HTC Vive Launch Thread -- Computer, activate holodeck

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Wrestlemania said:
Audioshield is good but I haven't loved any of the patterns in the tracks I've played, which is the same problem I always had with Audiosurf, never as much fun/actually related to the music as normal rhythm games. Are there are hand made ones or are they all automatically generated?
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Have you played "He's a Pirate"? The pattern fits amazingly well IMHO.

Wrestlemania said:
I really like that bullet hell shooter game from The Lab. I wish I could load that directly instead of having to go through all the other stuff.
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If you like that, you should really try Space Pirate Trainer (if you haven't already).

mrklaw said:
Nice impressions though. Getting the feeling the Vive is a bit of a beta headset in terms of fit and finish, and some of the tracking software. But the tracking and controllers are so good you accept the shortcomings.
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It's absolutely true that the Vive is not on the same level as the Rift right at this moment in time when it comes to ease of use in terms of software. However, it's also a lot more fully featured, and software can be iterated rapidly (as Valve already demonstrated with the Steam controller).

As an Android user I'd liken the difference to that between an Android phone and an iOS phone. Then again I've always been a functionality > all guy.
 
Durante said:
Have you played "He's a Pirate"? The pattern fits amazingly well IMHO.
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Not yet, I'll give it a try. Are there any tracks/patterns which are actually made by the devs or are they all automatically generated?

If you like that, you should really try Space Pirate Trainer (if you haven't already).
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Yeah, I need to get that next. Was deciding between that and Hover Junkers but I think I'll enjoy SPT more based on the demo I've had of it before. I really like that Valve demo though, someone needs to make a full on scrolling shoot em up for VR.

I forgot to cover the process of setting it up - it was a bit of a nightmare as I had no idea that both your main monitor and the Vive have to be connected to your graphics card and had to research online to find out hat was the problem. As my card only has one HDMI, I had to rush out to find a store to buy a DVI cable from. Other than that it wasn't too bad, but it was annoying that the software couldn't just tell me that was a problem.

Other things:

The camera on the headset is okay, but I'd rather be able to more easily slip my headset off to get my bearings or pick something up than use a camera feed.

I really wish the controllers didn't have that big ring on the end. I also wish the menu button was below the trackpad, it's just a tiny bit out of comfortable reach. And I want sticks instead of a pad. Basically I just want the Touch controllers :(
 
Anybody with one that has a laptop with Nvidia Optimus able to test?
I think my laptop has it and I only found out yesterday they apparently are incompatible.
Would be a bummer since I wanted to use my laptop to demo to people
 
Crispy75 said:
I wonder if there will be any 3rd party straps/padding etc. to help with comfort on the vive? I'm definitely leaning that way cos I have the space for roomscale and I don't see how Oculus' camera tracking can beat lighthouse. But I also want something comfortable...
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I'd like to think it is almost certain. You'll have clones of the OR setup and maybe the PSVR. I'm sure we'll see some other crazy options too like modding cycle helmets or welders masks.
 
Man I need Vive sword fighting game in the period of the middle ages......where you fight in the middle of a war like Dinasty Warriors.

This would be awesome!
 
Tadie said:
Man I need Vive sword fighting game in the period of the middle ages......where you fight in the middle of a war like Dinasty Warriors.

This would be awesome!
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Sword fighting in VR has limitations. There's nothing stopping your swing in real life, so you either have no-clip swords that cut through or brush aside everything without stopping, or you end up with a disconnect between the action in virtual reality and real life.
 
Zalusithix said:
Sword fighting in VR has limitations. There's nothing stopping your swing in real life, so you either have no-clip swords that cut through or brush aside everything without stopping, or you end up with a disconnect between the action in virtual reality and real life.
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I think the workaround that Vanishing Realms uses is pretty decent.

It basically "disables" your swords (they turn transparent and ineffective) for a set amount of time after you did something which wouldn't be possible, like moving the sword through a shield. This in return requires you to make plausible movements in order to be effective. It's far from perfect in its current implementation, but I think the general principle of this can go pretty far.
 
