Microsoft making at least four new IPs

Doesn't matter. It will still require a controller to be able to play the games we want to play. So it'll be a booster item at best, one that sucks up resources to give gameplay gimmicks like the occasional waggling of the arm that no one cares about. It'll always be destined to remain a casual gamer item only.

Clearly 360 gamers were at a loss for games after Kinect came out...waiiiiiiiit a minute, Microsoft went out and got them Minecraft, time exclusives on Skyrim DLC, CoD DLC etc etc. Why do you think it is that despite all your whining and hand-wringing that Microsoft continues to sell more hardware, games and services than Sony?
 
There must be something up there in Redmond, maybe a new studio? Because all these hires are game designers or directors.
#1:

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#2:

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#3:

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Check my earlier post too.

I mean, if they are working for T10 or 343i, they usually outright say it.
 
They are all shoo-

Oh, oh.
It could still be all Kinect though, because Microsoft also defines Fable the Journey as an action-adventure game. So we still have the right to remain sceptical. I'll be positively surprised if it turns out not be Kinect garbage. Let's see...


Baconsammy said:
Why do you think it is that despite all your whining and hand-wringing that Microsoft continues to sell more hardware, games and services than Sony?
No one is denying that their approach is the most effective one. However we still have all the rights to complain. Being effective in sales doesn't make their approach to exclusives any better.
 


No your opinion of Viva Pinata is complete trash.

HouseWelp.gif


two can play the House gif game, I guess? Surely this is better than discussing our differences.

Viva Pinata was a great game whether or not you were into it doesn't make it trash. I would've said the same thing if he called Little Big Planet complete trash.

The problem here is obviously a matter of you thinking me making a statement about the quality of a game means you think I was saying it was trash for everyone. I don't have the right to make such claims.

Re-read:

Amir0x said:
I thought Viva Pinata was complete trash

Amir0x said:
I thought...

Clearly, this statement implies I am talking only for myself. I think it's trash, and nothing you can say or do will make it not trash. But that doesn't mean it's trash for yourself; it might be amazing for you. I am speaking purely of my own opinion.

People need to stop taking insults or criticisms of games personally. It's a game, it's not an integral part of who you are. Instead of that, you can ask me why I feel it's a shit game, or failing that simply ignore the prospect altogether.

I am not going to say something is good if I think it's garbage. Now, the goal is to have a discussion around opinions like this, so if you want me to elaborate I can do it quite easily. And any opinion that is reinforced by thoughtful commentary, whether I agree with it or not, is decidedly not trash. No matter how harsh the verbage is when that person does the criticizing.
 
yeah but can't the voice stuff just be integrated into a headset? Why waste the moolah for a few quirky side show parlor trick games?

You want to wear a headset all the time?
 
You want to wear a headset all the time?

I already do and never had a problem with it? I wear headsets for my music all the time, for my handheld games all the time, for my Xbox Live gaming all the time... never once in all my life have I ever even stopped to ponder it being an issue.

More specifically, open air voice technology is extremely prone to being interrupted by environmental ambiance of all kind, and so I'd prefer my voice technology to be close to my face.
 
Well I'll have to take your word for it... I thought Viva Pinata was complete trash and Nuts and Bolts, well, I could not appreciate the minutia of building lame vehicles to overcome lame obstacles without challenge...

...but those are certainly at least 'creative'.



It's not about them replacing controllers. They don't have enough power to do that anyway.

It's about them replacing the RESOURCES to make games that don't control like garbage. Ever since Kinect, the 360 has simply become worse and worse for exclusive titles. And the reason that is is because Microsoft shifted their focus and funding to shit that either benefited Kinect or likely the next Xbox (and who knows how gimmicky those games will be).

What's the point of having a great controller if your money is going toward games that mostly utilize the shitty controller? if it's not that, it's just Microsoft obsessively returning to three core franchises over and over again. It's like a nightmarish treadmill.

