striferser
Huge Nickleback Fan
If that woman is not a friend, random stranger, yes, it's sexual harrasment. It's making me uncomfortable.
IndieStatik Founder apologizes for "inappropriate" comments to female game dev
- Thread starter benny_a
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If that woman is not a friend, random stranger, yes, it's sexual harrasment. It's making me uncomfortable.
Aquamarine
Member
I was talking about the hypothetical situation where the professional dialogue was replicated but the genders were reversed.
freenudemacusers
Member
ignoring pathetic advances is usually how women tell you to stop. consider this useful dating advice in the future.
CambriaRising
Member
Sorry, but his excuses are stupid. "I was drunk" doesn't fly, dude.
GhostTrick
Banned
I think she was better ignoring that guy. Makes the whole thing a lot more funnier and pitiful for that guy. She's basically giving him chances to act like none of those things happened, and yet, he keeps acting like a fool. Drunk ? Lol.
Anyway, I think that things like this happening is a shame and I think that this guy deserve what might happen to his career.
Devolution
Member
That always gets me too. People who brag, it's weird, like maybe you should let me be the judge of that?
I feel like dudes who need proper flirting explained to them in detail are just outing themselves as clueless as hell and lacking a lot of socialization.
It's almost like she has something to say about the current situation and can relate to it based on past experience, weird.
Anyone else been watching David Jaffe twitter during this? I'm not sure if I should laugh or cry... I guess both?
element
Member
Been watching this one evolve all day. Pretty much has been blacklisted from every developer and publisher.
I've been drunk at events like CES, E3, GDC, PAX, and I'd never get anywhere close to crossing those lines.
Hell, I get uncomfortable when working saying someone is cute, let alone making any type of sexual remark.
It is sad seeing people remotely defend the guy or try to displace blame on this. Having worked with and be friends with women in the industry, they have to put up with stuff like this all the time. In terms of 'why didn't she just tell him to stop' is a sad view as does one sacrifice their own personal worth to keep communication open with potential opportunities in the future? It is really easy to be someone like Jaffe and tell someone to fuck off, but being a small developer who is just trying to get ANY attention, it is really hard to tell anyone to fuck off, no matter what they are doing.
I've been drunk at events like CES, E3, GDC, PAX, and I'd never get anywhere close to crossing those lines.
Hell, I get uncomfortable when working saying someone is cute, let alone making any type of sexual remark.
It is sad seeing people remotely defend the guy or try to displace blame on this. Having worked with and be friends with women in the industry, they have to put up with stuff like this all the time. In terms of 'why didn't she just tell him to stop' is a sad view as does one sacrifice their own personal worth to keep communication open with potential opportunities in the future? It is really easy to be someone like Jaffe and tell someone to fuck off, but being a small developer who is just trying to get ANY attention, it is really hard to tell anyone to fuck off, no matter what they are doing.
Not Good at twitter but if you just read his tweets it's pretty saddening.
The point is that it's still harassment. You don't necessarily need to feel like your life is threatened for it to be so.
https://twitter.com/georgeb3dr/status/425389819091382272
"When you're toward the start of a career, it's hard to tell a journalist who may cover your game to fuck off."
freenudemacusers
Member
'please write up acceptable ways of flirting so men have a checklist' lol did he really just say that. yeah, i'm sure giving an anatomy lesson on the clitoris at 6am gets the women wild.
I'm so confused with how you perceive harassment at this point. It has to be two separate conversations to rise to the level of harassment? Or is it just that some time needs to have lapsed between comments?
Can one single sentence ever be considered harassment in your opinion?
idk, i think "are you drunk?" as a response is a p. good verbal queue that you should cease the 'thousand years trekking across the driest of deserts' level of lusting.
i spent the last six hours telling a women how i'd like to bury myself neck deep in her vagina, but it's okay because despite the cold reception she never told me to stop!
That's probably what turned her off most, she stopped replying afterwards.
Fam needs to step his workout game up before he can step his game up.
Why would people have a problem with that? Most of his videos are pretty good, people may have issues with his personal opinions on twitter, but who cares? I don't want to be his friend, I only care about the information I get from his videos.
I don't watch a lot of them though so I may be wrong.
ReturnOfTheRAT
Member
David is offering a fair counterpoint. She did go along with it, never saying stop in a variety of different ways. The founder is still wrong, but she let him dig his own grave, and rightfully so.
bender
What time is it?
I guess I come at it from the standpoint of admitting the behavior is wrong was all that was necessary for an adequate apology and the ancillary feels more like a slight of hand. I don't disbelieve what he is saying in regard to his personal struggles, I just think it would have been smarter to save that for another time.
edit: What are you doing David Jaffe?
