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[Thunder Monkey]

No it's not, Hillary needs to at least repudiate her words for the bill that she promoted if she is going to be the champion of minority rights. Letting Bill Clinton come out against it while she remain silent doesn't cut it. We already have Bernie's word from 1991.

Which in the end... MEANT NOTHING!

edit: I apologize if that came off harsh.

I agree that Hillary needs to elucidate her current stance, but holding her to a fire, when Bernie said words and did the opposite is disingenuous at best.

 

[pigeon]

Bernie has been a pragmatist his whole career. Yes he voted for the bill in the end, but the Clintons created and campaigned on the bill. If GW Bush was running against Hillary, Bush would be held a hell of a lot more accountable for the Iraq war.

Again, if it weren't for the support of the Congressional Black Caucus, the bill would never have passed. They explicitly saved it from failure. Why is that irrelevant?

 

[HylianTom]

I couldn't see replacing more than two and if Ginsberg and Beyer retire it would still be split. Now if Ginsberg and Kennedy retire that would help but I don't think Kennedy is going to retire. Its feels like a fools errand to wait until justices decide they want to retire (which may or may not happen) for overturn this ruling and what happens in the meantime. There's also a strong possibility that republicans will win the senate in 2016 and then you will have to fight to get the justice appointed and democrats just do not fight for their justices like republicans do for whatever reason.

I know there are obstacles, but I figured I'd give you the most realistic path (definitely more probable than an amendment). I'm actually kinda optimistic on the Senate; the GOP is defending a lot of Senate seats in states that were carried by Obama in both 2008 and 2012. That said, I don't see the Senate staying Democratic beyond 2019, as the 2018 map is not nearly as friendly. 2016's map couldn't be much nicer, to be honest.

"She cant get accountable for the consequences of her political decisions because pragmatism! supreme court! donors!".

Short of inventing a Delorean time machine, flying back to 1994, and addressing your objections, she's not going to satisfy your complaints. (I also have no clue how she or anyone for that matter would've changed the insane-against-crime political climate in 1994.)

So, I'll ask.. let's say that Super Tuesday comes along, she mathematically secures the nomination, and Bernie later on comes out and implores folks to vote for her in November. After Bernie - the guy you trust so strongly - makes this request, you're willing to ignore him and give progressivism the shank for 20-30 years?

We bring up SCOTUS because, thus far, the most substantive response to this major concern I've seen here is "We'll lobby SCOTUS." You claim to care about these causes, but then you seem all too determined to say "fuck 'em" if you don't get your way on the choice nominee. And that speaks volumes.

Just because you don't get your way this time around doesn't mean that the fight ends in 2016. You are aware of this, right? It would be logical to set the playing field for the movement so that it is as amenable to your cause as possible going into the future. That would be the action of a prudent political actor, wouldn't it?

And I ask this not only of Berniefolk, but of Democrats of all alignments who would want to throw a general election tantrum. Vote for whomever you like in the primary - that's great - but don't be shocked when you get called-out for acting illogically during the general.

 

[werks]

Which in the end... MEANT NOTHING!

Which in the end means that would never have been part of his political agenda. Are all the Hillary pragmatists that dominated this thread all of a sudden act like congressmen don't have to compromise for the least worst position? There is a huge difference between compromising on a vote and creating a bill and campaigning on it during presidential elections.

Oh wait, everyone in this thread is a idealist now and there are is only black and white in politics all of a sudden.

Bill (with the first lady's full political support) created and ran on "tough on crime", including killing a mentally disabled black man on death row. That was their defining political record during that time. Hillary won't even admit it was wrong, just that times have changed.

Bernie compromised on a bill he clearly opposed ( https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aZJ7f-3XGB4 ), something that just 10 posts above is a great asset for Hillary.

But you are right, it's the same thing.

Again, if it weren't for the support of the Congressional Black Caucus, the bill would never have passed. They explicitly saved it from failure. Why is that irrelevant?

The CBC isn't running for president.

This is Hillary's official stance on the crime bill.

https://twitter.com/JesseFFerguson/status/593485081655832576

 

[Thunder Monkey]

Which in the end means that would never have been part of his political agenda. Are all the Hillary pragmatists that dominated this thread all of a sudden act like congressmen don't have to compromise for the least worst position? There is a huge difference between compromising on a vote and creating a bill and campaigning on it during presidential elections.

Oh wait, everyone in this thread is a idealist now and there are is only black and white in politics all of a sudden.

Bill (with the first lady's full political support) created and ran on "tough on crime", including killing a mentally disabled black man on death row. That was their defining political record during that time.

Bernie compromised on a bill he clearly opposed ( https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aZJ7f-3XGB4 ), something that just 10 posts above is a great asset for Hillary.

But you are right, it's the same thing.

Like I said that.

You've made this a point of contention. Pointing out time after time that Hillary was the public face of that bill. And you are right. She was.

But you turn Bernies about face into a point of concession. Of pragmatism. When the end result is... his hands are dirty too.

His hands weren't holding the weapon, like Clintons, but covered in blood nonetheless.

Disingenuous at best.

 

[besada]

And I ask this not only of Berniefolk, but of Democrats of all alignments who would want to throw a general election tantrum. Vote for whomever you like in the primary - that's great - but don't be shocked when you get called-out for acting illogically during the general.

I don't think many Sanders supporters are going to stay home or vote for someone else, but surely there will be some, just as there was a block of Hillary supporters in 2008 that went batshit and did the same sort of thing. Let me, for the record, say that those people are not thinking clearly. Hillary and Bernie have many differences, but those pale in comparison with what they have in common. People who get upset that their primary candidate fails to secure the nomination, regardless of who that candidate is, and then turn around and fuck the ideals because they couldn't have exactly what they want suck. They suck a lot. It's the classic problem of throwing away the good because you can't have the perfect.

All that said, I'd love it if we could remember that on most of the issues, we are all basically sympatico when compared with any other viable candidate, and quit taking giant shits on each other. We should be encouraging a reasonable, but calm primary fight, because opposition is good. It causes candidates to focus more clearly on issues and actually respond to the people. But creating a circular firing squad and shooting each other for months before the general is much less good. It creates angry blocks of voters whose emotions are so roiled that they do stupid stuff. Part of having cohesiveness in the general involves not being such assholes to each other in the primary. The Hillaryis44 crew let their anger get so out of control over Obama that they found themselves unable to vote for anyone but Hillary, and became this insane, screeching pseudo right-wing enclave of birthers. That's not helpful to anyone, and it would be tragic if Sanders supporters did the same.

 

[Thunder Monkey]

I don't think many Sanders supporters are going to stay home or vote for someone else, but surely there will be some, just as there was a block of Hillary supporters in 2008 that went batshit and did the same sort of thing. Let me, for the record, say that those people are not thinking clearly. Hillary and Bernie have many differences, but those pale in comparison with what they have in common. People who get upset that their primary candidate fails to secure the nomination, regardless of who that candidate is, and then turn around and fuck the ideals because they couldn't have exactly what they want suck. They suck a lot. It's the classic problem of throwing away the good because you can't have the perfect.

All that said, I'd love it if we could remember that on most of the issues, we are all basically sympatico when compared with any other viable candidate, and quit taking giant shits on each other. We should be encouraging a reasonable, but calm primary fight, because opposition is good. It causes candidates to focus more clearly on issues and actually respond to the people. But creating a circular firing squad and shooting each other for months before the general is much less good. It creates angry blocks of voters whose emotions are so roiled that they do stupid stuff. Part of having cohesiveness in the general involves not being such assholes to each other in the primary. The Hillaryis44 crew let their anger get so out of control over Obama that they found themselves unable to vote for anyone but Hillary, and became this insane, screeching pseudo right-wing enclave of birthers. That's not helpful to anyone, and it would be tragic if Sanders supporters did the same.

You are more than right.

And I apologize if I've helped foment any of that anger in Bernie supporters. I really do think they are fighting the right battle. I just don't think it's the right time... honestly I'm jaded enough to wonder if there will ever be a right time.

 

[alstein]

It seems that people don't understand how the American government works.

