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[Spike Spiegel]

In the IMO extremely unlikely event that Kyle turns out to be the killer, then... god, DC is so f*cking dumb. "Well, we got rid of Hal by turning him into a crazy villain, and the fans didn't like that at all so... this time, let's bring him back by turning his replacement, Kyle, into a crazy villain."

Sorry, I smell bullsh*t.

 

[8bit]

The only people that would appeal to are the crazy fucks at HEAT.

 

[DarienA]

In the IMO extremely unlikely event that Kyle turns out to be the killer, then... god, DC is so f*cking dumb. "Well, we got rid of Hal by turning him into a crazy villain, and the fans didn't like that at all so... this time, let's bring him back by turning his replacement, Kyle, into a crazy villain."

Sorry, I smell bullsh*t.

I must be the only one that like Parallax... Awesome costume.

 

[Ignatz Mouse]

New issue is out. I got it at lunch.

Spoiler

I was right, Jean did survive, exactly as I predicted (here or somewhere). Very cool save. Looks like the Atom is not the killer.

 

[8bit]

New issue is out. I got it at lunch.

Spoiler

I was right, Jean did survive, exactly as I predicted (here or somewhere). Very cool save. Looks like the Atom is not the killer.

I haven't read it yet, but

Spoiler

I don't see how that excludes the Atom from being the killer, if anything, I'd be even more suspicious of him from here on in

. Misdirection and everything.

 

[Yossarian]

I must be the only one that like Parallax... Awesome costume.

I liked the whole parallax storyline. To me it was fairly good (and I'd never liked Hal Jordan anyway).

 

[BuddyC]

picking this up in a few hours. why, i'm almost excited.

 

[Ignatz Mouse]

I haven't read it yet, but

Spoiler

I don't see how that excludes the Atom from being the killer, if anything, I'd be even more suspicious of him from here on in

. Misdirection and everything.

Spoiler

When you read it, you'll see why. It doesn't make any mechanical sense for it being him. Unless there's more than one killer.

 

[evil solrac v3.0]

Spoiler

atom is not the killer, neither are any of the usual villains. it has to be someone who was a hero and we have forgoten about him. or a villain. why does chronos keep saying "we'll win"

 

[evil solrac v3.0]

NY times article.

Arts Briefing
Published: September 15, 2004

SUPERCRIME AND PUNISHMENT The fourth chapter of "Identity Crisis," a seven-part mystery that forces the DC Comics superheroes to question their culpability in a vengeful murder, is on sale today. The series, which began in June, has been one of this summer's top-selling comic books. The events in "Identity Crisis" stem from the rape of a hero's wife and the Justice League's questionable retaliation. The series is written by Brad Meltzer, a thriller novelist and the co-creator of "Jack & Bobby," a new WB television drama. "I'm absolutely humbled by the reaction," Mr. Meltzer said in a telephone interview. "The No. 1 compliment I've gotten is, 'I don't read comics, but I'm reading this.' " Internet message boards have been buzzing with readers' reactions, good and bad. Some posters have even accused the writer of misogyny, for the rape and murder of one woman and the apparent murder, last month, of another. Mr. Meltzer suggested a wait-and-see approach and said that Issue 4 had "all the chess pieces in place," including greater involvement from Batman, who puts his detective skills to work, and Superman, who will find the threat hitting very close to home. Ñ GEORGE GENE GUSTINES

 

[evil solrac v3.0]

anybody buy it yet? i'm gonna post spoilers pretty soon.....

 

[Mercury Fred]

Oh my god, I think I figured it out. Issue 4 spoilers below.

Spoiler

Re-read the Hal/Spectre stuff. First the panel of Sue's burned body underneath Hal's "I can't say" panel. Then Ollie: "You're the Spectre Hal! You're supposed to punish the guilty! Isn't that what being the spirit of vengence is all about? Hal: "You don't understand-- I report to a higher power..."

Have the higher powers behind the Spectre decided that the JLA are guilty? Guilty from the mindwipe(s) and who knows what else? Are the powers that be using the Spectre to exact vengence on behalf of gravely wronged villains and doing so by offing those nearest and dearest to the JLA?

