Frankie Williamson
Member
Wasn't that exactly what was usual for cycling cards, if it was basically a reprint, it always costs one more?
-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
Magic: the Gathering |OT11| Amonkhet - Have you ever had decks with a Pharaoh?
- Thread starter SigmasonicX
- Start date
- Status
Wasn't that exactly what was usual for cycling cards, if it was basically a reprint, it always costs one more?
Based on Hazoret and Kefnet, I'm predicting the other gods to go something like this:
Green God
Indestructible, Trample
Control other creatures with combined power over X to attack/block
Pay mana: Target creature gains +X/+X
White God
Indestructible, Vigilance
Control over X number of creatures to attack/block
Pay mana: put a token into play
Black God
Indestructible, Deathtouch
Have X less life than your opponent
Pay mana: Draw a card, lose life
Green God
Indestructible, Trample
Control other creatures with combined power over X to attack/block
Pay mana: Target creature gains +X/+X
White God
Indestructible, Vigilance
Control over X number of creatures to attack/block
Pay mana: put a token into play
Black God
Indestructible, Deathtouch
Have X less life than your opponent
Pay mana: Draw a card, lose life
"God's Beard!"
Member
Another upgrade for Rainbow Bogles:
I was already playing 4 Unstable Mutation, and Consuming Fervor can be played through Blood Moon.
I was already playing 4 Unstable Mutation, and Consuming Fervor can be played through Blood Moon.
Familienoberhauptvogel
Banned
I doubt they'd staple greed onto another black god.
Cheap cycler + Oblivion Ring for 4. Not too bad.
When are you EVER going to cycle this card
Terrible design
When you're getting beaten up by manlands.
"God's Beard!"
Member
when your turn 4 spell to kill their 1-drop just doesn't cut it
"God's Beard!"
Member
I definitely don't think it's hitting constructed unless there's a specific goal in mind and there's just no other options. Or there's a real control deck and this is basically just something to do on turn one like how Quicken used to be. Definitely worse than Quicken, though.
When you don't want to cast it?
charlequin
Banned
Now that an actual development person is talking about the set we have the upfront acknowledgement that their theory about graveyard hate was a mistake:
The gimmick is that all the cards are instant -> sorcery though, so you can either play just one half as a combat trick, or get the full effect if you play both halves in the same main phase.
I think the difference between the Invocations (where like thirty people came up with better versions immediately) and these (where literally nobody came up with a better version) established that if you aren't using DFCs this is definitely the best way to execute this mechanic.
In the development article they mentioned that cycling tends to be a mechanic only established players like. Having cards that read well on their own, with cycling just tacked on, is a good way to reduce that problem, and it's a good lenticular design (since newbs will just play the cards worse by never cycling them) so it seems like the right way to go.
On turn one? It costs just {W} for a reason.
Unfortunately I'm detecting a common thread in a lot of reactions to this set so far (not your post here) that approximately breaks down to "this card is hard to evaluate... that clearly means it sucks." To my mind "this runs afoul of a specific overpowered strategy in standard" is a pretty good critique of a newly revealed card while "this is conditional to [x] thing so it's definitely not going to be played" is a pretty bad one.
The gimmick is that all the cards are instant -> sorcery though, so you can either play just one half as a combat trick, or get the full effect if you play both halves in the same main phase.
I think the difference between the Invocations (where like thirty people came up with better versions immediately) and these (where literally nobody came up with a better version) established that if you aren't using DFCs this is definitely the best way to execute this mechanic.
In the development article they mentioned that cycling tends to be a mechanic only established players like. Having cards that read well on their own, with cycling just tacked on, is a good way to reduce that problem, and it's a good lenticular design (since newbs will just play the cards worse by never cycling them) so it seems like the right way to go.
On turn one? It costs just {W} for a reason.
Unfortunately I'm detecting a common thread in a lot of reactions to this set so far (not your post here) that approximately breaks down to "this card is hard to evaluate... that clearly means it sucks." To my mind "this runs afoul of a specific overpowered strategy in standard" is a pretty good critique of a newly revealed card while "this is conditional to [x] thing so it's definitely not going to be played" is a pretty bad one.
Simply Sarah
Member
Now that an actual development person is talking about the set we have the upfront acknowledgement that their theory about graveyard hate was a mistake:
Well, the first step in fixing things is recognizing that there's a problem.
Yeah. I've generally stopped after "this card is hard to evaluate" since so many of them seem to fall very much into the "Well, this entirely depends on what the rest of the set and Standard look like" bin. The two gods so far especially feel a bit like they'll either have a pretty clear home or won't have a home at all.