I think Viva Pinata and Nuts and Bolts were made for kids primarily so that may account for the difficulty. Also, Microsoft does not need to do what Nintendo HAS to do with first party titles. They can depend on 3rd parties and do very well. Again, unless I'm outright wrong about the sales numbers (and I may be since I don't follow that closely), it seems like the 360 is the number 1 seller in the US week after week and 360 games are on the top of the list for the most part. Why would MS drastically change anything they are doing at this point if this is the case? To satisfy a vocal minority? You, and everyone on this board, may loathe Kinect. Sales prove otherwise. I like the stupid thing and kids love it (it takes NOTHING away from my enjoyment of other titles). What should MS do, ignore their customers like Nintendo did for the last two years of the Wii and shut down the Kinect support. Also, what proof is there that the resources MS is allocating towards Kinect are somehow taking away from support for other areas? Perhaps they are just spending extra money developing for Kinect and using the money from the sales of this device to further production of new software and hardware.
 
HouseWelp.gif


two can play the House gif game, I guess? Surely this is better than discussing our differences.



The problem here is obviously a matter of you thinking me making a statement about the quality of a game means you think I was saying it was trash for everyone. I don't have the right to make such claims.

Re-read:





Clearly, this statement implies I am talking only for myself. I think it's trash, and nothing you can say or do will make it not trash. But that doesn't mean it's trash for yourself; it might be amazing for you. I am speaking purely of my own opinion.

People need to stop taking insults or criticisms of games personally. It's a game, it's not an integral part of who you are. Instead of that, you can ask me why I feel it's a shit game, or failing that simply ignore the prospect altogether.

I am not going to say something is good if I think it's garbage. Now, the goal is to have a discussion around opinions like this, so if you want me to elaborate I can do it quite easily. And any opinion that is reinforced by thoughtful commentary, whether I agree with it or not, is decidedly not trash. No matter how harsh the verbage is when that person does the criticizing.

I didn't know "Complete Trash" could mean anything other than "Complete Trash" and it's of my opinion that your opinion of the game is "Complete Trash". Why are you taking my opinion that your opinion is Complete Trash personal if It's clearly just my opinion.
 
I already do and never had a problem with it? I wear headsets for my music all the time, for my handheld games all the time, for my Xbox Live gaming all the time... never once in all my life have I ever even stopped to ponder it being an issue.

More specifically, open air voice technology is extremely prone to being interrupted by environmental ambiance of all kind, and so I'd prefer my voice technology to be close to my face.

So you don't really know much about Kinect then?
 
So you don't really know much about Kinect then?

Please elaborate so we can be done with the snark and get to actual discussion.

Edit: My fiancee got me a Kinect for my last birthday, so I was sort of forced into it :/

She secretly just wanted to play Dance Central
 
anyway, of Microsoft's four IPs, I can probably discount the RARE one these days

so who else would make the other three (if RARE is making one)? Epic isn't going to make another Microsoft exclusive, you think? They seem to have other plans these days outside of Gears...
 
There has to be something there.



(Pro-tip: click the picture).

There is.

Back to the games. I don't count out anything. Genre or studio or device. Maybe I have been in the hobby too long but no company has remained unscathed, no company hasn't had its ups and downs and no genre is missing at least 1 turd and at least 1 great game.

So to me. Its four more games to be interested in and read about when they announce them. That is about it. No hand wringing. No amazing excitement. Just + 4. As it should be.
 
Please elaborate so we can be done with the snark and get to actual discussion.

Edit: My fiancee got me a Kinect for my last birthday, so I was sort of forced into it :/

She secretly just wanted to play Dance Central

Sure, I'll stop with the snark when you stop with the massive hyperbole. If you can't see any potential uses for Kinect then it's more to do with a lack of creativity on your part and less do with the technology itself. If all you want to do is play games designed for controller then that's fine, but to say Kinect is useless for gaming, especially a massively improved version, is at best shortsighted and at worst simply self-serving.

