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I think the New Disney Animation Renaissance might have topped the previous one

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E

EdReedFan20

Member
This may seem controversial, but I think the New Disney Animation Renaissance might have officially topped the previous one. With both Zootopia and Moana releasing this year to extraordinary critical reception, I think that just might be the case. If it hasn't just yet, I do think it will if Disney keeps this up.

The first Disney Renaissance is said to have lasted 10 years (1989-1999)

These are the 10 movies from that era:

The Little Mermaid (1989, 92% Fresh on Rotten Tomatoes)
The Rescuers Down Under (1990, 68% Fresh on Rotten Tomatoes)
Beauty and the Beast (1991, 93% Fresh on Rotten Tomatoes)
Aladdin (1992, 94% Fresh of Rotten Tomatoes)
The Lion King (1994, 92% Fresh on Rotten Tomatoes)
Pocahontas (1995, 56% Rotten on Rotten Tomatoes)
The Hunchback of Notre Dame (1996, 73% Fresh of Rotten Tomatoes)
Hercules (1997, 83% Fresh or Rotten Tomatoes)
Mulan (1998, 86% Fresh on Rotten Tomatoes)
Tarzan (1999, 88% Fresh on Rotten Tomatoes)

Between 2000 and 2006, they had some good movies, but they also hit rock bottom at points. In 2006, Disney acquired Pixar Animation Studios. As part of that acquisition, Pixar's John Lassetter became the overseer of all Disney Animation. The first such film was Meet the Robinsons. As that was a decently well received movie, in my mind, should be where the new renaissance should start (some have it starting at Frozen, which I find odd).

These are the (currently) 10 movies from this era:

Meet The Robinsons (2007, 66% Fresh on Rotten Tomatoes)
Bolt (2008, 89% Fresh on Rotten Tomatoes)
The Princess and the Frog (2009, 84% Fresh on Rotten Tomatoes)
Tangled (2010, 89% Fresh on Rotten Tomatoes)
Winnie the Pooh (2011, 90% Fresh on Rotten Tomatoes)
Wreck-it-Ralph (2012, 86% Fresh on Rotten Tomatoes)
Frozen (2013, 89% Fresh on Rotten Tomatoes)
Big Hero 6 (2014, 89% Fresh on Rotten Tomatoes)
Zootopia (2016, 98% Fresh on Rotten Tomatoes)
Moana (2016, 98% Fresh on Rotten Tomatoes)

I know many hold the first Disney Renaissance in high regard, but this new Renaissance is incredibly consistent in quality. Thoughts?
 
Y

yanipheonu

Member
I'd be more inclined to agree if they funded more 2D animation. I get it's expensive but it's fucking Disney.

They're still making money off of decades old movies. Don't tell me they can't fund an expensive old school animation project.

I guess I'd settle for stuff like Paperman, where the cg is indistinguishable from 2d animation.
 
K

kmfdmpig

Member
They seem fairly comparable to me. It's hard to compare objectively as movies like Little Mermaid, Lion King, Beauty and the Beast, and Aladdin became part of the culture and the newer ones haven't had the same chance to do so yet (except for Frozen which became part of the culture very quickly).
 
G

Goodstyle

Member
Doesn't matter to me.. We haven't had a truly great Disney villain since Dr. Facilier. The old Renaissance had Scar, Ursula, Jafar and more. This one just has one guy from 2009, that's pathetic.
 
E

EdReedFan20

Member
Goodstyle said:
Doesn't matter to me.. We haven't had a truly great Disney villain since Dr. Facilier. The old Renaissance had Scar, Ursula, Jafar and more. This one just has one guy from 2009, that's pathetic.
Click to expand...

How can you reference old Renaissance villains and leave out Frollo? I mean, the dude literally came close the killing an infant (Quasimodo) by (almost) throwing it into a well. Plus, the whole Esmeralda stuff.
 
F

Fat4all

Banned
Ganondorfo said:
I disagree, there is not "dark disney movie" this renaissance like the Hunchback of Notre Dame.
Click to expand...

While I'd be inclined to agree, Hunchback suffered greatly from the need to add goofy side characters and terrible "funny" musical scenes.