GregLombardi
Member
I'd really, really prefer that they remove the infinite combo from standard than talk about what we already know: there aren't a lot of answers to certain decks in this format.
I'm not even a standard junkie, but as a magic player since '94, I hate hate hate hate hate hate infinite combos. Especially in a format where there is almost nothing you can easily do.
I'm not even a standard junkie, but as a magic player since '94, I hate hate hate hate hate hate infinite combos. Especially in a format where there is almost nothing you can easily do.
Imperfected
Member
Not digging these Gods at all, and as a result I'm pretty down on the entire set.
Pretty good chance I skip it entirely.
Pretty good chance I skip it entirely.
I want to see what else they reveal, but if it's not any better than AER/KLD I might end up just drafting it once or twice a week, just because I like collecting the cards. That would also allow me to save some money and finish the modern deck I started, as well as pick up the rest of the staples that were reprinted with MM3, in case I decide to have a few more decks in the future.
I'm reminded a bit of the response to Khans of Tarkir spoilers, in which everyone was down on the set for appearing underpowered. That ship righted itself quickly once we got to play with the cards.
I'm just finding them hard to evaluate right now before we get to see the rest of the set. I'm actually liking what we're seeing so far.
I hope that this is what's happening here. This is only the third MTG set I've experienced and I would be disappointed if it turns out to not be any good. I only need it to be a good limited set, I don't think I am asking for much.
divisionbyzorro
Member
Does the token deal commander damage?
SigmasonicX
Member
I don't think there will be anything to worry about in regards to Limited.
Temmet token.
Today's articles are very informative.
Developing Amonkhet - No anti graveyard techs, but there will be better artifact destruction. Commune with the Gods was too good, because they didn't want to make the main strategy self-milling. And more.
Five Trials - Finding green's flavor through Bolas, aftermath layout, and more.
Temmet token.
Today's articles are very informative.
Developing Amonkhet - No anti graveyard techs, but there will be better artifact destruction. Commune with the Gods was too good, because they didn't want to make the main strategy self-milling. And more.
Five Trials - Finding green's flavor through Bolas, aftermath layout, and more.
Familienoberhauptvogel
Banned
No. It has to be the actual physical card but then it does under any circumstances. Morphed, copying something, under control of an opponent, made a 0/1 treefolk, as a forest,...
I've certainly complained about this spoiler season (even just this morning!), and I get being disappointed by the "I don't get this card, it sucks" reactions I have, or other posters.
For me it is mostly an issue of nailing the "pageantry" of the spoiler season. Why spoil these new gods in isolation without highlighting how they fit in a deck? Why not remove the chance of casual players (such as myself) writing off the set because they don't understand where they will fit, or if they will fit. This is especially true in the current climate our fan base has of general frustration with the Standard environment.
You have 5 days in the work week, and 5 mono-colored gods. Why not use one day a week to not only spoil a new god, but also where it fits? Each of the gods should have enablers, across each rarity, why hold back on some of those splashier cards?
As I've mentioned before, I am not a big standard or limited guy, so I may be missing all the connections to make with these cards, but I certainly don't feel alone in my disappointment.
Please don't think that I felt specifically attacked by your comment, or that I am attacking you with a rebuttal, I just wanted to give some clarity as to why I am feeling like these cards are lackluster.
In this era of Magic where making things accessable to new players is focused on by removing "unfun" elements of the game and making effects work in specific ways to only be beneficial (ie, Banishing Light can't hurt you like Oblivion Ring does, Lords now only work on your creatures instead of globally), this seems like a terrible trick to play on a new player.
How many players are going to show up to the prerelease or their New Player store events (that Wizards is pushing with this set), and when they see this card in their opening hand, cycle it away on turn 1? Most new players first limited decks are filled with bad 1 drops and auras that don't do anything, and if you have taught someone to play recently, you will know that new players love to do something at any oppertunity. Cycling this card in limited is almost always going to be a bad decsion- the fact that it costs W to cycle instead of colorless means you can't cycle this card unless you have the colors to cast it!
It's a kind of skill-tester that is going to lead to new players feeling bad, which isn't something we have seen recently. It feels very out of place in 2017
This is a very good idea. I'd like to see WotC take a new approach to spoilers, rather than just dumping cards randomly into our laps. Hearthstone does a good job at the end of spoiler season, where Ben Brode and one of the community members sits down and streams gameplay with the new cardsit's a lot of fun.
