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[Infinite Stars]

It's just bad design after bad design. I have low expections for this set based on what we have seen so far.

Low Expectations is where I'm at right now. I'm hoping that it improves though and that this is just awkward stumbling as Wizards is still adapting to the two block model.

I mean, for those with better knowledge of Wizard's Scheduling, has the idea of having no gaps between Blocks crossed their mind? Something similar to the TV, where there's an "on Standard" period and an off season. Like, Set A1 in October, Set A2 in January, Set B1 when MM2017 came up, and set B2 in May/June?

I don't know, it just feels like the two block structure is causing issues with promotions.

I agree that we've been bad at evaluating things at times. We missed Siege Rhino, many of us were down on EDM Liliana (I know I was), but so far, man, I am not really digging what we're seeing in this set.

...

So, best ever expansion incoming?

I hope it's better then it seems so far. The last thing I want is a bad Magic Set especially when it's a new plane.

 

[Transhuman]

Limited fodder. Decent against embalm decks I guess. Not knowing enough of the set I'd say this card will sometimes squeak as your 23rd but will most likely end up in your sideboard.

With cycling, best ratio might be 24:16 in Amonkhet limited

 

[Giant Panda]

One big factor with the Theros gods that makes them so popular is their applicability to EDH. Most of the Theros gods have nice build-around and themed abilities that play well in the format. Both Amonkhet gods seem a lot less interesting for EDH because they only provide generic grindy card advantage.

 

[traveler]

The other missing piece is the static ability. With Theros gods, you have the indestructible beatstick, activated ability, and static ability. Here, you're only getting the activated ability and the jump through hoops beatstick for the same cost as the Theros gods, the same P/T as the Theros gods, and HARDER drawbacks. They just seem weaker on every level.. Thassa was at least invulnerable to creature removal, like path or something, and gave you scry 1 each turn if you didn't have her "turned on" and had better things to do with your mana. There's a legitimate chance you'll get zero benefit from casting these gods for several turns, which is not where casting a 3-4 mana legendary creature should put you. The red and blue god's requirements actively work against their undercosted nature too- encouraging you to invest more mana before you can even swing with them, making them essentially overcosted beatsticks.

Re: the set as a whole, I actually like a lot of the limited fodder design. I think exert is a great mechanic, Glorybringer is a great card, and embalm is about the safest approach to creature flashback we've seen yet. Cycling is great too. I'm cautiously optimistic on the flavor of the set given the lack of gatewatch in the cards and emphasis on world building, but I don't like the fact that the entire plane revolves around a Bolas scheme the Gatewatch will likely attempt to stop. I want places to exist entirely apart from the Gatewatch conflicts and lore that's not directly tied up in something they're doing/opposing. These one city and surrounding environ planes that focus entirely on the gatewatch plots feel awfully small, compared to older planes.

It's also worth keeping in mind they're spoiling a more balanced set of cards. Typically, we'd get splashy rare after splashy rare with the final day dumping all of the draft fodder on us. Here, we're seeing just as much, if not more, draft fodder up front, so naturally it's not going to be exciting.

The Gods are the only real disappointments thus far, (invocation frames aside) and there's only been 2 revealed. Jury's still firmly out on the set for me, and there's a good chance I end up in the positive camp.

 

[divisionbyzorro]

Limited fodder. Decent against embalm decks I guess. Not knowing enough of the set I'd say this card will sometimes squeak as your 23rd but will most likely end up in your sideboard.

This card is good. The effect is super powerful, but it risks rotting in your hand while you can't cast it. Cycling solves that problem.

 

["God's Beard!"]

Reminds me of one of my favorite draft cards from Theros:

 

[Megalosaro]

Oh hey guys.

Downloaded Magic the Gathering Duels on Steam. Should I invest in it?

 

[Ashodin]

Like I can see it. The Limited design of the set seems interesting as fuck but goddamn do they know fuck all about what to put into Standard. It really feels like Stoddard has a fucking tunnel vision into Limited and Standard is an afterthought, which makes cards come out on the 1-10 scale of either 9-10 of OP broken af (Smug Cop, Heart of Kiran, Aetherworks Marvel), or 1-2 scale of "why would you print this" with Kefnet, Temmet, the fucking crocodile having a better time than Hazoret, etc.