But that was a flaw in a few of those 90's films. Some of them pulled it off really well, though.

Still, can't beat Hellfire.
 
4

4Tran

Member
I'm not surprised. Disney Animation currently has a much better idea of what they're trying to achieve and how to go about doing it than they ever have before, so their products have been able to consistently reach the high notes, and simultaneously manage to appeal to their target audiences. That said, the new films mostly take fewer risks so they've also failed to achieve the cultural zeitgeist status of their predecessors (with the noted exception of Frozen).

Ganondorfo said:
I disagree, there is not "dark disney movie" this renaissance like the Hunchback of Notre Dame.
Click to expand...
And there won't be. To this day, I have no idea what Disney was thinking when they decided to adapt Hunchback. I mean, Hellfire is a great song and all (the best song really), but it's also crazy inappropriate for a children's film.
 
JaseMath

JaseMath

Member
I'm not sure any of the films from the new Renaissance will go down like some of the all-time greats of the first. That's really what we're talking about here: All-time greats versus a handful of entertaining ones.
 
A

alemmon

Member
I am not quite sure how I feel about this... I think the current streak will end with the release of Wreck it Ralph 2 and Frozen 2. Disney makes great stand alone movies, sequels have never been a strength and I think doing them is whats making Pixar feel stagnate. I could be wrong... I certainly love the current batch of films and feel Meet the Robinsons is criminally underrated.
 
SonicMegaDrive

SonicMegaDrive

Member
yanipheonu said:
I'd be more inclined to agree if they funded more 2D animation. I get it's expensive but it's fucking Disney.

They're still making money off of decades old movies. Don't tell me they can't fund an expensive old school animation project.

I guess I'd settle for stuff like Paperman, where the cg is indistinguishable from 2d animation.
Click to expand...

I agree with that sentiment. Disney still makes good movies, but I much prefer the 2D animation. Their 3D films have mostly been great but as a lover of 2D animation they could never be on the same level as their older, traditional output. At least not in my eyes.
 
J

jph139

Member
I wouldn't start the contemporary era until Tangled. Robinsons, Bolt, and Princess and the Frog - ignoring quality - were major underperformers, which puts them squarely in the dark age of cultural irrelevance alongside Chicken Little and Treasure Planet.

Tangled and Frozen set the current mold, just like Little Mermaid and Beauty and the Beast back in the day.

But yeah, if you rub off the nostalgia, I think the modern era stands up pretty well to the Renaissance. Not quite as ambitious in tone, I think, but they're definitely more varied in style and setting. The Renaissance is almost purely European stories and literature. Nowadays you have fairy tales, sure, but superheroes and video games and funny animals all mixed in.
 
E

EdReedFan20

Member
Joni said:
That first renaissance seems quite weak. They have three absolutely amazing movies.
Click to expand...

I just watched a new "Everything Wrong With" yesterday. It was about Pocahontas. Watching that made me realize, that's probably one Disney movie that will definitely not got the live action treatment. Half of the 90's movies have one in the works (The Little Mermaid, Beauty and the Beast, Aladdin, The Lion King, and Mulan).
 
A

alemmon

Member
JasonMCG said:
I'm not sure any of the films from the new Renaissance will go down like some of the all-time greats of the first. That's really what we're talking about here: All-time greats versus a handful of entertaining ones.
Click to expand...

I think Tangled will stand the test of time, and possibly Moana.
 
E

EdReedFan20

Member
4Tran said:
I'm not surprised. Disney Animation currently has a much better idea of what they're trying to achieve and how to go about doing it than they ever have before, so their products have been able to consistently reach the high notes, and simultaneously manage to appeal to their target audiences. That said, the new films mostly take fewer risks so they've also failed to achieve the cultural zeitgeist status of their predecessors (with the noted exception of Frozen).


And there won't be. To this day, I have no idea what Disney was thinking when they decided to adapt Hunchback. I mean, Hellfire is a great song and all (the best song really), but it's also crazy inappropriate for a children's film.
Click to expand...

