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[Christoff Yurievich]

Thraktor, it's great that you've taken first year university math, but let's get real. I did a Fourrier transform on the console sales, which tells us the representation of the console sales in the frequency-time domain.

And I think the results were very telling:

a red X?

 

[Grampa Simpson]

:lol

You quoted all that just for a :lol?

 

[Odysseus]

I mean, it depends on your definition of "a ton." I'm sure there are plenty of fence-sitters who will suddenly consider $400 to be a huge bargain once Halo 3 is out. Their holiday sales could, say, double between then and Christmas. But it's not like they're going to start doing a million units a month or anything.

Then again, if that didn't happen this year anyway, regardless of software, it wouldn't look very good for them.

Also, amazing that Xbox 360 seems to be heading for a third holiday season at the same price. Is that unprecedented? If it does happen, we can all thank Sony.

i just don't see any evidence in the good ol' u s of a that software releases on a home console produce noticeable increases in sales of a home console over and above existing trends.

go ahead, look at sales of ps2, xbox, and gamecube. point me to any increase in sales outside of seasonal trends that is not tied to a price drop or, in the case of the ps2 during the slimline changeover, the end of shortages. i can't find one. all of the upticks are during the holidays and they have a near uniform correlation to sales during the non-holiday months. software sells systems, but the effect of software is not felt all at once; it is felt before, during, and after the game's release as something that affects the console's momentum, it doesn't seem to greatly impact sales numbers the actual month the game is released. but i'd be interested to see someone else's take on it.

but for this, and strictly because i'm more aware of these two systems' release schedules, let's look at a few non-holiday major software releases for xbox and gamecube.

august 2002. super mario sunshine released towards the end of the month. august npd for gamecube -> down from july. september npd (five week reporting period, adjusted) -> up 4% from august. september also saw the release of star fox adventures, which i believe pulled very good numbers. the internet may hate it, but it reviewed and sold really well.

march 2003. legend of zelda: the wind waker released towards the end of the month. march npd for gamecube -> numerically flat versus february, but march was a 5 week reporting period, so it was actually down considerably in the weeklies. april npd was down even more.

july 2003. star wars knights of the old republic released on xbox. it set records for initial sales on xbox at the time of its release, went on to sell more than a million copies all told. july npd -> up 3% versus june (adjusted from 5 weeks to 4 weeks).

march 2004. ninja gaiden released on xbox. sold several hundred thousand units in its first month. march npd (five week reporting period) -> numerically nearly flat to february, weekly sales down more than 20%.

september 2004. fable released on xbox. has sold well over a million copies, hundreds of thousands the first month. september npd -> weekly average down 2% versus august.

the reason i listed non-holiday releases is that you can see if there is any tangible selling power of these games over and beyond established patterns more easily than you can for holiday releases, where consoles sell in massive quantities due to moms and dads and grandmas and everybody else buying game consoles for their loved ones.

it might work differently on portables, and it might work differently in japan, but games don't immediately sell home systems in the united states. look at xbox 360 last year. every month, there was a contingent of people saying "this is when the thing takes off." 360 supporters would look forward to npd for hope. 360, um, non-supporters would look forward to npd with comments such as "if it doesn't sell well this month, d00m." oblivion, graw, dead rising, madden!, saint's row, all of them came and all of them went. flat sales. gears of war launched during the holiday. stuff sells during the holiday. how's 360 doing in early 2007, riding the wave of success surely caused by the monstrous gears? eh, sales are starting to sag off established non-holiday 50k/week patterns.

bubububut halo 3 is real big. grand theft auto iv is real big. established patterns are bigger. and $400 is pretty dern big, too.

oh, guess what i think lesser titles like metal gear solid 4 will do for a $600 or even $500 ps3?

the only thing that will spur sales of these systems over and beyond what they're doing now are price reductions.

again, that's my opinion, feel free to offer another take.

 

[d[-_-]b]

Calculus 1 Graphs

Thanks for reminding my I have math hw do .

