves to catch a lot of shit, not just for how this primary has been run but for its general awfulness over the last few decades. people keep saying his job is to push hillary to the left but fundamental reforms in how the party is run are probably more important outside of this election.
he needs to be careful about the way he does it in order to keep things peaceful and respectful, and i agree he hasn't been successful there. if the situation gets worse and he doesn't alter course then i'll be first in line to criticize him for it. but he doesn't need to start playing nice with a party organization that never liked him or wanted to reach out to his platform or voters and did everything it could to anoint hillary as the chosen one. steps need to be taken to make sure things like this don't happen in future elections, which will be better for the party, the electorate, and progressive causes generally.
They can only pick a POTUS and VP from those who were on the ticket.
They can't. Has to have ran in the race and been in the top 3. Congress' choice would be Hillary, Trump or Bernie.
Oh I did not know that. Welp.
We're already seeing a pick up. You need to let these things marinate a bit.
If Sanders was ever going to be a larger problem for the Democratic electorate, he would have been winning states by larger margins. There's enough data showing the majority of Democratic supporters being okay with either candidate.
At this point all that's left is for June to roll around and the general to start in earnest. The DNC and the surrogates waiting in the wing haven't done shit yet specifically because there's no formal general candidate. Once there is, everything's going to end up going sideways for the GOP considering who the DNC are gonna have out on the trail pounding the pavement for voters.
Sanders is many things, but unless you're talking about his hyperbolic fringe supporters, the man has said repeatedly he's not looking to kneecap the DNC's chances against Trump, not in any fashion of an independent run and has said he'll be supportive of the nominee (in what capacity who knows, but either way support). All the talk now is just hot air till June as far as I'm concerned.
The primary is done, has been done for months now. No semantic arguments are going to change that fact and baring some outlandish twist of fate we all know where we're going. Stating she is the presumptive nominee shouldn't be some controversial claim considering where we're standing right now.
- Status
- Not open for further replies.