I see the pessimists are going to keep the discussion going, We've basically had the same discussion last week about Core game sales and Wii software sales in general, then Joshua put up some numbers and everybody was silenced, there is no need to be afraid people, everything is fine. Wii will do well, DS will do well, PSP will do well and maybe even the PS3 will get some action.
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Media Create Sales 10/29 - 11/4 2007
- Thread starter Cheesemeister
- Start date
charlequin
Banned
Attack You said:
So get a PSP-Slim and play it on your TV.
farnham said:
We pretty much do. This week tells us something important: SMG isn't showing a casual sales pattern here, because it saw a 70% drop. That means that people who didn't already want the game before its release aren't going out to get it. The numbers will go up some with the holiday, of course, but there's only so much that can do: at the moment, it's very probable that SMG will undersell, or just barely meet, SMS's poor numbers. Legs of the NSMB variety are probably out of the picture at this point.
The real problem I see, especially if Galaxy doesn't pick up in late Dec early Jan which could still happen, is here is the only developer who's having great success on home consoles in Japan, with Wii Sports (aka the reason for most people owning a system), applying as much of that knowhow to create a title to not only draw in the new casuals but also reinvigorate traditional gaming and appeal to the hardcore, failing.farnham said:
SMG is doing what is expected from most titles on a home console, selling less than the last version.
Bringing in personal opinion for a moment, now I've played it, this makes the current sales even worse because the game is amazing, fucking amazing in fact. It's far better than Sunshine, which admittedly I didn't like, but still the 3D platformer was stale. Galaxy really does bring something new and brilliant to the genre, which was needed, and for my money it deserves huge success.
Still, this could mean a new 2D Mario from EAD finally hitting a home system, so it's not all bad news.
As I pointed out..charlequin said:
This holiday season.. In japan.. there is nearly no competition in terms of sales..
FF IV, DQ IV, Wii Fit and SMG.. thats it.. thats pretty much it..
ziran said:
You are forgetting that the hardcore centered market brought us.. countless iterations of Tonyhawk, Madden, Need For speed, Dynasty Warriors (And DW Empires etc), Tales of games and other bull crap that was rehashed again and again..
Its not like the so called hardcore market did a good "job".. In preserving and providing great titles...
Oh yeah and i would prefer Wii Sports over any of the games I listed as rehashes btw (with the exception of THPS 2 and Tales Of Symphonia)
Attack You
Member
Yes ma'am. -_- (Although, I'm already popping enough candy as it is.)Dragona Akehi said:
Graphics Horse said:In addition to it.
In any other wii game, two people can try to play coop by sharing the wiimote and nunchuk anyway.
I can't even imagine how that's... Well, I guess I'll see for myself in a few hours.
charlequin said:
Now, now... We can't all throw money at our problems.
Dragona Akehi
Retired
Attack You said:
An Rx for spectacles. Not drugs.
Attack You
Member
Dragona Akehi said:An Rx for spectacles. Not drugs.
Oh, right. Durr. I need glasses to play games, huh. How odd.
charlequin
Banned
ksamedi said:
Your exact choice of wording here makes it very hard for me to resist breaking out the classics:
...
More seriously: Joshua didn't "silence" anyone, nor did his numbers really disprove the argument about core games -- a direct comparison of games by list-position looks good, but doesn't actually address the specific question.
The fact is that there's very little justification for SMG's performance that don't break down to the Wii having a userbase made up of Wii Sports converts who don't like core games. It's lost sales on Zelda and Mario from the GameCube -- which means the core Nintendo market isn't even there; SMG is going to end its life with fewer sales than Mario 64 put up on the DS, which pretty much throws out the "failed due to 3d Mario" theory.
As I said, there are more info points to come -- RE:UC being the big one -- but last week's sales were a very bad sign for Wii's future as a system with software titles for people who are traditionally gamers, and this week is another one. Trying to spin it as business as usual, or an essentially harmless statistical glitch, is simply not giving this information its due.
charlequin said:Your exact choice of wording here makes it very hard for me to resist breaking out the classics:
...
More seriously: Joshua didn't "silence" anyone, nor did his numbers really disprove the argument about core games -- a direct comparison of games by list-position looks good, but doesn't actually address the specific question.
