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"I need a New PC!" 2012 Thread. Ivy, SSDs, and reading the OP. [Part 2]

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scogoth

Member
So mkenyon I'm thinking of grabbing the EK full blocks, I figured out how to make them not ugly

6p0GE.jpg
 

JMPerona

Member
Hi GAF! What about this build? Something to change? I hope I can get a computer similar to this but a little bit cheaper:

Samsung SSD Basic 830-Series 128GB
Intel Core i5 3570K 3,4Ghz (Ivy Bridge)
Corsair 8GB (1x8192MB) CL10 1600MHz VENGEANCE
ASUS GeForce GTX 670 2048MB DirectCUII
Corsair TX 750W M 80+ Bronze Modulär
Asus P8Z77-I DELUXE mITX
BitFenix Prodigy Svart mITX

Thanks!
 

krae_man

Member
Quick question GAF.

I bet I know the answer to this but I'll double check how much was I screwed over?

I don't know anything about building PC's so I went to a guy my grandpa reccomended who can build them. He told me he would put in the parts I want from wherever is the cheapest online and then charge an extra $60 to put it together and install Windows 7.

So I took the standard parts list from this thread and went to him without telling what prices I expected to pay for all the parts and he kept quoting me prices exactly in line with what the thread said and in the end he came up with $600+ tax including him putting Windows 7 on it and building it. I thought that seemed like a great deal. I figured he would be making more then $60 off me because he had a merchant account with newegg or whatever and can get the parts cheaper then what he said they cost but that's totally fine. I wasn't expecting him to build the thing for free.

Anyway, I picked it up today and he said he gave me a newer better video card which was the 7750. while in the store I ran the comparrison and noticed he put in a cheaper video card to pad his profit margin a little bit and called him out on it. He told me to take the computer home and he would order the right card and put it in on Friday.

I figured okay fine, I caught him and the rest of the specs seemed right. The CPU is identical the Motherboard is exactly what I asked for and it has the 8gb of ram I asked for.

Unfortunately windows doesn't tell you how good the ram is. I just installed speccy and it says this: 8.00 GB Dual-Channel DDR3 @ 665MHz (9-9-9-24)

Looks like he cheaped out on the RAM too.

Basically my question is. How much worse are these parts money? I don't know what kind of reaction I'm going to get out of him when I call him on this stuff. I need to decide if it's worth my time to fight him on it.

I think the price he gave me was a little on the low end for the specs I asked for ($574 vs $600 including windows and building it). So if offering him a little more money will get what I want, how much extra should I offer if it will get me the right parts?

I know he kind of scammed me a little bit but I also want this guy to be paid something for building the thing.

Any thoughts?

Alright so the dude came though and put the 6870 in my PC that I asked for without charging any more. I am now good to go. Thanks PC GAF!

Now I need to decide if I want to buy a better Monitor or not(My Current one is 1440x900).
 

Prozel

Member
I have a Prodigy myself and as long as the ASUS GPU (I know some of them are) isn't a triple slot then I'd say you are good to go.
 

Prozel

Member
Oh, I meant the graphics card. Some ASUS DCII are triple slot but from what I can see the 670 is not, so it should fit inside the Prodigy with no problems.
 

mkenyon

Banned
Hi GAF! What about this build? Something to change? I hope I can get a computer similar to this but a little bit cheaper:

Samsung SSD Basic 830-Series 128GB
Intel Core i5 3570K 3,4Ghz (Ivy Bridge)
Corsair 8GB (1x8192MB) CL10 1600MHz VENGEANCE
ASUS GeForce GTX 670 2048MB DirectCUII
Corsair TX 750W M 80+ Bronze Modulär
Asus P8Z77-I DELUXE mITX
BitFenix Prodigy Svart mITX

Thanks!
If possible, I'd suggest swapping down to a smaller PSU (physically I mean) like the S12II 520W.
 

kharma45

Member
So with a 550w will be enough? Can you help me to choose one to my build from this website? Is in Swedish, but I think you will understand:

http://www.inet.se/kategori/595/nataggregat

These XFX ones are just rebadged Seasonics and are worth a look

http://www.inet.se/produkt/6900491/xfx-core-edition-550w-80-bronze

They're almost identical to the Seasonic S12II platform and as a result get good reviews like this one http://www.jonnyguru.com/modules.php?name=NDReviews&op=Story3&reid=225 amongst others.
 

