Support NeoGAF

[Haunted]

I spent a while playing it last night, and I'm enjoying it, but I feel that Bioware went way too far in reigning everything in. There were many aspects of the original that I enjoyed which are now missing. It seems as if they didn't even attempt to fix the issues with the original, rather, they simply cut everything out. The game looks better, plays better, and runs smoother...but a lot of the details I loved about the original are MIA.

1) I feel as if the game world has been sliced up into compartments for convenience sake at the expense of atmosphere and scale. The citadel, once a massive and interesting environment, has been completely compartmentalized. I was expecting them to expand upon what they they had already created and deliver an even bigger environment. After talking to Anderson for the first time, I could not believe it when I found out that I could no longer leave that meeting room and explore the presidium. I also feel as if many of the new areas are smaller in scale in order to improve performance. Surely they could have delivered a larger environment while maintaining the fast travel stations for the less patient among us.

2) The Mako is another loss for me. Yes, it had issues, but it also had potential and could have been improved. Mixing it up between Mako and on-foot combat created a much greater sense of scale on the planets while delivering more variety in gameplay. I'm sure some associate it with the cookie cutter planets of the original, but I'm thinking more of its usage during actual story missions. Rather than attempting to improve it, they cut it completely. The ice station in the original game, for instance, felt significantly more remote as a result of the Mako sections beforehand.

3) Load screens galore. You know, the elevators WERE a bit too long, but let's not pretend we didn't know what was going on in the background. They were using them to hide loading screens and keep the player in the game world. What did they do here? They break the immersion and replaced those elevators with load screens. Talk about regressing. The loading screens aren't all that much shorter than the elevator rides and they pull you out of the world. The elevators definitely helped the world feel more cohesive despite their length. Prior to Mass 1, I was concerned about how they would present the environment due to the shortcomings of KOTOR (which had load screens around every corner). With the first game, it was clear that immersion was something they were striving for. With Mass 2, however, I feel as if they are returning to their old ways and that's disappointing.

4) The soundtrack is still very good, but I definitely feel as if it has become too epic for its own good. There's less "electronic sci-fi" and more "epic film" in there. Not exactly a huge deal, of course, but it's definitely something that I've noticed (both in the game and the actual OST).

Anyone else with similar feelings?

All very fair criticism and elements of the game I was dissapointed by as well. You nailed basically all my major complaints.

1) I had the same exact reaction after visiting Anderson. It severely restricts the scale they clearly were going for and supplied with their writing in the codex background info.

2) is THE biggest omission for me. I know it was criticised rightly in the first game, but just cutting it out of the main game... ridiculous, removing the exploration from this game feels like a major, major step back.

3) Agreed, and I'll add that the loading times on the Normandy are fucking atrocious, which is the single most important location where they should've worked to reduce them since you spend so much time on it. You're staring at loading screens so often going from one deck to the next that checking out whether your teammates had something new to say almost felt like a chore.

I say almost, because the writing, and ultimately, your squadmates are totally the saving grace, singlehandedly carrying the game for me. Bioware managed to pack a super-interesting and at parts downright unusual cast (compared to the usual sci-fi conventions ME adheres to at least) into this game and I'm loving it.

Spoiler

Ok, so there's the Borg and the Klingon and the rebellious hothead character but whatever. Mordin, Thane and Samara are fucking amazing and I applaud the development they've done to Garrus. Add to that that even Tali and Jack had fantastic loyalty missions (in addition to those named above) and you've got the reason I've played through this game so quickly after getting it just a couple days ago.

There's a lot of design decisions I fundamentally agree with, but in the end it's still a damn fine package. First entry on my GOTY candidate list 2010 and definitely a candidate for best writing and characters (successor to Brütal Legend's win 2009? possibly!).

 

[MMaRsu]

You could in the first game. Havent actually tried it yet in this one.

You can't. Another dumb thing. You can't customize your allies armor etc either. Ridiculous.

 

[bryehn]

Did a side mission last night that took place on wreckage hanging off a cliff. Such an excellent atmosphere and sense of scale!

 

[zero margin]

You can't. Another dumb thing. You can't customize your allies armor etc either. Ridiculous.