The set is all over the place and I think it's because of the stupid Standard changes fucking everything over yet AGAIN.

WATCH Hour of Devastation be the better set just like Oath was to Battle.

 

[Santiako]

Oh hey guys.

Downloaded Magic the Gathering Duels on Steam. Should I invest in it?

You get plenty of free coins doing the single player and the daily quests.

 

[HK-47]

Can't tell you how fucking happy I'll be for there not to be any exodus mentions. I want Egyptian mythology references not abrahamic ones in my Egypt set. Now if we can just avoid slaves building pyramids we are good to go.

I wonder if we will get a "weighing of the heart" card and what that would entail on this plane, especially given the Anubis expy is red and not black or white. Not having the God of mummification be white seems weird.

 

[OnPoint]

Can't tell you how fucking happy I'll be for there not to be any exodus mentions. I want Egyptian mythology references not abrahamic ones in my Egypt set. Now if we can just avoid slaves building pyramids we are good to go.

I wonder if we will get a "weighing of the heart" card and what that would entail on this plane, especially given the Anubis expy is red and not black or white. Not having the God of mummification be white seems weird.

You mean like

 

[Yeef]

Lol. For one more mana you can overload Cyclonic Rift.

Cyclonic Rift is a rare. Blue actually get this effect (bounce multiple things) at common, typically. Usually it's at uncommon.

 

[Santiako]

We are still in day 2 out of 9 for spoilers, so we've barely scratched the surface of the set.

 

[HK-47]

We are still in day 2 out of 9 for spoilers, so we've barely scratched the surface of the set.

Get with the program. The set is shit

 

[Adaren]

Oh hey guys.

Downloaded Magic the Gathering Duels on Steam. Should I invest in it?

Before you drop any money, play all of the tutorials and campaigns first. Magic Duels is pretty darn generous with free cards and gold, and it's entirely possible to maintain a full collection while playing casually (though you obviously have a bit more work to do if you're a new player!). Additionally, Magic Duels never gives you "excess" cards, which means every pack will give you new cards to use, and you're guaranteed to finish a set in a fixed number of packs. So if you do decide to spend money on packs, there's no chance of it being wasted due to bad pack RNG!

Magic Duels is a great way to play Magic on a budget. Hope you enjoy it!

 

[Ashodin]

This looks fun

 

[hermit7]

I agree the plane of Amonkhet may not survive the Hour of Devastation, an Exodus event is likely on hand, WotC might try to meet audience expectations based on The Prince of Egypt etc. But to be pedantic, there has been no archaeological evidence for Exodus so far. Current academic consensus is that the Israelites were natives of the Levant, and the story of Exodus is based either on distant memories of the Hyksos expulson, or Hebrews expanding from their high lands to fill the power vacuum left by the Late Bronze Age collapse of civilizations.

(Actually I'm just posting this to get more people to watch the video in the second link.)

I get all that. I agree that while there isn't any evidence for the exodus it does still lie in the cultural conscience of ancient Egypt.

That was mearly my point that it fits into the expectations of the players to an extent. Links are sweet I will have to read them more thoroughly tomorrow.

 

[Familienoberhauptvogel]

Wow not sure what to think abou this

 

[Santiako]

Wow not sure what to think abou this

The rares are mockups in English. If you see the spoiled ones in Portuguese and Italian they look the same as the uncommons.

http://mythicspoiler.com has them all side by side, you can see it easier.

 

[charlequin]

The problem I'm finding with this Amonket is that there is no interplay at all with all these mechanics.

Like, literally the sets people like best are like this (like Innistrad, where DFCs, Morbid, Flashback, and Curses had basically no overlap -- or like any gold set) while the sets with tightly interwoven mechanics built around singular themes often disappoint if the execution of the theme as a whole doesn't pay off.

Like, this kind of feedback is pretty weird to me given that the set has multiple mechanics with broad design space that have big potential in both casual and competitive environments. Every individual Aftermath or Embalm card has its own unique shot at being interesting or powerful without worrying at all about any other card with the mechanic. Cycling is great on individual cards even before you even think about the cycling-matters decks. All that increases the deckbuilding options because people can build around individually powerful cards and combos instead of having to chase powerful linear mechanics.