Still, I think sword fighting will feel a lot more abstract than something like guns, or bow and arrow, or even magic -- until we solve the feedback problem that is ;)
 
I have measured my room and I can get ~2m x ~2m with good clearance while not having to move around too much. I have a second room but I would have to permanently move my PC to that place. Seems OK to me unless a game needs more room.
 
Durante said:
I think the workaround that Vanishing Realms uses is pretty decent.

It basically "disables" your swords (they turn transparent and ineffective) for a set amount of time after you did something which wouldn't be possible, like moving the sword through a shield. This in return requires you to make plausible movements in order to be effective. It's far from perfect in its current implementation, but I think the general principle of this can go pretty far.
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Yeah, there's partial solutions, but they don't exactly work for a "middle ages" style sword fighting game. Medieval period high fantasy perhaps, but not really in low fantasy or historical set pieces. I mean, you could have your sword outright break if swung through a solid object, and have to perform a repair of it, but that would make for short fights lol. Ultimately though, without any real hit feedback, you're never going to really feel like you're locking blades with somebody. Nor can you feel like your strikes have been deflected and thrown you off stance.

VR just works best when it doesn't have to contend with real and constant physical forces to sell the illusion.
 
Durante said:
Still, I think sword fighting will feel a lot more abstract than something like guns, or bow and arrow, or even magic -- until we solve the feedback problem that is ;)
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I was thinking about this and my idea of a solution to try would be letting the "real" sword stop where it needs to but the outline, like a ghost swords is your controller so you can see the disconnect. I don't know maybe it'd make the player feel more like a ghost controlling a real sword and that's why the ghost sword keeps going but the real one stops.

edit: but the real sword follows the ghost hand trying to be 1:1 with it. So say your sword is stuck at the right from a shield and your real ghost sword is to the left. You can move your ghost sword up and down and see the real sword move the same while trying to magnetize back to where it needs to be. But the only way it will is if either the obstacle moves away or you move your ghost hand back to it yourself.

I'm not sure though since I don't have VR yet.
 
Durante said:
Still, I think sword fighting will feel a lot more abstract than something like guns, or bow and arrow, or even magic -- until we solve the feedback problem that is ;)
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You can create contextual situations where the lack of resistance would feel appropriate, however. Like lightsabres.

I had a fencer once explain the finer points of sword fighting to me once, though. Apparently much of the sport revolves around feeling the contact as the swords meet, then sliding the swords around each other to position your opponents arm to create openings. So like 90% of the sport takes place after physical contact.

It pretty much cemented for me that outside of some sort of novint falcon like solution, a true sword fighting game will never really be possible.
 
Jams775 said:
I was thinking about this and my idea of a solution to try would be letting the "real" sword stop where it needs to but the outline, like a ghost swords is your controller so you can see the disconnect. I don't know maybe it'd make the player feel more like a ghost controlling a real sword and that's why the ghost sword keeps going but the real one stops.

I'm not sure though since I don't have VR yet.
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Yeah, I think the ghost model would be my preferred solution too.

The "feedback problem" can be solved by having an industrial robot hold the other end of your controller. The safety implications of such a setup should be obvious - real swordfighting is very dangerous and the closer you approach it with a simulation, the more likely you are to get hurt.
 
I have a crazy idea. How about when the swords collide you mess up with the tracking/image simulating the shock combined with the haptic feedback?
 
KingSnake said:
I have a crazy idea. How about when the swords collide you mess up with the tracking/image simulating the shock combined with the haptic feedback?
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Tactical Haptics has a demo that works like this and it was supposed to work very well. Unfortunately they've been silent since Sixense stopped being a real option and their kickstarter died. I expect eventually we'll get such a solution on future controllers. Their haptics solution (independent piston-like servos running along the sides of a tube-shaped tracked controller that can move up and down) could simulate sword strike feelings, the shifting weight of a morning star, and other types of forces. It should be compatible with the design of the Vive controllers and PSVR (touch would need a major wand-like revision), but it would have to be built into the controller.
 