 

[Kobun Heat]

stuff

Yeah, I found myself mostly agreeing with you after I had typed that out anyway; see:

Then again, if that didn't happen this year anyway, regardless of software, it wouldn't look very good for them.

 

[Odysseus]

Yeah, I found myself mostly agreeing with you after I had typed that out anyway; see:

i had that thought process sort of bubbling in my mind for a while since i've sort of made the "i don't think halo 3 does jack for hardware sales" statement a few times now. your post just gave me excuse to put it to words.

 

[grandjedi6]

Actually, looking at the above chart, it's not really that good for Sony fans, as Wii is still ahead about half of the time. They'll have to look much deeper into misuse of linear algerba to find the good-news chart they're looking for, and I think I might have found it. The following is the thirteenth derivative of the top chart, or the rate of change of the rate of change of the rate of change of the rate of change of the rate of change of the rate of change of the rate of change of the rate of change of the rate of change of the rate of change of the rate of change of the rate of change of the rate of change of the actual console userbases. If the streams cross in this chart, then nothing the **** much happens. And it seems like PS3 is the clear leader when you look at things this way, as it's ahead for 8 of the weeks, compared to only 5 for the Wii. Domination am total, obviously.

.

:lol

 

[RiverBed]

PS3 selling under 9k?! wow, I never seen a SOny console doing that bad. anyone know what the numbers for PSOne for its last weeks were? I don't think even those were this low.
and there is nothing coming out for months. this is not looking good for PS3...

 

[Evlar]

I essentially agree with Odysseus. People will buy a console for a given game, but it's actually fairly rare that someone will buy a console on the very same day the killer app is released. That may seem counter-intuitive, but consider:

1) The enthusiasts know when the games will be released months beforehand. They know WHICH systems it will be released for usually years in advance. And, since these are enthusiasts, they are likely to make purchasing decisions earlier rather than later. So somebody may have Halo 3 as their core reason to buy a 360, but since they've known for years that the game is coming to the system and since the 360 has had other appealing games, they will purchase the system BEFORE the killer app comes out, in anticipation. Every PS3 thread is filled with people talking about the great games coming later this year or next, and explaining that's why they've already bought one. Or, to put it another way, enthusiasts are usually impatient and once they've determined they will buy a system for Game Y coming out next year, they're likely to go ahead and purchase it as soon as they have the money. Why wait?

2) Those same enthusiasts are the people with pre-orders of course. Casuals rarely pre-order. And another motivating factor are the pre-orders themselves. Wouldn't it suck to have Halo 3 on pre-order, expect to show up and release day and buy the game and system, and then discover that the store was sold out of 360s? Yes, that would most certainly suck. So, out of concern about getting their fix on day 1, they will rationalize an early purchase.

3) Casuals don't know the release day, don't have pre-orders, and don't intend to line up at midnight to buy this or any other game. They'll just be pleasantly surprised when they get to a store and happen to see it there, or they'll be motivated by advertising to look (but if they look prior to release day, and don't see it, they won't pre-order... they'll just walk out and maybe try later). It's unlikely that they'll just happen to buy it on release day... they are the ones that fuel the sales throughout the rest of the holiday season. And even if they will buy a whole console mainly to play Halo 3 that purchase isn't made an immediate priority, and will likely be tied into other rationales... buying the 360 for Christmas or a birthday, for example. This pushes sales away from the game's release date and toward the standard big-sales dates we all know about already (and that's precisely WHY those holidays are so important).

I would venture that more than half... significantly more than half... of all sales of Halo 3 will go to people who already own a 360. And similar can be said of other major franchises. We just witnessed this last month with the game that will compete with Halo 3 for the biggest NA sales of the year: Pokemon. The vast majority of Pokemon purchases went to existing DS owners, despite it being by far the largest franchise on the system.

 

[JoshuaJSlone]

PS3 selling under 9k?! wow, I never seen a SOny console doing that bad. anyone know what the numbers for PSOne for its last weeks were? I don't think even those were this low.

Certainly they were. All systems drag along the bottom for a while at the end; they don't just jump from 10K to 0. Media Create tracked PS1 through the end of 2004. Average week in 2003: about 1K. Average week in 2004: about 250.

 

[RiskyChris]

Certainly they were. All systems drag along the bottom for a while at the end; they don't just jump from 10K to 0. Media Create tracked PS1 through the end of 2004. Average week in 2003: about 1K. Average week in 2004: about 250.

Multiples of 250, ahh!

 

[giant_frying_pan]

They'll have to look much deeper into misuse of linear algerba to find the good-news chart they're looking for, and I think I might have found it. The following is the thirteenth derivative of the top chart, or the rate of change of the rate of change of the rate of change of the rate of change of the rate of change of the rate of change of the rate of change of the rate of change of the rate of change of the rate of change of the rate of change of the rate of change of the rate of change of the actual console userbases. If the streams cross in this chart, then nothing the **** much happens.

:lol

Thraktor, it's great that you've taken first year university math, but let's get real. I did a Fourrier transform on the console sales, which tells us the representation of the console sales in the frequency-time domain.

And I think the results were very telling:

:lol

I love you both.

 

[Oblivion]

Holy shit, that was awesome, Thraktor. :lol

 

[JoshuaJSlone]

Multiples of 250, ahh!

Hah, no, these aren't ******** numbers. But the weekly numbers I have for that period are generally to the nearest 10 or 100 and there are a few weekly gaps, so getting more specific seems useless and not very accurate.

 

[RiskyChris]

Hah, no, these aren't ******** numbers. But the weekly numbers I have for that period are generally to the nearest 10 or 100 and there are a few weekly gaps, so getting more specific seems useless and not very accurate.

I know you wouldn't quote those numbers, I just found the coincidence rather humorous :lol

Your reputation precedes you.

 

[Grampa Simpson]

Certainly they were. All systems drag along the bottom for a while at the end; they don't just jump from 10K to 0. Media Create tracked PS1 through the end of 2004. Average week in 2003: about 1K. Average week in 2004: about 250.

So, do you happen to know when the PS1 was down to 8k or 9k units per week? I'm guessing that it's after it was displaced by the PS2?

 

[titiklabingapat]

good stuff

Great analysis.

 

[SouthernDragon]

Thraktor just kicked this thread in the head.

And I understood some of what he said. Gah! Who knew I'd learn something useful at NeoGAF?

 

[JoshuaJSlone]

So, do you happen to know when the PS1 was down to 8k or 9k units per week? I'm guessing that it's after it was displaced by the PS2?

Media Create doesn't go back that far, but looking at Famitsu... you're pretty much right. About 5 months prior to the release of PS2 it started going below 20K regularly, other than holiday bump weeks. One month before the release of PS2 it went below 10K. Throughout the PS2's first year it usually stayed at 5-10K, though sometimes it dipped lower, and for holidays and a couple months around DQVII it was higher.

Here's PS1 weekly sales, 2000 & 2001. You'll notice one crazy spike near the beginning, which I think may be a typo from my source, but it's my only source for that time so for now it stays.

 

[Wiitard]

i just don't see any evidence in the good ol' u s of a that software releases on a home console produce noticeable increases in sales of a home console over and above existing trends.

go ahead, look at sales of ps2, xbox, and gamecube. point me to any increase in sales outside of seasonal trends that is not tied to a price drop or, in the case of the ps2 during the slimline changeover, the end of shortages. i can't find one. all of the upticks are during the holidays and they have a near uniform correlation to sales during the non-holiday months. software sells systems, but the effect of software is not felt all at once; it is felt before, during, and after the game's release as something that affects the console's momentum, it doesn't seem to greatly impact sales numbers the actual month the game is released. but i'd be interested to see someone else's take on it.

but for this, and strictly because i'm more aware of these two systems' release schedules, let's look at a few non-holiday major software releases for xbox and gamecube.

august 2002. super mario sunshine released towards the end of the month. august npd for gamecube -> down from july. september npd (five week reporting period, adjusted) -> up 4% from august. september also saw the release of star fox adventures, which i believe pulled very good numbers. the internet may hate it, but it reviewed and sold really well.

march 2003. legend of zelda: the wind waker released towards the end of the month. march npd for gamecube -> numerically flat versus february, but march was a 5 week reporting period, so it was actually down considerably in the weeklies. april npd was down even more.

july 2003. star wars knights of the old republic released on xbox. it set records for initial sales on xbox at the time of its release, went on to sell more than a million copies all told. july npd -> up 3% versus june (adjusted from 5 weeks to 4 weeks).

march 2004. ninja gaiden released on xbox. sold several hundred thousand units in its first month. march npd (five week reporting period) -> numerically nearly flat to february, weekly sales down more than 20%.

september 2004. fable released on xbox. has sold well over a million copies, hundreds of thousands the first month. september npd -> weekly average down 2% versus august.

the reason i listed non-holiday releases is that you can see if there is any tangible selling power of these games over and beyond established patterns more easily than you can for holiday releases, where consoles sell in massive quantities due to moms and dads and grandmas and everybody else buying game consoles for their loved ones.

it might work differently on portables, and it might work differently in japan, but games don't immediately sell home systems in the united states. look at xbox 360 last year. every month, there was a contingent of people saying "this is when the thing takes off." 360 supporters would look forward to npd for hope. 360, um, non-supporters would look forward to npd with comments such as "if it doesn't sell well this month, d00m." oblivion, graw, dead rising, madden!, saint's row, all of them came and all of them went. flat sales. gears of war launched during the holiday. stuff sells during the holiday. how's 360 doing in early 2007, riding the wave of success surely caused by the monstrous gears? eh, sales are starting to sag off established non-holiday 50k/week patterns.

bubububut halo 3 is real big. grand theft auto iv is real big. established patterns are bigger. and $400 is pretty dern big, too.

oh, guess what i think lesser titles like metal gear solid 4 will do for a $600 or even $500 ps3?

the only thing that will spur sales of these systems over and beyond what they're doing now are price reductions.

again, that's my opinion, feel free to offer another take.

Great point. Of course the Nintendogs and Brain Training are the examples of the immidiate boost to hardware, but there are two reasons for that:


1) Both Nintendogs and Brain Training were surprises, certainly to the general public. They were real unknown quantities. And suddenly they were revealed to be killer aps.

2) Buying a $129 handheld for a single game is very, very different than buying a $600 or $400 console for one killer app.


I'd be interested to see what happened when GTA 3 come out - it WAS a surprise, although it was close to holidays, if I recall correctly.

 

[Odysseus]

Great point. Of course the Nintendogs and Brain Training are the examples of the immidiate boost to hardware, but there are two reasons for that:


1) Both Nintendogs and Brain Training were surprises, certainly to the general public. They were real unknown quantities. And suddenly they were revealed to be killer aps.

2) Buying a $129 handheld for a single game is very, very different than buying a $600 or $400 console for one killer app.


I'd be interested to see what happened when GTA 3 come out - it WAS a surprise, although it was close to holidays, if I recall correctly.

i excluded handhelds from my analysis because they seem to follow different rules in some instances, while still staying true to the holiday/price drop bumps in general. i also steered clear because i don't do handhelds and don't watch them as closely as a result.

on gta 3, just check the season trends for 2001 through 2004 for ps2. using october as a base, here are the november and december multipliers for those years:

year	month	multiplier
2001	10	1.00
2001	11	2.77
2001	12	5.94
2002	10	1.00
2002	11	2.46
2002	12	5.11
2003	10	1.00
2003	11	2.83
2003	12	6.57
2004	10	1.00
2004	11	1.83
2004	12	2.60

gta 3 was 2001, vice city 2002, and san andreas 2004. the year with the highest multiplier for december was 2003, a gta-less year!

(2004's numbers are depressed due to shortages caused by the changeover from ps2 to the slimline)

you can see the same trends if you look at xbox and gamecube, right down to 2003 being the highest multiplier year for xbox. gamecube's was in 2004, mostly due to 2004 being especially absymal for gamecube outside of the holidays, which made the december bump that much more pronounced, relatively speaking.

 

[cartman414]

It takes much more than a single game or two to give a system serious momentum, unless one of those is a serious buzz item, like Wii Sports is right now. The PS2 had Grand Theft Auto 3 in Christmas 2001, in addition to other hits such as Final Fantasy X, Metal Gear Solid 2 and Devil May Cry. The latter 3 of course were the types of games, barring perhaps MGS2, that could sell systems on their own, but definitely helped on a collective basis. This is why I see the PS3 having problems unless Sony manages to pull down PS3 prices fast, AND a killer app out of one of its own upcoming properties.

On the same token, Nintendo will more likely than not need another big seller out of either Super Mario Galaxy or Smash Bros. Brawl, if not something else, to continue the Wii's momentum.

 

[Grampa Simpson]

gta 3 was 2001, vice city 2002, and san andreas 2006. the year with the highest multiplier for december was 2003, a gta-less year!

Wasn't it October 2004?

 

[Odysseus]

Wasn't it October 2004?

dern typos

 

[viciouskillersquirrel]

Thraktor, it's great that you've taken first year university math, but let's get real. I did a Fourrier transform on the console sales, which tells us the representation of the console sales in the frequency-time domain.

And I think the results were very telling:

I just have to point out that you can't make that kind of plot using a Fourier transform. I think you meant to say you ran a Laplace transform on the sales transfer function then plotted it, because that surface definitely has non-sinusoidal components on it (you have non-zero sigmas in there somewhere).

Of course, looking at your source data, I can't see where you could have gotten decaying exponential components ANYWHERE. It'd normally be impossible, but that's the power of the Playstation.

 

[sphinx]

comments

you post in a very convincing way but I am not sure your opinions reflect 100% the truth. I am the exact opposite example of what you present.

I have always said to myself I will buy a Wii the day Metroid Prime 3: Corruption is available on stores. That said, one of the Wiis that will appear on the august NPD thread will be mine.

how many gamers will do the same with other franchises? I have LOTS of friends stating they will not buy a PS3 until FFXIII is available in stores, some other will buy Wii when Mario Galaxy is available and some other will buy a 360 then and ONLY if Halo 3 is available in their nearest store, no pre-orders, no line ups, no BS in-between.

those saying hardcore gamers buy consoles in advance, there is a difference between a general hardcore gamer and a fan of an specific franchise. Those with a PS3 saying they are waiting MGS4 or FFXIII not only want those games, they wanted a pS3, the console.

As for myself, I don't want a wii it doesn't offer me compelling reasons to buy it. Metroid is reason enough for me.

Why would an xbox owner who still enjoys countless halo 2 sessions buy a 360 today? pointless. Now, when is the time to upgrade the console for said xbox owner? yes, only when halo 3 is available.

my way of thinking..

 

[Kafel]

my way of thinking..

What about the beta of Halo 3 ?

 

[sphinx]

What about the beta of Halo 3 ?

I wouldn't bget anywhere near a metroid beta with downgraded graphics, physics, options, forced to buy extra game (crackdown), not thorougly tested, etc..

that's only me, again.

 

[AdmiralViscen]

Odysseus owned the shit out of this.

Respect, props.

 

[Wiitard]

i excluded handhelds from my analysis because they seem to follow different rules in some instances, while still staying true to the holiday/price drop bumps in general. i also steered clear because i don't do handhelds and don't watch them as closely as a result.

on gta 3, just check the season trends for 2001 through 2004 for ps2. using october as a base, here are the november and december multipliers for those years:

year	month	multiplier
2001	10	1.00
2001	11	2.77
2001	12	5.94
2002	10	1.00
2002	11	2.46
2002	12	5.11
2003	10	1.00
2003	11	2.83
2003	12	6.57
2004	10	1.00
2004	11	1.83
2004	12	2.60

gta 3 was 2001, vice city 2002, and san andreas 2004. the year with the highest multiplier for december was 2003, a gta-less year!