This card is good. The effect is super powerful, but it risks rotting in your hand while you can't cast it. Cycling solves that problem.

Yes, this is literally why Cycling exists.

 

[Familienoberhauptvogel]

The rares are mockups in English. If you see the spoiled ones in Portuguese and Italian they look the same as the uncommons.

Aw you're right, easy to check even.

 

[Imperfected]

I should note that when I say I don't like the Gods, I'm not saying I don't think they're playable. I'm evaluating them based on whether or not I look at them and say, in order:

1. I want to build a deck around this card/these cards/this mechanic.
2. I want to include these cards in my existing decks.
3. I want a copy of this card just in case I decide to do something with it down the line.

I built an EDH Enchantments deck around the Theros Gods. I tried to find spots for the Titans in most of my appropriately-colored decks. I picked up copies of most of the "Political Big Shots" cycle in Kaladesh in the expectation that I'll probably want to slide them into an appropriately-themed deck, someday, even if I'm not playing with them right now.

The gods they've shown so far? Meh, I don't think I even want a copy in the vault.

That, to me, is why they're (so far) a failure: I definitely don't want to build a deck around either (and the fact the two shown so far have inherent anti-synergy means I definitely don't want to try and build around both), I don't want to run them even in my existing Gods deck, much less my other decks, and I don't even really want to grab cheap singles for 'just in case'. As marque cards of the set, they just aren't doing their job.

I'm sure they'll be fine as Limited bombs and maybe even get some nice play in Standard, but that won't make them any less a failure in terms of getting me to actually open a pack of Amonkhet.

 

[bigkrev]

Something I just realized....
Aren't gold and silver boarders cards banned from tournament play? Aren't these Invocations gold boardered (on the top and bottom it's most obvious)? Are Invocations actually legal without modifying the rule?

 

[Familienoberhauptvogel]

Something I just realized....
Aren't gold and silver boarders cards banned from tournament play? Aren't these Invocations gold boardered (on the top and bottom it's most obvious)? Are Invocations actually legal without modifying the rule?

they have the black border beneath the typeline

 

[Violet_0]

the blue god is more interesting than the red one at least. The 7 cards in hand requirement is a lot to ask for, though

 

[Tunoku]

the blue god is more interesting than the red one at least. The 7 cards in hand requirement is a lot to ask for, though

No big deal, we'll just get a Sphinx's Revelation reprint.

Spoiler

I wish

 

[Violet_0]

No big deal, we'll just get a Sphinx's Revelation reprint.

Spoiler

I wish

hypothetically, if there was a viable control-ish deck with, let's say, lots of counter spells, card draw and cycling, I could see the blue god being really good - if anguished unmaking didn't exist and was in the colors of mardu vehicles

 

[Tunoku]

I always forget Anguish Unmaking exists until I get owned by it.

 

[Rafy]

New spoiler

Watchers of the Dead (2)
Artifact Creature - Cat
Exile Watchers of the Dead: Each Opponent chooses two cards in his or her Graveyard and exiles the rest.
They are tasked with protecting the entrance to the embalming chambers
2/2

 

[divisionbyzorro]

What a weird card.

 

[Son1x]

Well that seems like a very shitty grave hate card. I don't like it at all.

 

[Tunoku]

Fair card. A bear that goes into every deck and it doesn't completely hose the opponent while still being a very relevant ability against GY interactions.

 

[Familienoberhauptvogel]

It only hoses delirium and nothing else.

 

[Son1x]

It only hoses delirium and nothing else.

But does it always? The same creature along with an aftermath card enables delirium.

Does almost nothing about Scrounger too. Well, I guess it trades once.

 

[Tunoku]

So everything that is not literally Tormod's Crypt or Relic is terrible? I feel like I'm the only one who isn't disappointed with this thing.

 

[GoutPatrol]

So everything that is not literally Tormod's Crypt or Relic is terrible? .

Yes.

 

[Yeef]

I think it's fine. Hoses Delirium and slows down things like Scrounger, Embalm and Aftermath.

