Foobar said:Virtua Fighter 4 and Soul Calibur 2 have the deepest controls and flexibility of any fighter out there, however, the "popular" style still seems to be the dialed-in combos and reversals you see in Tekken or DOA. I don't really get it, because Tekken and DOA don't really allow the player to develop their own style of play, meanwhile VF4 and SC2 allow for that.[/QUOTE
You mean of "any 3D fighter out there," right?
I'd probably have to place SC2 somewhere between "checkers" and "chess," then. VF stands alone in its complexity and deep game play. That's not an opinion...it's a fact.
Is it just me or is it obvious that companies aren't evolving fighting games
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Man you guys are blind... you basically hear what you want to hear and that alone...
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I'm not going to even get into it with you guys again... I've already said my piece, and I don't take you seriously. In other words it's over.
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Azih said:
Blind is a metaphor my friend... it has nothing to do with actual sight.... good grief...
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Ferrio said:
So we disagree... fine. We have different ideals on how fighting games should work.
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duckroll said:Yeah we say that everytime you post too.
Good for you.
Drinky Crow
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Azih, I think the lack of flash in tourney vids illustrates VF4's genius. In a REAL fighting competition between two pros, you AREN'T gonna see crazy moves -- you'll see a lot of conservative poking and feints in the hopes of landing an unspectacular but ruthlessly efficient finishing strike or submission.
That doesn't mean that you can't play VF4 flashy -- you can make characters like Lei Fei and Sarah go all Crouching Tiger or Bruce Lee respectively -- but you WILL get rocked by a pro.
That doesn't mean that you can't play VF4 flashy -- you can make characters like Lei Fei and Sarah go all Crouching Tiger or Bruce Lee respectively -- but you WILL get rocked by a pro.
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Ferrio said:So we agree that you want fighting games to NOT be fighting games... but something else entirely.
Ergo
you ruin our genre by sticking in your own beliefs what it should be.
I think you are confused about what I trying to get through, but with your turn for juvenilism, I'll simply say I no longer care to argue with you.
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Drinky Crow said:
But do we play video games to emulate conservative reality or exciting scenarios based on reality?
Kung Fu Jedi
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I would say that the current crop of fighting games have been more of an evolution then a revolution, but after VF4, what more can you add? Obviously you expect graphics to improve, and more characters, moves, environments to be added, but those are just part of the evolution of fighting games. Online play is the same. To make a revolution, at this point, would require a shift in the way we play fighting games.
For instance, for years, most boxing games were played the same way, at least with the same basic concepts. But when EA created Fight Night, they created a new style of control for a boxing game. Not sure I'd call it a revolution, but at least they were trying to do something new and different with the way we controlled our fighters.
KFJ
For instance, for years, most boxing games were played the same way, at least with the same basic concepts. But when EA created Fight Night, they created a new style of control for a boxing game. Not sure I'd call it a revolution, but at least they were trying to do something new and different with the way we controlled our fighters.
KFJ
Drinky Crow
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If you REALLY want to make sure you get the LAST WORD, Galian, I think I can help you.
ArcadeStickMonk
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You rollin' Burnout or GT?Hello GAF! I like to be an idiot! said:
Drinky Crow said:
I think one of the main reasons VF still hasn't caught on everywhere as much as some other fighters isn't even game play related.
You CAN play with "flash," like you said, but VF isn't a flashy game and still has some pretty fruity character designs. (Not that other fighters don't either, don't get me wrong here!) I'd love to see a VF game that retains the same amazingly deep game play, but has more flashy backgrounds and character designs, as well as some really good music (the series' weak point, but it really means nothing in a fighting game!). In other words, let AM2 design the game play engine and let someone else handle the rest. ^_^;
I do like how you can alter character appearances in Evolution and Final Tuned; it does help, but some characters like Shun Di (design only) just need to go.
Drinky Crow
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Which VF character designs are fruity? At best, you could call 'em generic, but I'd say Tekken's designs are vastly more fruity. Yoshimitsu? Jack? KING? Diaper Heihachi? Nina?
Drinky Crow
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Brad's not really fruity; he's just annoying as hell.
Come on, KING? He has a fuckin' LEOPARD HEAD. JACK/P-JACK is a lopsided ROBOT. And Yoshimitsu is a KUNG-FU ALIEN. Hell, Nina just rips off Sarah who was already a painfully generic character. The ever-popular Tekken is pure fruit factor.
Come on, KING? He has a fuckin' LEOPARD HEAD. JACK/P-JACK is a lopsided ROBOT. And Yoshimitsu is a KUNG-FU ALIEN. Hell, Nina just rips off Sarah who was already a painfully generic character. The ever-popular Tekken is pure fruit factor.
Drinky Crow
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And JP Wrestling isn't totally fruity?
Drinky Crow said:
Like I said, don't get me wrong; plenty of other fighting are fruity. To me, Tekken was just as fruity if not more so than VF until Tekken 3 came out, then the character designs were greatly improved IMO. Tekken 4 definitely took some steps backward with the likes Diaper Heihachi, that's for sure. :lol I don't think I ever cringed at a fighting game character before that.
I just find that some of the VF characters tend to have some of the fruitest clothing choices or overly-bizarre outfit choices. Jeffry, Kage, (alternate outfit) and Shun Di in particular are the worst offenders.
And then pretty much all the designs in VF3 take the cake for "fruitiest designs EVER."