XANDER CAGE
Member
Captain Fish
Member
So disgusting that she had to deal with that. I'm honestly surprised she reacted in such a tame way to those comments. I really hope she didn't react like that because she felt she was obligated to.
Purple Cheeto
Member
As the mandatory California sexual harassment course taught me, the victim of sexual harassment is not obligated to tell their harasser to stop for it to be considered harassment.
Aquamarine
Member
As I just said, she could be frightened or weirded out. She could have used humour to mitigate her fear / worries.
The burden is NOT ON HER to state her grievances for the situation to be unwanted or harassment.
There is no such thing as "proper" flirting. Some people like subtle, some like blunt.
EmCeeGramr
Member
I got to his tweet where he claimed that bringing up her divorce was "sending the signal" and had to quit.
That is the creepy part and appointing them judge over it.
Devolution
Member
I'm not exactly sure what the proper way of handling this is for a woman in an industry so entrenched with these problems that wants to work in it but not alienate possible employers.
NoirVisage
Banned
for some, yes they can't meet the challenge in that area, for some though, they know it to be the door opener, as if by doing that so well, they'll inspire them to okay their docking request. Its hit or miss though, its better just to give them a reason to want you rather than force the issue.."be excellent in her presence"..NOT creepy.
That is a tragic reality. Like depressingly sad. "At what price"? dudes rarely have to deal with that. Anywhere
I also thought you had a white beard for the longest time. that's a CAT!
Her absolute and steadfast refusal to acknowledge his 'flirting' was about as subtle as a 72pt block caps flashing FUCK OFF, only far more polite.
I guess I'm just not as sensitive when it comes to sex or sexually explicit texts as a lot of other people here seem to be. But then I've been to my fair share of gay dating sites where most guys greet each other with a photo of their genitals so that might have something to do with it
. I just don't think such a comment is a big deal, not even between two people with a strictly professional relationship. A little weird and awkward? Sure. But not as dramatic as most people here seem to find it. That's just me, though. Now with him continuously sending her messages, even hours later...that's something I had not realised when I had written that post and I definitely find that problematic.And no, I would most certainly not say that to a female coworker, mostly because the mere thought of having sex with a woman is off-putting to me. Would I say that kinda thing to a guy I don't know outside of a professional relationship? I don't think so. But would I be offended or feel harrassed if someone said it to me just once or twice? Nah, probably not.
Telling someone you're going to kiss their vagina isn't flirting.
Aquamarine
Member
Oh, you rapscallion! ;-)
Are they like super good friends or is that how he just talks to a random 'industry friend' because she's a woman? I can't believe anyone would write something like that. Seriously like what world do these people live on. There is really no justification for it either, even while drunk. Disgusting.
The fact she didn't acknowledge it shows how uncomfortable it made her.
The fact she didn't acknowledge it shows how uncomfortable it made her.
freenudemacusers
Member
I don't know how it could be more obvious.
You should have seen the Titanfall port beg thread.
Please let's not have his thread turn into a terrible dating advice thread.
Castle Doctrine
Member
hmm, reading through the exchange again, his comments don't seem to bother her. Based on this conversation alone, I don't see why this is even a news story at all. It's a man badly flirting with a woman on the internet. That's about it.
No he really doesn't. Ignoring his comments isn't "going along with it" and like others have said asking if he was drunk is a clear indication that she thought something was wrong with him and the things he was saying.
Maybe instead of relying entirely on the responses of the flirt-ees, flirt-ers could have some self-awareness and be ready to to check themselves lest they wreck themselves.
"SHE DIDN'T TELL ME TO STOP!" is not exactly a great place to start defending yourself from.
ReturnOfTheRAT
Member
Disengage. After his reiteration of his desire at the 10:16pm comment she could have dropped out of the conversation. He said he was put up for this with a challenge, he's still being weird with her. At that point just stop indulging him.
Ever had someone change the topic of conversation on you or completely ignore half of what you said? It's an easy, polite way to get people to stop what they're doing.
It would've been nice if she had told him right off, but unfortunately, she still needed his coverage and business.
"Could you please stop with the sexual advances? Thank you."
Askherserenity
Member
Thirsty ass dude. Yeah, she didn't say anything (which is kinda weird) but I can't see myself talking to anyone like that. I might talk to a gf like that but just fucking around and stuff.
Wonder how many guys get girls in that manner.
Wonder how many guys get girls in that manner.
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