LOST 06.17/18/18.5: "The End" (Everything Else Was Just Progress)

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itxaka said:
What? No!

I don't think it requires more. more like what? Anger? Frustration?

Meh, Jack should have turned into the smoke monster. In fact, that is what happened, I'm pretty sure. They aired the wrong ending.
Again, both Jacob and Smokey had specific abilities. Whatever happened with Smokey, Jacob thinks he caused it, but also may have been what happens when you throw someone lik MiB down there.

Even if he didn't cause it, the Island doesn't automatically change people into it anyway just by dropping them in the hole. No one, including Smokey thought this was the case.
 
phisheep said:
Seems to me that it started (as in diverged from the original 'real' world) at different times for different people.

Claire - on the plane (still pregnant)
Daniel - when he was about 12 (stuck with music, no physics?)
Sawyer - when he made the choice between being a vigilante or in law enforcement (but probably from the same cause)
Eloise - mid-1970's before she shot Daniel
Hurley, before the asylum

Jack is really weird though - because of Juliet and the son but still gets the scars from the island too

Struggling with my memory here, though.
It was made up in their subconsciousness. Jack needed to prove to himself he could be a good father before he could move on and he also needed to repay Locke the favour that Locke did for Jack. So its possible that he started experiencing sideways in the season 6 premiere and the memories he had of his son and being with Juliet were just made up.
 
Fjolle said:
Anyone got any idea why X started with people in the plane? Wouldn't it make more sense if they went there when they died? (maybe they did? ;) ).

This is the point when their connection with each other started, thus the began the most important time of their life. The X tmeline may have been around longer (I'm waiting for an interview or two on that), but the point in time that mattered was the plane and how everyone (Except Desmond but he caused the events) was on it.
 
Scullibundo said:
Watched it tonight. Loved it.

Fucking delivered on a series finale. Can't believe it.

Yeah, I'm still surprised by it. I figured no show would have a harder time delivering in it's final epiosode than Lost, but not only did that, but put out the best episode of the show. Certainly the most emotional one.
 
Patryn said:
Time didn't matter there. I'd be willing to bet that Hurley outlived Alex. Remember Jacob? As Christian said, some people died before Jack, some died after.

I think hurley and Ben were mortal and therefore died after a normal amount of time.

Jack gave Hurley that drink just to mimic what Jacob did - he didn't do any incantations, the island had lost its mojo at that point anyway and Jack/Locke were both mortal. So I think Jack just did it to give Hurley some confidence, some reassurance.


Solo said:
Every. Single. Character. Got an incredible end to their story.

Hmm. not sure. Some of them still had pretty tragic 'real' lives - eg Sun and Jin still drowned in the sub, thinking they'd failed, they'd never see their daughter again.

sure, they're ignorant in the alt-timeline and then get 'woken' and realise there is an afterlife, but if there is an afterlife then you'd still have wanted a decent pre-life too right?
 
mrklaw said:
Hmm. not sure. Some of them still had pretty tragic 'real' lives - eg Sun and Jin still drowned in the sub, thinking they'd failed, they'd never see their daughter again.

sure, they're ignorant in the alt-timeline and then get 'woken' and realise there is an afterlife, but if there is an afterlife then you'd still have wanted a decent pre-life too right?

"Incredible" doesn't have to equal happy.


And they got a happy ending...everyone did! Sorta.
 
mrklaw said:
I think hurley and Ben were mortal and therefore died after a normal amount of time.

Jack gave Hurley that drink just to mimic what Jacob did - he didn't do any incantations, the island had lost its mojo at that point anyway and Jack/Locke were both mortal. So I think Jack just did it to give Hurley some confidence, some reassurance.

?

The reference from Christian as to people dieing a long time after Jack was a pretty glaring reference to Hurleys long life. I also believe a Bad Robot writer was doing the rounds and commented that Hurley died centuries later. Anyway, its open to interpretation like everything in lost ~
 
j-wood said:
I loved the finale. But there is only one thing I really wish they would have explored more.

Jacob's Ashes.

Here is why it bugs me.

In the earlier seasons, we see a cabin, with what we presume to be now the MIB inside, surrounded by ash. When the Losties found it, the ash was clearly still in a complete circle, as they always made sure to step over it.