As for my comment about the audio capabilities, there is a lot of extremely sophisticated tech inside there for dealing with ambient noise issues. For one thing Kinect use it's camera to track your mouth movements. So if you're talking it can focus on listening to what you're saying and ignore other audio sources. This is demonstrated in one of the game where you can animate a character with your movements and voice and it works for 2 people at the same time. So while I was animating my character and giving it speech my girlfriend was doing the same it knew who was talking and therefore which character to apply it to. The next generation of Kinect will apparently be precise enough to read lips.

It also analyzes audio coming from the 360 itself and can filter it out. This is why it can still hear and understand you with music playing very loudly.

One of the other things I've often done is communicate with the Xbox from across or even outside the room. You expect people to do that with a headset?

Lastly, as derFeef said, the voice API is build into Kinect and just needs to be accessed by the developers without creating their own voice recognition system or licensing another one.

I'm well aware that you've owned a Kinect, I remember the threads when you got it, and you were so dead set against appreciating any aspect of it that there was never a chance you would find anything good in the tech.
 
Who doesn't want to play Dance Central? GOTY since 2010.

I always did, I really did... but I am not uhhh as fluid in meatspace as I might want to be and even in the comfort of my own home with shades carefully drawn I had trouble enjoying DC and it's various iterations no matter how much I wanted to.
 
There is.

Back to the games. I don't count out anything. Genre or studio or device. Maybe I have been in the hobby too long but no company has remained unscathed, no company hasn't had its ups and downs and no genre is missing at least 1 turd and at least 1 great game.

So to me. Its four more games to be interested in and read about when they announce them. That is about it. No hand wringing. No amazing excitement. Just + 4. As it should be.
Feel the same.

Just love tracking this and trying to figure out what the hell is going on. Fun.
 
Feel the same.

Just love tracking this and trying to figure out what the hell is going on. Fun.

The sheer amount is exiting, I think MS have a lot more than anyone here can predict. They've been working on these games for years. Remember that sly Fable 4 announcement which was never spoken of again.
 
Clearly 360 gamers were at a loss for games after Kinect came out...waiiiiiiiit a minute, Microsoft went out and got them Minecraft, time exclusives on Skyrim DLC, CoD DLC etc etc. Why do you think it is that despite all your whining and hand-wringing that Microsoft continues to sell more hardware, games and services than Sony?

Why are you bringing up sales to back your argument like a fanboy? No one here was talking about that at all. We were talking about the merits of kinect being used in real games in the future.
 
Sure, I'll stop with the snark when you stop with the massive hyperbole.

I'm only sharing my actual opinions. They might seem like hyperbole to you, but they are exactly down to the letter what I believe.

If you can't see any potential uses for Kinect then it's more do due with a lack of creativity on your part and less do with the technology itself. If all you want to do is play games designed for controller then that's fine, but to say Kinect is useless for gaming, especially a massively improved version, is at best shortsighted and at worst simply self-serving.

I want to play games designed with the best controls in mind, that's correct. if the controls break down, the game will always be shit. Not sure why this is controversial, and it has NOTHING to do with creativity.

As for my comment about the audio capabilities, there is a lot of extremely sophisticated tech inside there for dealing with ambient noise issues. For one thing Kinect use it's camera to track your mouth movements. So if you're talking it can focus on listening to what you're saying and ignore other audio sources. This is demonstrated in one of the game where you can animate a character with your movements and voice and it works for 2 people at the same time. So while I was animating my character and giving it speech my girlfriend was doing the same it knew who was talking and therefore which character to apply it to. The next generation of Kinect will apparently be precise enough to read lips.

It also analyzes audio coming from the 360 itself and can filter it out. This is why it can still hear and understand you with music playing very loudly.

One of the other things I've often done is communicate with the Xbox from across or even outside the room. You expect people to do that with a headset?

Lastly, as derFeef said, the voice API is build into Kinect and just needs to be accessed by the developers without creating their own voice recognition system or licensing another one.

