LOST 06.17/18/18.5: "The End" (Everything Else Was Just Progress)
- Thread starter BenjaminBirdie
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Honestly, now I think no one was trapped inside the cabin, and the ashes were just meant to keep MIB outside (not inside). He found a way to break the circle like he did with Bram and got inside to mess with Locke and Ben's heads. That's it.TheLastFantasy said:
It would be the simplest explanation, Occam's razor etc.
Drealmcc0y
Banned
I was just thinking Claire attacked Kate and was on top of her with a knife on her throat and Flocke saves Kate and in the finale Flocke is on top of Jack with a knife to his throat and Kate saves Jack.
I bet Flocke regrets saving her now
I bet Flocke regrets saving her now
Drealmcc0y
Banned
Plywood said:
Im not saying that was his last thought, just that the two scenes were very similar. Obviously it was done on purpse for when you rewatch
teruterubozu
Member
Igoritza said:should i spice the thread up a bit ?
what do you think about the actors - Mark Pellegrino and Titus Welliver ?
in my opinion - two of the best supporting actors in all of the US tv shows.
it made my day when i saw them - MiB, and Jacob - War and Lucifer.
MIB dude was very good. Jacob, not so much. I thought he was pretty terrible in the last campfire scene.
brandonh83
Banned
njean777 said:
I read all four books so that I could "legitimately" argue about how terrible it is, but it was far worse than I could have ever imagined. It's the biggest load of fucking crap ever shit out by a human being.
teruterubozu said:
I thought that was his best scene by far, apart from when he finds MIB after the cave shits him out.
JoshuaJSlone
Member
I find it a non-satisfying answer. Atomic bomb radiation that's massive enough to cause ALL pregnancies to end in death without other noticeable side effects. People who have the ability to temporarily leave the island and thus work around the problem, but... don't. People who call in fertility doctors to find a way to... make wombs radiation-resistant, because leaving the island for a few months is such a hassle?Drealmcc0y said:
Yeah. When a friend and I started watching season 1 and talkign about the genres others had given to the show, my feeling was that so many called it "sci-fi" because to say "fantasy" brings up images of knights and hobbits. Though definitely more sci-fi proper came in later.Dead said:
Discs can be fit quite economically when product designers aren't treating it like a dick-measuring contest and trying to waste my shelf space. I got the Farscape series set, and each season comes in a standard size DVD case holding something like 6 discs. No disc layering, but two extra "pages" with discs on both sides.mattiewheels said:
Igoritza said:should i spice the thread up a bit ?
what do you think about the actors - Mark Pellegrino and Titus Welliver ?
in my opinion - two of the best supporting actors in all of the US tv shows.
it made my day when i saw them - MiB, and Jacob - War and Lucifer.
Both were good, but were mostly wasted in the show meh.
deadhorse32
Bad Art
I just watched the finale.
AMAZING SHOW.
Music was superb.
Thanks.
AMAZING SHOW.
Music was superb.
Thanks.
VistraNorrez
Member
Raist said:I'm not referring to the ending (if they would have done that, woulda been horrible seriously) but the way they have very similar constructions.
The first book is not so much about the world, there's just a couple of weird things here and there. It's mostly about Roland's character, and we're introduced with the man in black. Then shit happens. For several books, you get to know about the world, the way it's fucked up, "magic" and all that stuff. Loads of mysteries, and in a way you expect that when Roland reaches his goal, you'll get at least some answers. Then for the last couple of books it completely ditches everything, focuses mainly on characters especially Roland, and you get no answers. Felt very similar to Lost in this way.
What answers? What mysteries? You know the point of the existence of the Dark Tower pretty early on. The Dark Tower never set up any mysteries to keep the reader going. It was all about Roland reaching the tower. You find out all you really needed to know about the history of the world. I can't think of any major loose ends.
You know that well before Roland's time a technologically advanced world existed that forgot all about magic. This civilization brought about it's own destruction which led the world back to a more primitive existence with magic taking a prominent role, yet plenty of their tech lasted. You also learn how it connects to our world: parallel universes.
And there is tons of weird shit in the first book.
A boy from New York dying and coming to mid-world, a man brought back to life, an advanced world destroyed with quite a few relics around, some link to our world (Hey Jude), mutants, Walter's tarot cards.
Not to mention you say it starts out being about characters and ends up being about characters.
And you make it seem like books 2-4 aren't completely about character either. Drawing introduces two brand new main characters and spends most of the time developing them. Wastelands is about bringing a character back. 4 is nearly all about Roland's past. If anything 5-7 are more about plot, than the the first 4 books.
It's not really similar to Lost in structure at all. It shares some themes and plots, but it is as much mystery driven as LOTR.
VistraNorrez said:
That's my main problem with it. I found the world extremely compelling but was disappointed that it wasn't more developped and we didn't get more details about what happened. Same with Lost's island. So I would say that, completely unlike LOTR, both Lost and the DT introduce you to a fascinating world, but at some point completely give up on any lore and explanations, at that is exactly why I'm disappointed.