Ah thanks, was wondering about this also. That does suck, guess the only thing you get is the one alternate from

Spoiler

loyalty missions

 

[adamsapple]

Did a side mission last night that took place on wreckage hanging off a cliff. Such an excellent atmosphere and sense of scale!

Yeah that one was pretty awesome, if it had the ship breaking off behind you it'd have been even better, but still it was pretty atmospheric.

 

[dave is ok]

Can anyone tell me how to equip your squad in different armor? If you can at all, and when you can if so.

 

[Solo]

What I dont get is WHY the Normandy has loading screens. There are places like Omega which are much larger and dont have loading screens.

 

[Zzoram]

You can't equip your squad with new armor. I actually like that, it allows them to keep their uniquely designed looks, instead of all looking the same like the end of ME1 where everyone is wearing Colossus armor.

 

[MMaRsu]

Can anyone tell me how to equip your squad in different armor? If you can at all, and when you can if so.

You cant. Not really anyway aside from a palette swap.

 

[Zzoram]

What I dont get is WHY the Normandy has loading screens. There are places like Omega which are much larger and dont have loading screens.

On my PC it takes about 5 seconds to go to another deck, which is probably faster than it would be to run down a spiral staircase.

 

[MMaRsu]

On my PC it takes about 5 seconds to go to another deck, which is probably faster than it would be to run down a spiral staircase.

on 360 it takes like 2 minutes or something.

 

[Arjen]

I'll be playing in 2 hours, finally

 

[Foliorum Viridum]

I pre-ordered this from Amazon 2/3 weeks ago, with first class postage, and it's status is currently "dispatching soon." I'm starting to worry I won't get it tomorrow.

:'(

 

[adamsapple]

on 360 it takes like 2 minutes or something.

you mean the loading ? it takes like 8 seconds with the install...

 

[MMaRsu]

you mean the loading ? it takes like 8 seconds with the install...

Too bad I'm not throwing down 90 euro's for a 250gb harddrive then. Also don't have the space to install it on my 13gb, 5 gigs of rock band songs and a bunch of other stuff comes in the way.

 

[corrosivefrost]

you mean the loading ? it takes like 8 seconds with the install...

I've had it take upwards of a minute with the install (both discs).

 

[adamsapple]

I've had it take upwards of a minute with the install (both discs).

Only takes slightly longer for me when loading the game after starting the console, but otherwise it's never that long for me at least .. especially the Captain's quarters loads in like 3 seconds ..

 

[The Lamonster]

Too bad I'm not throwing down 90 euro's for a 250gb harddrive then. Also don't have the space to install it on my 13gb, 5 gigs of rock band songs and a bunch of other stuff comes in the way.

Yep. Hard drive bullshit is the worst thing about the 360 IMO.

 

[Red Blaster]

Wow, no helmets for your squad? Stupid.

 

[Meus Renaissance]

Zaeed is a don with the sniper! I hope I can get to use a rifle with an adept

 

[EatChildren]

Im glad the Citadel was kept largely minimal. I dont want to play "RETURN TO ALL THOSE OLD AREAS WITH NEW FANCY GRAPHICS WOO". I dont get the complaints about areas feeling small. Omega is just as big and varied as Noveria, easily. The explorable level of the Citadal is also quite large.

Mass Effect may have had a lot of ground area to 'explore' but it was like butter spread thin; there was sweet fuck all to actually interact with. That's not saying ME2's environments are small, but so far they also feel like they're more alive and interactive. Omega particuarly feels more populated than than every Citadel scene in the original.

Anyway, I've got a question about the uncharted world side quests; I'm under the belief that when an anomoly is detected it will initiate a side quest, yes? My question is; are the anomolies automatically detected when I visit the planet, and then probe for their location, or do I have to probe the shit out of a planet in order to find the anomoly in the first place?

In other words, if I visit a planet and click "scan", and there's no mention of an anomoly, this means there's nowhere to land, correct?

 

[markatisu]

6hrs in and I REALLY miss the Mako. I never thought I would say that!

Other than that love the game

 

[infinityBCRT]

I spent a while playing it last night, and I'm enjoying it, but I feel that Bioware went way too far in reigning everything in. There were many aspects of the original that I enjoyed which are now missing. It seems as if they didn't even attempt to fix the issues with the original, rather, they simply cut everything out. The game looks better, plays better, and runs smoother...but a lot of the details I loved about the original are MIA.

