Agreed. Finished it on hard and traded it for Diablo!
-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
Max Payne 3 |OT| Funny as hell, we couldn't decide on a sub-title
- Thread starter NotTheGuyYouKill
- Start date
Net_Wrecker
Member
Seriously. There are issues here, but I think we need to keep things in perspective. Talk about Rockstar not getting flak, on the contrary, this game's being reviewed under some kind of weird microscope that no other big budget shooter has been with all sorts of complaints about narrative and "bullet sponges" and difficulty. Hell, Metacritic for this is sitting at an 87 and reception is mixed in this very thread. Let's talk about games not getting flak when Black Ops 2 and Halo 4 are sitting pretty with 94+ despite the same issues they've had for years. Or Uncharted 3 sitting at 92. Now THERE'S a game that barely got flak from critics, and even when it got 8's GAF started freaking out.
Sleepy Buddha
Member
I was thinking of replying to all this, but decided not to do it. I don't want to waste time arguing with you when it's obviously going to change absolutely nothing, so I'll just say this:
I completely disagree with your opinion of the game. The game is awesome. I love the gameplay, the story, the setting and the style. I like well made cutscenes. All these things come together in a way that makes me ignore all the flaws it has because they do not detract from the experience for me.
IMO you are way, way over-blowing the impact of the things you don't like and the small technical limitations it has due to the systems it was developed for, something you don't even take into account when complaining.
Yup, I agree. Could be a lot of trophy hunters in the game that just want that Platinum asap so they can move onto the next game.
Ravensmash
Member
So I'm up to Chapter 10, and I am loving this so far 
I thought the cutscene frequency would irritate me, but I'm surprisingly invested in the narrative, and really can't wait to see what happens next. That, coupled with some of the most satisfying shooting I've played this gen?
Love it. I keep dying lots though
I thought the cutscene frequency would irritate me, but I'm surprisingly invested in the narrative, and really can't wait to see what happens next. That, coupled with some of the most satisfying shooting I've played this gen?
Love it. I keep dying lots though
mickcenary
Member
Oh, no doubt, but there are gamers that couldn't care less about narrative in their games and you really can't blame them for being like that, considering the medium and the plethora of shitty video game stories that have come and gone. The focus of MP3 is the gunplay; gamers should be able to skip to that instantly. It's almost akin to going to a Monster Truck show and being forced to sit through back-story of the drivers, just because the people at the helm would rather that you do.
Anyway, I think it's silly to argue whether it's more onerous for Rockstar to implement skippable cutscenes - you know, like every other game, story-driven or not - or to compel the player to focus and invest time into a story when they rightfully may not give two hoots.
Sure, they've made a fantastic game, but the same cannot be said for all of their design choices. And hardware limitation is not an excuse at all. Design within your constraints. Don't push the envelope at the cost of smart design.
EDIT:
Everything else you said basically hinges on my opinion of the game against yours, so I won't go there, but if you're going to rely on that above statement, you're an idiot. I can't help you there, so continue to sit back and ignore the MANY OTHER fantastic, story-driven, gameplay-rich and beautiful games that have come before and put MP3 to shame, simply because the developer knew their limitations. The old saying, "a bad workman blames his tools" could not be anymore perfect in debunking the notion that you've put forth.
And Net_Wrecker, I agree with you. MP3 is a better game than all of those, but hey, that's the gaming industry.
Dick Justice
Banned
I see where you're coming from with this, it makes playing through the arcade modes, as well as replaying the game on higher difficulties more laborious than they should be, but IMO, the rest of the game more than makes up for it. To each his own.
mickcenary
Member
No arguments there. Of course, if you dig the shit out of this game, the qualms I have wouldn't even be on your radar.
Sleepy Buddha
Member
This entire diatribe just demonstrated why I should just ignore anything that comes out of your brain from now on. And old sayings and generalizations are not dogmas, but I guess you are too far up your own ass to realize that.
mickcenary
Member
Ha! Diatribe or not, something tells me that you can't quite discredit the sheer logic and strength in precedent of my argument...
Dr. Zombutler
Member
I remember when this thread was about Max Payne 3...
mickcenary
Member
I don't think its being reviewed under a weird microscope at all. I think it's just that the problems it has that are problems in those other games are just that much worse here.
Take your Uncharted 3 example. Almost every criticism I've heard levied against that game - too cinematic, poor pacing, tedious/repetitive gun-fights, difficulty spikes, non-tight shooting/aiming - could be levied against this game x 10.
Also, to go on record, the cut-scenes are indeed awful in their frequency and length and almost no amount of complaining could over-blow it. It is just impossible to get any kind of 'flow' when you have to watch a cut-scene literally after each gun-fight. And the "you'd be waiting either way through a cut-scene or loading screen" view doesn't provide any consolation because a loading screen might actually have been better - because at least then maybe the game wouldn't switch my equipped weapon to a pistol when I enter a new room.
I think the reviews should be higher. I wasn't expecting much, but Max Payne 3 is a big-budget blockbuster that rocked my balls off from beginning to end, with set-pieces and production values that simply embarrass most other games.
For someone like me who's been gaming for more than 30 years, it's a stunning example of how far games have come, and a jaw-dropping preview of where games are going.
Sure, it has some niggling problems. But they pale next to the towering triumph that is the game as a whole. MP3 is just an epic, epic, epic game, and one that every self-respecting shooter fan should play.
I'm looking forward to more multi-player, and I can't wait to go through the whole game again with the girlfriend, for whom the frequent cutscenes made it like the best damn action movie she's seen recently.
For someone like me who's been gaming for more than 30 years, it's a stunning example of how far games have come, and a jaw-dropping preview of where games are going.
Sure, it has some niggling problems. But they pale next to the towering triumph that is the game as a whole. MP3 is just an epic, epic, epic game, and one that every self-respecting shooter fan should play.
I'm looking forward to more multi-player, and I can't wait to go through the whole game again with the girlfriend, for whom the frequent cutscenes made it like the best damn action movie she's seen recently.
I disagree about the replayability, I've already played it through twice now and I still want to play more. The cutscenes are a little too frequent, but for the most part they are pretty entertaining, I don't feel too bad about not being able to skip them. If you're not a fan of the story though, I can see how it would start getting tedious quick.
Also, the multiplayer is an absolute blast.
Also, the multiplayer is an absolute blast.
Digital Foundry Face off is finally up:
http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-max-payne-3-face-off
Giving the slight advantage to the 360 version for a more stable framerate, better foliage, and more lighting effects during cutscenes.
If the PC version runs like like shit on my PC (i7/460 GT) I may end up getting the PS3 version and trade in my 360 version since the disc swapping bugs the shit outta me.
http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-max-payne-3-face-off
Giving the slight advantage to the 360 version for a more stable framerate, better foliage, and more lighting effects during cutscenes.
If the PC version runs like like shit on my PC (i7/460 GT) I may end up getting the PS3 version and trade in my 360 version since the disc swapping bugs the shit outta me.
Jeff Stephen
Member
This happened to me last night. My Kinect sensor had shut down as well.
I encountered a strange bug last night as well. During one of the favela segments (right before you join up with one of the women) you're supposed to see a cutscene when you move into a small building. After triggering that scene, Max will be hiding behind cover while trying to avoid being caught.
The first time I made it to this point, however, the cutscene did not trigger. I entered the building and nothing happened. At this point, nothing appeared to be out of place, so I continued outside. When I made it outside I noticed that I could follow the street in two directions, which was not something commonly encountered in this game. I ended up walking around empty, quiet streets until Max fell through the world geometry and the game ultimately crashed. I could still access the menu, but it did nothing and would simply return to Max falling through nothingness.
Those areas were clearly not designed to be explored by the player so, after a point, collision data ceased to exist. I'm impressed at how detailed all of these areas were, though, considering that you barely have the chance to see them in the cutscene that was supposed to play.
The first time I made it to this point, however, the cutscene did not trigger. I entered the building and nothing happened. At this point, nothing appeared to be out of place, so I continued outside. When I made it outside I noticed that I could follow the street in two directions, which was not something commonly encountered in this game. I ended up walking around empty, quiet streets until Max fell through the world geometry and the game ultimately crashed. I could still access the menu, but it did nothing and would simply return to Max falling through nothingness.
Those areas were clearly not designed to be explored by the player so, after a point, collision data ceased to exist. I'm impressed at how detailed all of these areas were, though, considering that you barely have the chance to see them in the cutscene that was supposed to play.
AgentOtaku
Member
My god
this game
THIS FUCKING GAME
I literally gasped when
, and that's just at the beginning
THIS FUCKING GAME ....A DREAM COME TRUE I TELL YOU
this game
THIS FUCKING GAME
I literally gasped when
you go through the window with the gangmember in the club and keep firing
THIS FUCKING GAME ....A DREAM COME TRUE I TELL YOU
Wind's Howling
Member
Worst part of the game, yes.
