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I made out with an older woman last night

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B

BlueTsunami

there is joy in sucking dick
Conor_Fool said:
And something I missed in the OP - she asked me to say her name or some shit when we were talking and I blanked. I didn't know her first or last name because I have referred to her as "the milf" for so long now. Her kids are young teens and at camp by the way.
Click to expand...

That's def the fuckup. The intimacy prob wasn't there for her, enough of it at least. You don goofed.
 
Northeastmonk

Northeastmonk

Gold Member
I think its still a bad thing to do. I mean, I knew a woman (10 years older than me) who had a picture of her dead husband standing next to Bill Clinton right next to her bedroom and that was still odd. So I would just tell her it was a mistake until she's divorced. Because adultery is still unethical no matter how you put it. They are still bound by law and other serious decisions. So unless she's already divorced I wouldn't have anything more to do with her.
 
U

usea

Member
Mr. B Natural said:
I was thinking of the same sketch while I typed what I did.
It's funny and all but if Louis C.K can't tell the difference between "No, Stop" as she is getting more and more aroused and smiling and grinding and "No, Stop" like someone that is very uncomfortable, then he can't handle a freak. Or, for that matter, he can't handle having sex with the more sexually complex gender in general.

There's a reason why a 47 year old will hit on and invite her 20 year neighbor of all people to her house and make out like a 18 year old and it's not because she's a good girl. She wants revenge sex and revenge sex isn't pretty.

But not all guys like that. But, don't be surprised that she keeps teasing you, OP, and then, for some odd reason, she just ups and gets frustrated with you (and very very abruptly). You don't read her mind, she will give up and cause drama/emotion. That is, of course, if my freak sense is tingling properly.
Click to expand...
Ok, given that this is the first time the OP has been intimate with this woman, and she's basically a stranger, do you think it's better for him to err on the side of caution or to just go for it?

Let's approximate some values and compute the expected value of each action.

- S - Consensual sex with neighbor: 100 points (ignore any negative points for her being married)

- N - No sex: 0 points

- R - Raping a person: -100000000000000000 points

- rP - Probability upon raping a neighbor that the OP sees some jail time: 15%

- J - OP goes to jail: -100000000000000000 points

- aP - OP's accuracy in determining whether she's just fooling when she says no: 60% (let's be generous, even though she's a stranger)

- tP - Probability that a grown woman says no to a stranger when she really means yes: 20% (being super generous)

"Just go for it": (C * tP * aP) + (R * (1 - (tP * aP))) + (J * (1 - (tP * aP) * rP)))
= 100 * .12 + -100000000000000000 * .88 + .018 * -100000000000000000
= 12 + -88000000000000000 + -1800000000000000
= -89799999999999988

"assume no means no": N
= 0

You can fool with the numbers if your estimates are different. For example, maybe his dad knows a judge and he can 100% avoid jail time. And maybe you don't think rape is that bad, so you only assign it -5000 points. And maybe you're pretty sure that 50% of women who say no to strangers really mean yes. And you're super confident (80%) that you can tell when a woman "really" wants it even though she says no. And maybe you -really- love sex (200 points).

"Just go for it": (C * tP * aP) + (R * (1 - (tP * aP))) + (J * (1 - (tP * aP) * rP)))
= 200 * .5 * .8 + -5000 * (1 - (.5 * .8)) + -100000000000000000 * 0
= 200 * 0.4 + -5000 * 0.6 + 0
= 80 + -3000
= -2920

"assume no means no: N
= 0

So even if you're stupid, horny, lack empathy and well-connected you're still WAYYYYY better off not doing this.


edit: I think the math is slightly off? I don't think I should just multiply tP and aP. regarding base rate fallacy?
 
J

jmdajr

Member
Conor_Fool said:
and things got weird...

So my good friend who I will be living with in Denver starting July 1st has always had a cougar neighbor in our hometown of St. Louis. She is 47 and married with two kids, but my god she is bangin. She has always taken a special liking to me, but I just figured she is a flirt/has an unhealthy relationship with her husband. I'm 20 by the way.