1) I feel as if the game world has been sliced up into compartments for convenience sake at the expense of atmosphere and scale. The citadel, once a massive and interesting environment, has been completely compartmentalized. I was expecting them to expand upon what they they had already created and deliver an even bigger environment. After talking to Anderson for the first time, I could not believe it when I found out that I could no longer leave that meeting room and explore the presidium. I also feel as if many of the new areas are smaller in scale in order to improve performance. Surely they could have delivered a larger environment while maintaining the fast travel stations for the less patient among us.

2) The Mako is another loss for me. Yes, it had issues, but it also had potential and could have been improved. Mixing it up between Mako and on-foot combat created a much greater sense of scale on the planets while delivering more variety in gameplay. I'm sure some associate it with the cookie cutter planets of the original, but I'm thinking more of its usage during actual story missions. Rather than attempting to improve it, they cut it completely. The ice station in the original game, for instance, felt significantly more remote as a result of the Mako sections beforehand.

3) Load screens galore. You know, the elevators WERE a bit too long, but let's not pretend we didn't know what was going on in the background. They were using them to hide loading screens and keep the player in the game world. What did they do here? They break the immersion and replaced those elevators with load screens. Talk about regressing. The loading screens aren't all that much shorter than the elevator rides and they pull you out of the world. The elevators definitely helped the world feel more cohesive despite their length. Prior to Mass 1, I was concerned about how they would present the environment due to the shortcomings of KOTOR (which had load screens around every corner). With the first game, it was clear that immersion was something they were striving for. With Mass 2, however, I feel as if they are returning to their old ways and that's disappointing.

4) The soundtrack is still very good, but I definitely feel as if it has become too epic for its own good. There's less "electronic sci-fi" and more "epic film" in there. Not exactly a huge deal, of course, but it's definitely something that I've noticed (both in the game and the actual OST).

While it certainly isn't as severe, these changes sometimes remind me of Deus Ex Invisible War in that many of the things that were loved about the original were simplified and compartmentalized. Why design a large map when the player can get everything they need in a single room? This line of thinking completely ruins the immersion for me. Still, I do love the game but I feel as if they just cut all of the problems areas out of the game rather than attempting to improve them.

Anyone else with similar feelings?

Great post. I echo your thoughts somewhat in my lengthy post over at the BioWare forums. One thing I didn't address was elevators (because it was widely hated). Honestly I enjoyed them in the first game and there is some sort of justification for them (in Mass Effect: Revelation, Anderson takes an elevator that goes 2 km deep into the planet and takes 10 minutes to ride). I enjoyed the news you got while in the elevator, another thing that adds depth to the game. But if the elevator ride length was such a huge issue all they needed to do is have a normal length elevator ride, and if it needed to take longer, then have the game pause and just have a "Loading" prompt at the bottom until the loading is done.

I think theres a theme in the things BioWare got rid of:
- Inventory
- Mako
- Planet Exploration
- Feeling of a more open ended mission structure (by not automatically transporting you to the Normandy after missions, having the Mission Complete screen)
- Elevator Rides

They took literal feedback from everyone, which is a big no-no. If you've ever done any training for focus group testing you should know that the important thing is the complaints, not necessarily the people's suggestions to fix those complaints (which were mainly take them out). Most of the time the better way is to refine those aspects to address the complaints. As I mentioned in that BioWare forum post, I think Assassin's Creed 2 really did the smart thing by taking all the feedback and addressing all the issues from AC1 without stripping down the gameplay. In fact, AC2 actually has MORE stuff to do than AC1 yet it has a higher completion % among gamers because they always made it clear as to what you need to do next to progress the story via the exclamation mark in your mini map.

 

[adamsapple]

In other words, if I visit a planet and click "scan", and there's no mention of an anomoly, this means there's nowhere to land, correct?

That is correct, if there's something there Edi will tell you "Anomaly detected" as soon as you select the planet and press the scan button once, maybe even without having to press the scan button, not sure on that part.