MMaRsu
Member
That aint shit yet!
goddamn it.
mr fuckin' armored guy and his fucking gun hurt. i'm not even sure what i'm supposed to be doing there, he has too much life and is destroying me.
MMaRsu
Member
Headshots in bullettime.
i'm trying! -cries-
Wind's Howling
Member
Dodge behind the cover, put in some few blindfire shots to fill up your bullettime bar and after that just keep shooting in his head
I think I'm almost finished at Chapter 14. I am loving it overall. It has been a meaty adventure with a lot of different environments. I'll say this though: when Max Payne is running n' gunning with the bullet time the game is bliss, even through some of the harder parts. There are some chapters however that seem to want you to take cover more and those aren't as great. There are better cover shooters out there. I hope that Rockstar makes another and takes this into account.
The game has definately replayability what with the clue hunting and the golden gun parts. Just the variety of levels alone makes them worth seeing twice. It's funny but I got a real Resident Evil 5 vibe going through certain areas, especially the favela. That's another game that have very detailed and well thought out environments.
The game has definately replayability what with the clue hunting and the golden gun parts. Just the variety of levels alone makes them worth seeing twice. It's funny but I got a real Resident Evil 5 vibe going through certain areas, especially the favela. That's another game that have very detailed and well thought out environments.
Actually, their comments on the 360 framerate would have me believe that it looks smoother on PS3. An unlocked framerate is a terrible thing when it fails to synchronize with the refresh rate.
They noted this:
35 fps simply doesn't appear as consistent as 30 fps as it does not sync up with the refresh rate of a 60 Hz display. I've played a number of games which used this technique and it just doesn't look as smooth as 30 fps in comparison. It adds motion judder to the image.
I can't imagine why they decided to unlock the framerate. Seems like a silly move as it just interferes with image consistency.
Sleepy Buddha
Member
Another thing I'm really liking about the game is that we get to play as a frail middle-aged man. IMO it's a refreshing change from the usual annoying teenager in Japanese games and cocky late-twenties to early-thirties dude in western games.
Wind's Howling
Member
It is Max Payne, papi. He can even stay cool when he is 60.
Fratkabula
Banned
The pace of the encounters feels perfect to me. There's always enough time to try a new way everytime. Sometimes the Uncharted-ish ranged shooting works great while continuous shoot dodging is great for tighter spaces.
Damn the thread became very negative towards the cutscenes last night. I love the cutscenes, and I don't even mind them in my second playthrough. I'm going to watch them again for my third playthrough to soak up the storyline another time.
My only issue is that I hate not knowing when it's finally time to push A to skip a cutscene, in those instances when you just want to skip and get right down to the game play (for me, in multiple playthroughs, that's not very often, but I still get annoyed).
I think people are getting really annoyed because they are in utter disbelief that a game could take this long to load... Like I said before, sometimes I think there's no way this game is actually "still loading" a couple of minutes into a cutscene. There needs to be a load progress bar with every cutscene!
My only issue is that I hate not knowing when it's finally time to push A to skip a cutscene, in those instances when you just want to skip and get right down to the game play (for me, in multiple playthroughs, that's not very often, but I still get annoyed).
I think people are getting really annoyed because they are in utter disbelief that a game could take this long to load... Like I said before, sometimes I think there's no way this game is actually "still loading" a couple of minutes into a cutscene. There needs to be a load progress bar with every cutscene!
Honestly, I'd imagine that some of the loading is increased by the fact that they are playing a video clip simultaneously. Unlike a lot of games, they actually used a reasonable bitrate in order to eliminate artifacts. This could place a greater demand on the system, however, as it streams the video while loading the next segment.
Honestly, as far as how the game is designed to be played, I just can't take real issue with it. Faster loading would be great, but I do appreciate that it was designed to be experienced without any actual loading screens appearing. So, despite the amount of time required to load in the background, it still manages to feel completely seamless.
If you're into replaying and want to skip cutscenes, however, I could see how it would become an issue.
I don't think it would have made a huge difference. Each multiplayer map requires upwards of 1 minute to load with a static loading screen.
I also have a feeling the PC version is going to suffer from lengthy load times as well. Just a hunch...
