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[RGM79]

Ah, in that case, nevermind then, though 4 gigs will not be enough to play the games he wants to play. Star Citizen requires 8 gigs minimum. how much would a single 8 gig stick set him back vs a 4? Then again , star citizen is looking like 2016, so he has plenty of time to toss in another stick or three to get up to 8 or 16 gigs of ram. Your picks are his best bet right at the moment.


EDIT: Yea, i saw the $140 270X 2gb, its worth the extra $20 for the 4GB version i found IMO, going forward 2 gigs is going to be a severe hinderance.

Oh yeah, you're right, completely missed that you said it was the 4GB version.

Cheers will go with 8gb worth it for what the cost is likely to be.



It was a motherboard failure - the rig was built in 05 Atx Tower/Amd Athlon Socket 939/DDR only salvageable parts is the case and fans really - still using the GPU in an older borrowed system but its dying slowly. The original PSU dies I still have the replacement its an Arctic Power 500W(2008) but I don't think it has the PCI power sockets required.

Quite happy to save £60 in the lower cpu and stock cooler for now but still gonna consider it - cheers



I thought the Z97 was the better chipset - am I not really going to lose anything by going with a slightly older mb chipset?

Oh, I see. That's more than enough reason to want a new power supply. Going with the lower CPU is OK, it's just a matter of priorities and when and where you want to spend. While it's true that a lot of games set 8GB of RAM as a requirement, a lot of them also put down quad cores (i5 2500K, 3570K, 4690K, for example) as a requirement as well. RAM can be added to, but processors will have to be entirely replaced. With less RAM you can't multi-task as well, but at least you can try to close down as many programs as you can before running the game, but it's not possible to improve FPS from lower end CPUs (overclocking would be a solution, but Intel only allows that on certain CPUs, mainly the enthusiast level £150+ CPUs).

Z97 is the better chipset - but H97 is not older, it's just cheaper and comes with fewer features, generally speaking.

Go with what you can budget for - if you just need to get the computer up and running now, going with the i3 is a perfectly fine solution. There's still next year's high end Broadwell processors that you can upgrade to. Save up for then, you might have to wait, but you'll get an excellent computer.

 

[LilJoka]

thank you so much! saved me a lot of time and hassle looking!

PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant

CPU: Intel Core i5-4690K 3.5GHz Quad-Core Processor ($219.98 @ OutletPC)
CPU Cooler: Cooler Master Hyper 212 EVO 82.9 CFM Sleeve Bearing CPU Cooler ($26.75 @ OutletPC)
Motherboard: ASRock Z97M-ITX/AC Mini ITX LGA1150 Motherboard ($108.91 @ Newegg)
Memory: Kingston Fury Black Series 16GB (2 x 8GB) DDR3-1600 Memory ($145.99 @ Amazon)
Storage: Crucial MX100 128GB 2.5" Solid State Drive ($62.44 @ Amazon)
Storage: Toshiba Product SeriesT01ACA 1TB 3.5" 7200RPM Internal Hard Drive ($49.99 @ NCIX US)
Video Card: MSI GeForce GTX 980 4GB Twin Frozr Video Card ($549.99 @ Newegg)
Case: Fractal Design Node 304 (White) Mini ITX Tower Case ($74.99 @ Newegg)
Power Supply: SeaSonic G 550W 80+ Gold Certified Semi-Modular ATX Power Supply ($81.98 @ SuperBiiz)
Total: $1321.02
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2014-12-15 07:15 EST-0500

Bit better and you cant not get an SSD.

 

[Kelli Lemondrop]

PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant

CPU: Intel Core i5-4690K 3.5GHz Quad-Core Processor ($219.98 @ OutletPC)
CPU Cooler: Cooler Master Hyper 212 EVO 82.9 CFM Sleeve Bearing CPU Cooler ($26.75 @ OutletPC)
Motherboard: ASRock Z97M-ITX/AC Mini ITX LGA1150 Motherboard ($108.91 @ Newegg)
Memory: Kingston Fury Black Series 16GB (2 x 8GB) DDR3-1600 Memory ($145.99 @ Amazon)
Storage: Crucial MX100 128GB 2.5" Solid State Drive ($62.44 @ Amazon)
Storage: Toshiba Product SeriesT01ACA 1TB 3.5" 7200RPM Internal Hard Drive ($49.99 @ NCIX US)
Video Card: MSI GeForce GTX 980 4GB Twin Frozr Video Card ($549.99 @ Newegg)
Case: Fractal Design Node 304 (White) Mini ITX Tower Case ($74.99 @ Newegg)
Power Supply: SeaSonic G 550W 80+ Gold Certified Semi-Modular ATX Power Supply ($81.98 @ SuperBiiz)
Total: $1321.02
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2014-12-15 07:15 EST-0500

Bit better and you cant not get an SSD.

Careful, that video card and that power supply are in conflict inside the node 304.... 160mm power supply means there wont be clearance for an 11 inch GPU. you need to find a 140 - 150mm (length) power supply at the largest.

Power Supply: Corsair CSM 550W 80+ Gold Certified Semi-Modular ATX Power Supply ($67.98 @ Newegg)

this is 140mm long, plenty of room for modular connections and a full length gpu in the node 304.

 

[titch]

Oh yeah, you're right, completely missed that you said it was the 4GB version.



