Microsoft is hiring for a Principal Software Engineer position to join the Xbox team that focuses on emulating legacy titles on modern hardware
- Thread starter IbizaPocholo
- Start date
- Game Dev
One year from today:
Xbox sets up a game preservation team and wants "the biggest technical leap ever" for its next-gen system
Xbox has established a new team dedicated to video game preservation and forward compatibility.
www.eurogamer.net
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Avid Reading Horse
Member
If only I wasn't so lazy and actually finished that NES emulator I started writing in college...
Mibu no ookami
Demoted Member® Pro™
That's because you think this is about playing Xbox games on Xbox when it is really about playing Xbox games on PC.
Cakeboxer
Member
I think it's to bring every Xbox game to pc. I bet their new console is a pc anyways and if they could they probably would buy Steam.
RetroGamingUK
Member
Likely old Xbox games on modern PC.
BlackTron
Member
Or just Xbox games in general on PC. Microsoft needs a way to cross the bridge between the console ecosystem and PC. Look at their handheld that is just a rebranded PC portable.
Everything that exists inside that Xbox console OS, they need to find a way to make it work on PC, to carry your library over. The alternative is some crazy dual boot system I guess.
Edit: To be fair, since so many more recent Xbox titles are already on PC. You aren't wrong that this would mean "old Xbox games". But MS also needs a way to serve you the Xbox version of a newer third party game without selling another license if it didn't include a Play Anywhere copy. Basically how will the "Xbox PC" still allow you you to play Xbox games lol.
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Clear
CliffyB's Cock Holster
Most likely I'd say.
Xbox hardware as a thing in itself has no future. MS are clearly going to at least a mostly software-based platform.
FingerBang
Member
This.
I don't know how much clearer Microsoft has to be. If everything is an Xbox, it needs to run Xbox games.
Dr.Morris79
Gold Member
These shitbags talking about game preservation whilst holding onto this and not re releasing it..
dragonyeuw
Member
My clueless layman's take is they want both their PC and console libraries playable within the Xbox OS they're working on. So case in point, allowing OG Xbox/360 content to be playable on a compatible PC device.
Which would make sense with the play anywhere/everything is an Xbox initiative as they shift away from the traditional console model. I no longer have an Xbox console but I do have a digital 360 library that I would love to access on my Legion Go( or any future PC device I own down the line).
DenchDeckard
Moderated wildly
This is all I want to see.
Do it right MS, if you do! - I thank you!
TBF their game preservation and BC programs are unmatched to this day, so if anyone can do it. MS can.
Do it right MS, if you do! - I thank you!
TBF their game preservation and BC programs are unmatched to this day, so if anyone can do it. MS can.
No, it's not just an emulator for Xbox 1 games; it's a team of engineers working to bring Xbox games from past-generation consoles to future Xbox devices/hardware.
The announcement of the creation of this "TEAM PRESERVATION" was made alongside the announcement of the launch of Xbox's next-gen hardware. So 2 + 2 equals 4.
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Little Chicken
Member
One day you could open gog and see Lost Odyssey 
Mibu no ookami
Demoted Member® Pro™
People don't want to believe it, so they won't.
The interesting thing about all of this is there really isn't much value in Xbox virtualization on PC. These legacy games themselves inherently aren't going to sell hardware, we know that based on the Xbox One and the worse-performing Xbox Series.
So what is this about then? It's about converting the Xbox ecosystem itself to PC. How do you convince Xbox fans to keep using GamePass without new console hardware? How do you keep them buying peripherals? The answer is you need to migrate over the core ecosystem as much as possible.
Remember, that Xbox has been Day 1 PC for years now. All Xbox Series and many Xbox One games are already on PC. This is more than just porting games like Halo 5 to PC. You also want to be able to bring across save-game progression and have an answer for 3rd party games, but from a licensing standpoint, Microsoft has Activision, Xbox, and Zenimax... but being able to say a large percentage of your library will come forward with saves is what they're looking to accomplish here. Especially when you're talking about multiple devices, i.e. PC handhelds, Cloud, and maybe even mobile.
The bigger question really is timing. They have a small window (assuming they have a window at all) to make this transition. The longer they wait the more Xbox One users and even Xbox Series users will move to PlayStation to play GTA6 and once that happens it'll be difficult to get them back.
I think the way gaming works today makes this project *somewhat* foolhardy. So much of the industry is live service now, these games are already cross-platform and cross-progression. Then so much of the industry is annual titles or semi annual or otherwise iterative titles that people don't tend to revisit like who is out there loading up FIFA 21 or Madden 16? I don't hear anyone pining for GT Sport instead of just playing GT7 and GT6 isn't getting anyone to buy new hardware.
So, yeah, I don't think this is really about hardware at all. I think inherently Microsoft understands that they're at a massive disadvantage to Steam and are looking for whatever angle they can get, but unless they're willing to exclude their games from Steam, that disadvantage is always going to exist. Microsoft could have a successful launcher surrounded by Minecraft, CoD, Diablo, WoW, Halo, Gears, Fable, Fallout, Elder Scrolls, Overwatch e.t.c. Microsoft should be pulling all of this stuff off of Steam, but they won't because they want the short term profit.