(2004's numbers are depressed due to shortages caused by the changeover from ps2 to the slimline)

you can see the same trends if you look at xbox and gamecube, right down to 2003 being the highest multiplier year for xbox. gamecube's was in 2004, mostly due to 2004 being especially absymal for gamecube outside of the holidays, which made the december bump that much more pronounced, relatively speaking.

Ok, that pretty much closes it for me: no big Halo 3 splash. Will Halo 3 be able to generate momentum in terms of mindshare outside of people who are already very much into HD? Seems less likely now. I'm pretty sure that the most talked about games will be Manhunt 2, Wii Fitness, Wii Music and, maybe, Metroid and even some sports games on Wii - all of these games are promissing really new experiences. Halo 3 is Halo on steroids... again.

 

[AniHawk]

Ok, that pretty much closes it for me: no big Halo 3 splash. Will Halo 3 be able to generate momentum in terms of mindshare outside of people who are already very much into HD? Seems less likely now. I'm pretty sure that the most talked about games will be Manhunt 2, Wii Fitness, Wii Music and, maybe, Metroid and even some sports games on Wii - all of these games are promissing really new experiences. Halo 3 is Halo on steroids... again.

Halo 3 is yet another third entry into a blockbuster series in 2007. No matter how good or shitty it is, people

Spoiler

who already own the 360 because that's the main userbase

will go nuts for it.

 

[JoshuaJSlone]

you post in a very convincing way but I am not sure your opinions reflect 100% the truth. I am the exact opposite example of what you present.

GAFfers, their gamer friends, and others like them, though, are an anomalous superminority compared to the dozens of millions of console sales across the country.

 

[turtle553]

Multipliers

Would it be more accurate to have September as the baseline since the GTA games came out in October? So then any bump from a GTA is still set as a 1.0. Particularly the multiplier from September to October 2001.

Especially since the biggest multiplier was in a non GTA year meaning that people may have waited until later in the year since they didn't need to buy one in October for a new GTA.

Unless I'm missing the point from not reading the last few pages.

 

[Sharp]

I know enough people who are waiting for Halo 3 before they buy 360's to suspect that, whatever prior sales trends, people are GOING to be buying 360's en masse when it comes out. Remember that the Xbox came out with a Halo, which helped introduce the userbase. The 360 has not had that luxury.

 

[Deku]

I know enough people who are waiting for Halo 3 before they buy 360's to suspect that, whatever prior sales trends, people are GOING to be buying 360's en masse when it comes out. Remember that the Xbox came out with a Halo, which helped introduce the userbase. The 360 has not had that luxury.

I think the 360 Halo 3 related sales are far more frontloaded than ever just because there's that built in audience.

The point being made is, those expecting a massive spike come this fall just on Halo 3 might be disappointed and it's a fair assumption. This isn't some unknown quantity.

 

[TJ Spyke]

It's been said before, but I agree that most of Halo 3's potential audience likely already own a Xbox 360. I doubt the Xbo 360 will get more than a small bump since most people who want the game will have already bought the system.

 

[super funk]

Damn this is quite a big thread, did I miss something funny in between the 20 some odd pages?

 

[Odysseus]

Would it be more accurate to have September as the baseline since the GTA games came out in October? So then any bump from a GTA is still set as a 1.0. Particularly the multiplier from September to October 2001.

Especially since the biggest multiplier was in a non GTA year meaning that people may have waited until later in the year since they didn't need to buy one in October for a new GTA.

Unless I'm missing the point from not reading the last few pages.

done. xbox and gamecube thrown in for giggles.