Oh, I see. That's more than enough reason to want a new power supply. Going with the lower CPU is OK, it's just a matter of priorities and when and where you want to spend. While it's true that a lot of games set 8GB of RAM as a requirement, a lot of them also put down quad cores (i5 2500K, 3570K, 4690K, for example) as a requirement as well. RAM can be added to, but processors will have to be entirely replaced. With less RAM you can't multi-task as well, but at least you can try to close down as many programs as you can before running the game, but it's not possible to improve FPS from lower end CPUs (overclocking would be a solution, but Intel only allows that on certain CPUs, mainly the enthusiast level £150+ CPUs).

Z97 is the better chipset - but H97 is not older, it's just cheaper and comes with fewer features, generally speaking.

Go with what you can budget for - if you just need to get the computer up and running now, going with the i3 is a perfectly fine solution. There's still next year's high end Broadwell processors that you can upgrade to. Save up for then, you might have to wait, but you'll get an excellent computer.

I missed the 2gb/4gb part too - for the sake of an extra £20/30 it does make sense on the GPU , will see if I can squeeze my budget to suit.

I think I had my mind set on a Z97 but will look at the options - I know I said I wasn't bothered about o/c but if its the difference between spending cash and getting game x to run then its better been an option even if its a last resort.

If I was going to go Quad CPU is the : Intel Core i5-4460 3.2GHz Quad-Core Processor the best (budget) value option then?

Cheers for the info folks - really appreciated

 

[Kelli Lemondrop]

I missed the 2gb/4gb part too - for the sake of an extra £20/30 it does make sense on the GPU , will see if I can squeeze my budget to suit.

I think I had my mind set on a Z97 but will look at the options - I know I said I wasn't bothered about o/c but if its the difference between spending cash and getting game x to run then its better been an option even if its a last resort.

If I was going to go Quad CPU is the : Intel Core i5-4460 3.2GHz Quad-Core Processor the best (budget) value option then?

Cheers for the info folks - really appreciated

that cpu would be a sizeable upgrade to the i3 you were looking at,yes,which is why he reccomended it to you. your best option is to buy the parts that he linked you on the previous page, and see if you can afford an extra stick of that same memory he linked you so you have 8 gigs in dual channel. That setup would run you 430 pounds and play every game out today on high and most games for the next few years on medium at worst.


EDIT : this part list here sir.

PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant

CPU: Intel Core i5-4460 3.2GHz Quad-Core Processor (£130.94 @ Aria PC)
Motherboard: MSI Z97 PC MATE ATX LGA1150 Motherboard (£64.62 @ Amazon UK)
Memory: Kingston Fury White Series 4GB (1 x 4GB) DDR3-1600 Memory (£29.74 @ Ebuyer)
Video Card: PowerColor Radeon R9 270X 2GB PCS+ Video Card (£124.81 @ More Computers)
Power Supply: EVGA 600B 600W 80+ Bronze Certified ATX Power Supply (£46.09 @ Aria PC)
Total: £396.20
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2014-12-15 11:35 GMT+0000


If you wanted the 4 gig version of the R9 270X, it would run you roughly 40 pounds more (you europeans always get fucked on electronics prices dont you?)

 

[Dries]

You should probably read this article as a primer.

Thanks! Triple Buffering is really awesome. I'm convinced.

But what is the advantage of running Borderless Windowed Mode? Tripple Buffering works fine when I'm running Full Screen Mode too.

 

[riflen]

He is. He lists the advantages too. My reply questioned the greatness of these advantages though. I'm running V-sync in Full screen mode and experience no tearing at all. What would be a reason to also play games in Borderless Windowed mode I wonder?

A correct reply to your question could fill an article. You misunderstand why Durante prefers borderless windowed mode; it's not solely to prevent tearing because simply enabling Vsync will do this. Many people prefer to use it because it forces a mode of rendering that can reduce stuttering, allows arbitrary frame rates and prevents tearing. Standard double-buffering with Vsync only does the latter.

It's a way to force a standard where no standard exists, as many game developers seem unwilling or unable to implement a sensible buffering system in their games.

Most games have a buffer system featuring two buffers (this is basically the sane minimum). The big problem with this double-buffering, is that when you enable Vsync, you're restricted to running the game at integers that are a division of the display refresh rate (typically 60). So the game can only run at 60, 30, 20, 15, 12, 10, 6, 5, 4, 3, 2 and 1 frames per second and will jump between these values if you cannot maintain 60fps.

True triple buffering is preferable, because the addition of an extra buffer allows the system to run the game at arbitrary frame rates while maintaining Vsync and preventing tearing. Performance can even increase over double buffering in some cases.
Triple buffering does consume extra video memory (negligible) and can sometimes add latency. This depends on implementation and Borderless Windowed mode in Windows Vista and above seems to feature a pretty good implementation. There are also the other advantages Durante lists that suit his requirements.
This article is a pretty decent write-up on the subject of double and triple buffering.

Thanks! Triple Buffering is really awesome. I'm convinced.

But what is the advantage of running Borderless Windowed Mode? Tripple Buffering works fine when I'm running Full Screen Mode too.