I think melee combat will wind up relying on the concept of your controller position being a goal which the player character does its best to reach and hold, up to the limits allowed by its strength/speed parameters. It can still be designed to minimize latency.

This allows for that fencing-style interplay after contact as long as the physics are good. You can't force the other player's real arm to move, but you could still force their avatar's arm down.

(Die By The Sword VR please)

Edit: yup, pretty much this.
Jams775 said:
I was thinking about this and my idea of a solution to try would be letting the "real" sword stop where it needs to but the outline, like a ghost swords is your controller so you can see the disconnect. I don't know maybe it'd make the player feel more like a ghost controlling a real sword and that's why the ghost sword keeps going but the real one stops.

edit: but the real sword follows the ghost hand trying to be 1:1 with it. So say your sword is stuck at the right from a shield and your real ghost sword is to the left. You can move your ghost sword up and down and see the real sword move the same while trying to magnetize back to where it needs to be. But the only way it will is if either the obstacle moves away or you move your ghost hand back to it yourself.

I'm not sure though since I don't have VR yet.
Click to expand...
 
Raticus79 said:
I think melee combat will wind up relying on the concept of your controller position being a goal which the player character does its best to reach and hold, up to the limits allowed by its strength/speed parameters. It can still be designed to minimize latency.

This allows for that fencing-style interplay after contact as long as the physics are good. You can't force the other player's real arm to move, but you could still force their avatar's arm down.

(Die By The Sword VR please)
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I really think that type of indirect control is exceedingly frustrating in VR.

It might work in combination with a 1:1 tracked "ghost"/"target" sword though.
 
My preorder date when I ordered the Vive said May. On my order page it says "We will start shipping in May but your shipping email will indicate your actual ship date". That's not verbatim but I'm sure anyone who's preordered has seen this. Does that indicate I will get mine in May or that's just when the next wave starts. Sorry if this has been covered. I originally preordered a rift and I am tired of them not have their shit together and won't get it now until late this month. Debating whether to wait a few more weeks to get a better experience if it's truly going to ship in may. Thanks in advance.
 
WarpathDC said:
My preorder date when I ordered the Vive said May. On my order page it says "We will start shipping in May but your shipping email will indicate your actual ship date". That's not verbatim but I'm sure anyone who's preordered has seen this. Does that indicate I will get mine in May or that's just when the next wave starts. Sorry if this has been covered. I originally preordered a rift and I am tired of them not have their shit together and won't get it now until late this month. Debating whether to wait a few more weeks to get a better experience if it's truly going to ship in may. Thanks in advance.
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The most recent thing I heard is that they reconfirmed that all the April shipments will still be fulfilled in April. One would assume that this (if it holds) by extension will mean that all May orders will still be fulfilled in May.
 
Durante said:
I really think that type of indirect control is exceedingly frustrating in VR.

It might work in combination with a 1:1 tracked "ghost"/"target" sword though.
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Right, the ghost would be your tracked controller, 1:1, and in free movement the avatar could keep up, unless you were wielding a really heavy weapon that your character isn't strong enough to move as quickly as you can move your controller. The ghost-seeking mode just comes into play during physics conflicts.

I don't think a controller thump would be satisfying enough. You'd need some pretty high end robotics for freedom of movement with convincing feedback. Don't think that'll happen any time soon.

I'm picturing a VR prototype lab somewhere with compressed air canisters in a backpack feeding jet nozzles on a custom controller... great until someone loses their grip, heh.
 
Durante said:
The most recent thing I heard is that they reconfirmed that all the April shipments will still be fulfilled in April. One would assume that this (if it holds) by extension will mean that all May orders will still be fulfilled in May.
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Thanks I appreciate it. I have a difficult decision to make over the next few days..
 