Then in Season 5, Illana comes and goes to the cabin, and sees the ash is broken, and alludes to the fact that smokey is now out and roaming.

But smokey has been out and roaming since season 1.
Has this been answered?
 
Fjolle said:
X timeline starts with the characters in the same position (age pregnancies etc) as when the plane crashed. If it is supposed to be a purgatory the logical reason for this would be that they died ;)

I was under the impression that purgatory has always been. Otherwise, people who had died before jack (and after) would have been there longer/less. Also, we don't know how long Hurley and Ben had been alive for after Jack dies. Sounds like a long time.

My theory is that maybe you get reincarnated and live 'life' in a loop, until you 'let go', like this lot did.

Unless I missed something?
 
Sorry if this has been posted before, I went back 20 pages and didn't see it. A supposed writer on the show explains the story. I got this unsourced from reddit. Who knows who this guy is, obviously, but I think it's a good summary of the story:

-----------------------------

"Good stuff on here! I can finally throw in my two cents! I've had to bite my tongue for far too long. Also, hopefully I can answer some of John's questions about Dharma and the "pointless breadcrumbs" that really, weren't so pointless ...

First ... The Island:

It was real. Everything that happened on the island that we saw throughout the 6 seasons was real. Forget the final image of the plane crash, it was put in purposely to f*&k with people's heads and show how far the show had come. They really crashed. They really survived. They really discovered Dharma and the Others. The Island keeps the balance of good and evil in the world. It always has and always will perform that role. And the Island will always need a "Protector". Jacob wasn't the first, Hurley won't be the last. However, Jacob had to deal with a malevolent force (MIB) that his mother, nor Hurley had to deal with. He created the devil and had to find a way to kill him -- even though the rules prevented him from actually doing so.

Thus began Jacob's plan to bring candidates to the Island to do the one thing he couldn't do. Kill the MIB. He had a huge list of candidates that spanned generations. Yet everytime he brought people there, the MIB corrupted them and caused them to kill one another. That was until Richard came along and helped Jacob understand that if he didn't take a more active role, then his plan would never work.

Enter Dharma -- which I'm not sure why John is having such a hard time grasping. Dharma, like the countless scores of people that were brought to the island before, were brought there by Jacob as part of his plan to kill the MIB. However, the MIB was aware of this plan and interferred by "corrupting" Ben. Making Ben believe he was doing the work of Jacob when in reality he was doing the work of the MIB. This carried over into all of Ben's "off-island" activities. He was the leader. He spoke for Jacob as far as they were concerned. So the "Others" killed Dharma and later were actively trying to kill Jack, Kate, Sawyer, Hurley and all the candidates because that's what the MIB wanted. And what he couldn't do for himself.

Dharma was originally brought in to be good. But was turned bad by MIB's corruption and eventually destroyed by his pawn Ben. Now, was Dharma only brought there to help Jack and the other Canditates on their overall quest to kill Smokey? Or did Jacob have another list of Canidates from the Dharma group that we were never aware of? That's a question that is purposley not answered because whatever answer the writers came up with would be worse than the one you come up with for yourself. Still ... Dharma's purpose is not "pointless" or even vague. Hell, it's pretty blantent.

Still, despite his grand plan, Jacob wanted to give his "candidates" (our Lostaways) the one thing he, nor his brother, were ever afforded: free will. Hence him bringing a host of "candidates" through the decades and letting them "choose" which one would actually do the job in the end. Maybe he knew Jack would be the one to kill Flocke and that Hurley would be the protector in the end. Maybe he didn't. But that was always the key question of the show: Fate vs Free-will. Science vs Faith. Personally I think Jacob knew from the beginning what was going to happen and that everyone played a part over 6 seasons in helping Jack get to the point where he needed to be to kill Smokey and make Hurley the protector -- I know that's how a lot of the writers viewed it. But again, they won't answer that (nor should they) because that ruins the fun.

In the end, Jack got to do what he always wanted to do from the very first episode of the show: Save his fellow Lostaways. He got Kate and Sawyer off the island and he gave Hurley the purpose in life he'd always been missing. And, in Sideways world (which we'll get to next) he in fact saved everyone by helping them all move on ...

Now...

Sideways World:

Sideways world is where it gets really cool in terms of theology and metaphysical discussion (for me at least -- because I love history/religion theories and loved all the talks in the writer's room about it). Basically what the show is proposing is that we're all linked to certain people during our lives. Call them soulmates (though it's not exactly the best word). But these people we're linked to are with us duing "the most important moments of our lives" as Christian said. These are the people we move through the universe with from lifetime to lifetime. It's loosely based in Hinduisim with large doses of western religion thrown into the mix.

The conceit that the writers created, basing it off these religious philosophies, was that as a group, the Lostaways subconsciously created this "sideways" world where they exist in purgatory until they are "awakened" and find one another. Once they all find one another, they can then move on and move forward. In essence, this is the show's concept of the afterlife. According to the show, everyone creates their own "Sideways" purgatory with their "soulmates" throughout their lives and exist there until they all move on together. That's a beautiful notion. Even if you aren't religious or even spirtual, the idea that we live AND die together is deeply profound and moving.

It's a really cool and spirtual concept that fits the whole tone and subtext the show has had from the beginning. These people were SUPPOSED to be together on that plane. They were supposed to live through these events -- not JUST because of Jacob. But because that's what the universe or God (depending on how religious you wish to get) wanted to happen. The show was always about science vs faith -- and it ultimately came down on the side of faith. It answered THE core question of the series. The one question that has been at the root of every island mystery, every character backstory, every plot twist. That, by itself, is quite an accomplishment."...

..."How much you want to extrapolate from that is up to you as the viewer. Think about season 1 when we first found the Hatch. Everyone thought that's THE answer! Whatever is down there is the answer! Then, as we discovered it was just one station of many. One link in a very long chain that kept revealing more, and more of a larger mosiac.

But the writer's took it even further this season by contrasting this Sideways "purgatory" with the Island itself. Remember when Michael appeared to Hurley, he said he was not allowed to leave the Island. Just like the MIB. He wasn't allowed into this sideways world and thus, was not afforded the opportunity to move on. Why? Because he had proven himself to be unworthy with his actions on the Island. He failed the test. The others, passed. They made it into Sideways world when they died -- some before Jack, some years later. In Hurley's case, maybe centuries later. They exist in this sideways world until they are "awakened" and they can only move on TOGETHER because they are linked. They are destined to be together for eternity. That was their destiny.

They were NOT linked to Anna Lucia, Daniel, Roussou, Alex, Miles, Lupidis, (and all the rest who weren't in the chuch -- basically everyone who wasn't in season 1). Yet those people exist in Sideways world. Why? Well again, here's where they leave it up to you to decide. The way I like to think about it, is that those people who were left behind in Sideways world have to find their own soulmates before they can wake up. It's possible that those links aren't people from the island but from their other life (Anna's parnter, the guy she shot --- Roussou's husband, etc etc).

A lot of people have been talking about Ben and why he didn't go into the Church. And if you think of Sideways world in this way, then it gives you the answer to that very question. Ben can't move on yet because he hasn't connected with the people he needs to. It's going to be his job to awaken Roussou, Alex, Anna Lucia (maybe), Ethan, Goodspeed, his father and the rest. He has to attone for his sins more than he did by being Hurley's number two. He has to do what Hurley and Desmond did for our Lostaways with his own people. He has to help them connect. And he can only move on when all the links in his chain are ready to. Same can be said for Faraday, Charlotte, Whidmore, Hawkins etc. It's really a neat, and cool concept. At least to me.

But, from a more "behind the scenes" note: the reason Ben's not in the church, and the reason no one is in the church but for Season 1 people is because they wrote the ending to the show after writing the pilot. And never changed it. The writers always said (and many didn't believe them) that they knew their ending from the very first episode. I applaud them for that. It's pretty fantastic. Originally Ben was supposed to have a 3 episode arc and be done. But he became a big part of the show. They could have easily changed their ending and put him in the church -- but instead they problem solved it. Gave him a BRILLIANT moment with Locke outside the church ... and then that was it. I loved that. For those that wonder -- the original ending started the moment Jack walked into the church and touches the casket to Jack closing his eyes as the other plane flies away. That was always JJ's ending. And they kept it.

For me the ending of this show means a lot. Not only because I worked on it, but because as a writer it inspired me in a way the medium had never done before. I've been inspired to write by great films. Maybe too many to count. And there have been amazing TV shows that I've loved (X-Files, 24, Sopranos, countless 1/2 hour shows). But none did what LOST did for me. None showed me that you could take huge risks (writing a show about faith for network TV) and stick to your creative guns and STILL please the audience. I learned a lot from the show as a writer. I learned even more from being around the incredible writers, producers, PAs, interns and everyone else who slaved on the show for 6 years.

In the end, for me, LOST was a touchstone show that dealt with faith, the afterlife, and all these big, spirtual questions that most shows don't touch. And to me, they never once waivered from their core story -- even with all the sci-fi elements they mixed in. To walk that long and daunting of a creative tightrope and survive is simply astounding."

--------------------

Slacker typing again. One dubious point here: There are at least three people (Desmond, Penny, and Libby) not featured in season 1 in the church at the end, so I'm not sure about that "planned from the beginning" thing. Good read though.
 
If thats' true, some of that doesn't make sense.

How could Miles not be connected to the OG Losties? He lived on the Island for years!

I'm not buying some of that, specifically about who gets in the church and who doesn't. I'll just take what was presented, that some of the Xers weren't ready.

Edit: Though I do like the concept of Ben helping the rest of the people move on. Didn't even occur to me.
 
Just finished it. Fuck it. :(( Only read until p. 61.

At first I didn't know how to feel about the ending. I was too taken aback to take all of it in and process it, but now that I've had time too, I do actually like the ending, the concept of it at least (that all the LOSTies who were in the afterlife timeline had to REMEMBER and put to hear all of the important/meaningful/happy things in their life in order to "move on" and leave their earthly existence, which so happened to be being WITH their fellow LOSTies), but no so much its execution.

For me, it lacked real substance to back up the actual conclusion -- that all these characters were DEAD in "real" life, which included very much alive people at the end of the island timeline like Kate, Richard, Miles, Sawyer, Claire, etc etc.

I'm not sure if people would find it agreeable but I think quick cuts to grown-up Aaron/Ji Yeon looking over their respective parent's tombstone (or something to that effect) just to SHOW rather than tell that Claire or Kate were actually dead be it 10 or 50 years after they were able to leave the island for good. Hell they could have shown grown-up baby Charlie looking at a picture of Penny/Des implying they were dead.

For me there was good opportunity to somehow relate to the audience the real-ness of the situation -- that all of these (good -- as opposed to presumably hell-bound Ana Lucia, Eko, Michael; those who are "not ready yet" as per Des' observation) LOSTies ARE dead and that the most important part of their lives was being in the island together.

That said, I think the real epilogue would have to be the real-world conclusion of the LOSTies lives, being alive, biologically. But...I guess I could do without that. I won't get it anyway. BUT DAMN. The ride has been awesome. SO AWESOME. SO EPIC. SO WONDERFUL. Never has a show strummed by heartstrings this much. I actually care about all these characters -- the TRUE strength of the series, fact.
 
goodness. I still can't get that final Locke and Ben conversation out of my ehead.

Locke: What did I have Ben?
Ben: You were special John, and I was not.

Locke has to be my favourite character ever to hit tv/movies. He just IS, and Ben was the best antagonist anyone could ever have come up with for Locke.

Season 6 Jack was amazing too though. He felt like an incarnation of Locke throughout the last few episodes.
 
YoungHav said:
Has this been answered?

Well, that only means that Smokey could entered the cabin. Presumably the cabin is where the leader and Jacob met, but since it was no longer a safe place, Jacob went to the temple, and Smokey used the cabin to act as Jacob and manipulate Locke and Ben.

Smokey was always free, remember that the was a place where the leaders could summon him?.

gdt5016 said:
The Cabin, as of now, is more or less a clusterfuck. There's no point debating it.

There's a lot of clusterfucks in the series, regarding the mithology and all, but the cabin is not one of them...
 