Also, I'm not sure exactly how the Spectre works, but could Hal be paying off his debt as the Spectre by doing this most painful, most heinous vengence against his friends? Is it the sort of thing large enough to satisfy the powers that be, thus setting up Hal's becoming GL again? Note that when Ollie asks him when he's coming back for real he says "I'm working on it."

 

[BuddyC]

i got to the shop at 6:01. they close at 6:00.

i'll chime in tomorrow.

 

[Willco]

Oh my god, I think I figured it out. Issue 4 spoilers below.

Spoiler

Re-read the Hal/Spectre stuff. First the panel of Sue's burned body underneath Hal's "I can't say" panel. Then Ollie: "You're the Spectre Hal! You're supposed to punish the guilty! Isn't that what being the spirit of vengence is all about? Hal: "You don't understand-- I report to a higher power..."

Have the higher powers behind the Spectre decided that the JLA are guilty? Guilty from the mindwipe(s) and who knows what else? Are the powers that be using the Spectre to exact vengence on behalf of gravely wronged villains and doing so by offing those nearest and dearest to the JLA?

Also, I'm not sure exactly how the Spectre works, but could Hal be paying off his debt as the Spectre by doing this most painful, most heinous vengence against his friends? Is it the sort of thing large enough to satisfy the powers that be, thus setting up Hal's becoming GL again? Note that when Ollie asks him when he's coming back for real he says "I'm working on it."

That's a pretty sharp bit of speculation there. And it makes a lot of sense.

 

[DarienA]

I only have a bit of a problem with the above speculation:

Spoiler

Hal's getting ready to come back as GL... why in the hell would the rest of the DC Universe accept him back as a GL when he's just finished committing mass murder? After the whole Parallax issue it took them awhile to even go after him to ask him to help with Sun Eater IIRC.

Anyone reading War Games? A question about the issue that came out yesterday.. I Think it was Batman Gotham Knights...

Spoiler

Who in the hell sliced Orpheus neck at the end of this most recent issue? I'll be damned that was a scapel... it was Hush?

 

[8bit]

I agree with DarienA. That doesn't make sense unless there's a retcon of massive proportions coming.

 

[Matlock]

I think it's

Spoiler

Jason Todd

.

 

[8bit]

I think it's

Spoiler

Jason Todd

.

Someone already used

Spoiler

him as a gimmick in Hush

.

 

[Ignatz Mouse]

Spoiler

I don't know who it is-- but the narrative is strongly hinting at Boomerang. Which doesn't make too much sense with the killer's abilities (apparently super strong) until you remember he had Miraclo in the Satellite. So here's the theory-- depressed about his son, and his confidence staggering, he goes on a Miraclo binge and decides to make the JLA pay. Mirror Master gimmicks (he has stolen and used them before) get him into the apartments, and Miraclo makes him strong (and manic). When we see him, he's on the downer after it's worn off. The only thing that doesn't make sense is the note at the end of #4-- unless he wrote it high also, just trying to upset folks. Oh, and Calculator could be giving him info. This issue establishes that they are friends, so for free. Oh yeah, he's in the Suicide Squad, so he knows Slipknot.

Or, he could be a red herring and the killer is somebody else.

 

[Mercury Fred]

Spoiler

Hal's getting ready to come back as GL... why in the hell would the rest of the DC Universe accept him back as a GL when he's just finished committing mass murder? After the whole Parallax issue it took them awhile to even go after him to ask him to help with Sun Eater IIRC.

Spoiler

Right, but what if Hal is a puppet of the Spectre at this point. That's certainly alluded to in his conversation with Ollie. So, Hal wrests himself away from the (corrupted?) Spectre by the end of IC in order to help save the day. He's back in business and now a little darker than the squeaky clean GL Hal used to be.

The way this series has been talked about is that it casts a major chill in the DCU and forces the heroes to re-examine themselves and what they do. What could be more chilling than having a higher power, not some two-bit Flash's rogue, exacting vengence on the JLA for their crimes.

 

[DarienA]

Spoiler

Right, but what if Hal is a puppet of the Spectre at this point. That's certainly alluded to in his conversation with Ollie. So, Hal wrests himself away from the (corrupted?) Spectre by the end of IC in order to help save the day. He's back in business and now a little darker than the squeaky clean GL Hal used to be.