When I think about it, I suppose the same could be said about that other fighting game with the old man in a diaper, weird looking alien that can't use a sword properly, and the wrestler guy with a big headed leopard mask too, but there are some characters that I think look cool in that game, and I can't say that for any character in VF. VF4 did make some large improvements in character design, but in general AM2 has always been the "king of fruity" in all their games IMO.
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ArcadeStickMonk said:
Gran Turismo while not the most exciting of racing games, definitely brings a certain level of excitement in terms of creating cars that you couldn't really imagine owning, not to mention racing in cars that you could quite easily afford. It's a good mix, and thats why it is so popular.
To get a good challenge against a good opponent you don't need to play a fighting game though. The genre itself exists because people like fighting, but that doesn't necessarily mean that someone wants a completely accurate portrail of a fight.
Haven't you always wondered why in martial arts movies why random people are martial artists... well it wouldn't be nearly as interesting if the fighting was one sided.
Yeah it was. Speaking of VB, have you ever watched Hajime No Ippo. If you did you would also understand more about what I am talking about. If a game properly emulated the fighting in HnI it would be very fast and fluid.
You just summed up the maturity level of this board in one sentence... thank you.
Drinky Crow
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Yeah, how is Shun Di anything but awesome? DRUNKEN MASTER, fool!
Now Jerky -- he's a fruit, given. And Jeffry's as gay as the day is long. But Shun Di is PURE BADICAL ENFLESHED.
Now Jerky -- he's a fruit, given. And Jeffry's as gay as the day is long. But Shun Di is PURE BADICAL ENFLESHED.
SonicMegaDrive
Member
I think it's intentional that they made the characters generic. You have the generic Ninja guy, the kung-fu girl, the japanese guy, the american guy, the muscular guy, the drunkard master, etc.
This was probably made that way so the player can imagine themselves as the character they're controlling.
This was probably made that way so the player can imagine themselves as the character they're controlling.
Drinky Crow
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As of VF4, the characters represent a distinct fighting style as opposed to KoF-style bish fan fodder or flesh-toned mounting braces for the giant tits Lyte Edge so loves. I rather prefer it remain that way.
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SonicMegaDrive said:
And yet it stifles the object of creating a character that people can deem as "cool". Look at high selling fighting games in the past, and the characters that pushed them there. Tekken 3's Jin Kazuma, or Street Fighter's Ryu Hoshi...
^^^^
You think Tekken 3 and SF gained all their popularity from two characters?
Ah, I knew I wouldn't be able have a discussion with Drinky Crow for too long before it turned into some form of (completely misjudged) personal attack.
Last time I checked, VF4 had three women with giant bouncing breasts too.
Now, clearly the most generic characters in dire need of a make-over are the "Stereotypical hardened Japanese guy in gi looking for the true meaning of the fight."
You think Tekken 3 and SF gained all their popularity from two characters?
Drinky Crow said:
Ah, I knew I wouldn't be able have a discussion with Drinky Crow for too long before it turned into some form of (completely misjudged) personal attack.
Last time I checked, VF4 had three women with giant bouncing breasts too.
Now, clearly the most generic characters in dire need of a make-over are the "Stereotypical hardened Japanese guy in gi looking for the true meaning of the fight."
SonicMegaDrive
Member
As for the VF characters being 'fruity' argument...I don't know about you...but whenever one of my buddies play as this guy -->
I can't help but throw names like 'DiCaprio', 'Frenchie', and 'Pierre' around.
I can't help but throw names like 'DiCaprio', 'Frenchie', and 'Pierre' around.
Drinky Crow
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That's not a personal attack; it's an observation. After that recent Mai avatar, you've pretty much publically advertised your love for female characters with giant jugs. Let's not play bashful just for convenience' sake, 'kay?
And yes, VF3 had the ugliest cast this side of an Arkansas family reunion.
And yes, VF3 had the ugliest cast this side of an Arkansas family reunion.
This argument is not valid, sorry. KOF 99 had K' yet it bombed.
Tekken 3 sold because there was a huge hype for it. Not only its two predecessors were excellent games but also were part of PSX name. Then Tekken 3 appeared with new things (extreme countering, increased side-stepping, awesome graphics and new characters) and people bought it.
SF is another matter. SF1 bombed because it lacked something. Then appeared SF2 which was a culmination of all the previous 2D fighters since Ye-Air Kung Fu and it was a killer. 6 button + specials + hyper cool characters + awesome gameplay.
Perhaps characters are a factor but not what makes a fighter sell.
Jack Random
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DOA:U's online mode is a nice step in the right direction too. For me, fighting games were all about beating out the competition at the local arcade, buuuut since there is no local arcade, and beating on the same friends day after day can be a bit boring... Im totally digging DOA:U's online play since it has almost an arcade "feel" to it... I just wish it was a deeper fighter then DOA that made this move 
VF4 Evo + DOA:U's Online Component > *
VF4 Evo + DOA:U's Online Component > *
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Ourumov, I'm just saying that it was character based fighting games that were really finding mainstream success.
For each of these popular franchises you have poster boys. Ryu Hoshi, Jin Kazuma, Sub-Zero, Scorpion, Liu Kang.
I wasn't aware that any SNK fighters were mainstream.
For each of these popular franchises you have poster boys. Ryu Hoshi, Jin Kazuma, Sub-Zero, Scorpion, Liu Kang.
I wasn't aware that any SNK fighters were mainstream.
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