Raticus79 said:
Right, the ghost would be your tracked controller, 1:1, and in free movement the avatar could keep up, unless you were wielding a really heavy weapon that your character isn't strong enough to move as quickly as you can move your controller. The ghost-seeking mode just comes into play during physics conflicts.

I don't think a controller thump would be satisfying enough. You'd need some pretty high end robotics for freedom of movement with convincing feedback. Don't think that'll happen any time soon.
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The problem with robotic feedback is that anything strong enough to physically stop you, is strong enough to injure you. Equipment goes haywire? You could be in for a very painful situation. The only way that I see this could be somewhat sidestepped is if you had an exoskeleton of sorts that only provided resistance. It could never forcefully move your arm, but it could arrest your movement. A virtual straight jacket of sorts lol. Make it passively permitting and actively restricting with a kill switch on your heel or something. Loss of power = loss of restraint.
 
Zalusithix said:
The problem with robotic feedback is that anything strong enough to physically stop you, is strong enough to injure you. Equipment goes haywire? You could be in for a very painful situation. The only way that I see this could be somewhat sidestepped is if you had an exoskeleton of sorts that only provided resistance. It could never forcefully move your arm, but it could arrest your movement. A virtual straight jacket of sorts lol. Make it passively permitting and actively restricting with a kill switch on your heel or something. Loss of power = loss of restraint.
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Imagine then, that you put your hand out to a wall and the suit restricts your movement so your hand doesn't go through the wall. Now you feel like you can lean against the wall...
 
Zalusithix said:
The problem with robotic feedback is that anything strong enough to physically stop you, is strong enough to injure you. Equipment goes haywire? You could be in for a very painful situation. The only way that I see this could be somewhat sidestepped is if you had an exoskeleton of sorts that only provided resistance. It could never forcefully move your arm, but it could arrest your movement. A virtual straight jacket of sorts lol. Make it passively permitting and actively restricting with a kill switch on your heel or something. Loss of power = loss of restraint.
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This is how Dexmo worked. It was a glove that let you feel shapes that didn't exist by locking your fingers from moving forward.
 
When playing with my Vive Pre the screen sometimes cuts to static and then black. Sometimes it recovers.

Why do you guys think this is happening? I'm thinking it is a failing HDMI cord.
 
Crispy75 said:
Imagine then, that you put your hand out to a wall and the suit restricts your movement so your hand doesn't go through the wall. Now you feel like you can lean against the wall...
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Nothing is foolproof. =P Still, considering people are already trying to support themselves on virtual items, I don't think we'd necessarily be that much worse off there. Perhaps give them a heads up somehow that they're interacting with a virtual object as opposed to a real one.
 
Zalusithix said:
The problem with robotic feedback is that anything strong enough to physically stop you, is strong enough to injure you. Equipment goes haywire? You could be in for a very painful situation. The only way that I see this could be somewhat sidestepped is if you had an exoskeleton of sorts that only provided resistance. It could never forcefully move your arm, but it could arrest your movement. A virtual straight jacket of sorts lol. Make it passively permitting and actively restricting with a kill switch on your heel or something. Loss of power = loss of restraint.
Click to expand...

Yup, would need some advanced future AI to handwave away safety concerns with the robot exerting any force to change your position in this hypothetical scenario. In the mean time, I was thinking of the handle as being the "on" condition. Goes neutral if you let go. The other end of the handle would be the robotic arm as the end of the sword, doing its best to stay out of your way. That would only really work with one sword, though - too many tricky tangles with two hands. Even then there would be some annoying limitations on moving in certain ways. The backpack/harness would run into similar problems with crossing over hands, although not as much with movement.

Interesting stuff.
 
KingSnake said:
With the pointing tool that you have in your left hand when you start. If you already transformed it into the map and driving thing you can press up on the touchpad to get back to the basic tool. Then you need to point at the containers and keep the trigger (I think) pressed until it feels out the bar and opens the container and then you get usually 2 items which you can grab with the same pointer and put on your ship where you want.
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I'm sorry, I meant the junk that appears on the map for you to pick up. Some people are out here picking up 10 pieces of junk to add to their ships while I never end up with any after the initial batch in the on-ship container.