I knew about a lot of this, but it doesn't really change what I said because my Kinect still occasionally makes mistakes or gets interrupted by sounds. I'm sure others Kinect does too, because I've read stories about it.

Sure, it's better than what we have before, but again the headset is the most guaranteed way to ensure the problem doesn't exist. But even if it wasn't, your original query seemed to be suggesting there is something wrong with wearing a headset. I was simply saying that we already have a headset on Xbox, we should basically use that instead of MS wasting money on tech that doesn't work adequately at all for most games (not the voice, but the motion controller-free shit). Since this has never been a problem for me, I didn't understand why you were saying it like there's some rush to be free of headsets for me (or most people).

I'm well aware that you've owned a Kinect, I remember the threads when you got it, and you were so dead set against appreciating any aspect of it that there was never a chance you would find anything good in the tech.

You have so little faith in my ability not to be five years old. I normally don't change my viewpoint on things because I am intimately familiar with my own beliefs and likes/dislikes. So it's extremely difficult for something to come out and have me read my own perspectives incorrectly. But it does happen. I changed my opinion with Saint's Row, for example. More recently, I was extremely outspoken in my criticisms of Journey from what I played on the demo... and the final game blew me away. And I admitted it and wrote up a huge post on why this is. Nay, the reason I don't like Kinect is because it fucking sucks - not because I had made up my mind.

I knew Kinect was going to be bad prior to launch because I tried it out prior to launch at NYCC and it was a fucking disaster. But, if it ended up being good, I would have said so.

Instead, it's a acid-bath apocalyptic cesspool of horrible games, awful controls and what's more, this will never change: games are inherently limited once you remove tactile feedback, the efficiency, reliability, etc. The list goes on and on.

You act as if I'm drawing a conclusion that is simply beyond reality. But the truth is anyone who knows Kinect tech realizes that you literally cut the number of relevant genres that actually work on the thing by well over 90%. The rest is conjecture: you can say there's AMAZING things coming that people have to think up that would only uniquely work on Kinect, and I will keep saying "Show Me the Money." Until such point when Kinect "showstoppers" end being just party games/mini-games that I will never give a shit about because I don't want to play shallow garbageware, I will continue being skeptical. Even Child of Eden was held back by the tech, and that's probably the least offensive game on the Kinect list!
 
There has to be something there.



(Pro-tip: click the picture).

At Microsoft Studios I am working on a project that I'm extremely excited to be a part of.

I was brought on during pre-production, and was part of a small art team tasked with exploring the visual language and look of a new game world. Our goal was to find a unique sculptural style and shape language that would make this new world stand out, and I think we nailed it.

Can't wait to see it :)
 
Sure, it's better than what we have before, but again the headset is the most guaranteed way to ensure the problem doesn't exist. But even if it wasn't, your original query seemed to be suggesting there is something wrong with wearing a headset. I was simply saying that we already have a headset on Xbox, we should basically use that instead of MS wasting money on tech that doesn't work adequately at all for most games (not the voice, but the motion controller-free shit). Since this has never been a problem for me, I didn't understand why you were saying it like there's some rush to be free of headsets for me (or most people).

I would really love to see some source on this. What's your opinion of 3D? Because the biggest reason I see for people not liking the tech is "I don't want to have to wear glasses all the time". If you eliminated the need for glasses wouldn't 3D be much better? Well here we have a technology that can already remove the need for having to wear something on your head in order for it to function and you're arguing that it's better to just force people to wear a headset all the time. I don't get it.

It works without the headset, why not use it? The tech is already done and works.
 
I would really love to see some source on this. What's your opinion of 3D? Because the biggest reason I see for people not liking the tech is "I don't want to have to wear glasses all the time". If you eliminated the need for glasses wouldn't 3D be much better? Well here we have a technology that can already remove the need for having to wear something on your head in order for it to function and you're arguing that it's better to just force people to wear a headset all the time. I don't get it.

It works without the headset, why not use it? The tech is already done and works.