Okay. If the game you're playing has support for triple buffering of some sort, then borderless windowed mode is less useful for that game. The problems are:

1. Most games do not provide a triple buffering option.
2. NVIDIA's triple buffering control panel option only affects OpenGL games (the extreme minority of titles today).
3. A form of triple buffering can be forced for Direct3D games using the D3DOverrider utility, but only for 32-bit games.

By using borderless windowed mode, people avoid all of this junk and can just enjoy the game as they would prefer. I'd probably do the same thing myself, but NVIDIA SLI is not supported in windowed modes.

 

[LilJoka]

Careful, that video card and that power supply are in conflict inside the node 304.... 160mm power supply means there wont be clearance for an 11 inch GPU. you need to find a 140 - 150mm (length) power supply at the largest.

Power Supply: Corsair CSM 550W 80+ Gold Certified Semi-Modular ATX Power Supply ($67.98 @ Newegg)

this is 140mm long, plenty of room for modular connections and a full length gpu in the node 304.

Nah this Seasonic is actually the best PSU for the case, since the connectors are very low it means all the plugs fit below the GPU. The best alternative is the Coolermaster V550S

 

[Kelli Lemondrop]

Nah this Seasonic is actually the best PSU for the case, since the connectors are very low it means all the plugs fit below the GPU. The best alternative is the Coolermaster V550S

Ah, carry on then, my bad. All the info i found while researching my own potential (and now abandoned) ITX build suggested what i stated. Sorry!

 

[RGM79]

I missed the 2gb/4gb part too - for the sake of an extra £20/30 it does make sense on the GPU , will see if I can squeeze my budget to suit.

I think I had my mind set on a Z97 but will look at the options - I know I said I wasn't bothered about o/c but if its the difference between spending cash and getting game x to run then its better been an option even if its a last resort.

If I was going to go Quad CPU is the : Intel Core i5-4460 3.2GHz Quad-Core Processor the best (budget) value option then?

Cheers for the info folks - really appreciated

If you want to overclock in the future? You should get the i5 4690K, it's £168, though. Don't want to bother with overclocking? The i5 4460 (£131) is the best price to performance you can get without the ability to overclock.
Both options will last you the next couple of years, the 4690K slightly longer.

Or if you don't mind waiting.. save money now and just get the i3 processor you mentioned before, and wait until the middle of 2015 to upgrade to the latest Broadwell CPU that will be replacing the current 4XXX series CPUs.

 

[LilJoka]

Ah, carry on then, my bad. All the info i found while researching my own potential (and now abandoned) ITX build suggested what i stated. Sorry!

The holy grail is here
http://www.overclock.net/t/1266342/official-fractal-design-node-304-owners-club/4690

This is where the most info for this case lies!

 

[Dries]

A correct reply to your question could fill an article. You misunderstand why Durante prefers borderless windowed mode; it's not solely to prevent tearing because simply enabling Vsync will do this. Many people prefer to use it because it forces a mode of rendering that can reduce stuttering, allows arbitrary frame rates and prevents tearing. Standard double-buffering with Vsync only does the latter.

It's a way to force a standard where no standard exists, as many game developers seem unwilling or unable to implement a sensible buffering system in their games.

Most games have a buffer system featuring two buffers (this is basically the sane minimum). The big problem with this double-buffering, is that when you enable Vsync, you're restricted to running the game at integers that are a division of the display refresh rate (typically 60). So the game can only run at 60, 30, 20, 15, 12, 10, 6, 5, 4, 3, 2 and 1 frames per second and will jump between these values if you cannot maintain 60fps.

True triple buffering is preferable, because the addition of an extra buffer allows the system to run the game at arbitrary frame rates while maintaining Vsync and preventing tearing. Performance can even increase over double buffering in some cases.
Triple buffering does consume extra video memory (negligible) and can sometimes add latency. This depends on implementation and Borderless Windowed mode in Windows Vista and above seems to feature a pretty good implementation. There are also the other advantages Durante lists that suit his requirements.
This article is a pretty decent write-up on the subject of double and triple buffering.



Okay. If the game you're playing has support for triple buffering of some sort, then borderless windowed mode is less useful for that game. The problems are:

1. Most games do not provide a triple buffering option.
2. NVIDIA's triple buffering control panel option only affects OpenGL games (the extreme minority of titles today).
3. A form of triple buffering can be forced for Direct3D games using the D3DOverrider utility, but only for 32-bit games.

By using borderless windowed mode, people avoid all of this junk and can just enjoy the game as they would prefer. I'd probably do the same thing myself, but NVIDIA SLI is not supported in windowed modes.

Great article and explanation on your side. I really hope more games provide Triple Buffering in the future.

 

[titch]

If you want to overclock in the future? You should get the i5 4690K, it's £168, though. Don't want to bother with overclocking? The i5 4460 (£131) is the best price to performance you can get without the ability to overclock.
Both options will last you the next couple of years, the 4690K slightly longer.

Or if you don't mind waiting.. save money now and just get the i3 processor you mentioned before, and wait until the middle of 2015 to upgrade to the latest Broadwell CPU that will be replacing the current 4XXX series CPUs.

that cpu would be a sizeable upgrade to the i3 you were looking at,yes,which is why he reccomended it to you. your best option is to buy the parts that he linked you on the previous page, and see if you can afford an extra stick of that same memory he linked you so you have 8 gigs in dual channel. That setup would run you 430 pounds and play every game out today on high and most games for the next few years on medium at worst.

EDIT : this part list here sir.