How it get a G rating, is what I wonder. I would assume the tone alone would guarantee a PG.
 
V

Veitsev

Member
Absolutely not

Nothing touches Lion King, Beauty and the Beast, and Aladdin. The first two are moving works of art and the best films Disney has ever made. Mulan and Little Mermaid are also strong.
 
S

Stumpokapow

listen to the mad man
rt scores don't really work pre-internet due to selective digitization and modern re-reviews, and there's no reason to believe the score scaling would work the same way anyway, but setting aside that, i would qualitatively disagree with you quite strongly
 
S

soco

Member
Wow, it's hard to believe Pocahontas did that poorly in reviews. Even Disney can't slap some recolor that shitty aspect of American history.
 
F

Fat4all

Banned
Zootopia joins the ranks of great cop drama/race relations films, like Lethal Weapon and... uhh... Beverly Hills Cop?
 
C

Creaking

He touched the black heart of a mod
SonicMegaDrive said:
I agree with that sentiment. Disney still makes good movies, but I much prefer the 2D animation. Their 3D films have mostly been great but as a lover of 2D animation they could never be on the same level as their older, traditional output. At least not in my eyes.
Click to expand...

Yep.

Disney no longer pursuing traditional 2D animation and Valve no longer pursing story-driven single player games are two of my biggest peeves in their respective industries. Both extremely well-off companies turning their backs on their roots.
 
T

thestopsign

Member
I hold The Lion King, Aladdin, Beauty and the Beast, The Little Mermaid, and Mulan in higher regard than anything from the newer era, but those are from my childhood so it isn't really a fair comparison. That said, I do think Disney has found a good spot for it's animation studio, I am excited to go see Moana at some point.
 
S

Skellig Gra

Member
I can't really agree at all. The only new generation mega hit that had a true cultural impact was Frozen. Everything else is just a well oiled box office machine.
 
W

WillyFive

Member
I don't think it topples it, but it is absolutely fantastic. I knew when Lasseter came on board and I saw Meet the Robinsons, I knew Disney was back.

Big Hero 6 and Hercules are still low-points though.
 
M

MMarston

Was getting caught part of your plan?
This is solely a matter preference and doesn't mean that I think the other is worse, but I vastly prefer that previous renaissance. Again, this is not to detract from the current ones' qualities - I still very much enjoy them. For me, the first renaissance had bigger focus on squeezing as much out of the Disney animated medium as much as they can, both visually and narratively. More importantly, each entry really stood out from one another in both regards. You had something incredibly campy like Hercules, grim like Hunchback, and in-between that with B&B and they were all executed well - erm, less so with Herc. Basically, they impressed every one by simply planting their legs knee-deep in their artistic integrity -- even if that became a fault to an extent.

As for the current renaissance, the films seem to have more of an emphasis on charming the shit out of the audience as much as they can. It involves a lot more humor and modern audience relatability such as the games in Ralph or the singing in Frozen. That said, this still works because it's done in an inobvious, organic way and the execution is still good. The problem is all the films start to tonally copy each other moreso than the other renaissance. And although I rarely complain a film relating well to its audience, there is a risk of this method becoming too emotionally manipulative/hamfisted that you can start to clearly see the cracks . It's not really happened with Disney Animation yet, but it's defs starting to show in Pixar for me.

Also the first renaissance auto-wins in terms of music.
 
T

The Interrobanger

Member
Granted I haven't watched a bunch of movies in both of the "eras", but this streak was so incredibly strong it would be tough to ever beat IMO.

The Little Mermaid (1989, 92% Fresh on Rotten Tomatoes)
The Rescuers Down Under (1990, 68% Fresh on Rotten Tomatoes)
Beauty and the Beast (1991, 93% Fresh on Rotten Tomatoes)
Aladdin (1992, 94% Fresh of Rotten Tomatoes)
The Lion King (1994, 92% Fresh on Rotten Tomatoes)

All 5 are fucking classics.

And Emperors New Groove should be in the first list too. I know it's 2000 but it's so good.
 
F

Frozenprince

Banned
Beauty and the Beast was nominated for best picture.

It was such a coup that the Academy made sure it could never happen again.