My problem with this quote from the writer


In the end, for me, LOST was a touchstone show that dealt with faith, the afterlife, and all these big, spirtual questions that most shows don't touch.

is that the show didn't deal with the afterlife for 5 seasons. Sure, there were ghosts but that's not the same thing. Heck even the ghosts (whispers) were presented as "the others" at first.

Heck it didn't really deal with the afterlife in season 6, either except for that final scene in the church.

The show dealt mostly in sci fi and some character drama but I don't think it's right to say it dealt with big, spiritual questions for it's run. Maybe he was writing a different show than what I was watching.
 
mrklaw said:
Hmm. not sure. Some of them still had pretty tragic 'real' lives - eg Sun and Jin still drowned in the sub, thinking they'd failed, they'd never see their daughter again.

sure, they're ignorant in the alt-timeline and then get 'woken' and realise there is an afterlife, but if there is an afterlife then you'd still have wanted a decent pre-life too right?

In my theory The flashsideways was not a purgatory, it was next plane of existence. It was a legitimate life they lead there. Jack's son is real, Hurley is lucky, Sawyer a cop, and so on. There was character development going on there. It's more or less how rebirth works in Buddhism. The same soul, but it's not consistent, each life is new and you don't remember the past one until you reach the final plane, which in Lost's case was the X world.
 
Slacker said:
Alleged LOST writer explanation:

Sideways world is where it gets really cool in terms of theology and metaphysical discussion (for me at least -- because I love history/religion theories and loved all the talks in the writer's room about it). Basically what the show is proposing is that we're all linked to certain people during our lives. Call them soulmates (though it's not exactly the best word). But these people we're linked to are with us duing "the most important moments of our lives" as Christian said. These are the people we move through the universe with from lifetime to lifetime. It's loosely based in Hinduisim with large doses of western religion thrown into the mix.

The conceit that the writers created, basing it off these religious philosophies, was that as a group, the Lostaways subconsciously created this "sideways" world where they exist in purgatory until they are "awakened" and find one another. Once they all find one another, they can then move on and move forward. In essence, this is the show's concept of the afterlife. According to the show, everyone creates their own "Sideways" purgatory with their "soulmates" throughout their lives and exist there until they all move on together. That's a beautiful notion. Even if you aren't religious or even spirtual, the idea that we live AND die together is deeply profound and moving.

It's a really cool and spirtual concept that fits the whole tone and subtext the show has had from the beginning. These people were SUPPOSED to be together on that plane. They were supposed to live through these events -- not JUST because of Jacob. But because that's what the universe or God (depending on how religious you wish to get) wanted to happen. The show was always about science vs faith -- and it ultimately came down on the side of faith. It answered THE core question of the series. The one question that has been at the root of every island mystery, every character backstory, every plot twist. That, by itself, is quite an accomplishment."...

...

They were NOT linked to Anna Lucia, Daniel, Roussou, Alex, Miles, Lupidis, (and all the rest who weren't in the chuch -- basically everyone who wasn't in season 1). Yet those people exist in Sideways world. Why? Well again, here's where they leave it up to you to decide. The way I like to think about it, is that those people who were left behind in Sideways world have to find their own soulmates before they can wake up. It's possible that those links aren't people from the island but from their other life (Anna's parnter, the guy she shot --- Roussou's husband, etc etc).

A lot of people have been talking about Ben and why he didn't go into the Church. And if you think of Sideways world in this way, then it gives you the answer to that very question. Ben can't move on yet because he hasn't connected with the people he needs to. It's going to be his job to awaken Roussou, Alex, Anna Lucia (maybe), Ethan, Goodspeed, his father and the rest. He has to attone for his sins more than he did by being Hurley's number two. He has to do what Hurley and Desmond did for our Lostaways with his own people. He has to help them connect. And he can only move on when all the links in his chain are ready to. Same can be said for Faraday, Charlotte, Whidmore, Hawkins etc. It's really a neat, and cool concept. At least to me.
WELL, fuck it. There's the only explanation I need about the afterlife scenes. Makes perfect sense.
 
gdt5016 said:
The Cabin, as of now, is more or less a clusterfuck. There's no point debating it.