Mattyp
Not the YouTuber
How do you propose bringing 3 generations of disc games to PC when not a single PC in the past 10 years has shipped with a disc drive?
What market is there for that at all? Or is it only about forcing people to rebuy old digital games of what they already own on disc that PC ports most likely exist for.
If it's Microsoft developed title 99% of them have PC ports already. What Xbox games are they looking to bring to PC and how
BennyBlanco
aka IMurRIVAL69
We are getting native ports of Lost Odyssey and Ninja Gaiden Black on PC bros. It will all be worth it IMO. The ugly death of Xbox consoles. The 70 billion in acquisitions. All the layoffs.
Mibu no ookami
Demoted Member® Pro™
You're still not getting it.
They have no interest in advancing your physical library...
XSX is going to be the last place to play your physical library.
People who own digital games will be advanced. It's not about getting people to rebuy either. At least not in large quantities. It's about shifting the spirit of the Xbox console to PC and PC adjacent devices with the hopes of getting enough of the xbox fanbase that even those left behind by digital will still feel at home.
Like I said, it's not about XSX and X1 games moving to PC. It's about virtualizing the entire Xbox ecosystem to PC.
Badlucktroll
Member
i think the greatest emulator ever written was UltraHLE. Good god!
a multicultural team of v
Member
Fixed
Durin
Member
That's what I assumed too, and would just be smart in general if more devices move away from x86. They also need to just make older Xbox titles work on PC in general.
I don't have any special attachment to an instruction set, but I don't want to lose easy access to & good performance on, my older games.
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Black_Stride
do not tempt fate do not contrain Wonder Woman's thighs do not do not
System Level Emulation?
So what there going to be a working emulator with the OS, no need to download the emulation layer with BC titles?
If this works on Windows I might actually nut, Xenia is great and all but im all in for more native support.
If its only for console that Series S might get a few more years yet outta me.
So what there going to be a working emulator with the OS, no need to download the emulation layer with BC titles?
If this works on Windows I might actually nut, Xenia is great and all but im all in for more native support.
If its only for console that Series S might get a few more years yet outta me.
Avid Reading Horse
Member
NESticle
Mattyp
Not the YouTuber
Of course the XSX will be the last place to play your physical library I'm betting the same with PS6 not coming with a disc drive out of the box, but you're still not explaining the methodology of what they want to achieve.
The Xbox OS is an already Windows, Xbox dumped games are ISOs that already boot now we've learnt how to dump them but will not run because of missing libraries stored on the Xbox that's it. Every physical release this generation already received a digital release and PC release at the same time.
Their current Xbox is already a PC running windows with Xbox OS on top. The next generation will be the same thing, there will be no backwards compatibility issues the OS will not change majorly just the hardware underneath.
Are you trying to imply they want everyone with an Xbox digital library on a console to shift to a non branded Xbox PC of some kind like the current Xbox app?
adamsapple
Or is it just one of Phil's balls in my throat?
Sounds like they're looking for a team to make current games work on a potential future ARM infrastructure.
Gameplay Gods Bless
Member
One year from today:
Xbox sets up a game preservation team and wants "the biggest technical leap ever" for its next-gen system
Xbox has established a new team dedicated to video game preservation and forward compatibility.
Lol hiring in blue sky
Mibu no ookami
Demoted Member® Pro™
You're really struggling here
- PS6 probably won't come with a disc drive, but I'll bet you anything there will be a drive option available
- Right now Xbox Anywhere does not provide you access to your library of 3rd party games
- This is about creation virtualization of the Xbox experience on non Xbox hardware
- In order to compete with Steam they want Xbox Anywhere on PC to bring over the Xbox experience as much as possible
- There is not going to be a next gen Xbox "console"
- There will likely be an Xbox branded PC and Xbox branded handheld that use the Xbox App
- There will also be non-Xbox branded PCs and handhelds that they'll want you to be able to use Xbox Anywhere on as well
FoxMcChief
Gold Member
Cool
poppabk
Cheeks Spread for Digital Only Future
Xbox emulation on 'xboxPC'.
Mattyp
Not the YouTuber
You seem to be struggling on what they're going to achieve and just guessing.
They're not going to convert console players to traditional PC players sitting in front of a monitor, it's that simple and they know that.
An Xbox branded 'PC' is exactly what we have already, that is the 'console' and we'll get exactly the same experience next gen as well.
Saying we won't get a console, but an Xbox branded 'PC' is bizarre take. We'll get the same experience next gen as we'll have this gen just with more power.
Will it run steam? It's more than capable already as it's already running Windows with an Xbox overlay.
Mibu no ookami
Demoted Member® Pro™
At what point did I ever ascribe success to what they're looking to do? I simply explained to you what they're doing.
No, we don't have an Xbox branded PC. I'm growing weary of trying to explain things to you.
