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[THE:MILKMAN]

Sorry for being slightly OT..............

Just gave my HTPC a good clean and now my Sony Bravia EX503 won't display 1080P(VGA)

The max it will display is 1650x1050 or I just get "Unsupported signal" error.

Tried switching everything on/off and unplugging/plugging everything in.
Tried updating to latest graphics driver.(Intel G31 Chipset)

Anything i'm missing? Cheers.

 

[brain_stew]

You can't get a 460 for $140. At most $168 for the 768MB models. And that's near HD6850 price territory.

X3 445 ($75~) is a good processor for gaming on a budget. Not much difference with the AII X4 ($99~), but at least $25 less that can be go to a better gpu. Not to mention the unlock possibilities.

Yes you can (even less after rebates).

Anyone buying a triple core processor in this day and age is going to end up kicking themselves. Games that make use of 4 cores are the norm these days, not the exception, and a measly $20 to add an extra core makes it a no brainer. Relying on the random chance of "unlocking" CPU is a fools game when you can guarantee it for $20.

The 6850 definitely looks to be the way to go if he has $200 for a GPU, if he doesn't the 5770 isn't the card he should be buying. Its been a shitty buy for a long time now, and its only looking worse these days.

 

[Ryoma-Echizen]

That's not retail price. They sell so bad that they need these discounts?

As for the setup, then we should adjust the PSU to update for a quad:

SeaSonic S12II 520 Bronze 520W

 

[brain_stew]

That's not retail price. They sell so bad that they need these discounts?

Who gives a fuck why they're available at below <$140!? As a consumer you buy the best card for your budget, regardless of why its available at that price point.

Take the AMD fanboy BS elsewhere. The 5770 is a bad buy, it almost always has been.

 

[Cipherr]

That's not retail price. They sell so bad that they need these discounts?

Just in case your not being sarcastic, I doubt there are discounts because they "need" them. There are discounts, combos, and rebates on some of the highest selling popular items on Newegg ALL the time.

I mean all the time. And by all the time I mean all the time.

 

[undu]

I read about this case, now I really want it for the PC I want to make, but can't find it for less than 180€.

fuck $1 = €1 conversions

 

[brain_stew]

As for the setup, then we should adjust the PSU to update for a quad:

SeaSonic S12II 520 Bronze 520W

Both CPUs have the exact same TDP! :lol :lol

No need to change the PSU, to suggest as much is simply ridiculous. FFS, you were only just talking about using the old PSU to run an "unlocked" version of the X3, have some consistency. Dicking people over just to push an agenda is not what this thread is for.

 

[brain_stew]

http://www.compusa.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=6491183&sku=G458-0464&SRCCODE=LSCMPUSA&cm_mmc_o=-ddCjC1bELltzywCjC-d2CjCdwwp&AffiliateID=NKa3hZyYoHA-.ChLDNv7KZUDmjA1FNTwHQ

Or even cheaper at newegg with coupon HARDOCP113C

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814500173

165 - 9 Dollar coupon code - 25 dollar rebate = 131ish at the end.

I'd take the Zotac model on Newegg personally, better brand, same price:


http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produ...73&cm_re=gtx_460_zotac-_-14-500-173-_-Product

 

[Ryoma-Echizen]

I'm not talking about TDP, just price (640 $99, 445 $75).

Months ago OCZ SXS 500w were $39, now out of stock.

At retail price both ModsXstream 500w and the seasonic 520w cost the same ($59).

 

[asdad123]

I'd take the Zotac model on Newegg personally, better brand, same price:


http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produ...73&cm_re=gtx_460_zotac-_-14-500-173-_-Product

Yep thats the one I linked for 131.

I gotta build myself a PC already and stop hanging out in this thread haha.

 

[brain_stew]

I'm not talking about TDP, just price (640 $99, 445 $75).

Then why specify a more expensive PSU? You're making my head spin.

 

[Cipherr]

Since your around stew, can you or anyone else answer a question about SSD's for me.