To be fair, LOTR alone doesn't exactly explain everything either, but at least you had the opportunity to read the rest of Tolkien's work and learn more about his universe. LOTR was just a small but very important part of a whole story.
And there was the totally awkward stuff such as
monsters, parallel universes, that apparently extremely important flower in a junkyard, etc ,etc.
So maybe I took the wrong approach with Lost (and DT) as it turns out their respective universes was not the important bit, but at the same time I don't think you can blame it on readers/viewers only when the authors put so much focus on the world, and eventually drop the ball. That's why I was quite disappointed by the last season, because I wanted to learn more on the "background" and I didn't really give a shit about the character's afterlife.
MadraptorMan
Member
There's always Tom Bombadil. In fact...The LOST island is kind of like one big Tom Bombadil.
VistraNorrez
Member
Raist said:
Seriously, I don't know what to say. You sound like you're willing to give one series a pass while another not. What didn't King explain well in the book? He developed his world almost exactly like Tolkien. He admits that straight up. Both are journeys to a destination, both to save the world. Along the way you learn more and more about the worlds. Not everything's origin is explained because a story has to be told. Pacing is important, there just can't be diversions because you want to know the origin of something that has little to do with progressing the story.
Give me an explanation for everything in LOTR, without looking up supplemental books. How were Trolls created? Tom Bombadil? Ents? The Watcher in the Water? Where exactly do the ring's powers come from?
The answer for all of these, is because thats just the way it is.
Name the major loose threads in the Dark Tower. I mean how do you explain some things? Magic explicitly exists in The Dark Tower from book one.
The monsters come from other universes, or are native creatures. The parallel universes exist the same way they do in our reality. The thinnies allow for crossover because of the weak fabric of time and space. The rose is the manifestation of the Dark Tower in that universe. It needs to exist for that universe to exist.
What more needs to be explained?
And what crap about LOTR. No one would give a shit about Tolkien's world if LOTR wasn't a great story. Most people who read LOTR don't read the supplemental material. That stuff should have no baring on the enjoyment of a self contained story.
SpeedingUptoStop
will totally Facebook friend you! *giggle* *LOL*
Solo is very much in his final stages of denial.
The thread won't let you leave, Solo. You haven't completely double the 2nd highest post count yet.
You can deny it all you want, but this is who you are, Solo.
The thread won't let you leave, Solo. You haven't completely double the 2nd highest post count yet.
You can deny it all you want, but this is who you are, Solo.
MadraptorMan
Member
Raist said:Actually, Desmond is Tom Bombadil, in a way
edit: oh snap.
Haha. Well, if you think about it, there are a handful of Bombadils in Lost. I guess that's the problem some people are having, one too many enigmas.
TheGreatDave
Banned
peterb0y said:
S5 and S6 are both structured in such a way I think a rewatch improves them.
SpeedingUptoStop
will totally Facebook friend you! *giggle* *LOL*
After they realize they couldn't get cancelled with the S4 season, they just said "fuck it". Especially this season, where the reveal that makes the whole season better (or for some I guess, worse) is at the end.:lolTheGreatDave said:
the character of the tom bombadil in LOTR, and any knowledge about him are vague. Tolkien himself stated that it should be left to mystery.
as i gathered from reading tolkiens books - he is a MoFo, and most possibly Eru Ilúvatar himself.
i have a really big theory on that, but it's not for this thread, just wanted to point out that no character in lost should be compared.
as i gathered from reading tolkiens books - he is a MoFo, and most possibly Eru Ilúvatar himself.
i have a really big theory on that, but it's not for this thread, just wanted to point out that no character in lost should be compared.
VistraNorrez said:
You said it yourself, it leaves tons of questions. You don't get any answers about the rules, how stuff works, nothing, it's completely left on the side. All these elements played an extremely important part in the story, as they all are means that have been used by the characters to fulfill their goal.
And you're comparing that to a few races in LOTR, or why the major rings had powers (while this is flat out explained in the first few minutes of the movie, and quite well in the books). Tom Bombadil is the only character that remains a complete mystery, although Elrond did give an answer after all. It's not like no one ever talked about him. Still, it was like one chapter in a 1200 pages book, it's not like the whole plot was built around him.
Regarding the remaining of Tolkien's work, yes you didn't need it to enjoy LOTR and yes, most people probably never read anything past the main trilogy, but that doesn't mean that the world hasn't been well documented and developed by its author, giving you an opportunity to learn more. That didn't happen with DT, and probably won't with Lost.
I just don't like the trend of purposedly building an intriguing world and forget about it afterwards when tons of major questions are left. King certainly wanted to do something like LOTR, calling the Dark Tower his Magnum Opus or whatever, but to me he used way too many shortcuts and dead-end answers, such as "it's parallel universes, problem solved". We know almost nothing about the main world, what happened to it, how some managed to build "doors" between worlds, etc.