Dick Justice
Banned
Strange, I just went to chapter select, and chose chapter 2, and it loaded the cutscene instantly, without an annoyingly long load screen. Very weird.
That's one of the videos; it doesn't switch to realtime until just before the dive through the glass. It's really easy to tell since that part has the framerate dive until you're actually through the glass.
Dick Justice
Banned
But normally, there's a load screen when I select a chapter, just like in the arcade modes, with the screens of what's happened so far. Here, it bypassed that.
Backfoggen
Banned
Wow the game has some Soldier of Fortune levels of violence.
Loving it so far.
Loving it so far.
Messofanego
Banned
Fixed. It's like these developers haven't heard of in-game storytelling.
Maybe because there's nothing to recap in the level at that point? I dunno.
Magic Mushroom
Member
Didn't really mind the cut scenes, epsecially not if they're used to mask loading. But besides the fact that they were pretty decent cut-scenes, it allowed me to blow off some steam after the rather intense shootouts on Hard. Gunplay is great.
Minor Spoiler to describe a later mission:
I'm at the rooftop of "the building" at the moment, and I thought I'd chime in with some opinions.
Does anyone else think the gunplay is somewhat weak? Most, if not all guns don't feel powerful at all.
And somehow slow mo wasn't that interesting in this game -- previous Max games allowed for far more interesting stuff, if I remember correctly, but in this game you just enter a stage, do the same standard animation for slow mo and/or sit behind cover, then when it's clear, you move to the next stage; rinse repeat. This is true for the most part. There's very little gameplay to speak of..
I'm a bit surprised that Rockstar made a game like this. It's not a bad game so far, but I expected the mechanics of the previous titles and perhaps more. I'm not a fan of Uncharted at all, cause of the lack of gameplay -- but they are very polished games of course. Just like MP3.
And the transitions from gameplay to cutscene/cutscene to gameplay are very annoying and is constantly ruining the pace. Occasionally, it's tolerable.
Binary Domain also did something similar, and it was awful; gameplay was pretty much broken up into 5 minute segments with 5-10 minute long cutscenes CONSTANTLY interrupting. It wasn't fun. At all.
I'm at the rooftop of "the building" at the moment, and I thought I'd chime in with some opinions.
Does anyone else think the gunplay is somewhat weak? Most, if not all guns don't feel powerful at all.
And somehow slow mo wasn't that interesting in this game -- previous Max games allowed for far more interesting stuff, if I remember correctly, but in this game you just enter a stage, do the same standard animation for slow mo and/or sit behind cover, then when it's clear, you move to the next stage; rinse repeat. This is true for the most part. There's very little gameplay to speak of..
I'm a bit surprised that Rockstar made a game like this. It's not a bad game so far, but I expected the mechanics of the previous titles and perhaps more. I'm not a fan of Uncharted at all, cause of the lack of gameplay -- but they are very polished games of course. Just like MP3.
And the transitions from gameplay to cutscene/cutscene to gameplay are very annoying and is constantly ruining the pace. Occasionally, it's tolerable.
Binary Domain also did something similar, and it was awful; gameplay was pretty much broken up into 5 minute segments with 5-10 minute long cutscenes CONSTANTLY interrupting. It wasn't fun. At all.
I haven't played this game since my first sitting with it. I was really liking it at first. Started out great, and totally felt like this was truly the sequel to Max Payne 2. I got stuck on (I think) chapter 3 and kept dying and when I loaded my last save I don't have any pills and I have pretty much no life left. It pissed me off and I just haven't had the push I needed to pick it up again.
mickcenary
Member
My issues in a nutshell, really. If you're after the same evaluation, only unnecessarily drawn-out, laborious and somewhat repetitious - you know, like the game - refer to my previous posts.
I am on fire tonight, guys. I'll leave on a high note, Costanza style.
D
Deleted member 47027
Unconfirmed Member
The loading didn't bother me. I played through the single-player once, and that's the one time that everything matters the most. I understand it can be a pain on subsequent replays, but I'd rather not sacrifice the visual fidelity or environments the first time around, as that's the playthrough that matters MOST.
All criticisms are valid, but your mileage may vary. Great game. Maybe the best I played all year...
EDIT: Mickcenary...you shoulda left like 5 posts ago if you wanted that high note
All criticisms are valid, but your mileage may vary. Great game. Maybe the best I played all year...
EDIT: Mickcenary...you shoulda left like 5 posts ago if you wanted that high note