Im going to grab an intel one, will there be anyway, with a Win7 install, to have OS folders like the desktop housed on my F3 instead of the SSD (which is of course where W7 will be installed). IIRC with windows OS's the directory for the desktop is located somewhere like C:\blah\blah\Puncture\Desktop. I suppose its not a big deal, but when I save a file to desktop in a hurry, or copy something from a dvd or my external USB thumbdrives to my PC, Ive built a habit over the years of copying it all onto the desktop.

It would just be nice to not be constantly writing to the SSD (the one I'm getting is only 80GB) and later having to move all of my crap onto the F3. But I'm sure Ill live, even if its not possible.



(Yes, my desktop is always littered with broken shortcuts and icons for stuff I cant even recall the use for)

 

[·feist·]

That's not retail price. They sell so bad that they need these discounts?

As for the setup, then we should adjust the PSU to update for a quad:

SeaSonic S12II 520 Bronze 520W

At this point, I find your staunch refusal to ever recommend a non-AMD product rather amusing.

I'm not normally the type to get into things of this sort, but it's as if it pains you in some way to suggest an Intel or Nvidia solution even in instances when one is clearly a better option. I don't mean this as an attack, but you seem to be doing your fellow members a disservice when the help you're providing has an obvious underlying bias. Preferences are one thing, allowing them to cloud your decision making is another. Unfortunately, this isn't the first time you've been called out on your AMD/ATI bias.

The majority of us are here providing assistance to others in order to help them get the best performing and lowest priced builds or accessories that properly suit their needs. Whether that's a cable, PSU, motherboard, CPU and so on, whatever number of options may be best for each user's needs and budget is what everyone of us has been trying to provide. Regardless of brand.

 

[Ryoma-Echizen]

Since your around stew, can you or anyone else answer a question about SSD's for me.

Im going to grab an intel one, will there be anyway, with a Win7 install, to have OS folders like the desktop housed on my F3 instead of the SSD (which is of course where W7 will be installed). IIRC with windows OS's the directory for the desktop is located somewhere like C:\blah\blah\Puncture\Desktop. I suppose its not a big deal, but when I save a file to desktop in a hurry, or copy something from a dvd or my external USB thumbdrives to my PC, Ive built a habit over the years of copying it all onto the desktop.

It would just be nice to not be constantly writing to the SSD (the one I'm getting is only 80GB) and later having to move all of my crap onto the F3. But I'm sure Ill live, even if its not possible.



(Yes, my desktop is always littered with broken shortcuts and icons for stuff I cant even recall the use for)

Do your keyboard support shortcuts? That should be the easiest way to access a folder without saturating the desktop with shortcuts.


*Another leaked pic:

 

[brain_stew]

Since your around stew, can you or anyone else answer a question about SSD's for me.

I'm not the man to ask about SSD queries, sorry.

 

[Cipherr]

Do your keyboard support shortcuts? That should be the easiest way to access a folder without saturating the desktop with shortcuts.


*Another leaked pic:

Nah my keyboard doesnt, I just remember someone making a post about ssd,s a linked libraries or something where they managed to put their steam data drive on the mechanical drive while leaving only like one installed game on the SSD through some kind of file or folder redirection tool. But maybe I misunderstood.

I'm not the man to ask about SSD queries, sorry.

No prob, thanks anyway.

And wow I like the colorscheme on that MSi card.

 

[brain_stew]

Nah my keyboard doesnt, I just remember someone making a post about ssd,s a linked libraries or something where they managed to put their steam data drive on the mechanical drive while leaving only like one installed game on the SSD through some kind of file or folder redirection tool. But maybe I misunderstood..

Oh, you can do that, its called *something* links, the name escapes me. A few GAFers have their SSDs setup like that. Its built into Windows 7.

Edit:

Symbolic links:

http://www.windows7home.net/how-to-create-symbolic-link-in-windows-7/

 

[vazel]

You use the mklink command to do that. Just google mklink steam.

 

[Cipherr]

Excellent thanks guys.

 

[BigBlackGamer]

I've been out of the loop for awhile so the 6870 is the new 5870? has pricing been discussed?