 

[Familienoberhauptvogel]

So everything that is not literally Tormod's Crypt or Relic is terrible? I feel like I'm the only one who isn't disappointed with this thing.

It doesn't really do anything in the current meta. Delirium has been a fallback plan for GB decks more than a primary strategy ever since Emrakul got banned.
The absolute best case you can make for it right now is popping it with an Ishkanah or Traverse on the stack. It only hoses a deck that's not a boogeyman of the format.

It's the inverse of what I wanted. Which is basically this

This can obviously change depending on how Amonkhet impacts standard.

 

[ultron87]

The set symbol always being half black regardless of rarity annoys me slightly. Makes the commons and uncommons a little harder to distinguish.

 

[Son1x]

So everything that is not literally Tormod's Crypt or Relic is terrible? I feel like I'm the only one who isn't disappointed with this thing.

Well theres also Rest in Peace and Nihil Spellbomb, but yes, grave hate card that doesn't target or remove whole graveyards is pretty bad. Especially one where the opponent can choose the cards to keep. It doesn't even help with GDD or Gearhulks, they'll just leave the 2 best targets in.

edit: You probably meant colorless cards, but still, this seems pretty weak.

 

[DrArchon]

Yeah, that cat is just here as a safety valve against embalm in limited. There's no way it's powerful enough to stop GY shenanigans in standard. It's an awesome limited card though, don't get me wrong. I love bears with upside, esp. when you can put them in whatever deck you want and I've got a feeling that embalm is going to be the deck to beat in limited.

 

[Son1x]

Yeah, that cat is just here as a safety valve against embalm in limited. There's no way it's powerful enough to stop GY shenanigans in standard. It's an awesome limited card though, don't get me wrong. I love bears with upside, esp. when you can put them in whatever deck you want and I've got a feeling that embalm is going to be the deck to beat in limited.

But it doesn't really stop embalm in limited unless your opponent has 3 or more embalm cards lying around in graveyard.

 

[DrArchon]

But it doesn't really stop embalm in limited unless your opponent has 3 or more embalm cards lying around in graveyard.

If someone gets lucky in sealed I can see them having a couple of embalm cards in the yard, not to mention any aftermath cards they might have. I'm expecting a fair number of common embalm dudes with pretty high embalm costs meant to be mana sinks later on in the game, so I'm imagining a point for embalm where they've had a bunch of their guys killed but don't have the mana to bring them back, so if this cat comes out at the right time it'll do wonders.

Could be wrong though.

 

[OnPoint]

I think it's interesting that it exiles itself to use the ability.

 

[A_Dang]

I think it's interesting that it exiles itself to use the ability.

That is the most interesting thing to me as well, that it has no cost especially. Nyx Weaver is similar but costs mana to do.

 

[Simply Sarah]

That is the most interesting thing to me as well, that it has no cost especially. Nyx Weaver is similar but costs mana to do.

Not having a cost besides exile is in line with other one shot mass graveyard exile effects. Tormod's Crypt is entirely free and Relic (which also exiles itself) is only 2 if you cast and activate in one turn and that even includes a card draw.

 

[SigmasonicX]

I'm more surprised that Standard sets are getting colorless 2-mana 2/2s below rare now.

 

[OnPoint]

I'm more surprised that Standard sets are getting colorless 2-mana 2/2s below rare now.

Grisly Bears ain't shit

 

[A_Dang]

Not having a cost besides exile is in line with other one shot mass graveyard exile effects.

Gotcha, for what ever reason my mind blanked on the obvious Crypt.

 

[Lucario]

So everything that is not literally Tormod's Crypt or Relic is terrible? I feel like I'm the only one who isn't disappointed with this thing.

Eh. I'm definitely not demanding high-impact graveyard hate, but that card does next to nothing. Two cards can leave your opponent with Delirium, or let them keep multiple scrapheap scroungers/prized amalgams. I don't really see the point.

IMO Scavenging Ooze, Relic, and Rest In Peace are all too oppressive for graveyard-based strategies. Withered Wretch, Cremate, Pillar of Flame, or Scrabbling Claws would be very welcome.