Clott

Member
This may be an off the cuff question, but I own and shoot on a Red Scarlet, so I preview footage in 4K and 5K quality, and with my current I would say monster rig I am still only able to buffer 10 seconds in advance and then forced again to re-buffer to continue watching, surely this also has greatly how complicated the scene is and how much information is stored in the image.

I have not been editing anything on my own, since I have an editor for that (currently working on debut feature film), but I would still love the idea of having an easier time previewing footage while at home.

I have

Windows 7 64bit
GTX 580
16 gig 1600 mhz Ram
intel 4 core 3.4

My main question is, is this mainly a question of ram, and if so what kind of mother board supports more ram, should I be waiting for an upcoming CPU or Graphics card?
 

kennah

Member
What are you previewing the footage on? Don't they use downsampled footage to edit from anyway? Wouldn't you just get that instead of the full res files
 

FinKL

Member
I'm leaning towards the AMD 7950 for my next build (comparable to 670, though a bit weaker, yet cheaper ~$280 after rebate vs $350?) but there are a few anecdotal pieces of evidence that says 7xxx series doesn't seem to work with 120hz monitors right out the box. Flicker & artificating problems seem the main problem.

http://www.techpowerup.com/forums/showthread.php?t=160425
http://forums.overclockers.co.uk/showthread.php?p=22461163

There is a fix, though I'm not comfortable keeping my clocks rated so high considering nVidia's seem to be just fine. And the latest beta drivers don't seem to help. Maybe it's not really a widespread problem.

Any 7xxx owners with 120hz monitors run into this?
 

Thraktor

Member
This may be an off the cuff question, but I own and shoot on a Red Scarlet, so I preview footage in 4K and 5K quality, and with my current I would say monster rig I am still only able to buffer 10 seconds in advance and then forced again to re-buffer to continue watching, surely this also has greatly how complicated the scene is and how much information is stored in the image.

I have not been editing anything on my own, since I have an editor for that (currently working on debut feature film), but I would still love the idea of having an easier time previewing footage while at home.

I have

Windows 7 64bit
GTX 580
16 gig 1600 mhz Ram
intel 4 core 3.4

My main question is, is this mainly a question of ram, and if so what kind of mother board supports more ram, should I be waiting for an upcoming CPU or Graphics card?

RedCine, but with on half the quality it still wont run smoothly.

I am worried that my CPU is bottlenecking the whole experience, but I doubt my motherboard supports sandybridge, this being it.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813188069

First things first, you have 16GB of RAM in a triple-channel motherboard, in a configuration which I can only assume is 4x4GB. The problem here is that triple-channel RAM only operates in triple-channel mode when the number of sticks inserted is either 3 or 6. With 4 sticks, you're very likely operating in single-channel mode*, which means you could get a three-fold increase in memory bandwidth simply by taking one of the RAM sticks out of your PC (check the motherboard's manual to see which slots the remaining ones should be in). This might be a bottleneck, and it's not going to cost you anything, so it's worth trying. If it turns out to help, but you don't want to give up the extra RAM, then a move up to 24GB (6x4GB) might be worthwhile. (Alternatively, the quantity of RAM might be the issue, so a move up to 24GB might be advisable in any case, but it's worth testing with 12GB first).

The second piece of advice is to get an SSD and make sure the files are on it before previewing (I don't know if you're previewing off a hard-drive, or directly from the camera). Redcode footage is an insanely high bitrate, and I wouldn't let it near a hard-drive. Get a Samsung 830 SSD, or even two in RAID 0 (and this is pretty much the only time when a RAID stripe of SSDs is actually justifiable) and you'll probably see some improvement.

The issue is, though, that even with faster RAM and an SSD, you're still not likely to get brilliant performance with Redcode footage. Not only are you dealing with a very high bitrate, but Redcode needs both decompression (which is based on a CPU-intensive wavelet compression scheme) and de-bayering (also CPU-intensive). If you put together a workstation with two 8-core Xeon CPUs, 64GB of quad-channel RAM at 2400MT/s and four Samsung 840Pro SSDs in RAID 0, then you should be able to get everything running smoothly, but it's hard to guarantee decent performance on anything less than that. In fact, Red actually make a PCIe card just for decoding Red footage, and charge almost $5,000 for the privilege, which illustrates just how difficult even playing Red footage is for the average computer, let alone editing it (although you'd be much better spending the $5k building the aforementioned workstation).