The cabin/smokey being in it or not before the ash was broken
Christian Shepard appearing off island to a few characters after his death

these two seem to be the two things that seem to contradict the "rules" of the island.

Walt
Dharma Sharks
Dharma food drops
Sickness
some characters being resurrected while others didnt/some people healing while others didnt
who shot at the raft when they were time jumping

are the things I would like more information on

numbers
time travel
can't leave island/island moves/hard to find island

these are things that I'm pretty sure they wanted to leave intentionally vague and never planned on getting into any detail on.
 
VistraNorrez said:
In my theory The flashsideways was not a purgatory, it was next plane of existence. It was a legitimate life they lead there. Jack's son is real, Hurley is lucky, Sawyer a cop, and so on. There was character development going on there. It's more or less how rebirth works in Buddhism. The same soul, but it's not consistent, each life is new and you don't remember the past one until you reach the final plane, which in Lost's case was the X world.

You know, this is completely realistic and plausible within the context of the story that was told. I don't know if *this* version of events is what is intended, but much of it is really left up to interpretation.
 
Relaxed Muscle said:
You know the island could move through time and space, the cabin was the same, but only around the island.

mindfuck!

It's just a metaphor for the island. Not so mindfucky. OR IS IT?

Only you can decide.
 
LCfiner said:
My problem with this quote from the writer




is that the show didn't deal with the afterlife for 5 seasons. Sure, there were ghosts but that's not the same thing. Heck even the ghosts (whispers) were presented as "the others" at first.

Heck it didn't really deal with the afterlife in season 6, either except for that final scene in the church.

The show dealt mostly in sci fi and some character drama but I don't think it's right to say it dealt with big, spiritual questions for it's run. Maybe he was writing a different show than what I was watching.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m8O_pd_sUhU&feature=related

Have you even been watching this show? Because you know nothing about it.
 
So.. I've come down from my rage a bit.

I still think sideways world was a giant worthless Red Herring that should have been completely ignored. Seems like a way to force a happy ending on us.. but moreover up until the point that they woke up nothing they did mattered. I think they just wanted to fuck with our heads for a few minutes by making us think that setting off jughead worked... and then make us think that Desmond was doing something to connect the two timelines (smokey talking about sinking the island, desmond talking about going to the x timeline after pulling the cork)... and then they managed to get a cast reunion out of the deal too.

I still want a lot of questions answered and think there are a few of the mysterious elements that are plot breaking.

I still like the show overall. I'm going to liken it to dark tower. Loved the journey, hated where they took it.
 
Sir Hamish said:
Not read the whole thread so apologies if this theory has cropped up before, but I think I know what the smoke monster is. I'm guessing its a manifestation of the island's power meant for protecting the island.


We've already had some strong hints that the smoke monster has been around before the MIB falls into the cave. Some of the Egyptian stuff we have seen indicate they worshiped the smoke monster in some way. Also, in Across the Sea there are several indications that the mother is in fact the smoke monster.

1. She kills a whole load of people
2. She fills up a massive hole in the ground with dirt in a short space of time.
3. She warns Jacob not to go into the light because it would be 'a fate worse than death'
4. She thanks the MIB when he kills her, implying she was suffering said 'fate worse than death'

I think this indicates pretty strongly that whoever becomes 'protector' of the island is supposed to enter the light and become the smoke monster and gain its abilities in order to better protect the island. It is essentially a weapon left behind by the whoever created the island, so its appearance and all the weird noises it makes are a result of intelligent (technologically advanced?) design rather than anything random. The ritual that Jacob goes through is only one part of the puzzle. Unfortunately his mother warns him away from going into the light, probably because she herself regrets doing so. The skeletons in the cave also indicate others have entered the light and are probably the remains of previous protectors who shed their physical bodies in order to become the smoke monster and protect the island.

However in this instance Jacob chucks the MIB down the cave instead of going down himself which results in the MIB gaining the island's 'weapon' instead of Jacob. Fortunately Jacob still has his powers over the island and the ability to set rules, so he puts some rules in place that prevent the MIB from ever being able to leave the island and unleash it's power upon the human race, which he would probably do since he has already told Jacob that he finds humans to be 'bad'. Jacob also acknowledges that the MIB may one day find a loophole in the rules and be able to leave the island, so he brings people to the island in the hope that he can change the MIB's opinion of the human race and if, one day, god forbid, the MIB does escape, he will be less inclined to decimate us. The MIB, in turn, tries to prove to Jacob that all human beings are bad, in the hope that one day Jacob will agree and stop giving a shit about humans and let the MIB leave the island to do whatever he wants.