I've tried flying up to the floating junk and shooting it with the tool thing but nothing seems to happen. I've also tried just grabbing it with a hand. nada. Dunno what to do.

If anyone knows how to pick up floating junk in Hover Junkers, please share the wisdom. I'm surprised there are no instructions in the game on this. Burden of knowledge shouldn't be a thing in a game with relatively simple mechanics.

Compsiox said:
When playing with my Vive Pre the screen sometimes cuts to static and then black. Sometimes it recovers.

Why do you guys think this is happening? I'm thinking it is a failing HDMI cord.
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Curious. I'd check the HDMI end going into the headset and maybe replace the HDMI cable going from the PC to the breakout box.
 
Not exactly what you guys are talking about, but I think you could make a cool rhythm sword fighting game. Basically show you a ghost of how and where you need to position and require you to be there on the beat. Either that or have it more freeform and require hits or blocks on the beat (kind of like Crypt of the Necrodancer). Basically turn the fight in to a dance that you can learn.
 
Dreams-Visions said:
I'm sorry, I meant the junk that appears on the map for you to pick up. Some people are out here picking up 10 pieces of junk to add to their ships while I never end up with any after the initial batch in the on-ship container.

I've tried flying up to the floating junk and shooting it with the tool thing but nothing seems to happen. I've also tried just grabbing it with a hand. nada. Dunno what to do.

If anyone knows how to pick up floating junk in Hover Junkers, please share the wisdom. I'm surprised there are no instructions in the game on this. Burden of knowledge shouldn't be a thing in a game with relatively simple mechanics.
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But this is what I'm talking about. There are some containers lying around on the field. You can see one opened already in the image below. Before you open it, it's lying horizontally. You to open them with this tool:

maxresdefault.jpg
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by keeping the trigger pressed until the bar that appears on the small square screen fills in. Then two items will pop up out of them and you can take them and place them on your ship.

If there's already some junk floating you can pick it with the same tool. You just need to be very close to the container or the junk.
 
KingSnake said:
But this is what I'm talking about. There are some containers lying around on the field. You can see one opened already in the image below. Before you open it, it's lying horizontally. You to open them with this tool:



by keeping the trigger pressed until the bar that appears on the small square screen fills in. Then two items will pop up out of them and you can take them and place them on your ship.

If there's already some junk floating you can pick it with the same tool. You just need to be very close to the container or the junk.
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hmmmmmmmmmm.

I'll give it another try. there were times when I navigated to floating junk so close that it was literally floating in my ship and I couldn't grab it. It seemed like it wanted to be grabbed, but nope. I didn't see any of those sorts of boxes so I'll keep an eye out for them next time. The junk I saw was just sort of in the middle of a given map, spinning around at about the height of the ships. Maybe shoulder height. I also didn't notice the small bar filling that you mentioned. I'll try a private lobby or something.
 
Dreams-Visions said:
hmmmmmmmmmm.

I'll give it another try. there were times when I navigated to floating junk so close that it was literally floating in my ship and I couldn't grab it. It seemed like it wanted to be grabbed, but nope. I didn't see any of those sorts of boxes so I'll keep an eye out for them next time. The junk I saw was just sort of in the middle of a given map, spinning around at about the height of the ships. Maybe shoulder height. I also didn't notice the small bar filling that you mentioned. I'll try a private lobby or something.
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The objects from the open containers are floating at that height. My impression was that also following battles there are some leftovers but I haven't seen that yet.
 
I've had my Vive for over a week but real life has been getting in the way of me fully trying out everything. So far Vanishing Realms has been my favorite. Lord help us if Nintendo makes a VR Zelda game! :D The sense of immersion and dread fighting these cartoon like enemies is so good! Has anyone tried legend of Luca yet?