year	month	ps2	xbox	gamecube
2001	9	1.000	--	--
2001	10	0.966	--	--
2001	11	2.674	--	--
2001	12	5.735	--	--
2002	9	1.000	1.000	1.000
2002	10	1.001	1.384	1.007
2002	11	2.464	2.709	2.800
2002	12	5.108	5.980	3.703
2003	9	1.000	1.000	1.000
2003	10	0.898	1.023	1.539
2003	11	2.542	2.849	4.570
2003	12	5.898	6.523	7.048
2004	9	1.000	1.000	1.000
2004	10	1.502	0.814	0.948
2004	11	2.747	2.671	3.050
2004	12	3.909	3.916	6.941

and to take it up another notch, here's october through december (totals) expressed in relation to may through september (totals, may being the starting point because that's typically when price drops occurred)

year	period	ps2	xbox	gamecube
2001	05-09	1.000	--	--
2001	10-12	1.657	--	--
2002	05-09	1.000	1.000	1.000
2002	10-12	1.735	1.817	1.658
2003	05-09	1.000	1.000	1.000
2003	10-12	1.875	2.398	3.617
2004	05-09	1.000	1.000	1.000
2004	10-12	1.425	1.687	2.494

things worth mentioning:

2004 saw ps2 in shortage through a majority of the periods being shown, it came out of shortage briefly in october with introduction of ps2 slim, but then was in shortage again through the holiday. in 2003, gamecube dropped in price to $99 heading into the last week of september, which makes gamecube's 10-12 multiplier significantly higher.

 

[Grampa Simpson]

Damn this is quite a big thread, did I miss something funny in between the 20 some odd pages?

Nerds dying of boredom on memorial day weekend.

 

[titiklabingapat]

Another thing that kinda brings down the whole Halo system seller school of thought a bit more down the notch is the pattern of 360 hardware sales the last 1 and a half year. No matter the month, no matter the game and no matter the raw software numbers, 360 hardware tend to sell at a very consistent rate.

 

[cartman414]

For the most part though, basing sales on a single game or two accounts for the set of gamers primarily waiting for that game. To sell to the masses, you need an established variety of games, which is what the PS2 had.

 

[Sharp]

I'd venture so far as to say that Halo 3 is bigger than all the other games the 360 has got, combined. It's in a very select class class of games.

 

[andthebeatgoeson]

Funny-snowball-man:
I agree. Sonycowboy started that thinking for me last year when we saw underwhelming sales on the 360 last year. It's the 1st place console and it sales only 200K or less each month barring holidays. It'll be a tough one to dissect over the years. Price? Reliability? Games? Lack of casual games? Maybe just a perfect storm of all of them. Who knows and it won't be evident for a few years. It really is a dreamcast 2. Why is it slouching? It has the games and marketability. What gives?

Luckily, they don't have the goodwill of a Dreamcast. The DC was like looking at a child born to a crackhead suffer. The 360 clearly has problems of it's own and you don't really care if it dies in the cold, not after it took your wallet 3 times and stole 65 bucks each time.

 

[Dragona Akehi]

Funny-snowball-man:
I agree. Sonycowboy started that thinking for me last year when we saw underwhelming sales on the 360 last year. It's the 1st place console and it sales only 200K or less each month barring holidays. It'll be a tough one to dissect over the years. Price? Reliability? Games? Lack of casual games? Maybe just a perfect storm of all of them. Who knows and it won't be evident for a few years. It really is a dreamcast 2. Why is it slouching? It has the games and marketability. What gives?

Luckily, they don't have the goodwill of a Dreamcast. The DC was like looking at a child born to a crackhead suffer. The 360 clearly has problems of it's own and you don't really care if it dies in the cold, not after it took your wallet 3 times and stole 65 bucks each time.

It's price. PRICE.

Trust me on this one.

 

[Odysseus]

definitely the price

 

[Sharp]

definitely the price

When will you buy one?

 

[Odysseus]

When will you buy one?

no sooner than a hardware revision, no sooner than $299, no gaurantees it will happen as soon as the both of those take place

 

[AdmiralViscen]

When will you buy one?

l8er

The only reason I have a 360 is because I scored a deal where I got a premium for $300.

 

[sphinx]

definitely the price

Why isn't the core an option? I mean seriously. you just go and buy a memory unit and your ready to go, isn't it?

people that are that price conscious will very likely not need HD cables, a headset and what not.

I'd like someone to explain why does the core flops.

 

[Sharp]

It'll be weird seeing you with a next-gen console. We'll all feel betrayed.