Do you realize what running Steam means?
yurinka
Member
Pretty likely the emulation of a portion of OG Xbox and 360 games that is in XBO and Series but for PC, with the idea of having it on their PC Xbox app, in order to have in PC, -so also the future 'Xbox consoles'/consolized PCs made by 3rd party manufacturers- as much older Xbox games as possible (and licensed by their publishers if legally possible) legally emulated and available to be sold in the Xbox PC store. No need to emulate XBO or Series because most of their games already are available in PC.
This is not to make to unoficial emulators to run pirated copies of the games.
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Mattyp
Not the YouTuber
What do we have then? We have a box with PC parts legitimately running Windows 11. Break down the difference between the current Xbox and the next Xbox they launch that makes it a PC over current gen.
Or you think the next console will be able to run more software on a TV screen because that's where people want to run office….?
Running steam means throwing an app on the Xbox front end. They could do this now already and allow developers the choice to make it compatible the same as steamdeck deck did if valve allowed it.
Mibu no ookami
Demoted Member® Pro™
Largely off the shelf parts, reduced R&D budget, and full capacity to run win11.
Who said anything about office?
You're really lost huh?
Let me try to help you along further. What impact on profit does running Steam have on an Xbox PC? What impact does it have on the cost of the hardware? If you can successfully answer those questions and still be lost, I'll be impressed.
Gamer_By_Proxy
Member
I still think Xbox will eventually just make PC/PS/Nintendo versions of games and Xbox titles will be stuck on the old hardware to die a slow death.
Mattyp
Not the YouTuber
When ever has the surface teams R&D budget been restricted? Or is that just facts from your ass.
The current Xbox runs windows ALREADY, underneath the Xbox front end there's a fully functioning windows or are you not keeping up home brew.
The next Xbox will run windows underneath and an Xbox front end yet again.
It has no impact on profit, they aren't profiting from allowing Steam to run their app on their front end. They profit from increased user base size of those interested in picking up a console.
Zero cost the hardware is what it is, they're not basing hardware decisions around Steam. It will be up developers to make sure their games are compatible with that hardware and Microsoft making it the best that is possible.
Mattyp
Not the YouTuber
My guess is they are probably digging in Activision's portfolio, along with all the other studios they bought, and wanting to make all their old games playable on consoles and PC.
It's frustrating they haven't just done a complete CoD series drop on gamepass yet of the older titles.
One at a time mid year working their way down so numbers don't jump all over place before new title launch be appreciated.
kevboard
Member
hopefully PROPER emulation. no modified download bullshit anymore! I want a fully offline functional og Xbox and 360 emulator!
this kills 2 birds with 1 stone.
1: no dependency on a download from their servers, so ACTUAL preservation not their pseudo preservation they do currently.
and 2: no need to get any licencing agreements as an emulator that just reads discs offline doesn't need any licensing agreements from publishers for games to become compatible.
and it's time they take this seriously, as Xenia is already running on the console and makes their efforts look lacking.
if a fan made emulator can run this well on their console, while not even have full access to the hardware, then they have no excuse to not offer an official one that's even better.
this kills 2 birds with 1 stone.
1: no dependency on a download from their servers, so ACTUAL preservation not their pseudo preservation they do currently.
and 2: no need to get any licencing agreements as an emulator that just reads discs offline doesn't need any licensing agreements from publishers for games to become compatible.
and it's time they take this seriously, as Xenia is already running on the console and makes their efforts look lacking.
if a fan made emulator can run this well on their console, while not even have full access to the hardware, then they have no excuse to not offer an official one that's even better.
ZehDon
Member
Unless Microsoft is prepared to pay NVidia, I don't think we're ever seeing a general purpose emulator for either console from them.
On topic, if they're looking into emulation now, I'm betting their next-gen hardware is locked and they're working on getting their software stack up and running on it. I'm curious what we can take away from this. If they're sticking with AMD x86, their emulation current work really should carry across without much work. Even getting XSX games running on new hardware shouldn't be too difficult. If they need to revisit this stuff, the hardware must be different enough to require re-implementation. Not sure what it means. It might mean it isn't AMD x86, or, it might mean their next-gen hardware is a very different beast to the XSX. Or, it's just a bit of work to ensure their current crop of emulation works on their next gen without meaning more than "business as usual".
kevboard
Member
they have to pay noone.
Microsoft already has a system in place since the 360, that dynamically recompiles the shaders to run natively on the newer GPUs.
the technical hurdle is getting all games to run without issue. on 360 they had to add custom settings files for nearly all games so that they work correctly, and even then the actual emulation was very spotty and imperfect.
but that was in 2005... 20 years later you'd think they'd have the manpower and budget to make a better and more accurate emulator/translation layer.
Parazels
Member
I'm concerned if classic Xbox 360 titles like Castlevania Symphony of the Night or Virtua Fighter 2 survive after transition to pc-architecture.
Overall it would be win-win for Microsoft to merge Xbox and Windows. This way they stay on the console market, but reduce development cost significantly.
Overall it would be win-win for Microsoft to merge Xbox and Windows. This way they stay on the console market, but reduce development cost significantly.
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Hudo
Member
They're also holding the best space game ever made hostage:These shitbags talking about game preservation whilst holding onto this and not re releasing it..