Also, for kicks, go to the Local Cluster, and send a probe anywhere on Uranus

 

[Killthee]

Im glad the Citadel was kept largely minimal. I dont want to play "RETURN TO ALL THOSE OLD AREAS WITH NEW FANCY GRAPHICS WOO". I dont get the complaints about areas feeling small. Omega is just as big and varied as Noveria, easily. The explorable level of the Citadal is also quite large.

Mass Effect may have had a lot of ground area to 'explore' but it was like butter spread thin; there was sweet fuck all to actually interact with. That's not saying ME2's environments are small, but so far they also feel like they're more alive and interactive. Omega particuarly feels more populated than than every Citadel scene in the original.

Anyway, I've got a question about the uncharted world side quests; I'm under the belief that when an anomoly is detected it will initiate a side quest, yes? My question is; are the anomolies automatically detected when I visit the planet, and then probe for their location, or do I have to probe the shit out of a planet in order to find the anomoly in the first place?

In other words, if I visit a planet and click "scan", and there's no mention of an anomoly, this means there's nowhere to land, correct?

That's my understanding. A couple of people who completed the game were confirming that earlier in the thread.

 

[1138]

I just recieved an email from my online retailer informing me that Mass Effect 2 Collectors Edition copies are not arriving until the 4th of february. I also recieved my preorder code from the same retailer in another email, and now i feel like they enjoy teasing their costumers

 

[corrosivefrost]

That is correct, if there's something there Edi will tell you "Anomaly detected" as soon as you select the planet and press the scan button once, maybe even without having to press the scan button, not sure on that part.

Also, for kicks, go to the Local Cluster, and send a probe anywhere on Uranus

You definitely have to bring up the scanner.

But as soon as you do, before you can hold LT to scan, you'll get the "ANOMALY DETECTED" and notice the little white line in the scanner.

Sometimes, you'll see random quests on the galaxy maps... like "shut down hacked mech facility" or something... (not sure if you find something on mission 1 that indicates there's another mission related, somewhere else or what could be though...) You can use those markers to find the planet with the assignment or whatever and as soon as you do the scan with Y ... "ANOMALY DETECTED".

 

[Revengeance]

Too bad I'm not throwing down 90 euro's for a 250gb harddrive then. Also don't have the space to install it on my 13gb, 5 gigs of rock band songs and a bunch of other stuff comes in the way.

I have about 8 gigs free with no game installed - just enough room to install a game at a time, or in Mass Effect 2's case, a disc at a time. It sucks, but the difference in load times (and loudness level) is very noticeable.

 

[dexterslu]

Just got my copy yesterday, already used my network code on the wrong EA Account. What are you supposed to do after that? ugh, super frustrating.

On the bright side I did get my amazon pre-order code!

 

[RubxQub]

Someone please tell me I didn't spend about an hour mining minerals off unexplored planets to buy the Medical Facility upgrade...only to have it only remove my scars and that's it.

50,000 Platinum for a cosmetic change...

PLEASE TELL ME I DIDN'T WASTE MY LIFE!!!

 

[Pancakes]

Someone please tell me I didn't spend about an hour mining minerals off unexplored planets to buy the Medical Facility upgrade...only to have it only remove my scars and that's it.

50,000 Platinum for a cosmetic change...

PLEASE TELL ME I DIDN'T WASTE MY LIFE!!!

I uh..................Doctor Chakwas is very pleased .

 

[EatChildren]

That is correct, if there's something there Edi will tell you "Anomaly detected" as soon as you select the planet and press the scan button once, maybe even without having to press the scan button, not sure on that part.

Also, for kicks, go to the Local Cluster, and send a probe anywhere on Uranus

That's my understanding. A couple of people who completed the game were confirming that earlier in the thread.

Thanks guys!

 

[RubxQub]

I uh..................Doctor Chakwas is very pleased .

IT'D BE WORTH IT IF THAT LADY WOULD FUCK ME FOR MY TROUBLES BUT SHE DIDN'T EVEN ACKNOWLEDGE MY UPGRADE!

AAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

Miranda keeps telling me it's on...but I can't eff her.
Kelly hasn't flirted with me in awhile so I'm starting to think that by flilrting with Mirando, Kelly is getting cold-feet.

SHEPARD'S GOTTA FUCK!