Even IF Sanders wins, the conservatives in congress would cock-block anything he wants to achieve. The conservative media would go into hyperdrive mode (actually worse than what they did with Obama) and proclaim that Bernie Sanders is trying to turn America into China or Cuba, and ignite the Tea Party like never before. The liberals who voted him in would sit on their hands during the midterms (when they should actually be the most active), and conservatives would flood the congress in record numbers, and absolutely nothing would get done in government.

2020 election rolls around and liberals would be pissed off that Sanders got nothing done, say that Democrats sabotaged him, and sit home on election day. The country would then elect an ultra-conservative to the presidency, and we begin our decent into a plutocratic theocracy.

Or we can simply elect Clinton, who could actually get some conservative votes, get some shit done, and get re-elected in 2020.

LOL. The Conservative media is going to do this Hillary or Sanders. At least Sanders would be willing to play hardball whereas Hillary would just give in and surrender the way Bill did.

I want a president who will fight- Obama had to learn how to fight. Hillary won't fight. If she wins, might as well let the Republicans be blamed for the recession of 2018-2019 which is likely coming. (and I don't think any Supreme Court seats open up if Hillary wins except maybe Kennedy- I think Scalia and Thomas will die before giving up their seats to a Dem)

 

[werks]

Like I said that.

You've made this a point of contention. Pointing out time after time that Hillary was the public face of that bill. And you are right. She was.

But you turn Bernies about face into a point of concession. Of pragmatism. When the end result is... his hands are dirty too.

His hands weren't holding the weapon, like Clintons, but covered in blood nonetheless.

Disingenuous at best.

LOL.

So the argument just minutes ago was "Bernie's too much of an idealist, he will never get anything done."

Bernie votes for something he is clearly ideologically opposed to and now it "Bernie's no better no true idealist"

Bernie was ideologically opposed to the bill back in 1991 and said it was wrong with clear video proof, even if had to end up voting for it. Hillary still won't admit that the bill was wrong herself, instead has her PR lackey put some bullshit on twitter that it wasn't wrong but times have changed.

Thats your candidate, always having to "evolve" to be on the right side of history, but still can't admit being wrong.

 

[ErasureAcer]

I don't think many Sanders supporters are going to stay home or vote for someone else, but surely there will be some, just as there was a block of Hillary supporters in 2008 that went batshit and did the same sort of thing. Let me, for the record, say that those people are not thinking clearly. Hillary and Bernie have many differences, but those pale in comparison with what they have in common. People who get upset that their primary candidate fails to secure the nomination, regardless of who that candidate is, and then turn around and fuck the ideals because they couldn't have exactly what they want suck. They suck a lot. It's the classic problem of throwing away the good because you can't have the perfect.

All that said, I'd love it if we could remember that on most of the issues, we are all basically sympatico when compared with any other viable candidate, and quit taking giant shits on each other. We should be encouraging a reasonable, but calm primary fight, because opposition is good. It causes candidates to focus more clearly on issues and actually respond to the people. But creating a circular firing squad and shooting each other for months before the general is much less good. It creates angry blocks of voters whose emotions are so roiled that they do stupid stuff. Part of having cohesiveness in the general involves not being such assholes to each other in the primary. The Hillaryis44 crew let their anger get so out of control over Obama that they found themselves unable to vote for anyone but Hillary, and became this insane, screeching pseudo right-wing enclave of birthers. That's not helpful to anyone, and it would be tragic if Sanders supporters did the same.

My state has voted Blue since 1972. So it doesn't really matter who I vote for in the general. There is only 1 way Hillary will get my vote with all the baggage she has(IMO) and that's if she puts up a good VP that I respect(a progressive). If she doesn't do that she obviously doesn't give a shit about my vote.

 

[brianmcdoogle]

His hands weren't holding the weapon, like Clintons, but covered in blood nonetheless.

Exactly. I'm voting Bernie #feelthebern because the Clintons have personally MURDERED dozens of people!!!

 

[HylianTom]

Years later, and I don't know if I'll ever understand the Hillaryis44 people.