 

[ChoklitReign]

If AMD doesn't release any new cards around $150, does it makes the 768MB 460 the (current) best?

 

[Nabs]

I've been out of the loop for awhile so the 6870 is the new 5870? has pricing been discussed?

closer to the 5770, i think??

 

[·feist·]

(nevermind, my PSU question had been answered...fuck. my dream of building a high-end portable gaming rig that looks like a gamecube still eludes me...)
*edit: wait, ·feist·'s post gives me hope. what's the minimum wattage an i5/GTX 460 or the like GPU require? would 500 be ok, or only 600w?

ah, only because the site im looking at doesn't offer the 6850, suppose i could take a cheaper card and then upgrade? your CPU comment lost me though; why would the i5-760 not be a good call? im told OC'ing it to @ 3.5ghz shouldn't be a problem, long as temperatures in the SFF case hold.

IrishNinja,

A quality 500w PSU can run a quad core + a GTX480, so you'd be fine with one for GTX460-level GPU. It's all in how much additional overhead you want, and what level of stress you'd like for your PSU to be under.

That Lian-Li looks great. When I build my power desktop, I am thinking about also building a Micro ATX system, for use with downloading and such, because I dont want a powerful gaming pc, being turned on all night... its bad for your power bills if your doing SLI and shit.


But is it the best way to build a dedicated HTPC? I was also thinking about buying one of those sleek HP Home Server systems, but thats more like storage, though it says it can convert files on the fly, and backup shit wirelessly.

Basically you want your gaming PC hooked up to your gaming monitors. but then you want your your HTPC hooked up to your HDTV, so you can browse the net from your couch and watch your downloaded stuff on the HDTV too.. and you also want back up for your HTPC AND your gaming PC, with all your important files.

how the hell would one go about all this, without buying needless systems and parts?


gaming rig

htpc

server backup for everything


and perhaps a budget sound system that connects everything, like a universal soundbar, that can get hooked up to the computers, console and tv.

jesus christ my head hurts

It can seem daunting, but you only need to weigh your options, research, and plan accordingly. Take into consideration whether or not you rent (if you own, you have the freedom to modify walls/floors, if need be, to get the best set up), the size of the space(s) or room(s) that each PC or device will occupy and how they'll all interact. For storage, you can look into a NAS solution. Instead of buying a pricing one, you can build a low-cost NAS or home server. Have a look at something like Linux or Windows Home Server.

As for that Lian-Li, it's a great choice for a smaller system. Mind you, it isn't as small as it appears in some photos, but considering that it'll take mATX boards, a 5970 GPU, full ATX PSU as well as 92mm/120mm/140mm HSFs and water cooling, it's a solid starting point.

If you decide on that particular case, start here for ideas and fitment:

http://hardforum.com/showthread.php?t=1523895
http://www.techspot.com/review/323-lian-li-mini-q-pc-v354/

I believe one of the Chinese tech sites also did a nice detailed break down of the case with lots of photos (most likely Expreview), but I can't recall. I'll post the link when I have a chance to.

I read about this case, now I really want it for the PC I want to make, but can't find it for less than 180€.

fuck $1 = €1 conversions

See the llinks above if that helps in anyway.

 

[Ryoma-Echizen]

New numbers:

3Dmark vantage "H" settings
GTX460 1GB 360mm^2 die size
GPU: 8830

HD6870 1GB 230mm^2 die size
GPU: 10430

In this bench HD6870 (Barts XT) is 18% faster than 460 1GB.



3Dmark vantage "P" settings
GTX460 1GB 360mm^2 die size
GPU: 12539

HD6870 1GB 230mm^2 die size
GPU: 15800


In this bench HD6870 (Barts XT) is 26% faster than 460 1GB.


http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?t=260720&page=16

 

[Hazaro]

If that slots in at $249 that's a nice price point for the card, esp considering the yields AMD is getting on that die. Hopefully there's a sweet game bundle thrown in as well. I don't think it'll clock as great as the 5 series or 460 though, but I sure hope so. 915Mhz already on the die.