The last option is the cheapest one; don't bother trying to play the footage natively. Every night after shooting, leave your computer to transcode everything you've shot into 1080p h264, and run over it in the morning. Given that you're not editing the footage, and you almost certainly don't have a 5K monitor, it seems the most sensible solution.


*It's technically possible it's running in double-channel mode, depending on the motherboard and the exact configuration of the sticks, but I'd bet on single-channel.
 

mkenyon

Banned
What is the most powerful AMD 7970? Is it ASUS MATRIX HD 7970 Platinum?
It's all on chip lottery. ASUS basically guarantees 1200mhz, but there are reference cards that can go higher than that.

If you are into tweaking every little bit of your card, with every voltage option available, then yeah, the Matrix is pretty sweet. Having a time with it myself.

xCLVLh.jpg
 
Why did I never know until now it is so easy to fix the full RGB output issues on an HDTV when using an NVIDIA card?

http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=1567634#post1567634

I install the NVidia drivers normally and open regedit and simply search (Ctrl-F) for an nvidia related drivers area entry like perhaps

UserModeDriverGUID

Everywhere you find it (F3 to find next occurance), add the DWORD entry below next to it.

SetDefaultFullRGBRangeOnHDMI

setting its value to 1.

Then just reboot, or perhaps change resolution once or twice, and the color difference will noticibly kick in.

I've been trying for so long to figure this out. I swear it didn't used to be in the top Google Search results. :(
 

Napophis

Member
Has anyone had problems with Asus and their RMA process? I bought 2 GTX580 DCII less than a year ago and have had to RMA both.
One is the wifes, which is sitting in a box now cause it needs to be RMA'd again and my own has to go back in again a 3rd time, this one they sent me was put in a box about the same size as the card itself, into another box that was bigger BUT there was no padding or popcorn of any kind, so naturally when i got i was like WTF! Anyhow i put it into my PC and the card doesn't even work, as soon as i get into a game it crashes my PC within 10sec or i get a Blue screen...
 

JMPerona

Member
Did you not change the PSU in the end from that Corsair, or are you sticking with it? And as has been said go for two sticks not one.

This low profile RAM would be a better buy for the same price

http://www.inet.se/produkt/5315229/corsair-8gb-2x4096mb-cl9-1600mhz-vengeance-lp

I will go with it, because it fits in the Bitfenix prodigy without much problems. And yes, I better buy two 4gb RAM. Does this work?

http://www.alina.se/Produkt.aspx?r=pl&T2=CMZ8GX3M2A1600C9
 
Two matched sticks will give you a dual channel setup and a slight performance boost.

I've got 8GB of RAM (2x4GB) and this made me realise that I didn't put them in the right slots to get the dual channel stuff going. Is the slight performance boost worth hoisting my PC out from under the desk and swapping the sticks around? Are there any benefits to dual channel RAM when it comes to gaming?
 
I've got 8GB of RAM (2x4GB) and this made me realise that I didn't put them in the right slots to get the dual channel stuff going. Is the slight performance boost worth hoisting my PC out from under the desk and swapping the sticks around? Are there any benefits to dual channel RAM when it comes to gaming?

The number I always see tossed around is a 5 to 10% increase in memory performance. It would be worth it in my mind.

While performance gains from dual-channel chipsets aren't huge, they can increase bandwidth by as much as 10 percent. To those seeking to push the performance envelope, that 10 percent can be very important.

http://www.crucial.com/kb/answer.aspx?qid=3751
 

JMPerona

Member
The fancy heat spreaders to nothing but waste space.

Will buy the other one you linked :)

One last question. Jumping from console to pc is not easy. I have a lot of question.
With the computer that I will buy, Would it be any problem to get the next generations games working on it?
 

kharma45

Member
Will buy the other one you linked :)

One last question. Jumping from console to pc is not easy. I have a lot of question.
With the computer that I will buy, Would it be any problem to get the next generations games working on it?

Hard to know until we get some real details on what hardware they'll have but if the PS4 is based on an A10 APU from AMD it won't be anything all that special.
 