I mean the biggest reason the glasses are a problem is because it frequently dims the colors, for example. Not because it's wrong to wear glasses, per say... I wear glasses all the time anyway :P

What I am saying is if they want voice tech, there's really three options here.

A.) They can use what they already have and save money, and few if any will grumble about it: Ergo, use the headsets.

B.) They can implement Kinect "open air" voice tech into the system itself, and drop the motion gimmickry stuff - it's a pointless waste of resources for something that provides so little benefit to most games.

C.) They can keep Kinect and its voice tech, but only people who have it will really care about it... and those people have to always want to invest in the awful motion shit as well. So you're limiting your audience, for one. And you're introducing open-air problems, for two. And the return for your investment is limited. (I'm using investment here in different terms - not monetary investment, but 'investment' here being the number of really truly new ideas your tech introduces versus the number of games that simply don't work anymore)

Now, if Kinect is included in every system, that only amplifies my point - now Microsoft's wasting precious resources and either increasing the price of the system or reducing the component parts prices in order to facilitate that shitty tech (edit: read another way, we could have had improved power, for example, if they weren't wasting money on that), thus impacting me anyway even more negatively than them just normally wasting resources on the thing.
 
Yes Microsoft, YES.

Please be good. Please be good. Please be good. Please be good.

I bet two will be Kinect 2.0 sports games, one from Lionhead and another from Peter M. studio, that always said wants to make a football game or something

The other ones will be XBLA games, with co play in windows 8 phone, now that XNA is no longer supported will have to make their own XBLA library

I have stopped believing that MS will bring the same stuff like Lost Odyssey or Alan Wake, that made 360 so special this generation
 
You actually believe that MS is making four new Kinect titles to entice the Hard-Core, day 1 adopters. You genuinely do, don't you?

What i want from xbox 720 to instantly buy it

1. Fable 4 proper

(proper = no robots, back to Fable 1 combat and fairy tale roots)

2. Alan Wake 2 (exclusive, not on PC same day)

3. Lost Odyssey 2

I am fairly certain none of the above will happen next gen
 
That Naughty Dog hire doesn't look good when you consider he worked on the 8 worst chapters in the series' brief history.

Ch.18 being the worst chapter of any video game ever. You literally hold your analog stick forward and walk through a desert for 10 minutes. Don't believe me search it on YouTube.
 
I mean the biggest reason the glasses are a problem is because it frequently dims the colors, for example. Not because it's wrong to wear glasses, per say... I wear glasses all the time anyway :P

What I am saying is if they want voice tech, there's really three options here.

A.) They can use what they already have and save money, and few if any will grumble about it: Ergo, use the headsets.

B.) They can implement Kinect "open air" voice tech into the system itself, and drop the motion gimmickry stuff - it's a pointless waste of resources for something that provides so little benefit to most games.

C.) They can keep Kinect and its voice tech, but only people who have it will really care about it... and those people have to always want to invest in the awful motion shit as well. So you're limiting your audience, for one. And you're introducing open-air problems, for two. And the return for your investment is limited. (I'm using investment here in different terms - not monetary investment, but 'investment' here being the number of really truly new ideas your tech introduces versus the number of games that simply don't work anymore)

Now, if Kinect is included in every system, that only amplifies my point - now Microsoft's wasting precious resources and either increasing the price of the system or reducing the component parts prices in order to facilitate that shitty tech (edit: read another way, we could have had improved power, for example, if they weren't wasting money on that), thus impacting me anyway even more negatively than them just normally wasting resources on the thing.

You have to get past the fact that consoles are not the domain of pure gamers anymore. They're not just for you. This will be true of the PS4 as it is of the 720. It's a fact of life moving forward. These are boxes that will be designed to appeal to a wider and wider audience.

You may not like Kinect but a lot of people do, including "gamers". I like Kinect. Do I like it for everything? No. It has severe limitations when used as the primary control method for many games, like character movement. Again, you can say "it's not for me" like Dance Central but that is a perfectly valid gaming genre and millions of people like it. Child of Eden was fantastic with Kinect. I enjoyed it FAR more than playing it with a controller.

