I just rewatched LotR- Return of the King for the first time since I saw it in the cinema a couple of years ago, and I noticed that Gandalf the white isn't doing much wizardry in this movie. In fact, when he is fighting the armies, he is running around with a sword just everybody else. I thought he was a powerful wizard, yet he is doing jackshit with his powers. Did he lose his powers or something, or was he just limited?
Lord of the rings: Return of the King - as I missing something?
- Thread starter darkwings
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SCULLIBUNDO
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An 'm'.
Ninja Scooter
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a pillow and some nyquil.
SCULLIBUNDO
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Wes said:
I meant in the sense that the title should have read 'Lordm of the Rings:..'
Combichristoffersen
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Zophar said:
This is the correct answer. Magic in LotR != magic in Harry Potter.
genjiZERO said:
Gandalf was a maiar (the closest equivalent in Christianity would probably be an angel), so he was a rather powerful being. In Return of the King he was most likely the most powerful of the istari, as he had died and been 'reborn', so he would easily be one of the five most powerful beings in Middle-earth, probably at the same level as Saruman, but definitely below Sauron (provided that Sauron had the ring in his possession).
British Monsoon
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On an unrelated note, how is it that every visual effect in the LotR trilogy looks stunning, with the exception of the Dead men of Dunharrow? They don't look too bad when Aragorn journeys on the Path of the Dead to recruit them, but during the charge at the Battle of Pelennor Fields they look pretty damn awful.
I'll let an even bigger LotR nerd than myself explain it in more detail, but Gandalf was a Maiar (basically angels). They were sent to Middle Earth tro assist people against Sauron. But they were given the form of old dudes to limit their power and were told simply to be guides, and not simply kick ass like they could.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gandalf
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gandalf
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Weenerz said:
But if you remove Narya, how does that affect his stats?
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darkwings said:
I love the first and third equally much (I fucking cried at the 'you bow to no one' scene, at Sam carryiing Frodo on his back up Mount Doom and at Sam and Frodo reminiscing of the Shire at 'the end of all things'), but Two Towers definitely suffers from being the 'inbetween' movie.
Pai Pai Master
Banned
Why the fuck can't they be awesome and release the extended cut of these movies on Blu-ray yet. 
British Monsoon
Member
Pai Pai Master said:Why the fuck can't they be awesome and release the extended cut of these movies on Blu-ray yet.
They're coming next year, although iirc like the DVD's they're releasing the Theatrical cuts on blu-ray first, then presumably the Director's Cut sometime after, probably this time next year.
Freshmaker
I am Korean.
Jackson didn't think that wizards should ever do magic.darkwings said:
darkwings said:
In Middle-Earth the power hierarchy goes:
Eru Iluvatar (God) > Valar > Maiar > Elves > Men
Both the Valar and Maiar were created in the beginning of existence by Eru, but the Valar are greater and the Maiar arf the lesser. In LotR the only possible Valar is Tom Bombidil (there's a really good essay on it on the internet), and Gandolf, Saruman, Sauron, and the Balrog are all Maiar. Elrond (and his children) and Aragorn are both direct descendants of a Maiar, which is the only known mating of a Maiar with one of the Children of Iluvatar. Specifically about Galdolf, as a Maiar, he has power, but not to the same level as the Valar. The Valar themselves, cannot (more accurately not supposed to) create life, but they can manipulate the world to their desire. In my knowledge of Tolkien's universe I can't think of any examples of a Maia "manipulating" creation in the same way a Vala would.
ItAintEasyBeinCheesy
it's 4th of July in my asshole
Fantasy books do this a lot, super powerful magicians who do fuck all.............. i mean what kinda war would it be if the dude just rocks up incinerates all enemy forces and then fucks off.
Bootaaay said:
Watched the HD marathon on TNT a few weekends ago and the effects have not held up well at all. Gollum still looks pretty OK but a lot of the matte composite shots and the CGI armies (using that 'Massive' tech') look pretty bad. After seeing AVATAR, the effects in LOTR look very dated, but this is true for most movies. I would say that the Star Wars prequel trilogy had more 'convincing' effects overall.
I always thought he limited himself in the LoTR movies/books because it was always man's fight and destiny to overcome the darkness. He was just "assistance" and that old wise guy who knew everyone and everything and whodispensed wisdom and rallied allies.
Sure he could probably rain down fireballs on the fodder orcs, but it was always humanity's fight.
Sure he could probably rain down fireballs on the fodder orcs, but it was always humanity's fight.
elrechazado
Banned
this. he was there to inspire men and elves and dwarves, not use his maiar powers like sauron, so he limited himself greatly.legend166 said:
JB1981 said:
the battlefield looks pretty bad CGI-vise, but most effects in the movie holds up decently. Of course the tech today blows LotR out of the water, but for its time it was mighty impressive.
btw wasn't the trilogy shot in the same timeframe, meaning the movies were made in the end of 90s, beginning of the 2000s?
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genjiZERO said:
The only one I could think of would be how Sauron supposedly created the orcs, as in that neither he nor his master, Melkor, had the power to create, only to twist and mock (or 'manipulate', if you will), so he took a bunch of elves (or humans, depending on what you want to go by, Tolkien seemingly never decided on the exact origin of the orcs), fucked them up real good, and voila, there be orcs (but that poses the problem; if the orcs were simply twisted elves, wouldn't their children be elves rather than orcs, or did Sauron alter their DNA too?).
elrechazado
Banned
Morgoth/melkor created orcs, not sauron, and they were corrupted elves specifically, not men. What do you mean he never decided on the origin? Silmarillion ftw.Combichristoffersen said:
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elrechazao said:
Silmarillion states that the orcs were corrupted elves, but Tolkien later on decided that the orcs originated from men that just were sort of degenerated humans or something (it's in one of the History of ME books IIRC, I'll google it). Thanks for the clarification BTW, you're absolutely right that the orcs were, going by the Silmarillion, created by Morgoth, not Sauron
EDIT: The thing with orcs coming from humans is mentioned here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Orc_(Middle-earth)#Sentient_beasts
EDIT 2: It's also mentioned briefly here, at question #14.
EDIT 3: And here
Fixed for wrong link
ItAintEasyBeinCheesy
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capslock said:
Read Midnight Tides but not the others, not much magic in that besides towards the end, sure they had the battle but it was all sorta counter this counter that.
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