Gala

Member
Hi computer expert GAF!

I'm currently looking into buying a new GPU for my PC, which I can use for the next couple of years. I already upgraded my RAM from 4 GB DDR3 to 8 and I'm considering buying 8 more since RAM is so cheap.

My current setup is:
Phenom II X4 965 BE
8GB DDR3 Corsair Vengeance
Sapphire Ati Radeon 5770

In a 2 screen setup (1440x900 and 1680x1050).

My friends all recommended me a GeForce Gtx 670 but I'm not quite sure which I should buy. I heard a lot good things about the FTW from EVGA and from the Asus one.

I would really appreciate if you guys could help me out with my decision!
 

JMPerona

Member
Hard to know until we get some real details on what hardware they'll have but if the PS4 is based on an A10 APU from AMD it won't be anything all that special.

I suppose that If I get a computer with 2012 specs I will get something easyly superior to a console with 2010-2011 specs... maybe Im wrong...
 

AndyD

aka andydumi
Hmm, so its time for a new GPU, but my Sonata 2 only fits cards up to 10.5 inches. I am eyeing a 7950, and one of the few I see that fits is the XFX one here:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?SID=iXu8xiaVEeKnnH6F092uNwRgv_KSQF3_0_0_0&AID=10440897&PID=1225267&nm_mc=AFC-C8Junction&cm_mmc=AFC-C8Junction-_-cables-_-na-_-na&Item=N82E16814150588
Which just happens to be on a pretty slickdeal here:
http://slickdeals.net/f/5415758-XFX-Double-D-Radeon-HD-7950-3GB-384-bit-GDDR5-PCI-Express-3-0-x16-HDCP-Ready-CrossFireX-Support-Video-Card-FarCry3-HitMan-Sleeping-Dogs-PC-Game-Coupons-280-AR-Free-Shipping

$280 after rebate and 5 games I can mostly sell is not too shabby. Opinions?
 
Feels weird to post in here but here goes nothing. So I have an old Gateway FX6860 laptop that I have had for 4-5 years or so and served me great through college. Unfortunately I think she is on her last legs in terms of the graphics card and I am thinking of finally going to a full blown desktop. I'm pretty good and knowledgeable with computers but when it comes to building a new desktop, I am somewhat overwhelmed. I have been doing my research but I'm stuck on what I want to do with the motherboard, CPU, and GPU.

What I'm looking for is to make a desktop to play top end games but I also do a lot of 3D modeling as well as game design on them (including other programs like Photoshop, Fireworks, Dreamweaver, etc...), thus I am looking at 16 gigs of RAM for now so I can run a lot of programs at once and some larger harddrives (not too sure what size yet). I also want it to be pretty future-proof as well. (I plan on picking up a MS surface pro when they are announced as my portable computer instead of a laptop)

So I have been looking at the OP as well as other places around the web to get an idea for what I want to do. So far I have a few things that I need addressed:

CPU: Should I go with an i5 or i7 processor? I have been looking at the i7-3770k but I'm unsure if I should be going with something that strong or if I could downgrade that.
GPU: This one is stumping me here since the last time I bought a computer (my old laptop) the NVIDIA GPU's were on 8000+ or something around that. I have seen people recommend the 550's I think but I have also been looking at the 660's and 670's.
Motherboard: This one has me the most stumped because I never really worried about this with a laptop. I have been looking at the ASUS P9X79 PRO, AS Rock LGA1155, and the ASUS P8Z77-V PRO LGA. Once again I have done some research but am still confused with some of these motherboards or if there are others out there that might be better.

I have a budget of around $1,200 (not including a new monitor and keyboard). Any help would be appreciated. Once again I want something that is future-proof and allows me to play recent games at high settings as well as allow me to do my 3D modeling, photoshop, etc... all at once.

So sorry if that sounded somewhat confusing, I am typing this fast and am somewhat confused with some of the hardware choices out there. So once again thank you for any help that you can offer and sorry for the long post.
 
Alright guys I can't take it. I tried some of the tips and bought new fans and everything and this 600T is just way too loud so I'm going to buy a new case. Will I have cooling problems in an R4 with SLI 580s? Other cases I'm looking at are 550D and Storm Stryker and Silverstone Raven.
 
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