And I can relate to Thunder on the whole jaded thing. Makes me wish for polling asking various voters how they'd describe their political mood/outlook/etc..

(alstein: I always joke that we'd see Weekend At Antonin's - with a few law clerks or his fellow conservative justices propping him up - before he lets a Democrat replace him, haha..)

 

[werks]

My state has voted Blue since 1972. So it doesn't really matter who I vote for in the general. There is only 1 way Hillary will get my vote with all the baggage she has(IMO) and that's if she puts up a good VP that I respect(a progressive). If she doesn't do that she obviously doesn't give a shit about my vote.

I'm voting in a red state, if clinton is the candidate, she will have my vote. But this whole inevitable candidate bullshit and shitting on Bernie's historically pro minority record while at the same time glossing over Hillary's record pisses me off. There isn't even a legitimate discussion on the private prison money she's getting, just Bernie can't relate to BLM and Hillary is the better minority candidate by default.

I'm not sure why I even have to type this, I'm not a crazed Hillary stan from 08. I'll vote for whoever is the dem candidate.

 

[Thunder Monkey]

LOL.

So the argument just minutes ago was "Bernie's too much of an idealist, he will never get anything done."

Bernie votes for something he is clearly ideologically opposed to and now it "Bernie's no better no true idealist"

Bernie was ideologically opposed to the bill back in 1991 and said it was wrong with clear video proof, even if had to end up voting for it. Hillary still won't admit that the bill was wrong herself, instead has her PR lackey put some bullshit on twitter that it wasn't wrong but times have changed.

Thats your candidate, always having to "evolve" to be on the right side of history, but still can't admit being wrong.

Well... that wasn't my argument.

My argument is and has been "I don't think he can get elected."

I was being an ass and pointing out the hypocrisy of damning Hillary for promoting a bill, that Bernie himself "Aye'd" to.

I really do respect your passion. I just don't want that passion to doom us to four/eight years of Trump/Bush/Walker.

Sorry for coming on so strong. I don't expect anyone to come out of politics clean. Especially career politicians.

 

[Thunder Monkey]

I'm from deep red Kansas myself.

I get brow-beaten by other Democrats for calling myself a Socialist. I've had other Democrats chastise me for not supporting the "Right to Work" legislation that passed. "Everyone deserves the right to work!"

I facepalmed so hard I detached a retina.

 

[besada]

Years later, and I don't know if I'll ever understand the Hillaryis44 people.

And I can relate to Thunder on the whole jaded thing. Makes me wish for polling asking various voters how they'd describe their political mood/outlook/etc..

(alstein: I always joke that we'd see Weekend At Antonin's - with a few law clerks or his fellow conservative justices propping him up - before he lets a Democrat replace him, haha..)

This will be my eighth general since I could vote, so I feel both of you on the jaded/cynical thing. For the first four I was deep into it, knocking doors, serving as chairman for my local party, etc. It's tough to follow it all for that long and not get sick of it all. Until Obama, no candidate I'd ever voted for in the primaries had won the primary, much less the general. Can you imagine my shock and astonishment when one of my long shot candidates finally won? Jerry Brown, Bill Bradley, Paul Tsongas, John Edwards, and even Jesse Jackson, waaaaaay back when. I just assumed anyone I voted for in a primary was doomed.

 

[Fenderputty]

This will be my eighth general since I could vote, so I feel both of you on the jaded/cynical thing. For the first four I was deep into it, knocking doors, serving as chairman for my local party, etc. It's tough to follow it all for that long and not get sick of it all. Until Obama, no candidate I'd ever voted for in the primaries had won the primary, much less the general. Can you imagine my shock and astonishment when one of my long shot candidates finally won? Jerry Brown, Bill Bradley, Paul Tsongas, John Edwards, and even Jesse Jackson, waaaaaay back when. I just assumed anyone I voted for in a primary was doomed.

Who you vote for this primary?

 

[besada]

Who you vote for this primary?

I will likely vote for Bernie Sanders, whose policies I've followed for the last twenty years. He is a flawed candidate, like all candidates, and I sometimes wish he were better with people and understanding perspectives far outside his Vermont life experience, but it's a rare chance to get to vote for someone I actually like.