 

[Net_Wrecker]

I spent a while playing it last night, and I'm enjoying it, but I feel that Bioware went way too far in reigning everything in. There were many aspects of the original that I enjoyed which are now missing. It seems as if they didn't even attempt to fix the issues with the original, rather, they simply cut everything out. The game looks better, plays better, and runs smoother...but a lot of the details I loved about the original are MIA.

1) I feel as if the game world has been sliced up into compartments for convenience sake at the expense of atmosphere and scale. The citadel, once a massive and interesting environment, has been completely compartmentalized. I was expecting them to expand upon what they they had already created and deliver an even bigger environment. After talking to Anderson for the first time, I could not believe it when I found out that I could no longer leave that meeting room and explore the presidium. I also feel as if many of the new areas are smaller in scale in order to improve performance. Surely they could have delivered a larger environment while maintaining the fast travel stations for the less patient among us.

2) The Mako is another loss for me. Yes, it had issues, but it also had potential and could have been improved. Mixing it up between Mako and on-foot combat created a much greater sense of scale on the planets while delivering more variety in gameplay. I'm sure some associate it with the cookie cutter planets of the original, but I'm thinking more of its usage during actual story missions. Rather than attempting to improve it, they cut it completely. The ice station in the original game, for instance, felt significantly more remote as a result of the Mako sections beforehand.

3) Load screens galore. You know, the elevators WERE a bit too long, but let's not pretend we didn't know what was going on in the background. They were using them to hide loading screens and keep the player in the game world. What did they do here? They break the immersion and replaced those elevators with load screens. Talk about regressing. The loading screens aren't all that much shorter than the elevator rides and they pull you out of the world. The elevators definitely helped the world feel more cohesive despite their length. Prior to Mass 1, I was concerned about how they would present the environment due to the shortcomings of KOTOR (which had load screens around every corner). With the first game, it was clear that immersion was something they were striving for. With Mass 2, however, I feel as if they are returning to their old ways and that's disappointing.

4) The soundtrack is still very good, but I definitely feel as if it has become too epic for its own good. There's less "electronic sci-fi" and more "epic film" in there. Not exactly a huge deal, of course, but it's definitely something that I've noticed (both in the game and the actual OST).

While it certainly isn't as severe, these changes sometimes remind me of Deus Ex Invisible War in that many of the things that were loved about the original were simplified and compartmentalized. Why design a large map when the player can get everything they need in a single room? This line of thinking completely ruins the immersion for me. Still, I do love the game but I feel as if they just cut all of the problems areas out of the game rather than attempting to improve them.

Anyone else with similar feelings?

I agree word for word. The Mako in particular is HUGE HUGE HUGE for me. I loved the sound, and feeling of isolation while exploring the planets, and it sucks that they just cut it out completely.

Another thing, why can't I toggle the helmets anymore? Unless I just can't find it, I liked being able to pick and choose when my teammates and myself wore helmets while indoors. This new "choose a helmet" thing makes for some awkward looking cutscenes.

 

[syllogism]

Not going to go into details, but I was a Mass Effect 1 hater in the sense I would have only given it a 7 or 7.5 and found the new game to overall be a clear improvement. I'd probably give it a 8.5 or 9. Based on the pre-release information I expected a fun, cinematic third person shooter and that's exactly what I got.

e: well okay I expected to be a bad third person shooter, but the sentiment stands

 

[MrTroubleMaker]

It's possible to modify the Coalesced.ini-file

Check this thread for more info: http://www.gamefaqs.com/boards/genmessage.php?board=944906&topic=53222801

cool, I used it to get screen cap support back in thanks! I'm making some cool wallpapers

a shot I made from a dlc location re-sized (spoiler) http://i186.photobucket.com/albums/x200/MrTroubleMaker/ScreenShot00000.jpg

 

[ElectricBlue187]

The loadtimes are superb on PC. The elevator icon doesn't even have time to reach it's destination on the load screen.

 

[PuppetSlave]

Oh yeah, making sandwiches while the computer installs the game.

Butter and caviar sandwiches mmmm.

Life's good.

 

[Jonsoncao]

switch classes for NG+?
anyone?