If you wanted the 4 gig version of the R9 270X, it would run you roughly 40 pounds more (you europeans always get fucked on electronics prices dont you?)

Thanks guys sounds like im pretty much sorted just need to get the CC out

Yeah sadly we always get hammered on electronics

 

[sturmdogg]

does it need to be nvidia? the amd R7 265 is in the same price bracket (actually around $130 all over the place right now) and should handily beat the 750Ti in just about every game. the R9 270X and the GTX 760 are in the bracket above, at around $160. its worth getting one of those cards instead for the slight increase in price honestly.

Skyrim isn't an issue depending on how many dozens of mods you plan to cram into it, BF4 should do fine on any of these cards as well assuming 1080p. No clue on dragon age though, sorry =).

If you are in the states, newegg's got a 4GB R9 270X for $184 ($160 after mail in rebate), that extra vram might help you as the years go by, its certainly going to be better than the 2 gigs youll find in any of those other cards anywhere near the sub $200 price point, and 4GB is roughly the sweet spot memory wise for 1080p gaming.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814202049

Well I'm not all that familiar with the AMD cards to be honest. Also, I see more people going for Nvidia cards on these threads than AMD, so I figured Nvidia was the way to go.

Anyways I'll go check out the AMD cards. Thanks for the input!

 

[riflen]

Great article and explanation on your side. I really hope more games provide Triple Buffering in the future.

The better solution all round is variable-refresh displays such as those supporting FreeSync or G-Sync. We should see more examples in 2015.
I should add that if you use NVIDIA SLI, you are essentially getting form of triple buffering for free. SLI AFR requires the use of an extra buffer, which brings some of the advantages of triple buffering (arbitrary frame rate). It's probably the same for AMD CrossFire AFR, but I have no experience there.

 

[kennah]

The holy grail is here
http://www.overclock.net/t/1266342/official-fractal-design-node-304-owners-club/4690

This is where the most info for this case lies!

I also have a node on hand and can answer questions. One of my favourite cases period.

 

[Needlecrash]

Hey GAF. So, I finally spent some time this weekend getting my new PC up to speed. Some notes...

• SSD's ROCK! A cold boot takes less than 10 seconds! YAY! I'm really happy I got one.
• Windows 8.1 is...interesting. I'm getting used to it but I definitely need a Classic Start Menu launcher or something.
• I was an idiot and forgot to back up my Steam saves. I backed up the wrong folders and now, I'm kinda SOL. Time to grind in Dark Souls 1 & 2 again... Time to check if my Steam cloud saves will be useful.
• Card Reader's USB port is busted but everything else works.
• Having some sound issues with my gaming account on the PC. Stupid Realtek HD Audio Manager.

Other than that, it's pretty damn sweet. I'm glad I decided to go with Intel this time around. Also, I'm deciding between the Logitech Z-506, Bose Companion 2/3, Kilpsch ProMedia 2.1 or Razer Leviathan for sound purposes. I want simplicity but no compromise on the sound quality. Thoughts anyone?

 

[The Llama]

Hey GAF. So, I finally spent some time this weekend getting my new PC up to speed. Some notes...

• SSD's ROCK! A cold boot takes less than 10 seconds! YAY! I'm really happy I got one.
• Windows 8.1 is...interesting. I'm getting used to it but I definitely need a Classic Start Menu launcher or something.
• I was an idiot and forgot to back up my Steam saves. I backed up the wrong folders and now, I'm kinda SOL. Time to grind in Dark Souls 1 & 2 again... Time to check if my Steam cloud saves will be useful.
• Card Reader's USB port is busted but everything else works.
• Having some sound issues with my gaming account on the PC. Stupid Realtek HD Audio Manager.

Other than that, it's pretty damn sweet. I'm glad I decided to go with Intel this time around. Also, I'm deciding between the Logitech Z-506, Bose Companion 2/3, Kilpsch ProMedia 2.1 or Razer Leviathan for sound purposes. I want simplicity but no compromise on the sound quality. Thoughts anyone?

Set the Windows 8 start button to take you to the apps list rather than the metro start screen.

 

[Lunar15]

How quite is your enthoo luxe by the way? Mine is on the loud side thanks to the noise generated by the stock fans in the back and front of the case. :S

For me, it's fine, but I'm coming from a really, really noisy case so my bar is low.

The back exauhst fan seemed pretty quiet to me, most of the noise is coming from my radiator fans and the front intake. I might swap out the rad fans, but overall, the noise isn't a problem for me. I do sometimes hear some coil whine from my 970, and since the case is pretty open on top (with the dust filter) the case does nothing to dampen the noise.

Overall, I'm pretty happy with it. I debated for a long time back and forth about getting this or the R5, but I'm satisfied with my choice. Noise was never a huge priority for me as I use headphones and anything from my last case would have been a giant step-up anyway.

The Luxe was an absolute delight to build in. I'm a novice at cable management, but I found it almost effortless due to the case's setup. I love all the dust filters and I'm quite partial to the tinted side window. It's a good looking computer.

 

[RGM79]

Hey GAF. So, I finally spent some time this weekend getting my new PC up to speed. Some notes...