The way this series has been talked about is that it casts a major chill in the DCU and forces the heroes to re-examine themselves and what they do. What could be more chilling than having a higher power, not some two-bit Flash's rogue, exacting vengence on the JLA for their crimes.

Hmm I like that... I like that...

 

[Mercury Fred]

Hmm I like that... I like that...

Thanks Darien.

I'm curious if anyone else has any new theories after #4.

 

[Spike Spiegel]

I really don't think Hal or the Spectre are involved.

And why the f*ck was WW on this issue's cover? Her hand and the lasso are all you see of her inside, and it's a bit part in the overall story.

 

[Ignatz Mouse]

It's the most compelling part of the story, though.

 

[evil solrac v3.0]

it's not hal. are you people forgetting he says at the end "make them pay ollie"? it's not even close to hal. its not boomerang...... the miraclo he's selling is fake, cheap crap. and he just met his son....... and he's nowhere near smart enough to figure out how to get around all those security measures.
even with calculator's help. and as batman said, it's not the suicide squad. they dont benefit and besides which, amanda waller would never allow something like that to happen. the squad takes care of their own (not in a nice way mind you).
the killer(s) is likey responsible for batman's mind wipe (why else would he not remenber fighting dr light in the league satellite) and knows how to stay one step ahead of all the heroes. answer: it's an ex-hero. someone whom we've forgotten and whose life was ruined by being a superhero. a shapeshifter? someone who can teleport? or someonewho is using some sort of technology to mimic heroes and villains abilities and powers? (hint: it's a robot) in issue #1 elongated man mentions that there was an amazo on the black market.the kiler likely bougt an amazo and reprogamed it to use as the killer.
sue wasnt killed because she was burned, she died cause someone superstrong beat her and then burned her to hide the evidence. i dont got a name yet but i think that's the method the killer(s) is using.

darienA: i dont think it's hush darien, maybe the joker?

 

[Ignatz Mouse]

Evil, that doesn't make sense. If it's Amazo being used as a weapon, why burn the body at all? What's to hide, since he's already mimicking somebody else?

And I'm not convinced it's Boomerang, but he's actually quite smart. What makes you say his Miraclo is fake?

 

[Mercury Fred]

it's not hal. are you people forgetting he says at the end "make them pay ollie"? it's not even close to hal.

I feel less that it's Hal per se than it is the Spectre whose strings are being pulled by that very "them."

Also note in the conversation that Ollie realizes the difference between Hal talking and the Spectre talking. I think Meltzer was setting up the distinction between the two to suggest that, at the moment, Hal is something of a puppet of the Spectre/ the powers that be.

And I can't remember the source of the top of my head (I'll look for it), but I believe that Meltzer mentioned that the killer has already appeared in the book.

 

[evil solrac v3.0]

Evil, that doesn't make sense. If it's Amazo being used as a weapon, why burn the body at all? What's to hide, since he's already mimicking somebody else?

And I'm not convinced it's Boomerang, but he's actually quite smart. What makes you say his Miraclo is fake?

maybe someone paid T.O morrow to reprgram an amazo android? ok, i know using an amzo is streching it (no pun intended) but i will stick by the theory that the killer is using something or some power to mimic abilities. it might actually be the red herring in the story.

 

[evil solrac v3.0]

I feel less that it's Hal per se than it is the Spectre whose strings are being pulled by that very "them."

Also note in the conversation that Ollie realizes the difference between Hal talking and the Spectre talking. I think Meltzer was setting up the distinction between the two to suggest that, at the moment, Hal is something of a puppet of the Spectre/ the powers that be.

And I can't remember the source of the top of my head (I'll look for it), but I believe that Meltzer mentioned that the killer has already appeared in the book.

but hal says that the spectre doesnt go after every last killer and bad guy. and besides, i dont think the spectre would go to such lenghts to punish the league, he would confront them head on..... and kill them.

 

[Spike Spiegel]

And I can't remember the source of the top of my head (I'll look for it), but I believe that Meltzer mentioned that the killer has already appeared in the book.