And when he almost certainly loses, I'll vote for Hillary Clinton.

 

[alstein]

I will likely vote for Bernie Sanders, whose policies I've followed for the last twenty years. He is a flawed candidate, like all candidates, and I sometimes wish he were better with people and understanding perspectives far outside his Vermont life experience, but it's a rare chance to get to vote for someone I actually like.

And when he almost certainly loses, I'll vote for Hillary Clinton.

I'd say I'm voting against the Republican. I'm never vote in favor of Hillary. It would only be because the alternative is worse. (no way I'd let Walker or Kasich win if I can stop it)

 

[lednerg]

Cornel West was asked on CNN, "[among the candidates for President] who is best for the African American vote?"

https://youtu.be/RNaAigeo7AE [clip at 0:56]

Spoiler

"There's no doubt, in the race right now, Brutha Bernie Sanders..."

 

[Fenderputty]

I will likely vote for Bernie Sanders, whose policies I've followed for the last twenty years. He is a flawed candidate, like all candidates, and I sometimes wish he were better with people and understanding perspectives far outside his Vermont life experience, but it's a rare chance to get to vote for someone I actually like.

And when he almost certainly loses, I'll vote for Hillary Clinton.

I was kinda hoping you said Hillary. Smart money on the high payout that way!

Does Vegas have odds on this stuff?

I'd say I'm voting against the Republican. I'm never vote in favor of Hillary. It would only be because the alternative is worse. (no way I'd let Walker or Kasich win if I can stop it)

This is all I hope from liberals. Whoever wins we vote for them.

 

[lednerg]

This is all I hope from liberals. Whoever wins we vote for them.

Bernie's not running negative against Hillary but as Chomsky has said, he's a thorn in her side, keeping her to the left. That's the whole point here. If Bernie can somehow pull of the nomination, then fine. If that doesn't happen, he's not going to become a third party candidate, and he will back the Democratic Party's nominee - asking his supporters to do the same. The Berners know what's at stake.

 

[Big Green Anus]

I'm voting in a red state, if clinton is the candidate, she will have my vote. But this whole inevitable candidate bullshit and shitting on Bernie's historically pro minority record while at the same time glossing over Hillary's record pisses me off. There isn't even a legitimate discussion on the private prison money she's getting, just Bernie can't relate to BLM and Hillary is the better minority candidate by default.

I'm not sure why I even have to type this, I'm not a crazed Hillary stan from 08. I'll vote for whoever is the dem candidate.

Is there a reason why pro-liberal news station, such as MSNBC, does not mentioned Hillary receiving money from private prisons, espeically since she "regrets" that crime bill?

 

[ivysaur12]

Democrats barely have a shot at the Senate in 2016, let alone the House which is gerrymandered to all fuck.

???

The Senate has a good chance of swinging back to the Dems.

 

[Angry Grimace]

I was kinda hoping you said Hillary. Smart money on the high payout that way!

Does Vegas have odds on this stuff?



This is all I hope from liberals. Whoever wins we vote for them.

I don't think anyone ever seriously questioned that this is what will happen with the winning candidate. I mean, there are angry posters saying they won't, but I simply don't buy it.

 

[danm999]

???

The Senate has a good chance of swinging back to the Dems.

Talking in the context of regaining a supermajority in the Senate like Obama briefly had in his first term. Because you just know anything Sanders wanted would be filibustered.

 

[alstein]

Talking in the context of regaining a supermajority in the Senate like Obama briefly had in his first term. Because you just know anything Sanders wanted would be filibustered.

I think if the Dems had the house, and a major piece of legislation was on the line- the full nuclear option would happen now.

Republicans will do it if they win the White House and the Dems filibuster everything which I'd expect them to do.

 

[Inuhanyou]

I don't see what the conservative votes and 'reaching across the isle' have anything to do with who people vote for.

They aren't really in good faith to start with, regardless of who is against them. So how is it an argument that Bernie or Hillary(if you say she's honest) even matter when it comes to obstruction in congress?