• SSD's ROCK! A cold boot takes less than 10 seconds! YAY! I'm really happy I got one.
• Windows 8.1 is...interesting. I'm getting used to it but I definitely need a Classic Start Menu launcher or something.
• I was an idiot and forgot to back up my Steam saves. I backed up the wrong folders and now, I'm kinda SOL. Time to grind in Dark Souls 1 & 2 again... Time to check if my Steam cloud saves will be useful.
• Card Reader's USB port is busted but everything else works.
• Having some sound issues with my gaming account on the PC. Stupid Realtek HD Audio Manager.

Other than that, it's pretty damn sweet. I'm glad I decided to go with Intel this time around. Also, I'm deciding between the Logitech Z-506, Bose Companion 2/3, Kilpsch ProMedia 2.1 or Razer Leviathan for sound purposes. I want simplicity but no compromise on the sound quality. Thoughts anyone?

Classic Shell is a good start menu utility.

For simplicity and sound quality, go with the Promedia 2.1 speakers. I owned the Klipsch Promedia 2.1 speakers and I'm currently using the Logitech Z506. I'm not an audiophile by any means, the Promedia speakers were just a bundled package with a PC purchase I made 12 years ago, and I only chose the Z506 because they seemed alright and a retailer near my house had them.

The 2.1 speakers are easier to set up, there's no extra effort involved. On the other hand, making sure the Z506 speakers were working in 5.1 mode when playing media files required changing settings around in media players and audio driver settings. Games work easily enough with 5.1 speakers, though. Making stereo sound work properly on 5.1 is annoying, a lot of the time the sound seems to only come from the centre channel. The old Logitech X-540 5.1 speaker set that was discontinued in favour of the Z506 was apparently better at that with built in stereo to 5.1 "matrix mode" conversion. They did some cost cutting with the Z506, leaving out that ability.

That said, I like that the Z506 allows RCA input, I use them with my PS3.

 

[Kelli Lemondrop]

Hi again PC GAF. Would an R9 290 be close enough performance wise to the GTX 970 for gaming at 1080p to be worth saving the $80? Don't need nvidia specific features (what features does nvidia still have that AMD didn't just add to its new driver anyway? just physx and a couple of post process AA solutions?) so its purely down to performance here. Old benches won't really tell me the truth here, catalyst omega was supposedly?? a big increase for alot of games...

 

[RGM79]

Hi again PC GAF. Would an R9 290 be close enough performance wise to the GTX 970 for gaming at 1080p to be worth saving the $80? Don't need nvidia specific features (what features does nvidia still have that AMD didn't just add to its new driver anyway? just physx and a couple of post process AA solutions?) so its purely down to performance here. Old benches won't really tell me the truth here, catalyst omega was supposedly?? a big increase for alot of games...

For the price, the R9 290 is a good choice. In some comparisons the GTX 970 can lead by some 20%, but in others they are evenly matched. You can get an Asus R9 290 for just $240 after $30 mail in rebate, so it's more like a $100+ difference.

 

[Kelli Lemondrop]

For the price, the R9 290 is a good choice. In some comparisons the GTX 970 can lead by some 20%, but in others they are evenly matched. You can get an Asus R9 290 for just $240 after $30 mail in rebate, so it's more like a $100+ difference.

I don't factor in mail in rebates until the moneys in my pocket, half the time the bastards never actually send me the money lol. would the catalyst omega driver update close that 20% gap in cases where the 970 had that lead prior to last weeks driver release? what games have such a gap, and, at 1080p, does it even matter?

EDIT: at 1080p every game on the anandtech list is well north of 60fps on both cards, why should i care if the 970 gets 100fps to the 290s 78 fps? 60hz peasant here btw, i wish i had a 120hz display, but i refuse to use a TN panel after seeing how marvelous IPS can look, my side monitors are a pair of ASUS VS239s and my center monitor is an LG 25UM64-S 21:9 2560x1080 ultrawide (love the hell out of this thing btw).

http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00JPK046Q/?tag=neogaf0e-20 LG Ultrawide - $250 for anyone curious about the 21:9 master race (its fuckawesome for movies, and for games you can make work with it, 1080p content would simply have black bars on the sides if you cant make a game run properly in 21:9 ratio.)

 

[RGM79]

I don't factor in mail in rebates until the moneys in my pocket, half the time the bastards never actually send me the money lol. would the catalyst omega driver update close that 20% gap in cases where the 970 had that lead prior to last weeks driver release? what games have such a gap, and, at 1080p, does it even matter?

EDIT: at 1080p every game on the anandtech list is well north of 60fps on both cards, why should i care if the 970 gets 100fps to the 290s 78 fps? 60hz peasant here btw, i wish i had a 120hz display, but i refuse to use a TN panel after seeing how marvelous IPS can look, my side monitors are a pair of ASUS VS239s and my center monitor is a 21:9 2560x1080 ultrawide (love the hell out of this thing btw).

Omega driver benchmarking shows that performance increases aren't that great, and not in the areas that most people expect. The claims of 20% higher performance are a bit misleading, I think. It also likely depends on several factors like game optimizations, how well the drivers play with games, as well as how the game engine works.

Techpowerup only found minimal differences except in Ryse: Son of Rome
Tweaktown found some gains, some drops, mostly improvements in lowest framerate
Legitreviews mainly found slight improvements
Hexus found some slight improvements

 

[Kelli Lemondrop]

Omega driver benchmarking shows that performance increases aren't that great, and not in the areas that most people expect. The claims of 20% higher performance are a bit misleading, I think. It also likely depends on several factors like game optimizations, how well the drivers play with games, as well as how the game engine works.