No way. The first renaissance was perfection.
 
D

dave is ok

aztek is ok
Frozen is the only movie with a soundtrack that comes close to the big ones from the 80s and 90s.

Half of the movies in the current section aren't even musical. Fuck that
 
G

GamerJM

Banned
I need to see Zootopia and Moana, but Mulan and the Lion King are so far ahead of anything from the new Renaissance IMO.
 
A

A Link to the Past

Banned
I think that Disney could stand to have more movies that vary visually. Not that I think Moana and Frozen are samey, but they definitely seem like they are cut from a similar cloth. How about cel-shaded, or hand-drawn animation?
 
J

JigglesBunny

Banned
While the original era had Beauty and the Beast, Aladdin and The Lion King, the modern era has Winnie the Pooh, Wreck-it-Ralph, Big Hero 6, Zootopia and Moana, so sign me up for new era.
 
M

MMarston

Was getting caught part of your plan?
A Link to the Past said:
I think that Disney could stand to have more movies that vary visually. Not that I think Moana and Frozen are samey, but they definitely seem like they are cut from a similar cloth. How about cel-shaded, or hand-drawn animation?
Click to expand...

I really want a full-blown feature for whatever they did with Paperman.
Paperman-2.gif
 
C

cw_sasuke

If all DLC came tied to $13 figurines, I'd consider all DLC to be free
Renaissance 1 has Lion King so it wins by default. Its. def. getting closer though.
 
T

TangoAlphaLima

Member
EdReedFan20 said:
The first Disney Renaissance is said to have lasted 10 years (1989-1999)

These are the 10 movies from that era:

The Little Mermaid (1989, 92% Fresh on Rotten Tomatoes)
The Rescuers Down Under (1990, 68% Fresh on Rotten Tomatoes)
Beauty and the Beast (1991, 93% Fresh on Rotten Tomatoes)
Aladdin (1992, 94% Fresh of Rotten Tomatoes)
The Lion King (1994, 92% Fresh on Rotten Tomatoes)
Pocahontas (1995, 56% Rotten on Rotten Tomatoes)
The Hunchback of Notre Dame (1996, 73% Fresh of Rotten Tomatoes)
Hercules (1997, 83% Fresh or Rotten Tomatoes)
Mulan (1998, 86% Fresh on Rotten Tomatoes)
Tarzan (1999, 88% Fresh on Rotten Tomatoes)

These are the (currently) 10 movies from this era:

Meet The Robinsons (2007, 66% Fresh on Rotten Tomatoes)
Bolt (2008, 89% Fresh on Rotten Tomatoes)
The Princess and the Frog (2009, 84% Fresh on Rotten Tomatoes)
Tangled (2010, 89% Fresh on Rotten Tomatoes)
Winnie the Pooh (2011, 90% Fresh on Rotten Tomatoes)
Wreck-it-Ralph (2012, 86% Fresh on Rotten Tomatoes)
Frozen (2013, 89% Fresh on Rotten Tomatoes)
Big Hero 6 (2014, 89% Fresh on Rotten Tomatoes)
Zootopia (2016, 98% Fresh on Rotten Tomatoes)
Moana (2016, 98% Fresh on Rotten Tomatoes)
Click to expand...

The first era got worse over the last half, whereas this era got better over the same period.
 
C

Creaking

He touched the black heart of a mod
Frozenprince said:
Or such horrible songs as "I'll make a man out of you".

Awful.
Click to expand...

Honestly, it's hard to pick just one. It's overwhelming how many damn good songs those first renaissance movies had.

I mean-- uh, garbage songs. Like Gaston's song? Jeez, talk about creating a bunch of little egomaniacs.
 
D

digdug2k

Member
Goodstyle said:
Doesn't matter to me.. We haven't had a truly great Disney villain since Dr. Facilier. The old Renaissance had Scar, Ursula, Jafar and more. This one just has one guy from 2009, that's pathetic.
Click to expand...
I actually like when they've moved away from "good guys vs. bad guys" motifs in movies. That's part of what's made so many of Pixar's movies successful as well.
 
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