Well, last night about 7 of my friends were all drinking on my buddys porch, and sure enough, the cougar yelled "Is that Conor I hear!?" from across the street after hearing my laugh (I have a very unfortunate laugh, the sound seems to carry for miles). Well give it like 15 minutes or so and she shows up to the porch and starts drinking with us. She is in a great mood but she keeps slipping in how alone she is and that her husband is never home. Rewind to a bit earlier in the night when I inquired about "the milf" and my buddy was telling us she is going through a nasty divorce and her husband has been having an affair for god knows how long. I was about to joke "now is my chance" when he was telling the story, but I refrained because I thought it was in bad taste. Welp, it really was my chance.

After drinking with us for a while, I end up walking her back to her house across the street. She had told us earlier that she had made out with an 18 year old, and on the way back she starts rubbing on me and being like "I hope you know were totally going to make out" or some shit like that. I was drunk and in disbelief, but I'll be damned if I wasn't the happiest man on earth. So we start going at it on her porch, all the while my buddies could apparently make out (no pun intended) silhouettes of us. So she is like straight up opening up to me as I drink the glass of Jack she offered me, telling me all about her fucked up husband and how he never comes home until super late (it was like midnight and she said he comes home at like 2 or 3, but I was still a bit nervous). As she tells me this she just starts crying on my shoulder and shit as I rub her head and say its okay, then 5 minutes later we're going at it again. When we would go at it I would just be grabbing her and feeling on her and shit, but to my dismay she would reject me whenever I tried to go further, insisting she was "a prude." I was making out and giving life advice to a married woman who is over two and a half decades older than me. We even acknowledged the whole decade thing. It was totally bizarre.

We parted ways after about an hour and I walked back across the street to applause from all my friends. I denied we did anything but they all knew something happened. Even though I didn't get nearly as far as I would have hoped, I figured I would share my tale with GAF because I have few others to tell...
Click to expand...

Damn, no finger up your ass. Oh well, better luck next time.
 
H

hydragonwarrior

Member
I've done the same with a 44 year old ish woman (although she was single).

Definitely it's an interesting experience, but the fact that she *isn't* single yet is an alarm bell. You don't want to get caught up in that (i.e. not finalized divorce, emotional problems, etc.)

Add onto that, if her husband really was sleeping around, who knows if she caught anything from that.
 
S

soepje

Member
Northeastmonk said:
I think its still a bad thing to do. I mean, I knew a woman (10 years older than me) who had a picture of her dead husband standing next to Bill Clinton right next to her bedroom and that was still odd. So I would just tell her it was a mistake until she's divorced. Because adultery is still unethical no matter how you put it. They are still bound by law and other serious decisions. So unless she's already divorced I wouldn't have anything more to do with her.
Click to expand...

Isn´t it ''till death do us part''?
 
G

GoldenEye 007

Member
I was wasted at a football game once at a bar on campus and ran into some milf. She thought I looked like Darius Rucker because I was wearing a cowboy hat.

Anyway, somehow a topic relating to her fake tits came up. I mentioned something like I've never played with fake ones. She took my hands then put them under her shirt right in the bar.

They felt nice. We made out at one point too. Never saw her again. Got her number, though. But I was like..... nah, bad idea. Never made it to the football game. :(
 
M

Mr. B Natural

Member
usea said:
Ok, given that this is the first time the OP has been intimate with this woman, and she's basically a stranger, do you think it's better for him to err on the side of caution or to just go for it?

Math
Click to expand...

A. I said nothing about rape. I am not saying he just go find her right now and start molesting her. Context. If you're grinding private parts from under your pants with a woman for half an hour (to the point where your friends thought you had sex), the context changes. You can, in fact, experiment a little to get a reaction especially since that is exactly what she is doing to him. You HAVE TO at some point experiment in having sex every single time you have sex with someone for the first time. If you're afraid of being accused of rape then I suggest never having sex with anyone, ever.


B. If you can't tell the difference between a woman that is being turned on by something and a woman that is being turned off by something, again, I suggest never having sex with anyone, ever. Things have to build up too. It starts with a kiss or a touch no matter how far it builds up. If you kiss someone that doesn't want to be kissed then that's molestation as much as a spank on the butt fifteen minutes into a makeout session. Heck, it might be more so.

And how did you know she wanted to be kissed? In her eyes? Her lips? Looks. Posture. Did she flick her hair? Talk to you a certain way?

You know whether the woman wants to be braced against the wall well before you reach the wall. Is she going with you (like a part some strange dance between the two of you)? If not, then stop. It takes two to be bent over the knee.
Observational skills: that's what makes you good in bed AND safe in bed.

There is "Oh" as in surprise, shock, arousal, anger, confusion, etc.
"Please" can mean yes, no, thank you, I appreciate it, ugh, prayer and desperation, etc.
How does one know the difference? It's obvious to anyone without aspergers, no?

C. If OP had an interest in being cautious, then why did he go with her to her house at all? Nevermind that he knew her husband could actually be coming home soon. The OP wants to bang this lady. I'm the only one here that appears to have any clue how to make that happen. It is advice and only advice. He does what he wants, and, to give you credit, it's his ass if things go wrong. But to me, I'd be more afraid of Mr. Hubby than Mrs. Emotional Rollercoaster. But, then again, without Mr. Hubby, Mrs. Emotional Rollercoaster wouldn't have hit on him in the first place.

I mean, she called herself a "prude" for christ's sake. She's playing innocent make believe for a reason.
 
U

usea

Member
Mr. B Natural said:
A. I said nothing about rape.
Click to expand...
The discussion is about whether you can tell if a person "really wants it" when they say no. If they said no and you incorrectly interpret that as them really wanting it and you fuck them, that's rape. You didn't use the word, but let's be clear about what we're talking about. Having sex with a person who doesn't want it is rape, even if you think they want it.

I am not saying he just go find her right now and start molesting her. Context. If you're grinding private parts from under your pants with a woman for half an hour (to the point where your friends thought you had sex), the context changes.
Click to expand...
Let's be clear again, just because a woman invites you over, makes out with you, grinds with you, she's still free to say no. I am sure you understand this, but I'm just making it explicit. Yes, it probably changes your perception about her actions and words that immediately follow, but you still run the risk of being wrong.

You can, in fact, experiment a little to get a reaction especially since that is exactly what she is doing to him.
Click to expand...
You just described the variable I labeled aP - OP's accuracy in determining whether she's just fooling when she says no: 60%. This is the probability that he can tell whether this person who he is not familiar with is being sincere when they say no. Feel free to adjust the number and recalculate, as in the example I gave. I am sure that any reasonable value you plug in for the numbers will show that you'd be a moron to fuck a stranger who says no.


B. If you can't tell the difference between a woman that is being turned on by something and a woman that is being turned off by something, again, I suggest never having sex with anyone, ever.
[...]
Observational skills: that's what makes you good in bed AND safe in bed.
Click to expand...
Nobody can tell this for sure. There's a variable level of certainty, which I've labeled in the formula. I believe that this certainty is pretty low with strangers, since you don't know them or their mannerisms. Obviously you're supremely confident in your ability to tell this, even with strangers. I think you're a fool if you think you know people that well. My point is that there is some probability that you're wrong, and the consequences for being wrong are cosmically huge compared to the benefits of being right. That's what expected value is for: weighing options where you know the value of each outcome and its probability.

Being right and having sex, even at a 99% probability (which is unrealistic in this situation) is still FAR outweighed by a 1% chance of being wrong. Rape is more bad than sex is good, by a large enough margin that it outweighs whatever ability you think you have in determining what's in the mind of a stranger.
 
S

superpickleman

Member
The older I've gotten (23 atm) the more I've appreciated cougars.

Can't say I blame you for going as far as you did OP, I just hope you tried everything in your power to get further.
 
C

Conor_Fool

Banned
Cow Mengde said:
Did you count her wrinkles?
Click to expand...

She would look me in the eyes and talk about her wrinkles. She hardly had any for real. The whole time I was either looking her dead in the eye or putting my head down and explaining how I was in disbelief, calling her beautiful and shit.

GoldenEye 007 said:
I was wasted at a football game once at a bar on campus and ran into some milf. She thought I looked like Darius Rucker because I was wearing a cowboy hat.

Anyway, somehow a topic relating to her fake tits came up. I mentioned something like I've never played with fake ones. She took my hands then put them under her shirt right in the bar.

They felt nice. We made out at one point too. Never saw her again. Got her number, though. But I was like..... nah, bad idea. Never made it to the football game. :(
Click to expand...

The cowboy hat bit made me laugh out loud. Congrats on copping a feel by the way.

nemss said:
Enjoy that trip to Bush Stadium.
Click to expand...

She actually wants to go to the Counting Crows with us at Live on the Levee for July 4th (its on the 6th) which is right by Bush Stadium. That's the music she played as everything went down. Also, is that a pun about her having a hairy vagina?

And to the mathematical equations, I am quite lost...

superpickleman said:
The older I've gotten (23 atm) the more I've appreciated cougars.

Can't say I blame you for going as far as you did OP, I just hope you tried everything in your power to get further.
Click to expand...

I did my friend...I did
 
M

Mr. B Natural

Member
usea said:
The discussion is about whether you can tell if a person "really wants it" when they say no. If they said no and you incorrectly interpret that as them really wanting it and you fuck them, that's rape. You didn't use the word, but let's be clear about what we're talking about. Having sex with a person who doesn't want it is rape, even if you think they want it.
Click to expand...
You have absolutely, positively no idea what I'm talking about, do you? For the virgins out there: at the point of actually inserting ones private parts into another's, you will and MUST have absolute agreeance. Unless you're some psychotic rapist, you won't be able to not notice if the woman wants it or not at that point. I am referring to, and have been referring to, what leads to sex eventually. I am referring to the gradual building up of foreplay via subservience/dominance and not the disgusting act of rape. Some people watch too much of that Japanese porn crap.

Yes, there are people out there that enjoy rape simulation, but they're a subculture that is nothing like what the OP's neighbor is doing. Usually, such people are aware that their interests are considered extremely taboo and dangerous and thus the person's desires are expressed outwardly.

And please stop trolling with your "formula" nonsense.
 
F

Fonds

Member
channing-tatum-jamie-foxx2-jimmy-kimmel-gif-2013.gif
 
P

PhoenixDark

Banned
NEVER have sex with a married woman in her house. If you're going to creep, do it in a hotel or at your place. But in this case since she lives across the street...a hotel would be better. I realize you weren't going to do it but still, IF you do it you have to be safe.

I was somewhat involved with an older woman who wanted her husband to catch her cheating. Her husband was a POS and they were going through a divorce, but I couldn't will myself to have sex with a married woman even though she is stunningly hot; 43 years old, 1 adopted (grown) kid. She'd come to my place and we'd cook together, watch movies...and she'd cry; I've known her for a pretty long time (went to school with her adopted daughter...). She'd always want me to go to her place to fuck, and based on shit she had said previously while drunk I knew she wanted her husband to find us. Fuck that shit.

Eventually she moved to Oregon, thus making my life a lot more simple. We still talk but I do miss her; she finalized the divorce so next time I see her it's on lol.
 
C

commedieu

Banned
Theres a reason people who are older than you, advise to stay away from married people.
Have your fun buddy, but remember risk vs reward..
 
D

dvdjamm

Member
Conor_Fool said:
Thanks for the replies my friends. To the person who said she was waiting for me to take control - I wish. I took full control and there were points where she was on top of me and me on top of her, but she just wouldn't let me do anything else. By god I tried.

And to those saying this doesn't end well, I go out of town the day after tomorrow for a week and then I'm only back in town for a week or so (lease starts July 1st but I'm waitin til the 7th or so). So for all I know I won't see this woman again for many months or even years.
Click to expand...

You have some planning to do,Conor...If you get it right,the 1st week of July should be memorable
 
K

KnightSlyder

Banned
Sounds like a trainwreck. Sounds like a slut. Sounds like she's using you to fling a zinger at her husband by making out in full sight in her own neighborhood. Sounds like it a bunch of drama.

Get an unmarried one at whatever age you prefer. It's a more honest way to go...
 
M

mugurumakensei

Member
I slept with a married 40 year old when I was 23. She actually broke up with her boyfriend to be with me. Not long after, I stopped returning her calls.

Anyway, relationship is already strained so you're doing nothing wrong if you dive in.
 
digoutyoursoul

digoutyoursoul

Member
I was having a brief fling with a 32 year old when I was 21. She was gorgeous, I can't find her on social networks, would love to speak to her again
 
R

RoninChaos

Member
Man, just don't fuck at her place. That's asking for problems. Don't pass up a hook up like this either though if it's something you want. Don't let GAF hold you back. Just be safe and smart about it.
 
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