The fact is that there's very little justification for SMG's performance that don't break down to the Wii having a userbase made up of Wii Sports converts who don't like core games. It's lost sales on Zelda and Mario from the GameCube -- which means the core Nintendo market isn't even there; SMG is going to end its life with fewer sales than Mario 64 put up on the DS, which pretty much throws out the "failed due to 3d Mario" theory.
As I said, there are more info points to come -- RE:UC being the big one -- but last week's sales were a very bad sign for Wii's future as a system with software titles for people who are traditionally gamers, and this week is another one. Trying to spin it as business as usual, or an essentially harmless statistical glitch, is simply not giving this information its due.
So the Wii is actually selling to a crowd that is not hardcore and not nintendo fanatic..
Imagine the Possibilities when Nintendo could draw in all the nostalgic nintendo fans
Pureauthor
Member
farnham said:
...And how would they do that if the best Mario game in a decade couldn't?
Magicpaint
Member
Smash Bros is more popular than Mario? :lolGrecco said:
(I guess you mean 3D Mario, but it's still not that clear-cut and isn't a franchise on its own. SSBM might have outsold SMS, but SM64 crushed the N64 original)
Pureauthor
Member
Grecco said:
I think you're kinda missing the point. SMG's sales went down from the GCN.
Relative to popularity of the franchise, sure, SSBB is going to sell more. But what's the justification for it reversing the trend and drawing in more than the fanbase it's always sold to?
Pureauthor said:
Its the game that will bring any nintendo games on board. Thats what we were talking about? How Wii has only sold to casuals and still has Nintendo gamers to bring back? Smash is the game that will do that. Not Galaxy. Even though Galaxy is a pretty awesome game.
well they will in time.. thats what im trying to say...Pureauthor said:
I think the Wii had a very very great launch and a great sell through after that.. but now they somehow got a bad image in japan and they got to get rid of that... Mario Galaxy is a good start.. but they got to come with some more... eventually
And dont get me wrong.. on a absolute scale SMGs sales until now are disappointing..
but look at the competition.. SMG is just smashing the competition...
AND
there is no competition left until next year... so there is a room for improvement
So Smash Bros is now being regarded as the crown jewel for Nintendo fans, instead of the Mario franchise? I think I've heard it all.
That said, I do think Smash Bros will outsell Galaxy...it is a multiplayer game, and that might be a far bigger play in Japan these days.
Still, I don't see how people can't say the console dynamic in Japan hasn't drastically changed. Galaxy would've been a solid bet to sell two million units had it come out when Sunshine did.
That said, I do think Smash Bros will outsell Galaxy...it is a multiplayer game, and that might be a far bigger play in Japan these days.
Still, I don't see how people can't say the console dynamic in Japan hasn't drastically changed. Galaxy would've been a solid bet to sell two million units had it come out when Sunshine did.
Oh yeah, you're right, and I love Wii Sports, and the direction Nintendo is going, a huge amount.farnham said:
Developers brought on this lethargy in the market themselves with countless rehashes of existing gameplay with new/better graphics, still, here is EAD trying to do what they do best, but the market is not responding at the moment.
I do feel it is far too early to call it death for the Galaxy knowing what we how about how the Japanese market works and the big weeks in Dec and Jan. It could still top a million, but these 2nd week sales are disappointing.
The way I see it, the hardcore market could depend on Wii Fit! I could be the catalyst needed to spur people into playing (some) traditional home console games again, like Galaxy.
I think that pretty much sums up the Japanese market though, it's not just those who own Wii. People, even those who used to be gamers on PS2, are bored of hardcore games on home systems, and I can't blame them, because it's happened to me to an extent due to the repetition and time it takes to play them.charlequin said:
If I want to play a hardcore game I'm much happier to play it on DS because it's more likely to cut out the crap and let me get down to actually playing the game instead of wading through lengthy, mindlessly poor cutscenes, dialogue, etc.
I'll still wait for Media Create numbers but imo, 176k is great for a PS3 game but I would have still preferred over 200k and 56k is lower then I thought.
I really hope that DW6 does 200k+ next week, which is very unlikely but if Sony keep it bundled it should sell throughout the holidays to get very respectable numbers. At least that is what I am hoping. I think that anything under 600,000k is disappointing but my expectations are probably to high but the game should still sell that much.
I really hope that DW6 does 200k+ next week, which is very unlikely but if Sony keep it bundled it should sell throughout the holidays to get very respectable numbers. At least that is what I am hoping. I think that anything under 600,000k is disappointing but my expectations are probably to high but the game should still sell that much.