I find it interesting that all the conflict in the show boils down to the upbringing of Jacob and the MIB. If the islands protector was a regular person with some life experience and hadn't been raised in seclusion with weird views of the rest of the species none of this conflict would have happened. Which is why I believe Hurley will make a good protector :)

Hey, you know...I quite like that.

Two days later and I'm still thinking about the Lost ending. When The Sopranos ended, I didn't care much after the fact, or when Rome did, or Six Feet Under, or any other show I cared to watch. Guess that's L O S T for you.
 
DoctorWho said:
You know, this is completely realistic and plausible within the context of the story that was told. I don't know if *this* version of events is what is intended, but much of it is really left up to interpretation.

Well that would be pretty shitty ending considering Jack's son would be left alone to fend for himself since his mom and dad moved on.

I still contend that there wasn't anything deep or meaningful about x-world. It was a way to fuck with the viewers heads for half a season and then give us a happy ending that I still feel is tacked on and unnecessary.
 
I think it's pretty funny that as soon as Solo finds the one episode to surpass all others, and totally elevate his love for the show, and make it his favorite show ever...he is forced to wear an avatar that says "Lost sucks" :lol .
 
YoungHav said:
Has this been answered?
Everyone is assuming the seal was brken recently. The seal around the cain could have been broken years ago even prior to the crash and possibly as long as Ben was leader of the Others. It was an old base of Jacob's, but it became Smokey's. The mystery is not that big of a deal unless I'm forgetting some stuff (which is not unusual so re-educate me).
 
thekad said:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m8O_pd_sUhU&feature=related

Have you even been watching this show? Because you know nothing about it.


gtfo with that scene. i know the show and you've been a condescending twat to anyone who had problems with the finale.

yes, I understand that Locke had issues with Faith. he needed to believe in the island. and Jack was a man of science. and the confrontation of those two viewpoints was a big part of the show.

And, yes, I also understand that Locke needed to die to help convince Jack to give in to faith at the end and take up his role as protector (even if it was only a temp job)

that is not the same as saying the show dealt with "big, spiritual" questions or the afterlife

Most characters on the show didn't have the same issues with faith and believing in the island as Locke had.

in addition, the idea of spirituality and the afterlife is not the same kind of faith that Locke was talking about with the island. he needed to believe in the island to give his present life meaning - since he had nothing else.

that's not the same as having faith in the afterlife (or in a God). something that was never mentioned until the very final season of the show. heck, the very final scene.
 
StoOgE said:
The cabin/smokey being in it or not before the ash was broken
Christian Shepard appearing off island to a few characters after his death

these two seem to be the two things that seem to contradict the "rules" of the island.

Walt
He had abilities, watch the deleted scene on youtube where's he in room 23.
Dharma Sharks Dharma had a shark and they experimented on it in the room where Jack was being held.
Dharma food drops If you don't enter the Island with the right coordinates, you can move through time. Dharma fooddrop is probably that.
Sickness Who knows.
some characters being resurrected while others didnt/some people healing while others didnt
who shot at the raft when they were time jumping Probably Illana or other Ajira survivors. Who cares anyway, that was only like a minute in one episode.

are the things I would like more information on

numbers
time travel
can't leave island/island moves/hard to find island

these are things that I'm pretty sure they wanted to leave intentionally vague and never planned on getting into any detail on.


Tried to give some answers
 
Silent Death said:
Well, as Widmore`s machine proved Desmond was the only one able to survive the pool of electromagnetism/magic light of the island, so he had to do it


Yeah but apparently he was incorrect as Jack jumped down and put the stone back in place

There was a blast of energy when Desmond pulled the cork. THAT is what only he could survive. There wasn't anything similar when Jack was putting it back in. The cork was just hot because of the lava/steam.
 