Techpowerup only found minimal differences except in Ryse: Son of Rome
Tweaktown found some gains, some drops, mostly improvements in lowest framerate
Legitreviews mainly found slight improvements
Hexus found some slight improvements

Ah, i see. Still, performance is closer than i expected considering the $80+ price gap between them. I think ill grab one Are the 90C+ operating temperatures a problem for stability? or were the things designed to run safely at those temps?

 

[exmachina64]

PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant

CPU: Intel Core i5-4690K 3.5GHz Quad-Core Processor ($219.98 @ OutletPC)
CPU Cooler: Cooler Master Hyper 212 EVO 82.9 CFM Sleeve Bearing CPU Cooler ($26.75 @ OutletPC)
Motherboard: ASRock Z97M-ITX/AC Mini ITX LGA1150 Motherboard ($108.91 @ Newegg)
Memory: Kingston Fury Black Series 16GB (2 x 8GB) DDR3-1600 Memory ($145.99 @ Amazon)
Storage: Crucial MX100 128GB 2.5" Solid State Drive ($62.44 @ Amazon)
Storage: Toshiba Product SeriesT01ACA 1TB 3.5" 7200RPM Internal Hard Drive ($49.99 @ NCIX US)
Video Card: MSI GeForce GTX 980 4GB Twin Frozr Video Card ($549.99 @ Newegg)
Case: Fractal Design Node 304 (White) Mini ITX Tower Case ($74.99 @ Newegg)
Power Supply: SeaSonic G 550W 80+ Gold Certified Semi-Modular ATX Power Supply ($81.98 @ SuperBiiz)
Total: $1321.02
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2014-12-15 07:15 EST-0500

Bit better and you cant not get an SSD.

If you're going to recommend an MX100, the 256GB model is hovering around $100, which would fit in with his budget.

 

[thefil]

Hey all. My computer has started randomly restarting (hard power off then on again) with a power error message showing up in my Windows log. How likely is it that this is PSU related? I just got this PSU in January, so it would really suck if it was already dead. It's quite over-specced for my rig, too.

 

[The Llama]

Ah, i see. Still, performance is closer than i expected considering the $80+ price gap between them. I think ill grab one Are the 90C+ operating temperatures a problem for stability? or were the things designed to run safely at those temps?

The ones with aftermarket cooling shouldn't get that hot anyway. But they're (apparently) designed to run hot so its not something to really worry about.

 

[Boss Man]

Hey GAF. So, I finally spent some time this weekend getting my new PC up to speed. Some notes...

• SSD's ROCK! A cold boot takes less than 10 seconds! YAY! I'm really happy I got one.
• Windows 8.1 is...interesting. I'm getting used to it but I definitely need a Classic Start Menu launcher or something.
• I was an idiot and forgot to back up my Steam saves. I backed up the wrong folders and now, I'm kinda SOL. Time to grind in Dark Souls 1 & 2 again... Time to check if my Steam cloud saves will be useful.
• Card Reader's USB port is busted but everything else works.
• Having some sound issues with my gaming account on the PC. Stupid Realtek HD Audio Manager.

Other than that, it's pretty damn sweet. I'm glad I decided to go with Intel this time around. Also, I'm deciding between the Logitech Z-506, Bose Companion 2/3, Kilpsch ProMedia 2.1 or Razer Leviathan for sound purposes. I want simplicity but no compromise on the sound quality. Thoughts anyone?

I bought Start8 for like $5 and it's totally worth it. I've used Classic Shell (free) which is fine too.

Basically you can set it up so that you'll never know you're on Windows 8 instead of 7. Boots straight to the desktop and the start menu acts like it used to. Windows 8 is actually a better OS than Windows 7 aside from the annoying Metro stuff if you're on a Desktop, but once you hide it that's sort of a moot point.

 

[RGM79]

Ah, i see. Still, performance is closer than i expected considering the $80+ price gap between them. I think ill grab one Are the 90C+ operating temperatures a problem for stability? or were the things designed to run safely at those temps?

Uh, where are you reading that they run at 90 degrees? I think the ones based on the reference R9 290 cooler will do that, but if you go with any decent model that has an aftermarket cooler design, you should be fine. The Asus R9 290 Direct CUII that I mentioned earlier, for example:

HardOCP reports 75 degrees load, 80 degrees overclocked load
Bit-Tech reports 50 degrees increase over ambient temperatures (which puts it at around 70ish)
Guru3D reported 73 degrees from software sensors, 75 degrees from thermal imaging equipment

 

[michaelius]

[*]SSD's ROCK! A cold boot takes less than 10 seconds! YAY! I'm really happy I got one.

No kidding I was helping friend reinstall windows on his laptop and through his windows was restarting but it turned out it was going out of hibernation on his 5400 rpm drive

 

[Mekh]

What do you guys think of this, is it good for £549.99?

 

[kennah]

What do you guys think of this, is it good for £549.99?

PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant

CPU: AMD FX-6350 3.9GHz 6-Core Processor (£89.94 @ Aria PC)
CPU Cooler: Cooler Master Hyper TX3 Evo 43.1 CFM CPU Cooler (£15.98 @ Scan.co.uk)
Motherboard: Asus M5A78L-M LX PLUS Micro ATX AM3+ Motherboard (£71.22 @ Amazon UK)
Memory: Patriot Signature 8GB (2 x 4GB) DDR3-1600 Memory (£43.35 @ Amazon UK)
Storage: Seagate 1TB 3.5" 7200RPM Hybrid Internal Hard Drive (£57.60 @ Aria PC)
Case: Cooler Master Silencio 352 MicroATX Mini Tower Case (£40.92 @ CCL Computers)
Power Supply: Cooler Master Thunder 600W ATX Power Supply (£43.92 @ Scan.co.uk)
Optical Drive: Lite-On iHAS124-14 DVD/CD Writer (£11.12 @ Ebuyer)
Operating System: Microsoft Windows 8.1 (OEM) (64-bit) (£71.60 @ Amazon UK)
Total: £445.65
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2014-12-15 19:05 GMT+0000

It's very expensive for what you get, and also it doesn't have a GPU (and that CPU doesn't have onboard graphics) It's also a very old processor on a dead socket.

 

[turnernader]

I currently have a intel G3258 processor and looking to upgrade to a I5 4690k. what do i need to do before and after i install the new processor

 

[roddur]

mobo : ASUS P8Z68-V PRO
processor : i7 2600k
ram : 8gb kingston ddr3

are these good choices for $500?

 

[kennah]

I currently have a intel G3258 processor and looking to upgrade to a I5 4690k. what do i need to do before and after i install the new processor

Apply fresh paste when you reseat it. But software wise you don't need to do anything.

mobo : ASUS P8Z68-V PRO
processor : i7 2600k
ram : 8gb kingston ddr3

are these good choices for $500?

Definitely not. That's $300 at the most.

 

[ISee]

mobo : ASUS P8Z68-V PRO
processor : i7 2600k
ram : 8gb kingston ddr3

are these good choices for $500?

used? no

CPU ~ 130
Mobo ~ 90
Ram ~ 60

~ 280 total.

 

[yatesl]

Hey GAF

Been having an issue with the PC. Over the past year or so sometimes it will just turn off, and not turn back on unless you leave it for a little while. I've tried swapping the PSU in the past, but it still did it, so put the original back in.

Did it today. Turned it off, unplugged it, and left it for an hour. Turned it back on and heard... not a pop, but a noise, and it turned off again. Wouldn't turn back on. Unplugged everything, plugged it back in, and it works - only I can smell a plasticy burning smell.

I've put the on/off issues down to the motherboard, as the PSU was fine. However, now this smell is worrying me. The PC is on and running now but I can still smell it - I take it I should turn this off, and replace the PSU too? Originally I was going to replace the mobo/CPU (as it's an old AM3+ socket), and the case because it's old. Am I adding a new PSU to the list too?



Edit: For what it's worth, it's a Corsair TX 650 power supply.

 

[roddur]

Apply fresh paste when you reseat it. But software wise you don't need to do anything.

Definitely not. That's $300 at the most.

forgot to say it's in CAD and no taxes . still not good i guess.

used? no

CPU ~ 130
Mobo ~ 90
Ram ~ 60

~ 280 total.

yes used. i'll try ebay then. thanx

 

[kennah]

forgot to say it's in CAD and no taxes . still not good i guess.

I'm in Canada too and it's still a terrible deal.

General used values are $200 for the CPU, $50 for a motherboard that old and 50-60 for the RAM.

Don't forget - these are parts that would be without warranty since they are more than 3 years old. You need to allow for that in the value.

That said, it's amazing that the 2600k has held even that value for so long.

 

[roddur]

I'm in Canada too and it's still a terrible deal.

General used values are $200 for the CPU, $50 for a motherboard that old and 50-60 for the RAM.

Don't forget - these are parts that would be without warranty since they are more than 3 years old. You need to allow for that in the value.

That said, it's amazing that the 2600k has held even that value for so long.

please don't jump on me if i ask this, where do you find those parts at the prices mentioned in the first page. tried ncix, newegg, ebay, RFD (if anyone selling), none of them selling even used ones close to those prices. i know those are in USD, but still.

 

[RGM79]

What do you guys think of this, is it good for £549.99?

No point in repeating that it's overpriced. What's your budget for a PC, £600? You can put together a more modern computer easily.

Hey GAF

Been having an issue with the PC. Over the past year or so sometimes it will just turn off, and not turn back on unless you leave it for a little while. I've tried swapping the PSU in the past, but it still did it, so put the original back in.

Did it today. Turned it off, unplugged it, and left it for an hour. Turned it back on and heard... not a pop, but a noise, and it turned off again. Wouldn't turn back on. Unplugged everything, plugged it back in, and it works - only I can smell a plasticy burning smell.

I've put the on/off issues down to the motherboard, as the PSU was fine. However, now this smell is worrying me. The PC is on and running now but I can still smell it - I take it I should turn this off, and replace the PSU too? Originally I was going to replace the mobo/CPU (as it's an old AM3+ socket), and the case because it's old. Am I adding a new PSU to the list too?


Edit: For what it's worth, it's a Corsair TX 650 power supply.