Any thoughts on the how much of the PS3's bump should be attributed to Musou? Does anyone have any bump numbers for software releases that sold comparably? If I remember correctly (which I probably don't) the bumps typically put the PS3 in the mid to high 30K range, which would mean that the new color and the price drop only led to an increase of about 20K, which while good, doesn't strike me as stellar or enough to signal a large shift in momentum.
SMG's performance is sad. Regardless of the brand or the system it is on, it is of a high enough caliber that it deserves great sales.
SMG's performance is sad. Regardless of the brand or the system it is on, it is of a high enough caliber that it deserves great sales.
Shinobi said:
Smash Bros is a bigger franchise than 3d Mario. SB is basically a fanservice dream that draws a bigger pool of gamers and also a game that doesn't even require skill to be enjoyed (not saying skills aren't rewarded, so don't bash me).
But like you said, in the grand scheme of things, nothing will change the direction console gaming in Japan is heading.
And your second point about Galaxy selling 2million if released 5 years ago......only if it was released on the PS2 :lol.
has the critical acclaim for smg been as ebullient in japan as it has been in the west?
some sort of console success this gen featuring hardcore games not starring licensed vehicles or military hardware would be nice.
does wii fit have legit buzz in japan already, or is everyone just assuming that it's the sales successor to wii sports?
some sort of console success this gen featuring hardcore games not starring licensed vehicles or military hardware would be nice.
does wii fit have legit buzz in japan already, or is everyone just assuming that it's the sales successor to wii sports?
Stumpokapow
listen to the mad man
So, here's something interesting.
Million Sellers Released in 2006
Pokemon Diamond
Pokemon Pearl
New Super Mario Bros
Final Fantasy XII
Wii Sports (sold more than a million in 2007)
English Training
Wii Play (may have sold more than a million in 2007)
Common Sense Training
Dragon Quest Monsters Joker (broke 1m in 2007)
Tetris DS
Winning Eleven Pro 2007
Final Fantasy III
(?) Love&Berry
(?) Kirby Squeak Squad
Million Sellers Released in 2007
None
(Both versions of Pokemon Mysterious Dungeon 2 combined make it to 1 million... Mario Party 8 might make it... that's it!)
Besides the general shift from console to handheld gaming... is there a shift away from monolithic titles or just a lack of mega hits this year? No new games have sold a million in 2007, and only two catalog titles have sold more than a million during 2007.
Million Sellers Released in 2006
Pokemon Diamond
Pokemon Pearl
New Super Mario Bros
Final Fantasy XII
Wii Sports (sold more than a million in 2007)
English Training
Wii Play (may have sold more than a million in 2007)
Common Sense Training
Dragon Quest Monsters Joker (broke 1m in 2007)
Tetris DS
Winning Eleven Pro 2007
Final Fantasy III
(?) Love&Berry
(?) Kirby Squeak Squad
Million Sellers Released in 2007
None
(Both versions of Pokemon Mysterious Dungeon 2 combined make it to 1 million... Mario Party 8 might make it... that's it!)
Besides the general shift from console to handheld gaming... is there a shift away from monolithic titles or just a lack of mega hits this year? No new games have sold a million in 2007, and only two catalog titles have sold more than a million during 2007.
Pureauthor
Member
ethelred said:
*looks at Mario Party DS and Mario Party 8 sales*
I don't think the whored-out stuff with Mario is wanting in sales, per se.
Stumpokapow
listen to the mad man
ethelred said:
To be fair, Nintendo under Iwata has moved towards new IP very significantly. It just hasn't been new gaming IP...
Magicpaint
Member
Well, the whoring would only end if the games that are being whored out (which isn't 3D Mario) are the ones failing.ethelred said:
schuelma said:
Yes, but don't we also only have one day of Musou's sales as well. I think it is valid to say that a good portion of the bump was due to the game. Of course we can't say for sure with so little data, but those numbers just don't seem to be that great.
ethelred said:
I'm talking strictly in terms of quality. It is a really good game, deserving of good sales. I'm also not sure what mess you are talking about, but whatever.
Forgotten Ancient
Banned
ethelred said:
wha wha wha?
Ethel..no..
Are you gonna pass on all the DQs?
Hcoregamer00
The 'H' stands for hentai.
dionysus said:
Don't worry, handheld dominance means more games for everybody.
We all win, except console owners.