I hope they are more aggressive with the 6850.

 

[brain_stew]

I've been out of the loop for awhile so the 6870 is the new 5870? has pricing been discussed?

Its a 6770 going by the naming scheme established for the last few years. Slightly slower than a 5870, fixed tessellation performance, lower power consumption and a lower price.

 

[brain_stew]

If that slots in at $249 that's a nice price point for the card, esp considering the yields AMD is getting on that die. Hopefully there's a sweet game bundle thrown in as well. I don't think it'll clock as great as the 5 series or 460 though, but I sure hope so. 915Mhz already on the die.

I hope they are more aggressive with the 6850.

It has to come in at <$300 to make me take notice. $250 is what it should be, its overpriced at anything more than that imo, just like the 5850 and 5870 are already. AMD need to get price competitive again. The entire 5xxx series offered worse value than the cards they replaced.

 

[Shambles]

New numbers:

3Dmark vantage "H" settings
GTX460 1GB 360mm^2 die size
GPU: 8830

HD6870 1GB 230mm^2 die size
GPU: 10430

In this bench HD6870 (Barts XT) is 18% faster than 460 1GB.



3Dmark vantage "P" settings
GTX460 1GB 360mm^2 die size
GPU: 12539

HD6870 1GB 230mm^2 die size
GPU: 15800


In this bench HD6870 (Barts XT) is 26% faster than 460 1GB.


http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?t=260720&page=16

Well that was painfully useless information to give us as it looks like it will be priced near the 6850 NOT the 6870. From those numbers though I would assume the 1GB 460 > 6850 and will be at the same price point. *sigh*

 

[BigBlackGamer]

Its a 6770 going by the naming scheme established for the last few years. Slightly slower than a 5870, fixed tessellation performance, lower power consumption and a lower price.

ahh nice. so is there going to be a GPU on the 5870's level? 6970?

 

[Fredescu]

Does someone feel like making a 6 series thread to get the useless data and rubbish speculation out of this one?

 

[Jin34]

ahh nice. so is there going to be a GPU on the 5870's level? 6970?

Yep, codename is Cayman. They are the 6950, 6970.

 

[BigBlackGamer]

oh ok. gotta catch up big time. I hope we see a good 5870 price drop. would love to get another one for crossfire.

 

[Ryoma-Echizen]

HD5850 X7285
HD5870 X8958
HD6850 X6682
HD6870 X7715
GTX 460 1GB X6921
GTX 470 X7831
GTX 480 X9864

In real world gaming, 6850 is a bit faster than gtx 460

http://www.chiphell.com/thread-130336-1-1.html

Napoleon, a trusful source.

 

[rohlfinator]

I really hope they get the pricing right on the 6000 series. I'm getting the itch to replace my on-the-cheap 4850 (which gets the job done for most things, but at 1080p I'd like something with a bit more kick).

 

[Darkatomz]

In real world gaming, 6850 is a bit faster than gtx 460

http://www.chiphell.com/thread-130336-1-1.html

Napoleon, a trusful source.

This is assuming that their drivers are ok. Nvidia is a little more stable when it comes to the drivers department than ATI.

 

[IrishNinja]

IrishNinja,

A quality 500w PSU can run a quad core + a GTX480, so you'd be fine with one for GTX460-level GPU. It's all in how much additional overhead you want, and what level of stress you'd like for your PSU to be under.

i see - thanks man. is OCing the CPU something that affects this overhead/stress much? i know its hard to say per chip/etc but again, an i5-760 @ say 3.5ghz, would you expect a great deal more heat/voltage/load from this? still trying to get a feel for what to expect.

really want to make peace with the SG07, most of my demands sound best for it, but some of the cases in this thread look lighter/more aesthetically pleasing for my SFF wishes here. for instance: the Lan Li PC-V354, where are you guys even seeing that for sale?

If not the shuttle, then Ill probably pick up this and get an Athlon X4 640 for $100 with a free matx motherboard from the Microcenter near me since this case fits a full size power supply.

yeah, ive been looking at a few shuttles as well, nothing that seemed to work with my setup just yet, sadly. if you do go with taht thermalite one, post back on it; i was told to be a bit wary since they're not known for quality.

 

[Hazaro]

i see - thanks man. is OCing the CPU something that affects this overhead/stress much? i know its hard to say per chip/etc but again, an i5-760 @ say 3.5ghz, would you expect a great deal more heat/voltage/load from this? still trying to get a feel for what to expect.

really want to make peace with the SG07, most of my demands sound best for it, but some of the cases in this thread look lighter/more aesthetically pleasing for my SFF wishes here. for instance: the Lan Li PC-V354, where are you guys even seeing that for sale?



yeah, ive been looking at a few shuttles as well, nothing that seemed to work with my setup just yet, sadly. if you do go with taht thermalite one, post back on it; i was told to be a bit wary since they're not known for quality.

Voltage bumps are what really cause power consumption to go up, but with a i5+460 on a 500w you are fine. You can probably hit 3.5 on stock volts with no problems.

 

[Mercutio]

I've just put together my first rig in a few years... I thought I could get by with my workstation at the office as my primary method of computering, but I got kind of sick of dragging myself in on weekends to do my own stuff.

Phenom II 1090T
Gigabyte 890FX-UD5
EVGA GTX 470 Superclocked
Corsair HX 750w
Corsair 1600 DDR3 Rams
Cooler Master 690 ii Advanced Case

Thoughts:
So far, I'm very pleased with the stability and quiet of the whole thing. I have a TON of hard drives in there (frames got to be rendered somewhere, and I don't delete anything) so this case (while not as nice as the Lian-Lis I've had in the past) has been decent so far. I like the HD SATA connections on the top a lot, and the cable routing is very good. The plastics seem OK, but I'm not the hugest fan of the tricky to replace side panels. Well fitted when they're on, but a real pain in the neck to find the right "notch."

This AMD processor is excellent. I've never had an AMD before, and the thing absolutely screams in rendering and seems to be great in games. It also unlocked the potential of getting a less expensive motherboard from great companies with fantastic features.

My thinking with the GTX 470 is that in 90 days I can either step up to a 480, or if something better pops up I'll hop on board with that. I remember going from an 8800 Ultra to a 9800 GX2 with no issues on EVGA a few years ago. What're the odds of a successor card to hit shelves from nVidia before mid January?

To Do:
Other than the GPU update at some point, I'm considering getting a better case possibly, and a sound card for sure. The onboard audio on the UD5 blows.

 

[opticalmace]

Any news of when Sandy Bridge should be out?

 

[kitch9]

This is assuming that their drivers are ok. Nvidia is a little more stable when it comes to the drivers department than ATI.

Thats bollocks, my last card was a 5870, and my current cards are 2x460's, and whilst neither are perfect, they are both fine.

My mobility 5730 in my Laptop is flawless....

 

[Sanjay]

Oh, you can do that, its called *something* links, the name escapes me. A few GAFers have their SSDs setup like that. Its built into Windows 7.

Edit:

Symbolic links:

http://www.windows7home.net/how-to-create-symbolic-link-in-windows-7/

People should use Steam Tool.

http://forums.steampowered.com/forum...6&postcount=47

This user called Kappaseven from the steam forums made this awesome application called Steamtool which lets you easily install any non Valve game to any hard-drive you want, really good for people with small HD's or SSD.

http://www.steamtool.com/

So what I have, games that I play a lot I keep them on my SSD and games for storage on a large HD. You can easily swap them around when ever you feel like your going to play some other games more often.

 

[golem]

snap thats awesome

 

[Hazaro]

To the people looking for $5-600 build I'll have it up tomorrow.
Gonna crash after Starcraft tonight.

 

[brain_stew]

In real world gaming, 6850 is a bit faster than gtx 460

http://www.chiphell.com/thread-130336-1-1.html

Napoleon, a trusful source.

6870 has to be =<$250 and 6850 has to be =<$200 to be worthwile launches. A penny more and they'll be offering worse priceerformance than cards already on the market, should really be $150/$250 if they want to shake things up, these are midrange solutions afterall.

Lower power consumption and the rest of it is nice and all but ultimately most gamers are still going to buy their GPU based on what gives them the best framerates for their dollar. Nvidia have been offering 5870 performance for <$300 for a long time now so if AMD are coming in with performance below that point, they're going to have to adjust their pricing appropriately.

The performance:area and performance:watt are super, super impressive but ultimately they don't mean all that much to the people buying these cards, they're just nice for AMD's bottom line and not much else.

To the people looking for $5-600 build I'll have it up tomorrow.
Gonna crash after Starcraft tonight.

Hmm, not going to hold out for the 6850 launch? Its only a couple days away, might as well wait it out to see how things shake out imo.

 

[brain_stew]

My thinking with the GTX 470 is that in 90 days I can either step up to a 480, or if something better pops up I'll hop on board with that. I remember going from an 8800 Ultra to a 9800 GX2 with no issues on EVGA a few years ago. What're the odds of a successor card to hit shelves from nVidia before mid January? .

Somewhere around zero? Any card that does release this year is just going to be a fully unlocked variant of one of their current designs, nothing to write home about. Nvidia have only just finished rolling out their 4xx series in the last week or so.

 

[Hazaro]

6870 has to be =<$250 and 6850 has to be =<$200 to be worthwile launches. A penny more and they'll be offering worse priceerformance than cards already on the market.
Lower power consumption and the rest of it is nice and all but ultimately most gamers are still going to buy their GPU based on what gives them the best framerates for their dollar.
The performance:area and performance:watt are super, super impressive but ultimately they don't mean all that much to the people buying these cards, they're just nice for AMD's bottom line and not much else.

Hmm, not going to hold out for the 6850 launch? Its only a couple days away, might as well wait it out to see how things shake out imo.

Very true.
Good job saving me work. I'll just copy paste with a 640 and I'm done anyway :lol

 

[Mercutio]

Somewhere around zero? Any card that does release this year is just going to be a fully unlocked variant of one of their current designs, nothing to write home about. Nvidia have only just finished rolling out their 4xx series in the last week or so.

Oh well, fine by me! The 470 has been really competent so far, and I couldn't really put off building the rig until the next thing showed up.

If something fully unlocked (like a 490? Or 485?) shows up, I'll just trade up to that. If not, I'll get a 480. I remember how awesome the Ultra felt, a few years ago... I suspect I'll get the same kick out of owning a 480.

I can't believe how much more affordable it was to build a machine this time around.

 

[The Elite]

To the people looking for $5-600 build I'll have it up tomorrow.
Gonna crash after Starcraft tonight.

Are we looking at something that can play Call of Duty Black Ops on decent settings? I still might bite at a gaming PC.

 

[brain_stew]

Are we looking at something that can play Call of Duty Black Ops on decent settings? I still might bite at a gaming PC.

Next year's laptop integrated graphics will be able to do that! :lol

Anything from a 9600gt and up will murder any COD game without breaking stride.

A locked 60fps @ 1200p with 4xAA/16xAF and all the trimmings is what you can expect out of a $500-$600 rig in Black Ops.

You're looking at something that can play Crysis/Metro 2033/Call of Pypriat/Crysis 2/Shattered Horizon at "decent settings." Good performance and settings in low end games like Black Ops are a given on any modern PC with a discrete GPU these days.

 

[The Elite]

Next year's laptop integrated graphics will be able to do that! :lol

Anything from a 9600gt and up will murder any COD game without breaking stride.

A locked 60fps @ 1200p with 4xAA/16xAF and all the trimmings is what you can expect out of a $500-$600 rig in Black Ops.

You're looking at something that can play Crysis/Metro 2033/Call of Pypriat/Crysis 2/Shattered Horizon at "decent settings." Good performance and settings in low end games like Black Ops are a given on any modern PC with a discrete GPU these days.

:lol

Thanks. I know very little about PC Gaming so every game seems "high end" to me.