Regardless of what is brought up, whatever comes out of anything they have to do with will be a corporate okayed piece of crap. Only difference being with Hillary, she's much more happy to pass something like that under the table to make her donors and associates happy than Bernie would be.

Her stance on NAFTA, CAFTA, TPP, the keystone XL and federal trade in general says everything really.

 

[BertramCooper]

HillaryWitch.gif

Apparently she practices magic. Simplistic thinking Measley. Today's Republicans are obstructionists. They wont work with anyone. We need a political revolution. Bernie is that leader.

You - the person who is basing much of your dislike of Clinton on video games - is accusing someone else of simplistic thinking?

 

[Log4Girlz]

 

[lednerg]

[img http://i.imgur.com/g0iUXNl.jpg /img]

That's cute but doesn't actually make much sense.

 

[marrec]

Hillary: don't do wars, don't make anything worse, don't rock the boat.

Bernie: Sweden things a bit.


Huckabee: Jesus rapture gay abortion.

Trump: build a wall tall enough to contain my ego and incompetence.

Bush: don't say Bush a lot.

Christie: pies and mafia

Cruz: I'm Hispanic

Paul: goldbugs isolationism sounds nice but BAM republican

Fucking lost it here.

Amazing write up of the current candidates.

 

[Magni]

Oh, and to refute the "BLM more favorable than Sanders" talking point from earlier:

Wow, all of two whole percentage points. Margin of error means that's basically even. Sanders less unfavorable than BLM, to boot. Are you kidding me with this trash we're calling evidence based arguments?

7% of Americans have never heard of the current Vice President? This fucking country.

 

[Deleted member 231381]

7% of Americans have never heard of the current Vice President? This fucking country.

An asterisk in polling means "Not 0, but less than 1", so there's even a small fraction of Americans who responded they've never heard of Hillary Clinton.

 

[HylianTom]

This will be my eighth general since I could vote, so I feel both of you on the jaded/cynical thing. For the first four I was deep into it, knocking doors, serving as chairman for my local party, etc. It's tough to follow it all for that long and not get sick of it all. Until Obama, no candidate I'd ever voted for in the primaries had won the primary, much less the general. Can you imagine my shock and astonishment when one of my long shot candidates finally won? Jerry Brown, Bill Bradley, Paul Tsongas, John Edwards, and even Jesse Jackson, waaaaaay back when. I just assumed anyone I voted for in a primary was doomed.

I wanted Paul Simon but knew he had noooo chance whatsoever. Introduced me to political heartbreak very early on, hehe..

 

[NeoXChaos]

???

The Senate has a good chance of swinging back to the Dems.

and a good chance of flipping right back to the Republicans in 2 years.

 

[inner-G]

Lol, awesome

 

[Pizza Booty]

Sanders is speaking tonight in Columbia. I really want to go. Anyone else going tonight?

 

[Flo_Evans]

Sanders is speaking tonight in Columbia. I really want to go. Anyone else going tonight?

columbia, mo?

edit: NM south Carolina

 

[LegendofDragoonLives]

Such optimism. Gonna make Hilary thrashing Bernie even funnier.

Why would anyone with any common sense want Hilary to win over someone like Sanders?

 

[ErasureAcer]

You - the person who is basing much of your dislike of Clinton on video games - is accusing someone else of simplistic thinking?

It's an example of her making shit up to suit her needs. Hillary can't be trusted on anything. She has no spine and plays to people's fears(videogames) rather than addressing the bigger issue...nuts with guns. She's insane.

 

[Fenderputty]

I don't think anyone ever seriously questioned that this is what will happen with the winning candidate. I mean, there are angry posters saying they won't, but I simply don't buy it.

There's a dude in this thread who hasn't voted in 8 years and is registering democrat to for Bernie only. This is probably anecdotal evidence based on a vocal minority in a liberal internet forum, but some of the shit slung in here is straight scary.

 

[inner-G]

Clinton has historically been tough on drugs too, and we're at a turning point where we are getting close to cannabis legalization/decriminalization. Sanders has talked a lot about the need to reduce prison populations, while Clinton has done a lot to put more drug offenders into prisons.