Tonight I will probably try Budget cuts and Unseen Diplomacy I have heard great things about those two so far. How easy is hover junkers to get into? I already bought it but since its a multiplayer title I am hesitant to just hop on for an hour only to get frustrated at getting killed since I haven't had the time to practice.
 
I got a gray screen while using my Vive. I think I pressed the camera button on the side of the headset twice and everything suddenly went gray. I had to restart SteamVR to get it working again. Does anyone know why this happens and how to prevent it? I was able to use the camera in the past and I think I set it to 60hz.

Actually come to think of it, there was another time the screen turned gray but I think it's because I was out of the lighthouse's range. I assume this is normal?
 
dgco86 said:
I got a gray screen while using my Vive. I think I pressed the camera button on the side of the headset twice and everything suddenly went gray. I had to restart SteamVR to get it working again. Does anyone know why this happens and how to prevent it? I was able to use the camera in the past and I think I set it to 60hz.

Actually come to think of it, there was another time the screen turned gray but I think it's because I was out of the lighthouse's range. I assume this is normal?
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I don't have one, but from what I've gotten from other people, the gray screen seems to be something that happens when the headset loses tracking. Going outside of the lighthouse range and activating the camera (assuming insufficient USB bandwidth) are both capable of causing that.
 
I've been searching all over but haven't been able to find it. Can someone point out all the ceiling mounting options that people are using? I am particularly interested in the spring loaded poles with the tripod style mounts. Thanks in advance for your help.

FYI I originally canceled my april pre-order but now I'm back with a June order. Hello again.
 
Compsiox said:
When playing with my Vive Pre the screen sometimes cuts to static and then black. Sometimes it recovers.

Why do you guys think this is happening? I'm thinking it is a failing HDMI cord.
Click to expand...

Happened to me 2 times. After that i removed all the cables from all parts (HMD, CenterBox and the PC) cleaned all cables and put everything back. No problems ever since.

Also, check for EMI sources nearby the CenterBox and the PC.

Every cable in the system is pushed to the limits of signal strenght and distance, so better not take chances.
 
Compsiox said:
When playing with my Vive Pre the screen sometimes cuts to static and then black. Sometimes it recovers.

Why do you guys think this is happening? I'm thinking it is a failing HDMI cord.
Click to expand...

That sounds exactly like a failing HDMI cable or port. Hopefully it's the former, and also not the HDMI attached the the HMD.
 
qa_engineer said:
I've been searching all over but haven't been able to find it. Can someone point out all the ceiling mounting options that people are using? I am particularly interested in the spring loaded poles with the tripod style mounts. Thanks in advance for your help.

FYI I originally canceled my april pre-order but now I'm back with a June order. Hello again.
Click to expand...

Would those poles really be considered ceiling mounting? They're basically ceiling stabilized monopods, not something actually mounted to the ceiling. I don't think there are any traditional ceiling mount options that don't involve drilling holes. Now with a drop ceiling, or if you have track lighting installed, then there's options available. A standard ceiling though? Not so much.
 
Zalusithix said:
Would those poles really be considered ceiling mounting? They're basically ceiling stabilized monopods, not something actually mounted to the ceiling. I don't think there are any traditional ceiling mount options that don't involve drilling holes. Now with a drop ceiling, or if you have track lighting installed, then there's options available. A standard ceiling though? Not so much.
Click to expand...

It's a pole that extends from the floor to the ceiling, so yes, I would consider it a ceiling mounting option.

Any mounting options that have been discussed that do not require drilling into walls and or ceilings is welcome.
 
chubigans said:
Wrote a post on my tumblr about my VIVE experience over the weekend if anyone's interested: http://chubigans.tumblr.com/post/142689171209/vr
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very nice write-up and it mirrors my own thoughts. Gonna go get Blarp as well.

Also, theBlu is like...my new favorite chill thing. I play it with the old SegaCD Ecco the Dolphin soundtrack:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xzdShv9Rfv4

Do recommend to all. I just sit on the floor watching the fish go by feeling peaceful as I could ever imagine feeling. It's so nice.
 
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