 

[itsinmyveins]

So, uh, I got my game in the mail today. To my surprise, it's got a huge australian warning label on it and the websites it refers to are all also australian. I live in Scandinavia, so what's the deal?

 

[zero margin]

IT'D BE WORTH IT IF THAT LADY WOULD FUCK ME FOR MY TROUBLES BUT SHE DIDN'T EVEN ACKNOWLEDGE MY UPGRADE!

AAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

Miranda keeps telling me it's on...but I can't eff her.
Kelly hasn't flirted with me in awhile so I'm starting to think that by flilrting with Mirando, Kelly is getting cold-feet.

SHEPARD'S GOTTA FUCK!

:lol Thanks for reminding me but does anyone know if taking Kelly all the way to the

Spoiler

stripper part

ruin any romances or is that separate? Would appreciate info because I am um...a completionist? Yeah that.

 

[MMaRsu]

I know this is a very small nitpick but this really bothers me :

If I want to change suits, or talk to someone in my crew while on a planet, and select return to the normandy, it undocks and takes off into space. While in the first game you could enter the normandy and it wouldn't undock until you selected a new location which makes 100% sense.

Also you got that little cool animation that scans you ... that's gone too .

I have about 8 gigs free with no game installed - just enough room to install a game at a time, or in Mass Effect 2's case, a disc at a time. It sucks, but the difference in load times (and loudness level) is very noticeable.

I certainly understand and want to install the game, however redownloading all RB2 songs when I feel like it is gonna suck .

 

[corrosivefrost]

Someone please tell me I didn't spend about an hour mining minerals off unexplored planets to buy the Medical Facility upgrade...only to have it only remove my scars and that's it.

50,000 Platinum for a cosmetic change...

PLEASE TELL ME I DIDN'T WASTE MY LIFE!!!

I dunno... I got it on the hopes that it would help me keep people alive toward the end, like better shields and better armor and better guns... but I don't think it ever gets used.

And if you think you're a sucker, knowing that I probably didn't need it, I still bought it immediately with the bonus 50000 platinum they give you for new game +.

 

[corrosivefrost]

switch classes for NG+?
anyone?

I don't think you can. I know you can change your face -- but I don't remember it prompting me for "what class do you want to be this time" when I did the import.

 

[PuppetSlave]

So, uh, I got my game in the mail today. To my surprise, it's got a huge australian warning label on it and the websites it refers to are all also australian. I live in Scandinavia, so what's the deal?

Who you buy it from? I bought mine from webhallen and it does not have anything like that.

 

[Brandon F]

Where are the optional missions on unexplored planets????

I feel like every system I explore is full of scannable surfaces, but I rarely if ever see a 'landing' mission. I've probably tapped 30 planets for resources and have only had two 'Away' missions I've discovered. (Which were extremely short)

What the hell?

 

[RubxQub]

:lol Thanks for reminding me but does anyone know if taking Kelly all the way to the

Spoiler

stripper part

ruin any romances or is that separate? Would appreciate info because I am um...a completionist? Yeah that.

I don't know the answer to your question, but if me effing Miranda means I can't eff Kelly than I'm breaking shit off with Miranda ASAP!

 

[Zzoram]

Wow, no helmets for your squad? Stupid.

Helmets are awful, they cover up everyone's faces. I refuse to use a helmet for Shephard too.

 

[itsinmyveins]

Who you buy it from? I bought mine from webhallen and it does not have anything like that.

Spelbutiken, I think it was.

Considering how notorious Australia is when it comes to censoring games I'm not a big fan of this at all, and on top of that I don't know how a store here would react to me trying to trade the game in at a later point, even if it is a PAL version. I'm gonna try to call them tomorrow and see what the deal is, if it's just a mistake or what.

 

[The Librarian]

IT'D BE WORTH IT IF THAT LADY WOULD FUCK ME FOR MY TROUBLES BUT SHE DIDN'T EVEN ACKNOWLEDGE MY UPGRADE!

AAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

Miranda keeps telling me it's on...but I can't eff her.
Kelly hasn't flirted with me in awhile so I'm starting to think that by flilrting with Mirando, Kelly is getting cold-feet.

SHEPARD'S GOTTA FUCK!

Whatever happened to staying true to your digi-love in ME1? Is there no honor in gamers anymore? D: