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[airmangataosenai]

Again, if DD sales were significant, Sony would have shared a PR about it.

And since they didn't, we assume the DD sales are not that compelling.

No one's saying it's a major share here. To bring the SW total to 1:1 for instance it'd require 20k sales which would only represent less than 7% of overall sales. Unless you think no one but product testers used the online store that number seems pretty doable to me.

 

[Jonnyram]

Even if DD sales were the same as retail, there's no way Sony would make a press release about it.
I don't know what people are expecting, but these figures are only ever released by the developers, and even then, it's on rare occasion, and not subject to being a success or not.

 

[lunchwithyuzo]

I've been in Europe where FFXIII sold 2 ml copies, and I've noticed in NA it selling other 2 ml copied (shipped or not, we're close to that). I've seen also a spin off like Dissidia on a dead console managing to do great sales in both territories, and it was called Final Fantasy. I've seen also mediocre games like DAII surviving. The point is: we (westerns) buy everything, thus how can a Final Fantasy flop so hard here too?

Btw, as a super fanboy I'm actually concerned lol. Especially because I love the new Final Fantasy (XII, XIII and so on) and the direction they're taking with the series. God, it'll be so bad if it really bombs T.T

It's going to bomb, and hard. Western word of mouth for XIII was horrible and it had NO legs practically.

Dissidia 012 bombed hard too btw.

 

[BladeoftheImmortal]

Again, if DD sales were significant, Sony would have shared a PR about it.

And since they didn't, we assume the DD sales are not that compelling.

Sony doesn't share anything. People thought their Black Friday sales were going to be like last year's, but they were great.

 

[Chris1964]

21./21. [WII] Mario Kart Wii <RCE> (Nintendo) {2008.04.10} (¥5.800)
22./00. [PSV] Disgaea 3: Absence of Detention <SLG> (Nippon Ichi Software) {2011.12.17} (¥6.090)
23./23. [WII] Rhythm Heaven: Fever <ACT> (Nintendo) {2011.07.21} (¥5.800)
24./00. [PSP] Lord of Apocalypse <RPG> (Square Enix) {2011.12.17} (¥5.980)
25./05. [PS3] Mobile Suit Gundam Extreme Vs. <ACT> (Bandai Namco Games) {2011.12.01} (¥8.380)
26./04. [PS3] The Elder Scrolls V: Skyrim <RPG> (Bethesda Softworks) {2011.12.08} (¥7.980)
27./24. [3DS] Nintendogs + Cats: French Bulldog / Shiba / Toy Poodle & New Friends <ETC> (Nintendo) {2011.02.26} (¥4.800)
28./00. [PSV] Ridge Racer <RCE> (Bandai Namco Games) {2011.12.17} (¥3.980)
29./26. [NDS] Tamagotchi Collection <ETC> (Bandai Namco Games) {2011.11.10} (¥5.040)
30./00. [PSV] Shin Kamaitachi no Yoru: 11 Hitome no Suspect <ADV> (Chunsoft) {2011.12.17} (¥6.090)
31./22. [PSP] Little Battlers eXperience: Boost <RPG> (Level 5) {2011.11.23} (¥4.980)
32./18. [WII] The Legend of Zelda: Skyward Sword # <ADV> (Nintendo) {2011.11.23} (¥6.800)
33./30. [PSP] World Soccer Winning Eleven 2012 <SPT> (Konami) {2011.11.03} (¥4.980)
34./33. [NDS] Kirby Mass Attack <ACT> (Nintendo) {2011.08.04} (¥3.800)
35./20. [WII] Itadaki Street Wii <TBL> (Square Enix) {2011.12.01} (¥6.090)
36./29. [WII] New Super Mario Bros. Wii <ACT> (Nintendo) {2009.12.03} (¥5.800)
37./37. [WII] Go Vacation <ETC> (Bandai Namco Games) {2011.10.20} (¥5.800)
38./27. [WII] Kamen Rider: Climax Heroes Fourze <FTG> (Bandai Namco Games) {2011.12.01} (¥6.280)
39./25. [NDS] Power Pro Kun Pocket 14 <SLG> (Konami) {2011.12.01} (¥5.250)
40./36. [PSP] Monster Hunter Freedom 3 (PSP the Best) <ACT> (Capcom) {2011.09.22} (¥2.990)
41./07. [PS3] Dragon Ball Z: Ultimate Tenkaichi <FTG> (Bandai Namco Games) {2011.12.08} (¥7.330)
42./42. [NDS] Pokemon Black / White <RPG> (Pokemon Co.) {2010.09.18} (¥4.800)
43./00. [PSV] Dream Club Zero Portable <SLG> (D3 Publisher) {2011.12.17} (¥6.090)
44./00. [PSV] Touch My Katamari <ACT> (Bandai Namco Games) {2011.12.17} (¥4.980)
45./39. [WII] Family Fishing # <SPT> (Bandai Namco Games) {2011.08.04} (¥5.040)
46./00. [PS3] Umineko no Naku Koro ni San: Shinjitsu to Gensou no Yasoukyoku # <ADV> (Alchemist) {2011.12.15} (¥8.379)
47./00. [PSP] Hatsune Miku: Project Diva 2nd (Low Price) # <ACT> (Sega) {2011.12.15} (¥3.300)
48./00. [360] Final Fantasy XIII-2 <RPG> (Square Enix) {2011.12.15} (¥7.980) - 10.000 / NEW
49./41. [3DS] Pokemon Rumble Blast <ACT> (Pokemon Co.) {2011.08.11} (¥4.800)
50./00. [PSV] Shinobido 2: Revenge of Zen <ACT> (Spike) {2011.12.17} (¥6.090)
00./00. [PSV] Software Sales 2011 <ALL> (All Publishers) {2011.12.17} (¥0) <92,00%>

Top 50

WII - 15
PSV - 10
PS3 - 7
3DS - 6
NDS - 6
PSP - 5
360 - 1

SOFTWARE

--------------------------------------------------------------------------
|System | This Week  | Last Week  | Last Year  |     YTD    |  Last YTD  |
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
|  ALL  |  2.812.000 |  2.018.000 |  2.838.151 | 48.832.000 | 60.111.317 |
--------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

[DGRE]

Wow the YTD year-over-year for software is depressing. I really hope we start to see a rebound with a full year for two new handhelds next year.

 

[gkryhewy]

Sony doesn't share anything. People thought their Black Friday sales were going to be like last year's, but they were great.

It's amazing how one awful year can make barely mediocre numbers look "great."

So glad we get to enjoy the bububu DD numbers! refrain into perpetuity, since this is the way of future consoles as well.

 

[lunchwithyuzo]

So PSN is the new Gamecube Hut?

 

[BladeoftheImmortal]

It's amazing how one awful year can make barely mediocre numbers look "great."

So glad we get to enjoy the bububu DD numbers! refrain into perpetuity, since this is the way of future consoles as well.

lol, ok. They were almost a 100% increase YOY numbers on NPD, and many people were saying their sales must be 720k or less because they didn't release info.

My point isn't how great the numbers are, opinions wise, just that Sony not releasing numbers doesn't mean they sold sub-par or not.

I doubt it skyrocketed them into the stratosphere, but i wouldn't be surprised if, say, Minna no Golf and Uncharted had an extra 7k a piece from DD. Nor would a i be surprised, if, collectively, the 20 launch titles produced a 40k overall increase across the board for overall software sales.

 

[Datschge]

The Final Fantasy brand is a nice reflection of the state Square Enix's internal development is in.

The series' main entries always have been the premium output, initially joined by an increasing amount of daring new RPG IPs trying different concepts. The high point for this were the 1990s back when Gooch did very well putting together groups to work on games without interference, initiating the parallel development of FF 8, 9, 10, 11 and 12 well in advance. At that time the variety of Square's games portfolio was at its peak, and so were the sales. Development of FF games were smooth sailings, resulting in FF 8-11 being released on a yearly base. Then Sakaguchi was let go, development on unproven IPs reduced and development on FF 12 slowed to a crawl. To make up for the lack of main FF games in the mean time unproven IPs were essentially replaced by more daring FF offshots regardless of if it really fits in (e.g. Dirge of Cerberus), trying to milk the brands' popularity.

Today the series only relies on a select few staff anymore. Even for the main games development apparently doesn't work anymore without bringing in outside developers to help out. And the output is very low, only increasing the pressure on having good sales with the few games released.

 

[FINALFANTASYDOG]

PSVITA PSN Sales

They wouldn't even be a statistical blip at this point.

I think people are underestimating psn sales highly

- We have stats that tell us Persona 4 sold around 10% of it:s copies through psn , this gives us a base line of a min of 10% sales through psn on a system that didn:t even highly push online sales

- Folks that brought vita also are the ones most likely to have also brought a PSP Go, trained in buying games online

- Some of the psn discounts like on Ridge racer made the game cheaper then you can buy it on amazon, far far cheaper then through retail stores.

Also FFXIII-2

It seems to me a ton of hardcore gamers were burned seeing the 13 go down in price by 5000 yen in two months, lots of *I want to buy it and play it* but will wait for the bargain bin

 

[Datschge]

I think people are underestimating psn sales highly

Without numbers there simply isn't anything to talk about. So trying to put it in relation to steadily released numbers is not earnest.

 

[airmangataosenai]

It's amazing how one awful year can make barely mediocre numbers look "great."

So glad we get to enjoy the bububu DD numbers! refrain into perpetuity, since this is the way of future consoles as well.

You're way off base here. Even though last year PS3 was down it wasn't some huge anomaly drop, it was still much higher than say, 2007 or 2008. The 900k number the PS3 pulled this year is a personal best for the system by over 20% from their historic November high and before 2010 Xbox had never hit 900k either. Calling it mediocre just because Xbox sold so much more than expected this year too is unfair.

 

[wrowa]

How's the word on the street regarding XIII-2? Is it still a disappointment or have the developers really learned from the XIII fiasco? I actually think that XIII will profit more than your usual game from a positive word of mouth. It wouldn't surprise me at all if many people simply are in "wait and see"-mode until they hear that's it's actually a good game, to prevent themselves from bein burnt again.

It will obviously have better legs than your normal Final Fantasy release (relatively speaking), but maybe it can actually sell through its first shipment without price collapsing.

 

[Cipherr]

Wow. Really? So we are going to do the b-b-but PSN numbers thing? One game selling 10% of its share of a launch week only creates a BASELINE for all titles now?


The new gamecube hut indeed.

 

[Dash Kappei]

I've been in Europe where FFXIII sold 2 ml copies, and I've noticed in NA it selling other 2 ml copied (shipped or not, we're close to that). I've seen also a spin off like Dissidia on a dead console managing to do great sales in both territories, and it was called Final Fantasy. I've seen also mediocre games like DAII surviving. The point is: we (westerns) buy everything, thus how can a Final Fantasy flop so hard here too?

Btw, as a super fanboy I'm actually concerned lol. Especially because I love the new Final Fantasy (XII, XIII and so on) and the direction they're taking with the series. God, it'll be so bad if it really bombs T.T

FFXIII didn't *sell* anywhere near to 2M copies in Europe, despite being 50% off after two weeks in the UK and less than 1/4 of its RRP a month after that, retailers were still flooded with copies.
Even the Platinum/Classics release was sold at half its RRP at day1.

 

[Mpl90]

What was Gamecube hut? :O

 

[FINALFANTASYDOG]

Without numbers there simply isn't anything to talk about. So trying to put it in relation to steadily released numbers is not earnest.

I think you:ve missed out on media create threads, more then 75% of these threads are trying to make estimates and guesses based on past released numbers.

 

[cw_sasuke]

FFXIII didn't *sell* anywhere near to 2M copies in Europe, despite being 50% off after two weeks in the UK and less than 1/4 of its RRP a month after that, retailers were still flooded with copies.

True, I've never seen a FF main title loosing so much worth in such a short time. You could import it for 25€ a week or so after its release.

 

[airmangataosenai]

Wow. Really? So we are going to do the b-b-but PSN numbers thing? One game selling 10% of its share of a launch week only creates a BASELINE for all titles now?


The new gamecube hut indeed.

So we're just supposed to pretend PSN sales are zero or what? This isn't the same thing as saying there's some hidden mom and pop store not included in tracking that sells a huge share of hardware/software here. Digital distribution is a significant part of Sony's strategy and they've positioned their online store as a competitor to retail with aggressive pricing. Just because we like arguing about numbers on here and we never get to see them doesn't mean they don't exist. Sony wouldn't spend millions every year maintaining and developing an online store no one uses.

 

[Gravijah]

True, I've never seen a FF main title loosing so much worth in such a short time. You could import it for 25€ a week or so after its release.

i had a man walk up to me and offer me 10 copies of ffxiii for the price of a mcdonalds quarter pounder.

i passed, of course. if he wanted a quarter pounder he could have gotten a damn job.

 

[stilgar]

i had a man walk up to me and offer me 10 copies of ffxiii for the price of a mcdonalds quarter pounder.

i passed, of course. if he wanted a quarter pounder he could have gotten a damn job.

Plus he could have bought a house with all these copies, if he wasn't so lazy.

 

[lunchwithyuzo]

Sony wouldn't spend millions every year maintaining and developing an online store no one uses.

 

[Cipherr]

So we're just supposed to pretend PSN sales are zero or what? This isn't the same thing as saying there's some hidden mom and pop store not included in tracking that sells a huge share of hardware/software here.

It is when you dont have anything concrete. Sales age is about the numbers we know. If you haven't noticed, we have very few numbers about the EU region also. And because of that we dont pretend its 0, we just dont bother with it until we get a report, IF we get a report from the publisher at a quarterly report.

People shouldnt be posting a games number that underperforms, then saying "Well lets add about 10 or 15% because this one game, this one time another game did 10% of its sales online". Thats how fucking Chartzzzzz was founded, thats not what sales age does.

 

[iceatcs]

Although Sony only spent $50K a year for this service.

 

[heringer]

PSVITA PSN Sales



I think people are underestimating psn sales highly

- We have stats that tell us Persona 4 sold around 10% of it:s copies through psn , this gives us a base line of a min of 10% sales through psn on a system that didn:t even highly push online sales

So one game having a share of 10% sold digitally is enough to assume that AT LEAST 10% of every game's sales are digital? I don't see your reasoning here.

 

[Opiate]

I see merit in both sides of the argument here.

On one hand, I agree that DD is unlikely to say permanently irrelevant in regards to sales tracking, even in Japan. At some point, DD is likely to start mattering there as well. Whether that time is right now is unclear.

On the other hand, I'm dreading the posts where people suggest that apparent bombs are actually hits, because there's a hidden horde of buyers who we can't see, in the form of DD users. Thus, this "bomb" is actually a "hit!"

Again, this doesn't mean that the above won't be true, in some cases. At some point in the future, a game that seems to have done poorly will have actually done quite well, because a very significant portions of its sales were online. The problem is that many people will be quick to claim this of all seemingly failed software, and there's nothing we can do, empirically, to disprove them.

 

[heringer]

I see merit in sides of the argument here.

On one hand, I agree that DD is unlikely to say permanently irrelevant in regards to sales tracking, even in Japan. At some point, DD is likely to start mattering there as well. Whether that time is right now is unclear.

On the other hand, I'm dreading the posts where people suggest that apparent bombs are actually hits, because there's a hidden horde of buyers who we can't see, in the form of DD users. Thus, this "bomb" is actually a "hit!"

Again, this doesn't mean that the above won't be true, in some cases. At some point in the future, a game that seems to have done poorly will have actually done quite well, because a very significant portions of its sales were online. The problem is that many people will be quick to claim this of all seemingly failed software, and there's nothing we can do, empirically, to disprove them.

It's coming. Sooner or later.

I just hope we get some sort of baseline in the future to work with DD sales.

 

[Brazil]

So one game having a share of 10% sold digitally is enough to assume that AT LEAST 10% of every game's sales are digital? I don't see your reasoning here.

It's called wishful thinking.

 

[airmangataosenai]

So one game having a share of 10% sold digitally is enough to assume that AT LEAST 10% of every game's sales are digital? I don't see your reasoning here.

He's using it as an example because there aren't that many stats for this sort of thing. He's saying that digital sales now are higher because back then there was less incentive to purchase through PSN than there is now.

It also needs to be brought up again that the people defending the PSN angle aren't saying anything like "Add 10% to get the real sales of each game" or anything like that. We're simply pointing out that retail sales will be somewhat depressed for future releases since you can buy online now same day and date for all retail games and at a discount. If you go back in the discussion what prompted the entire argument was someone saying that PSN SW sales would be "next to nothing at this point", or something very close to that.

 

[stilgar]

He's using it as an example because there aren't that many stats for this sort of thing. He's saying that digital sales now are higher because back then there was less incentive to purchase through PSN than there is now.

But this is certainly not enough to make this assumption. It's not stupid, but I don't think it adds up aything.

 

[Cipherr]

He's using it as an example because there aren't that many stats for this sort of thing. He's saying that digital sales now are higher because back then there was less incentive to purchase through PSN than there is now.

And he doesn't know that for certain, at all. This is such a slippery slope, since its not actually based on anything, people can do that for ANY and EVERY game that releases. You cant discuss it, because there's no foundation, its all assumptions built on examples thats arent indicative of anything other than that one game.

 

[iceatcs]

It's coming. Sooner or later.

I just hope we get some sort of baseline in the future to work with DD sales.

I don't think so, I can see we will never get the sale data for DD services from trackers in any future.

 

[saichi]

I see merit in both sides of the argument here.

On one hand, I agree that DD is unlikely to say permanently irrelevant in regards to sales tracking, even in Japan. At some point, DD is likely to start mattering there as well. Whether that time is right now is unclear.

On the other hand, I'm dreading the posts where people suggest that apparent bombs are actually hits, because there's a hidden horde of buyers who we can't see, in the form of DD users. Thus, this "bomb" is actually a "hit!"

Again, this doesn't mean that the above won't be true, in some cases. At some point in the future, a game that seems to have done poorly will have actually done quite well, because a very significant portions of its sales were online. The problem is that many people will be quick to claim this of all seemingly failed software, and there's nothing we can do, empirically, to disprove them.

I have come to accept the fact that every single underperforming PSP/PS3 game is actually not underperforming because of DD sales. And that's not only for Japan but for all regions.

I'm gonna accept it for all PSV titles as well from now on.

 

[DaSorcerer7]

I have come to accept the fact that every single underperforming PSP/PS3 game is actually not underperforming because of DD sales. And that's not only for Japan but for all regions.

I'm gonna accept it for all PSV titles as well from now on.

And so it begins.

 

[get2sammyb]

It's amazing how one awful year can make barely mediocre numbers look "great."

So glad we get to enjoy the bububu DD numbers! refrain into perpetuity, since this is the way of future consoles as well.

Except the numbers Sony posted were very good. That Microsoft's were astronomical by comparison deserves discussion, but it's not like the PS3 did shit or anything.

 

[freddy]

There's a fair chance that if you see someone in a media-create thread talking about digital download numbers for a particular title then it has has done pretty poorly. So they are useful in one respect.

What was Gamecube hut? :O

I wanna know too!

The answer is in the graffiti.

 

[Boney]

What was Gamecube hut? :O

I wanna know too!

 

[Byakuya769]

Are they tracking all the PSVita systems that were sold digitally? Probably not.

 

[Magicpaint]

I wanna know too!

Old GAF meme

 

[airmangataosenai]

I wanna know too!

"Gamecube Hut" was coined by a guy named Gahiggidy who was/is a joke character used to make fun of overenthusiastic Nintendo fans. In one thread low Gamecube sales came up and he said it's doing better than expected and pointed out that NPD doesn't track all stores, namely smaller mom and pop operations. The example he gave was the "Gamecube Hut"
which sold Gamecubes by the hundreds..... I probably ruined the joke here but I never found it funny in the first place.

 

[thestopsign]

I wanna know too!

The untracked store (by NPD) owned by Gahiggidy that sold most of the Gamecubes/Wiis, without the store being tracked, they were at a clear disadvantage against their competition.

 

[Mpl90]

"Gamecube Hut" was coined by a guy named Gahiggidy who was/is a joke character used to make fun of overenthusiastic Nintendo fans. In one thread low Gamecube sales came up and he said it's doing better than expected and pointed out that NPD doesn't track all stores, namely smaller mom and pop operations. The example he gave was the "Gamecube Hut"
which sold Gamecubes by the hundreds..... I probably ruined the joke here but I never found it funny in the first place.

I searched for Gahiggidy, and i found this.

Craaaaaaaaaap :lol :lol :lol :lol

 

[Kikujiro]

FFXIII didn't *sell* anywhere near to 2M copies in Europe, despite being 50% off after two weeks in the UK and less than 1/4 of its RRP a month after that, retailers were still flooded with copies.
Even the Platinum/Classics release was sold at half its RRP at day1.

Every game is 50% off after 2 weeks in UK, and the game shipped 5 million first time, then it shipped 6.2 million total. You don't have other shipments if there's no demand for the game.

 

[Cipherr]

I searched for Gahiggidy, and i found this.

Craaaaaaaaaap :lol :lol :lol :lol

greatest image of all time.

 

[charlequin]

What do you think constitutes a "Real" FFXIV and what makes you think versus unsuitable to be considered a true sequel?

A "real" XV is a game that's designed from the ground up to be a mainline Final Fantasy, with consideration of the features and depth expected in such an entry, the amount of visual pizazz expected, and sufficient hewing to the genre conventions of the series to play to expectations. (Arguably the entire problem with XIII is that people don't feel like it met all of these conditions.)

Versus obviously doesn't meet the first and its gameplay is very straightforwardly not what the gameplay of "Final Fantasy" as a series is -- it's not even the same genre of game.

(But also, on top of that, a "real XV" would be a game created and announced after the whole FNCF, with full knowledge of where SE started going wrong by their fans, rather than a repackaged effort conceptualized right in the heart of that whole disaster.)

 

[Datschge]

I think you:ve missed out on media create threads, more then 75% of these threads are trying to make estimates and guesses based on past released numbers.

Comnget numbers are already relatively frowned upon as its represents an arbitrary abstraction. You can't tell me some statement "game x did additional 10% of its physical sales on PSN" deserves any better. Estimates and guesses based on past released numbers are something entirely different. Taking PSN into account is like guessing cell phone download numbers affecting the games industry based on console software sales or something equally stupid.

Ideally we would have hard numbers for all areas. But we don't (Japanese sales ages is already comparatively privileged) so we have to either limit ourselves to which hard number exist or proceed with fluffy discussions where anyone can state anything.

 

[Mpl90]

If Azalyn report is anything to go by, I think Chris in his post abour reports from retailers will talk about amazing 3DS sales.

 

[FINALFANTASYDOG]

And he doesn't know that for certain, at all. This is such a slippery slope, since its not actually based on anything, people can do that for ANY and EVERY game that releases. You cant discuss it, because there's no foundation, its all assumptions built on examples thats arent indicative of anything other than that one game.

My lord... my only point was that based on previous info we have it doesn`t make sense to say DD sales on psn are non-existent. As we have a figure of 10% of a game that wasn`t even highly discounted.

Also at least a couple hundred thousand of hard-core PS users who are acceptable to buy a console that only plays download titles.

fluffy discussions where anyone can state anything

Based on the info we have it`s far more ridiculous /fluffy discussion to assume that [they aren`t even a statistical blip] and just go comparing sale data of past systems 3ds games to vita games as if dd doesn`t exist


http://headlines.yahoo.co.jp/hl?a=20111222-00000057-famitsu-game

&#12414;&#12383;&#12479;&#12452;&#12488;&#12523;&#12398;&#12480;&#12454;&#12531;&#12525;&#12540;&#12489;&#29256;&#12364;&#24819;&#20687;&#20197;&#19978;&#12395;&#22770;&#12428;&#12390;&#12356;&#12414;&#12377;

SCEJ President says that the sales of downloads titles have been above their expectations.

 

[charlequin]

A "real" XV is a game that's designed from the ground up to be a mainline Final Fantasy

And to expand on my point here -- has any other videogame series ever announced a spinoff game and then retroactively upgraded it to "main series"/numbered status with a pre-release rename/rebrand? I couldn't think of a single example.