Hard to say. Can you isolate where the smell is coming from? You can take the PSU out of the computer and turn it on with the old paper clip trick. If the smell is definitely coming from there, then it's not worth using again.

forgot to say it's in CAD and no taxes . still not good i guess.



yes used. i'll try ebay then. thanx

Yeah, those are awful prices, that probably cost more than it was when it was new. Where are you buying? What's your budget?

please don't jump on me if i ask this, where do you find those parts at the prices mentioned in the first page. tried ncix, newegg, ebay, RFD (if anyone selling), none of them selling even used ones close to those prices. i know those are in USD, but still.

You can't. Even after currency conversion, market prices here in Canada still suck.

For $425 before taxes you can easily get a 4690K, Z97 motherboard, and 8GB of RAM, all brand new.

PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant

CPU: Intel Core i5-4690K 3.5GHz Quad-Core Processor ($257.68 @ DirectCanada)
Motherboard: MSI Z97 PC MATE ATX LGA1150 Motherboard ($98.98 @ Newegg Canada)
Memory: Team Zeus Yellow 8GB (2 x 4GB) DDR3-1600 Memory ($67.99 @ Newegg Canada)
Total: $424.65
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2014-12-15 14:43 EST-0500

If you're in Vancouver, I saw an alright deal on Craigslist. $580 for a complete system with a i7 4790K, relatively new, unworn parts.

 

[Oxn]

So I just received a refurbish Sabertooth Z77 board today which I will install over the weekend. Also bought a Corsair H75 which I will be installing with it.

I hate the Asrock Pro 4 board I have, so I am switching it out. I really wanna steal my sisters 3770K, and give her my 3570K.

Will I need to reinstall anything cause Im changing Mobos? Will it all work OK? Im hoping I don't need to reinstall the OS and reformat.

With making these slight upgrades, Im hoping to extend its life so I can wait for Cannonlake-E, instead of Skylake-E.

 

[LilJoka]

So I just received a refurbish Sabertooth Z77 board today which I will install over the weekend. Also bought a Corsair H75 which I will be installing with it.

I hate the Asrock Pro 4 board I have, so I am switching it out. I really wanna steal my sisters 3770K, and give her my 3570K.

Will I need to reinstall anything cause Im changing Mobos? Will it all work OK? Im hoping I don't need to reinstall the OS and reformat.

With making these slight upgrades, Im hoping to extend its life so I can wait for Cannonlake-E, instead of Skylake-E.

Possibly need to install chipset again, and if its using LAN from a different brand then those drivers too. And possibly USB 3.0 if its a 3rd party brand.

Consumer range CPU after Skylake may have 6 cores, so no point jumping on E platform again.

 

[Oxn]

Possibly need to install chipset again, and if its using LAN from a different brand then those drivers too. And possibly USB 3.0 if its a 3rd party brand.

Consumer range CPU after Skylake may have 6 cores, so no point jumping on E platform again.

But if thats the case then the E's after skylake in theory should be getting 8 cores?

I was considering CannonLake Extreme Edition for 8 cores, but if the lower end E's are going to be Octocores, then no need.

 

[TC McQueen]

Possibly need to install chipset again, and if its using LAN from a different brand then those drivers too. And possibly USB 3.0 if its a 3rd party brand.

Consumer range CPU after Skylake may have 6 cores, so no point jumping on E platform again.

I haven't heard this anywhere. What is this based on?

 

[AbortedWalrusFetus]

Hey guys, I did a build and posted about it on here a few weeks ago. I just noticed that the front audio ports on my Phanteks Enthoo Pro are not working. Any hints for troubleshooting this? I am starting to think I missed plugging something in when I was installing it, but I didn't notice anything.

 

[garath]

Hey guys, I did a build and posted about it on here a few weeks ago. I just noticed that the front audio ports on my Phanteks Enthoo Pro are not working. Any hints for troubleshooting this? I am starting to think I missed plugging something in when I was installing it, but I didn't notice anything.

There should be some cables from the case that plug into the motherboard for the front sound ports. Trace back and see if there are any not plugged in.

 

[The Llama]

Hey guys, I did a build and posted about it on here a few weeks ago. I just noticed that the front audio ports on my Phanteks Enthoo Pro are not working. Any hints for troubleshooting this? I am starting to think I missed plugging something in when I was installing it, but I didn't notice anything.

You probably didn't connect a wire. If you google "front audio ports connection" you'll find a ton of pictures of what you should be looking for. Just connect them to your motherboard (or soundcard if you have one).

 

[roddur]

Yeah, those are awful prices, that probably cost more than it was when it was new. Where are you buying? What's your budget?



You can't. Even after currency conversion, market prices here in Canada still suck.

For $425 before taxes you can easily get a 4690K, Z97 motherboard, and 8GB of RAM, all brand new.

PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant

CPU: Intel Core i5-4690K 3.5GHz Quad-Core Processor ($257.68 @ DirectCanada)
Motherboard: MSI Z97 PC MATE ATX LGA1150 Motherboard ($98.98 @ Newegg Canada)
Memory: Team Zeus Yellow 8GB (2 x 4GB) DDR3-1600 Memory ($67.99 @ Newegg Canada)
Total: $424.65
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2014-12-15 14:43 EST-0500

If you're in Vancouver, I saw an alright deal on Craigslist. $580 for a complete system with a i7 4790K, relatively new, unworn parts.

thanks for the list, budget for good mobo, cpu, ram is <=$500.