So the whole universe and its rules, while being a central part of the plot, is left to a "background" status that feels completely under-developed. I won't have any more precise questions in mind, granted that I read the series 8 years ago, but I do clearly remember being left with so many questions and the feeling that it was a completely missed opportunity.
TheGreatDave
Banned
I don't envy anyone single at 62.
SpeedingUptoStop
will totally Facebook friend you! *giggle* *LOL*
My exact sentiments.Snuggler said:
SpeedingUptoStop
will totally Facebook friend you! *giggle* *LOL*
I really hate articles that paint Lost fans as being mislead into a finale filled with disappointment. I won't link to any articles because I don't want to give them the hits they're going for, but seriously man, broad generalizations to justify shaky conclusions are such a crock of shit.
SpeedingUptoStop
will totally Facebook friend you! *giggle* *LOL*
Naveen AndrewsRadogol said:
is
COUGAR HUNTER
Kitschkraft
Member
SpeedingUptoStop said:
Like I said some pages back, seems like the media has decided that the "storyline" is going to be that this was a hot show that faded....
Fucked up in a way, because I feel as though this could throw a wrench into Emmy noms/wins (Which I usually don't care about, but would like to see Lost win something for once).
Drealmcc0y
Banned
Just read this theory on the monster:
So its definitely true that the Man in Black is the smoke monster, yet him actually becoming this entity is questionable. Jacob throws him down into the light of the island, and out pops the smoke .what? There are a few theories about this, although I like mine the best, and that sounds extremely arrogant. Pretty much, Jacob tosses his brother down into this cave of light, and hes exposed to this extreme energy and when this happens it rips his soul from his body. The man in black is no happy individual though. In fact, hes very much a man of constant sorrow. Through the years, hes suffered so much frustration and anger, and we saw how that morphed into hatred and heartbreak near the end. I think that he was so full of all these dark emotions, that was all that was left of him. Jacob said a sorrowful goodbye to his brother, and he was right. The man who used to be his brother is dead and gone, and all that remains is a physical embodiment of pain, suffering, and darkness. Evil Incarnate.
So its definitely true that the Man in Black is the smoke monster, yet him actually becoming this entity is questionable. Jacob throws him down into the light of the island, and out pops the smoke .what? There are a few theories about this, although I like mine the best, and that sounds extremely arrogant. Pretty much, Jacob tosses his brother down into this cave of light, and hes exposed to this extreme energy and when this happens it rips his soul from his body. The man in black is no happy individual though. In fact, hes very much a man of constant sorrow. Through the years, hes suffered so much frustration and anger, and we saw how that morphed into hatred and heartbreak near the end. I think that he was so full of all these dark emotions, that was all that was left of him. Jacob said a sorrowful goodbye to his brother, and he was right. The man who used to be his brother is dead and gone, and all that remains is a physical embodiment of pain, suffering, and darkness. Evil Incarnate.
brandonh83
Banned
Not sure I'd call that an original theory because it's what I've thought about it all along. 
But yeah I think that's spot-on.
But yeah I think that's spot-on.
Liara T'Soni said:
You mean besides its win for Best Drama Series and its two wins for Supporting Actor?
I don't see it beating Mad Men in Drama Series this year, but Emerson/O'Quinn are frontrunners in Supporting Actor, and it's possible that Matthew Fox sneaks in depending on how much the final season love comes through. But it's not like the show has been absent at the Emmys or anything: it just hasn't been winning, which isn't really a travesty.
Kitschkraft
Member
Memles said:
I'm talking collective awards, not the individual ones, which they haven't won since like season 2.
And the past seasons don't seem to have been as divisive as this one.
BenjaminBirdie
Banned
Also, Season 5 on rewatch is so much more tragic. Because let's be honest, no one here fully processed Locke being dead until the finale was completely over because, who knows, he could have taken over Smokey's consciousness or some shit, whatever.
But now that Dead Is Dead, him running around trying to protect everyone (even Widmore as "one of his people") and then trying to get everyone back to the island is so fucking tragic.
We miss you, Pep Pep.
But now that Dead Is Dead, him running around trying to protect everyone (even Widmore as "one of his people") and then trying to get everyone back to the island is so fucking tragic.
We miss you, Pep Pep.
SpeedingUptoStop
will totally Facebook friend you! *giggle* *LOL*
I don't care much for awards for the show. This TV season has had so many outstanding performances, it's really a flip of a coin as to who really is better. Same goes for individual episodes. It's all a toss up. Nominations would be nice, but the fields are so crowded with deserving winners, it doesn't even matter all that much to me.
Kitschkraft
Member
SpeedingUptoStop said:
If anything, I sorta just wanna see the whole cast show up for something for one last time. A big emmy nomination would do that....:lol
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