 

[Fenderputty]

Clinton has historically been tough on drugs too, and we're at a turning point where we are getting close to cannabis legalization/decriminalization. Sanders has talked a lot about the need to reduce prison populations, while Clinton has done a lot to put more drug offenders into prisons.

Her husband has literally come out against the war on drugs in general. Now she isn't her husband, but she also doesn't have the luxury as an acting politician to say the things her husband can no say. Her current stances seem to mirror our current president with leave it up to the states mentality regarding pot legalization. Most people figure it will be the states that lead the way for the Feds to make change anyway.

Former President Bill Clinton appears on it, saying that his administration’s attempts to limit drug trafficking from Colombia “hasn’t worked.” He joins former President Jimmy Carter in claiming that that the global war on drugs is "a failure."

“What I tried to do was to focus on every aspect of the problem. I tried to empower the Colombians for example to do more militarily and police-wise because I thought that they had to. Thirty percent of their country was in the hands of the narcotraffickers,” Clinton says in the film documentary.

The film, narrated by Morgan Freeman, says, “the U.S. spent billions of dollars funding military operations in Colombia to cut of cocaine coming into America." To which Clinton responds, "if the expected results was that we would eliminate serious drug use in America and eliminate the narcotrafficking networks — it hasn’t worked.”

https://www.youtube.com/user/breakingthetaboofilm

 

[dramatis]

I am planning on continuing my grand tradition of wistfully pretending that I'm in a parliamentary democracy and voting for Democrats down the line, so either of them is already guaranteed my vote.

The Arizona primary sure is gonna #feelthebern with my largely irrelevant vote for him there, though.

I imagine with the record temperatures this year Arizona is burning just fine with or without Bernie

Funny that you would pretend you're in a parliamentary democracy. Just yesterday I read an essay from an anonymous Congressperson on Vox, where he (or she) stated that Congress is pretty much a parliament:

5) We don't have a Congress but a parliament

Over the last several decades, party loyalty has increased to near-unanimity. If a member of Congress doesn't vote with his or her party 99 percent of the time, he's considered unreliable and excluded from party decision-making. Gone are the days when you were expected to vote your conscience and your district, the true job of a congressperson. Parliaments only work because they have a prime minister who can get things done. We have a parliament without any ability to take executive action. We should not be surprised we are gridlocked.

I don't think by default the parliamentary way is better. The form of democratic government usually fits the country. If we had a parliament, the partisanship might be even worse. The problems with Congress right now don't come from the structure of the government. It comes from national apathy; voter turnout is pretty much garbage.

 

[Kickz]

Come on Bernie!

Hopefully the media continues to expose Hilary with the illegal email fiasco

 

[Angry Grimace]

There's a dude in this thread who hasn't voted in 8 years and is registering democrat to for Bernie only. This is probably anecdotal evidence based on a vocal minority in a liberal internet forum, but some of the shit slung in here is straight scary.

Here's the thing: we've had relative in-party peace because there hasn't been any real competition to Barack Obama in 7 years and Obama is and was a far superior candidate to everyone else running in 2008.

But this kind of shit slinging is completely normal in a political debate, even in-party. I assure you that there's a Republican-oriented forum out there where a ton of shit-slingers are bitching that Jeb Bush is a RINO and true conservatives would vote for Trump/Cruz/Walker/Rubio.

I mean, its sad that the poster right above me actively wants the favorite in the election who shares 95% of his own guy's positions to be completely discredited just so his guy wins, but c'est la vie. I doubt he's thinking about anything past the primaries and his own guy winning.

 

[Dude Abides]

Come on Bernie!

Hopefully the media continues to expose Hilary with the illegal email fiasco

Good to see Sanders supporters becoming indistinguishable from Fox news goons.

 

[Hrothgar]

Good to see Sanders supporters becoming indistinguishable from Fox news goons.

The enemy of my enemy and all that!

 

[Pastry]

Come on Bernie!

Hopefully the media continues to expose Hilary with the illegal email fiasco

Benghazi Benghazi Benghazi! There is nothing indicating the email situation is anything but manufactured.