I've used this example many times, if the ultimate goal for many people is the holodeck, then something like Kinect is a necessary step. Of course, even if we developed a holodeck people would complain that it took actual physical effort. Some people want to be entertained without moving more than their thumbs. That's fine, but it's not everyone. The 360 was underpowered and the Kinect hardware wasn't precise enough, but the potential is there.

So if you feel that other areas of the Xbox suffer because Microsoft wants to include a piece of hardware you don't like then that's a tough break and it may affect your decision to purchase one, but not an opinion that everyone shares.
 
I feel sorry for the hopeless people, I know MS did some nasty things with the device of the demon(Yeah I don't like Kinect), but hope my friends is the last thing we can have.

The sad part of the jokes is the complete lack of originality, we did better in the past...

r7GJs.gif
 
That Naughty Dog hire doesn't look good when you consider he worked on the 8 worst chapters in the series' brief history.

Ch.18 being the worst chapter of any video game ever. You literally hold your analog stick forward and walk through a desert for 10 minutes. Don't believe me search it on YouTube.
He worked on level 13 and level 20 of UC3. Both regarded as really excellent chapters.
 
You have to get past the fact that consoles are not the domain of pure gamers anymore. They're not just for you. This will be true of the PS4 as it is of the 720. It's a fact of life moving forward. These are boxes that will be designed to appeal to a wider and wider audience.

You may not like Kinect but a lot of people do, including "gamers". I like Kinect. Do I like it for everything? No. It has severe limitations when used as the primary control method for many games, like character movement. Again, you can say "it's not for me" like Dance Central but that is a perfectly valid gaming genre and millions of people like it. Child of Eden was fantastic with Kinect. I enjoyed it FAR more than playing it with a controller.

Of course some people do. Some people like the Transformers movies. Some people like Britney Spears. No accounting for taste. One can recognize something is not for me and also criticize that something if it is impacting your hobby. One can recognize something is for a different audience and still point out very real problems it has, which the Kinect undeniably does.

So you don't really even dispute most of the points I'm making - you concede the problems Kinect has, even if perhaps you don't think they're as severe. You just want to use it anyway.

I've used this example many times, if the ultimate goal for many people is the holodeck, then something like Kinect is a necessary step. Of course, even if we developed a holodeck people would complain that it took actual physical effort. Some people want to be entertained without moving more than their thumbs. That's fine, but it's not everyone. The 360 was underpowered and the Kinect hardware wasn't precise enough, but the potential is there.

The ultimate goal is complete immersive virtual reality, which would somehow 'fool' the body into being able to 'feel' surfaces and stuff like that.

That's probably 50~80 years away for the consumer level :P

Anyway, it's not that I don't want to be entertained by something other than just 'moving my thumbs.' It's that I don't want to be entertained by something that is inherently limited for most genres. It's that I don't want to do it if it's in exchange for something much better - for example, if Kinect was 100% perfect and included in Xbox 720, but we had to take a power cut to have it. Then, fuck that, because power is far more important than being able to have tech that would be quaint for about three circus sideshow parlor trick games, in my view.

So if you feel that other areas of the Xbox suffer because Microsoft wants to include a piece of hardware you don't like then that's a tough break and it may affect your decision to purchase one, but not an opinion that everyone shares.

Naturally. I never claimed otherwise.
 
Why are you bringing up sales to back your argument like a fanboy? No one here was talking about that at all. We were talking about the merits of kinect being used in real games in the future.

No, the post I responded to was another in a long line of your stupid "Once Microsoft focused on Kinect their focus on gaming went away." Clearly it hasn't.
 
Isn't this similar to when they were setting up 343i?

I'm most interested in what these new IP are it could be retail/XBLA/Kinect/Non-Kinect could be anywhere on that compass!
Think about it....would they really be bringing in all of this good to great talent from companies like ND, Retro & such to have them work on Kinectimals 2? And on top of that have them excited to do so?
 
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