JGS said:
Everyone is assuming the seal was brken recently. The seal around the cain could have been broken years ago even prior to the crash and possibly as long as Ben was leader of the Others. It was an old base of Jacob's, but it became Smokey's. The mystery is not that big of a deal unless I'm forgetting some stuff (which is not unusual so re-educate me).

No. when they first saw the cabin (Locke and Ben) they were very careful to step over the ash circle.

Yet, it seems clear that it was smokey giving orders to Locke from day 1.
 
Solo said:
Yes, you are right. I posted the general gist of things many pages back, but Ill do it again:

- EVERYTHING happened with the exception of the X-timeline; the events of the Pilot up to Jack's death in The End were 100% real
- *
- Jack died on the island, Kate and Co flew away and led long, happy lives, Hurley and Ben ruled the island for many years
- Everyone dies eventually. When the Losties did, they ended up in the X-timeline, which was really a form of purgatory
- They all needed to find eachother again and remember their past lives together before they could move on
- in the end, they all did just that (Ben didnt move on because he wanted to make things right with Alex and Rousseau first)

* some people believe that detonating Jughead created the X-timeline/purgatory, but I dont subscribe to that. Jughead did nothing but allow the Swan station/hatch to be built and shoot the Losties back to 2007.

Awesome! Thanks for the synopsis. I just emailed this to the people who didn't agree with me. I'm sure they still won't get it though.

But maybe I should be a bit more open minded. Maybe it was left up to the viewer's interpretations. Kind of like with the Sopranos finale. Did Tony die or didn't he? You decide...
 
LCfiner said:
gtfo with that scene. i know the show and you've been a condescending twat to anyone who had problems with the finale.

yes, I understand that Locke had issues with Faith. he needed to believe in the island. and Jack was a man of science. and the confrontation of those two viewpoints was a big part of the show.

And, yes, I also understand that Locke needed to die to help convince Jack to give in to faith at the end and take up his role as protector (even if it was only a temp job)

that is not the same as saying the show dealt with "big, spiritual" questions or the afterlife

Most characters on the show didn't have the same issues with faith and believing in the island as Locke had.

in addition, the idea of spirituality and the afterlife is not the same kind of faith that Locke was talking about with the island. he needed to believe in the island to give his present life meaning - since he had nothing else.

that's not the same as having faith in the afterlife (or in a God). something that was never mentioned until the very final season of the show. heck, the very final scene.

So questions of faith, fate, and meaning are not spiritual nature. Nice to know.

And faith in God had nothing to with the last scene. Did you even watch the finale?
 
StoOgE said:
Well that would be pretty shitty ending considering Jack's son would be left alone to fend for himself since his mom and dad moved on.

I still contend that there wasn't anything deep or meaningful about x-world. It was a way to fuck with the viewers heads for half a season and then give us a happy ending that I still feel is tacked on and unnecessary.

It was an epilogue, just there to complete the characters' journeys. It's not vital to the main plot, which ends with Jack dying, the plane leaving, and Hurley becoming the new protector, so if it really bugs you, it's not too hard to ignore.
 
MMaRsu said:
Tried to give some answers

Time jumping on the food drop makes some sense and has been my working theory for a while.. but they could have done a better job explaining it.. like "Oh shit, this food says it expires in 1971.. but it's still good" just not that cheesy. We still wouldn't have known what was going on because time travel/island time hadn't been fully explained yet.

Dharma Sharks - mostly joking, but I would have liked to know why they were working with the sharks. In general, I would have liked a better idea of what dharma was up to in the different stations.

Walt - I get that he had powers.. but it seems clear he was initially going to be more important but the show writers didn't factor in puberty. Hopefully the deleted scene will explain what Walt was.

The raft being shot at is just something that would have been really easy to work into any one of their trips back and forth on the rafts this season. Don't know why they didn't just do it. Maybe it got cut somewhere.

I also never liked the whisper explenation or Aaron not really being important because the guy was a false profit. Seemed like a copout for no other reason than to distract us from Walt being the one they wanted.
 
Season 2,3, and 4 were the best for me. I liked the storytelling and drama when the Others were the main antagonists. Plus the flashbacks into the past in previous seasons were stronger than the sideflashes of this last season.
 
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