Quick! Somebody make a list of all the characters that've appeared so far!

 

[Escape Goat]

I think Hush did it.

Or Jason Todd.

 

[Ignatz Mouse]

WHo has ties to the Suicide Squad, knows all the info the killer would need to know, and has a possible motive?

Oracle.

She's be hiring the killer(s) of course, but consider that she could be getting late revenge for her own crippling.

OK-- it's completely out of character and highly unlikely. But it occurred to me, I thought I'd mention it.

 

[DarienA]

WHo has ties to the Suicide Squad, knows all the info the killer would need to know, and has a possible motive?

Oracle.

She's be hiring the killer(s) of course, but consider that she could be getting late revenge for her own crippling.

OK-- it's completely out of character and highly unlikely. But it occurred to me, I thought I'd mention it.

That would be incredibly... limp-wristed/bad/stupid/dumb/etc... but I wouldn't put it past them.

 

[evil solrac v3.0]

nightwing did it. he was wearing a trench coat in issue one. he's been unstable altely (had his friends killed by blockbuster) and wo else can get past security measures built by batman?

 

[Son of Godzilla]

Batman is the killer. Just has to be.

 

[karasu]

What about Jack Drake? He's probably pissed that Batman didn't save him and his wife before she was killed and he was paralyzed. Now Batman is putting his son in danger by hiring him as Robin, so Jack is making a point of showing how vunerable they all are, how superheroes aren't there when you need them or some shite.

 

[Mercury Fred]

Yeah, but
Don't read if you don't want future issues of IC spoiled

Spoiler

Jack Drake dies in IC and I believe is the next victim.

 

[karasu]

Really? How do you know that?

Spoiler

He could fake it

 

[Mercury Fred]

Really? How do you know that?

Spoiler

He could fake it

Spoiler

One of my best friends works on one of the Bat books. I've known about it, as have they for a loooong time. They only know that one as it's relevant to the Bat-verse. They don't know, for example, the killer or other future deaths. DC is keeping a tight lid on most of it. It's a very need to know basis thing.

 

[Spike Spiegel]

DC announces 2nd printing of Identity Crisis #1

Think I'll ask my comic shop to order one for me.

 

[DarienA]

Yeah, but
Don't read if you don't want future issues of IC spoiled

Spoiler

Jack Drake dies in IC and I believe is the next victim.

Oh shit... I was just kidding in the comic book thread.... or was I?

 

[evil solrac v3.0]

it was kinda known that he was gonna die anyway. if you have seen the cover to issue number five you'll know why. and that might lend credence to the fact that it could be

Spoiler

nightwing

 

[Spike Spiegel]

How could it possibly be

Spoiler

Nightwing?

That's just batty.

 

[evil solrac v3.0]

How could it possibly be

Spoiler

Nightwing?

That's just batty.

read the last few issues of his tittle.he has lost friends because his secret identity was found out by blockbuster. he's been unstable lately. he was also wearing a trench coat similar to sue's killer. and he knows how to get around all types of security systems. it's a wild theory but a lot people seem to be clinging to it.

 

[Spike Spiegel]

Sounds like an assortment of coincidences to me... Still, how much would that suck for Batman if true? He already has the worst luck with sidekicks.

 

[evil solrac v3.0]

Sounds like an assortment of coincidences to me... Still, how much would that suck for Batman if true? He already has the worst luck with sidekicks.

yeah, it's a wild theory but....... not impossible. it's most likely a hero everyone has forgotten or a villain we have missed.

 

[karasu]

it was kinda known that he was gonna die anyway. if you have seen the cover to issue number five you'll know why. and that might lend credence to the fact that it could be

Spoiler

nightwing

v

That? I'm still bettin it's him.

 

[evil solrac v3.0]

the cover to flash #217. IC spoilers i guess.....

 

[Spike Spiegel]

"Funeral for a Villain," is it?

Anyway, I lucked out. I went to the shop today to pick up my stuff and order a 2nd printing of IC #1, and the clerk looks at me and says, "ah, you're a regular" and sells me a 1st printing off the wall display at cover price instead of markup. Sweet.

 

[evil solrac v3.0]

i hope boomerang doesnt die..... but it sure is looking that way.....