Giant Panda
Member
What? I thought the consensus was that Khans looked super-powerful right from the get-go. I remember people commenting that it seemed like a big step up from Theros at the time.
Some GAF reactions to Khans spoilers:
Reading through old spoiler threads is a good way to gain some perspective on our ability to evaluate cards in a vacuum. We barely made a peep about Siege Rhino, and someone even said it wouldn't see play because of Reaper of the Wilds.
Giant Panda
Member
I was mostly only reading r/magictcg at that point, and I remember people being amazed at most of the 3-color rares, Bloodsoaked champion, Wingmate Roc, Sorin and Sarkhan both seemed liked.
At least give it trample.
Familienoberhauptvogel
Banned
So I narrowed my Mom and Dad Eggs list down to the 99 and am thoroughly enjoying goldfishing it.
I'd say turn 4 is very reasonable to get to go off and I've done it as early as turn 2 while goldfishing.
Kaladesh actually added a ton of great cards for this kind of deck. Treasure Keeper, Scrap Trawler, Paradox Engine, Implement of Combustion, Indomitable Creativity and Foundry Inspector.
Scrap Trawler is pretty busted but also a lot of fun. You get to chain eggs hoping to draw a way to restart the chain.
Pia and Kiran add a lot to the deck that might actually make them better than Slobad. The Thopters are good fodder to sac or equip with skull clamp , being able to shoot themselves to death can be quite relevant because of Paradox Engine and Blasting Station.
OT: I'm just not interested enough in the set yet to evaluate cards much, despite being one of the few active standard players.
There are few combinations of cards in it that just go "I have these two cards I win" and the deck is very prone to getting destroyed by any interaction but it can play Solitaire very well.
I'd say turn 4 is very reasonable to get to go off and I've done it as early as turn 2 while goldfishing.
Kaladesh actually added a ton of great cards for this kind of deck. Treasure Keeper, Scrap Trawler, Paradox Engine, Implement of Combustion, Indomitable Creativity and Foundry Inspector.
Scrap Trawler is pretty busted but also a lot of fun. You get to chain eggs hoping to draw a way to restart the chain.
Pia and Kiran add a lot to the deck that might actually make them better than Slobad. The Thopters are good fodder to sac or equip with skull clamp , being able to shoot themselves to death can be quite relevant because of Paradox Engine and Blasting Station.
OT: I'm just not interested enough in the set yet to evaluate cards much, despite being one of the few active standard players.
Infinite Stars
Member
This whole spoiler season also seems off because we're getting a lot more Commons/Uncommons right now vs other sets having a generally higher Mythic/Rare rate.
I mean, we don't even know a single walker in the set proper yet when those are usually put out near the start. I mean, you'd figure we have one right now but we don't.
I'd imagine Spoilers are being dampened by something they still need to reveal within the set or story.
I mean, we don't even know a single walker in the set proper yet when those are usually put out near the start. I mean, you'd figure we have one right now but we don't.
I'd imagine Spoilers are being dampened by something they still need to reveal within the set or story.
I'm actually digging the blue god quite a bit. He blocks and kills every major vehicle in the format and doesn't die to push/disintegration/Harnessed Lightning. If a draw-go control deck can exist in a format full of vehicles and 2 mana 3/4's and 4/4's then I think he'll be a part of it.
Angry Grimace
Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
I like the blue one enough, though it's slightly bland. I still don't like the red one. Want to see the other three before judging obviously.
I agree, but it's still annoying! I want all the juicy spoilers now!
As much as I complain, I know, and WotC knows, that I'll buy a bundle, and probably draft once or twice no matter what the set turns out like.
Patreon up for Team Draft Super League, as an in-between VSL season event. Will be 3v3 team drafts
https://www.patreon.com/TDSL
Teams so far:
Luis Scott-Vargas, Eric Froehlich, Ben Stark
Jon Finkel, Chris Pikula, Jaime Parke
Marshall Sutcliffe, Kenji Egashira, Paul Cheon
Paul Rietzl, David Williams, Matt Sperling
Owen Turtenwald, Reid Duke, William Jensen
Looking for $600
https://www.patreon.com/TDSL
Teams so far:
Luis Scott-Vargas, Eric Froehlich, Ben Stark
Jon Finkel, Chris Pikula, Jaime Parke
Marshall Sutcliffe, Kenji Egashira, Paul Cheon
Paul Rietzl, David Williams, Matt Sperling
Owen Turtenwald, Reid Duke, William Jensen
Looking for $600
I've said it before and I'll say it again, gaf usually isn't too good at evaluating a set lol.
- Status